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Has Spector's lost his mind?

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Old
07-20-2006, 06:55 AM
  #1
shadoz19
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Has Spector's lost his mind?

Usually he provides pretty good commentary/analysis on various articles, but his latest comments on the Wings goaltending search seem absurd.

Quote:
The problem for Wings GM Ken Holland isn't a lack of available goaltenders, but rather the asking price other teams are seeking in return. Undoubtedly some of those teams are trying to pry either Pavel Datsyuk or Henrik Zetterberg from Holland, two players he has no intention of parting with.
Thats basically asking for the team.

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07-20-2006, 07:00 AM
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Bobcat110
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Why is Spector's absurd? Isn't he just the messenger? Seems like the GMs requesting Zetterberg or Datsyuk would be the one's absurd?

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07-20-2006, 07:13 AM
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David Puddy
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Which goalies are the interest of Ken Holland's inquiry? I can't even imagine for whom he would ask that would cause another GM to ask about Zetterberg or Datsyuk.

Luongo was the only available goalie that had that kind of clout.

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07-20-2006, 07:49 AM
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oil slick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadoz19 View Post
Usually he provides pretty good commentary/analysis on various articles, but his latest comments on the Wings goaltending search seem absurd.



Thats basically asking for the team.
Why blame Spector? I don't know anything about Giggy or Nabokov, but it became obviouse last year that Regier was asking an absurd amount for Biron - which is why he's still a Sabre... it could be he's still asking the moon. I could easily see him asking for a Datsyuk in return for Biron.

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07-20-2006, 07:51 AM
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shadoz19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oil slick View Post
Why blame Spector? I don't know anything about Giggy or Nabokov, but it became obviouse last year that Regier was asking an absurd amount for Biron - which is why he's still a Sabre... it could be he's still asking the moon. I could easily see him asking for a Datsyuk in return for Biron.
I believe those comments to be pure specualtion on his part. Thats why I think he has lost his mind.

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07-20-2006, 07:55 AM
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oil slick
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Originally Posted by shadoz19 View Post
I believe those comments to be pure specualtion on his part. Thats why I think he has lost his mind.
Fair enough. Generally I find Spectors comments to be fairly well grounded and seeing as I can see Regier asking this price I could see it being true... I was pretty amazed that Roloson cost 1st + 3rd last year as well.

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07-20-2006, 07:57 AM
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Spector isn't the one stating the Wings need to trade Datsyuk or Zetterberg for a goalie, he's saying that's what other teams ask for when Holland's on the other end of the line.

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07-20-2006, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadoz19 View Post
I believe those comments to be pure specualtion on his part. Thats why I think he has lost his mind.
IMO Detriot is in trouble, if they don't have prober goaltending and face it Osgood isn't gonna cut it. You guy parted with Legace, too. The GM around the league take notice and want to take adventage of that situation plus several of them don't really have to trade their goalies.

Look, what Minnesota got for Roloson! It was an overpayment by Edmonton. Risebourgh knew that the Oilers had trouble in goal and got the maxium out of Lowe. Expect the Wings to overpay for a good goalie.

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07-20-2006, 08:10 AM
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I could see Datsyuk being traded for a goalie + a d-man but not Zetterberg.

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07-20-2006, 08:29 AM
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I am almost certain Darcy is not asking for Datsyuk or Zetterberg. We have too many forwards as it is. And the reason the price was so high for Biron last year was because Regier didn't want to trade him. Instead of just saying no he asked for all the stars in the sky knowing no one would pay to get him.

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07-20-2006, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Puddy View Post
Which goalies are the interest of Ken Holland's inquiry? I can't even imagine for whom he would ask that would cause another GM to ask about Zetterberg or Datsyuk.

Luongo was the only available goalie that had that kind of clout.
The 3 articles referenced:

MLive.com
(mentions Toskala and Biron as likely targets, and mentions Garon, Esche, Weekes, and Giguere as others who might be available)

Detroit News
Quote:
Buffalo, San Jose, Anaheim and possibly Montreal and Philadelphia are among the teams looking to deal a goalie. And as teams struggle to fit their payroll under the $44 million salary cap next month, the asking price for the likes of Martin Biron (Buffalo) and Vesa Toskala (San Jose) likely will drop for Holland, one of only a few GMs actively seeking goaltending help.

Helene St James of the Freep mentions the same possibilities, and comes the closest to speculating which Wings might go:
Quote:
"His [Nabokov's] salary really inhibits," Nill said. "We couldn't take on a $5-million average, not without moving another player making four or five million."

The only Wings making that kind of money are centers Pavel Datsyuk ($3.9 million) and Robert Lang ($3.8 million) and defenseman Mathieu Schneider ($3.3 million) -- and the Wings have no intention of trading any of them.
Datsyuk, who turned 28 today, is an incredibly talented forward, and the Wings see him as the foundation of their future.

In the articles reference, none of the writers are suggesting that other teams are asking for one of Detroit's stars. It looks to me like that speculation is indeed coming from Spector.

I agree with the thread starter that he's out to lunch on this one.

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07-20-2006, 08:37 AM
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I don't get it. Spector thinks that other teams want Datsyuk and Zetterberg. He also thinks the wings won't give them up. If he thought anything else, he would be stunningly stupid.

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07-20-2006, 08:38 AM
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I just don't get it why don't they re-sign Legace?Did something happen with the club?I mean he did not have that bad of a season.

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07-20-2006, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by oilers_guy_eddie View Post
In the articles reference, none of the writers are suggesting that other teams are asking for one of Detroit's stars. It looks to me like that speculation is indeed coming from Spector.

