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Call Up Dagenais!

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Old
11-10-2003, 04:46 AM
  #1
zurg999
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Call Up Dagenais!

Of the Hamilton forwards last night, Dagenais earned the right to be called up before Plekanec, Balej or anyone else. Just one game I know, and only my own opinion.

As to being soft for his size, I think that is being coached out of him because last night he used his size and reach very effectively. His foot speed does seem slow, but certainly fast enough for the tempo last night, which I thought was fairly fast. His effort was there all night and he did all the work for one of his goals.

I'd be curious to see how he'd with another shot in the NHL. He might be one of those type of players who needed a few trips to the minors before getting the message that size and/or skill is not enough to make it (at least 99.9% of the time).

Right now we have too many small speedy forwards with good skills who can't win the position battles, and there are way too many young players on the Bulldogs who also fit that mold. I think he'd be great in front of the net, his reach is unbelievable, Andreychuk like. Don't get alarmed, I'm not comparing him directly to Andreychuk, just the way he can use his reach.

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11-10-2003, 05:02 AM
  #2
Mike8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zurg999
Right now we have too many small speedy forwards with good skills
We do?

I can't think of any small speedy forwards with good skills on Montreal outside of Koivu. And Koivu's about the biggest player on Montreal in terms of winning battles along the boards and playing physically. Begin, another small player, is the only other that is speedy and physically.

The team needs to get faster, stronger, and smarter. Not slower, with a questionable work ethic.

There's more invested in Plekanec and Higgins; both should get the call before Dagenais does.

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11-10-2003, 05:07 AM
  #3
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I realize that Dagenais is having some success in Hamilton right now, but I still don't see him as a top 6 player, which is where we need help. In my mind, Dagenais is a 3rd or 4th liner and we don't need any help in that area right now.

I would like to see Pleks, Higgins or Perezhogin get a shot at the 2nd line. Neither Perrault or Ribs have impressed lately.

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11-10-2003, 05:12 AM
  #4
zurg999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
We do?

I can't think of any small speedy forwards with good skills on Montreal outside of Koivu. And Koivu's about the biggest player on Montreal in terms of winning battles along the boards and playing physically. Begin, another small player, is the only other that is speedy and physically.

The team needs to get faster, stronger, and smarter. Not slower, with a questionable work ethic.

There's more invested in Plekanec and Higgins; both should get the call before Dagenais does.

I guess I should have said "soft" instead of "small". We just don't come up with the puck along the boards enough of the time.

Plekanec floats when he doesn't have the puck (reminds me of the way Audette and Perreault play at times). Higgins won't be anywhere near ready this year.

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11-10-2003, 05:13 AM
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zurg999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habber
I realize that Dagenais is having some success in Hamilton right now, but I still don't see him as a top 6 player, which is where we need help. In my mind, Dagenais is a 3rd or 4th liner and we don't need any help in that area right now.

I would like to see Pleks, Higgins or Perezhogin get a shot at the 2nd line. Neither Perrault or Ribs have impressed lately.
I see Dagenais with one job and that is going to the net on the 1st or 2nd line.

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11-10-2003, 05:16 AM
  #6
Mike8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zurg999
I guess I should have said "soft" instead of "small". We just don't come up with the puck along the boards enough of the time.

Plekanec floats when he doesn't have the puck (reminds me of the way Audette and Perreault play at times). Higgins won't be anywhere near ready this year.
Disagree. I think Ryder, Hossa, Koivu and Zednik are strong along the boards. None of them get pushed off the puck easily and they have done well cycling. Audette and Ribeiro are the weak links among the top two lines, and I'd have no qualms seeing them replaced.

Plekanec is feisty and his play without the puck does need improvement. However, he's not disinterested in the game--as Audette or Perreault are--he just doesn't yet have his game down pat away from the puck, but it's improved ever since he came to North America.

Higgins is most certainly ready for NHL minutes, in my opinion. Plug him next to some NHL level talent and you would see him thrive. Maybe not points on the board, maybe a few rookie mistakes, but the NHL is where he should be right now in my mind.