I agree with the thread starter that he's out to lunch on this one.
None of the three articles referene here mention what other GMs are asking... That does not mean GMs are not asking. Someone spending all his time writing about hockey and trade rumors could have picked this up somewhere else. Jim Nill was quoted recently as saying that other teams wanted them to take on a big contract AND give up a good player...

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07-20-2006, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
I just don't get it why don't they re-sign Legace?Did something happen with the club?I mean he did not have that bad of a season.
During contract talks before the playoffs, Manny wanted $4 million and a guarantee he'd be the starter. Detroit offered $2.5 million and no guarantees. Manny opted to not sign. After the playoffs, the Wings did not extend another offer, presumably because they felt he still wanted too much money and the guarantee.

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07-20-2006, 08:43 AM
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shadoz19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kärppä32 View Post
IMO Detriot is in trouble, if they don't have prober goaltending and face it Osgood isn't gonna cut it. You guy parted with Legace, too. The GM around the league take notice and want to take adventage of that situation plus several of them don't really have to trade their goalies.

Look, what Minnesota got for Roloson! It was an overpayment by Edmonton. Risebourgh knew that the Oilers had trouble in goal and got the maxium out of Lowe. Expect the Wings to overpay for a good goalie.
Though I think the market was different then. There were a lot of teams looking for a goalie. Now how many are looking? Detroit, St. Louis, and Florida? Florida is on the verge of signing Belfour and St. Louis seems content with Sanford. Maybe St. Louis will sign Legace. That would lower the market even further. A lot of the teams with goalies available can afford to wait it out, but at some point Regier is gonna want to get a return on Biron. The same could be the case for Giguere and god forbid Aebischer.

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07-20-2006, 08:44 AM
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shadoz19
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
I just don't get it why don't they re-sign Legace?Did something happen with the club?I mean he did not have that bad of a season.
He was pretty public with a lot of his comments. In those comments he seemed to lack confidence. Because of this its been alleged that hi teammates didn't have much confidence in him come playoff time either.

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07-20-2006, 09:25 AM
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Spector is taking a page from Eklund's book on this one. His comments are normally sane and logical, but to claim other GM's are asking for Datsyuk or Zetterberg in exchange for a goaltender? Puh-lease. That's absurd. If Ken Holland were trying to trade for Luongo, Turco or Brodeur I could see it. But Biron? Toskala? Esche?!? It's beyond reason to think any of those would be close to Hank or Dats in value. Spector has lost his marbles.

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07-20-2006, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by doublejack View Post
Spector is taking a page from Eklund's book on this one. His comments are normally sane and logical, but to claim other GM's are asking for Datsyuk or Zetterberg in exchange for a goaltender? Puh-lease. That's absurd. If Ken Holland were trying to trade for Luongo, Turco or Brodeur I could see it. But Biron? Toskala? Esche?!? It's beyond reason to think any of those would be close to Hank or Dats in value. Spector has lost his marbles.
How is it asburd? Did he said it was straight up for a goalie ? no It can be Goalie+D+draft picks for Datsyuk

I really think Datsyuk is not all that protected in Detroit. Everyone knows he will be difficult Yashin style.

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07-20-2006, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadoz19 View Post
I believe those comments to be pure specualtion on his part. Thats why I think he has lost his mind.
Agreed.

I actually called him out on something about why the Canes let go Kevin Weekes. He basically said the Canes wanted Gerber because he was a better goalie than Weekes. The real reason was that going into the lockout, Kevin Weekes was going to command a lot of money and (probably) a long term deal, something Rutherford wasn't (and didn't) do for anyone. Rutherford was already planning to use Cam Ward as a backup 2004-2005 season or not, so he went with a trade to get Gerber knowing he could be a cheaper stop gap. Anyway, ol' Lyle Richardson basically told me I didn't know what I was talking about. That's when I realize half of what he writes are interjections anyway.

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07-20-2006, 09:51 AM
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You've lost your mind if you disagree with him and think teams aren't trying to get one of those two out of Detroit.

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07-20-2006, 09:56 AM
  #22
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Uhhh... people were talking Toskala for Havlat, how's that any different?

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07-20-2006, 10:00 AM
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You've lost your mind if you disagree with him and think teams aren't trying to get one of those two out of Detroit.
Agred,If I am a GM and have a goalie to trade, I know that Detroit really needs one, I am probably going to start out asking for their better players. I am not starting by asking for Jamie Rivers.

That is called good negotiating...

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07-20-2006, 10:02 AM
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I don't understand why this board has such a difficult time grasping the real world cost for a legitimate starting goaltender in the NHL. Marc Denis got a top 6 forward despite never playing a single NHL playoff game and having career numbers comparable to Biron and Giguere.

The value of a starting goaltender is a top 6 forward or a top 4 d-man. Just because there are a couple to choose from doesn't make that value lower, especially since none of the teams with two good goalies are forced to move any of them. If you want a starting goaltender in the league through a method other than UFA, you have to pay for it.

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07-20-2006, 10:09 AM
  #25
shadoz19
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Originally Posted by Poulinsflakjacket View Post
Agred,If I am a GM and have a goalie to trade, I know that Detroit really needs one, I am probably going to start out asking for their better players. I am not starting by asking for Jamie Rivers.

That is called good negotiating...
Given the current market (more sellers than buyers) there is no ground to ask for those two. Maybe Burke could ask for Datsyuk given a similar contract situation but thats about it. He still wouldn't get it either.

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