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11-10-2003, 05:17 AM
  #7
FTK
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Dagenais is an Eriz Dazé Clone...Except he has yet to reach his potential

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Old
11-10-2003, 05:53 AM
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I disagree with what everybodys saying about Ribs.... his play has been good out there, he is creative and probably the second best play maker on the habs. Until Koivu came back, he was having a hard time because he was facing the best defensive unites of the other teams;... now with koivu back he is getting more ice to work with and its showing in all the chances he is getting.... he is a great 2nd line center IMO...

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Old
11-10-2003, 06:22 AM
  #9
zurg999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
Disagree. I think Ryder, Hossa, Koivu and Zednik are strong along the boards. None of them get pushed off the puck easily and they have done well cycling. Audette and Ribeiro are the weak links among the top two lines, and I'd have no qualms seeing them replaced.

Plekanec is feisty and his play without the puck does need improvement. However, he's not disinterested in the game--as Audette or Perreault are--he just doesn't yet have his game down pat away from the puck, but it's improved ever since he came to North America.

Higgins is most certainly ready for NHL minutes, in my opinion. Plug him next to some NHL level talent and you would see him thrive. Maybe not points on the board, maybe a few rookie mistakes, but the NHL is where he should be right now in my mind.

Mike8;

I sincerely hope Plekanec and Higgins thrive when they do arrive. I would also be quite happy to see any of the better prospects with the big club for a few games, if only to try and light a fire under the vets.

However, based on what I saw last night, I would like to see Dagenais get a shot first. I know he has earned a rep for being lazy and soft in the past, but last night, against a bigger and arguably better team he did not look out of place at all, and in fact he created something almost every shift. Plekanec and Higgins on the other hand looked overwhelmed at times.

Dagenais would add much needed size. Even if he can't out jump guys, he can take pucks away with good body positioning and reach. If I am proven wrong later in the year I will be the first to admit it.

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Old
11-10-2003, 06:38 AM
  #10
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Why not Gratton?

Gratton is doing pretty well and i think we should call him up before anyone, to see what he could do... He is beginning to play the way he was playing last year, i think he deserves a try. Ryder and Ward got theirs, why not Gratton?

Anyone agree?

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11-10-2003, 06:58 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FTK
Dagenais is an Eriz Dazé Clone...Except he has yet to reach his potential
You mean a Daze without the speed...

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11-10-2003, 07:17 AM
  #12
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Dags has been on a tear these days and is doing his best to make a good case for his call up. The problem is that with the return of Koivu and Kilger for the IR, and with the wiaver additions of Begin and Langdon both playing and doing well, I just don't see that there is any room at all for any forward from Hamilton. After all, we are sitting guys like Perreault and Dackell who are far more NHL ready than Dags, and all this is assuming that Dags' reports of being slow and soft are out of date and he has improved on the above.

I can see Dags continuing on in his key role on the top two lines in Hamilton for a while, much like Gratton has being doing for the past few years. Every now and then there will be glimpses of skill and brilliance, but just not enough to get that permanent spot in the bigs. I could be wrong, and that would be a pleasant surprise and bonus for the team!!

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11-10-2003, 07:25 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zurg999
As to being soft for his size, I think that is being coached out of him because last night he used his size and reach very effectively. His foot speed does seem slow, but certainly fast enough for the tempo last night, which I thought was fairly fast. His effort was there all night and he did all the work for one of his goals.
.
Foot speed slow to Ok for AHL = not even enough for NHL, the guy is too slow, and if you want to play a physical game, you have to be some kinda fast because players are good at avoiding check, except if the players have his head between his legs, but that doesn't happen a too much in the NHL.

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Old
11-10-2003, 12:14 PM
  #14
Habs4ever
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Dagenais has to clear Waiver wire

when he's demoted back to farm team, best solution is to let him play all year in Hamilton let him become dominant there and when he's fully ready like Ryder bring him over if we bring him now it would probably be for few games and the way he's playing he'd be surely pickedup in waiver wire.

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Old
11-10-2003, 04:44 PM
  #15
CHareth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FTK
Dagenais is an Eriz Dazé Clone...Except he has yet to reach his potential
If so, he's a bad genetic result. Yes, they are both gentle giants, but Dagenais is slower than Daze, softer than Daze, and has nowhere near the same offensive capabilities as Daze.

Dagenais is merely on a hot streak. Unless he can play at a high level on a consistent basis, I don't see any need to call him up before the likes of Plekanec and Higgins.

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