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Old
11-11-2003, 06:46 PM
  #26
Walsher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spaz44
Have you read any of my report cards besides this one? I have commented on almost all of them that Smytty hasn't played up to his potential yet and has struggled this year but in the last few games he has played better and I liked his effort tonight. You and I disagree on this, ok so what? So IMO we agree that he hasn't played his best hockey yet but the results are still there.

Ryan Smyth will continue to get his points, I am not worried about him whatsover.
I have read your posts and I like what you have to say. I agree he has played better of late - but he needs to be the best player on thie ice consistently. He has the ability to be that player and we both know it. Better effotrs aside- he still wasn't even top 3 Oilers tonight. I know he will get his points, Carter got 26-30 goals a year in Edmonton but every knows he could have been better. I refuse to settle for second best with this guy because he has the ability to be better. Sometimes people need to be criticized to help them make that next step. Look at Isbister on a smaller scale this year. Every guy needs a kick in the pants and I feel he needs that push to get him into the upper echelon of players an there is no reason why he can't get there. Don't feel like this is an attack at you - I just see his play being nowhere near where it should be. Not tonight, not last night, not yet this year.

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Old
11-11-2003, 06:50 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
I have read your posts and I like what you have to say. I agree he has played better of late - but he needs to be the best player on thie ice consistently. He has the ability to be that player and we both know it. Better effotrs aside- he still wasn't even top 3 Oilers tonight. I know he will get his points, Carter got 26-30 goals a year in Edmonton but every knows he could have been better. I refuse to settle for second best with this guy because he has the ability to be better. Sometimes people need to be criticized to help them make that next step. Look at Isbister on a smaller scale this year. Every guy needs a kick in the pants and I feel he needs that push to get him into the upper echelon of players an there is no reason why he can't get there. Don't feel like this is an attack at you - I just see his play being nowhere near where it should be. Not tonight, not last night, not yet this year.
I think what you see with Ryan Smyth is what you get.

He has improved immensely over the years with his on ice vision but that is never going to be his bread and butter.

The two assists he got the other night epitimize Ryan Smyth's game. Outhustle guys and outwork them and either get it to the front of the net or pass to the open guy.

When he scores it is a garbage goal two feet in front of the net. Frankly, I have no problem with that. That is Ryan Smyth's game and when he is outworking guys in the corner and setting up chances and scoring the garbage goal I know he is doing his job.

Earlier in the year he wasn't working in the corners very well because IMO of the move to centre.

I don't expect more from Ryan Smyth because that is his game and there are few guys that work the corners and the boards better.

In conclusion I think you are looking for something in Ryan that he simply can not provide and thus we have different expectations and thus different perceptions of what we are seeing when we watch him.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:00 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spaz44
I think what you see with Ryan Smyth is what you get.

He has improved immensely over the years with his on ice vision but that is never going to be his bread and butter.

The two assists he got the other night epitimize Ryan Smyth's game. Outhustle guys and outwork them and either get it to the front of the net or pass to the open guy.

When he scores it is a garbage goal two feet in front of the net. Frankly, I have no problem with that. That is Ryan Smyth's game and when he is outworking guys in the corner and setting up chances and scoring the garbage goal I know he is doing his job.

Earlier in the year he wasn't working in the corners very well because IMO of the move to centre.

I don't expect more from Ryan Smyth because that is his game and there are few guys that work the corners and the boards better.

In conclusion I think you are looking for something in Ryan that he simply can not provide and thus we have different expectations.
Trust me I know Ryan Smyths game better than most people. He hasn't been bringing his game. Like I said before, he has lost his presence in front of the net, and the cycle down low is non-existent with his line 5 on 5. That is exactly what I have been saying. He hasn't been bringing his game. I have seen a change that has him playing less desperate and with less toughness. I mentioned in another post his best game was the 4-2 loss to Clagary ironically enough. He had that desire, and effort we have come to know. A Ryan SMyth game is a game that is ugly but you notice him in their making hits, getting to the front of the net and causing havoc. He has lost that. I think some of it has been Hemsky's reluctance to get in the corners and support Smyth leading to short time in the offensive zone but some of it has been Smyth's innability create a cycle and free up time and space for himself and Hemsky. I understand what makes him successful and I can easily see what he is capable of. All I am trying to reinforce is that he has capabilities and strengths to his game and I feel he has not utilized them near potential. To keep it simple he hasn't been Ryan Smyth and that is what the team needs especially without Comrie, Marchant, etc. I understand the situation. I also understand what he is being paid and that to me dictates where his level of play should be. Raffi Torres is exceeding expectations based on Salary, experience, and skill. Ryan Smyth has thus far underachieve at the worst possible time in his career - that being when everyone is expecting a step up the latter rather than down.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:29 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
Trust me I know Ryan Smyths game better than most people. He hasn't been bringing his game. Like I said before, he has lost his presence in front of the net, and the cycle down low is non-existent with his line 5 on 5. That is exactly what I have been saying. He hasn't been bringing his game. I have seen a change that has him playing less desperate and with less toughness. I mentioned in another post his best game was the 4-2 loss to Clagary ironically enough. He had that desire, and effort we have come to know. A Ryan SMyth game is a game that is ugly but you notice him in their making hits, getting to the front of the net and causing havoc. He has lost that. I think some of it has been Hemsky's reluctance to get in the corners and support Smyth leading to short time in the offensive zone but some of it has been Smyth's innability create a cycle and free up time and space for himself and Hemsky. I understand what makes him successful and I can easily see what he is capable of. All I am trying to reinforce is that he has capabilities and strengths to his game and I feel he has not utilized them near potential. To keep it simple he hasn't been Ryan Smyth and that is what the team needs especially without Comrie, Marchant, etc. I understand the situation. I also understand what he is being paid and that to me dictates where his level of play should be. Raffi Torres is exceeding expectations based on Salary, experience, and skill. Ryan Smyth has thus far underachieve at the worst possible time in his career - that being when everyone is expecting a step up the latter rather than down.
Just to let you know I have watched the Oiler since before they were in the NHL and I am quite cognizant of what Ryan Smyth can bring to the Oilers.

But as I have already said I agree that his board work and his play in front of the net has not been as good as it usually is and I have already commented on that in many of my Oiler reports.

That being said in the last few games it has improved and unlike you I thought he played one of his better games last night, those two goals that he set up were very Smytty like.

Tonight he didn't get the results except for one assist but I didn't think he played a bad game, not a great one but certainly not a bad one.

I think he is starting to look more like Ryan Smyth in the last couple of games and the results are starting to show.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:31 PM
  #30
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remember-it's not good enough to be good if you have the ability to be better...

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:33 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#2
remember-it's not good enough to be good if you have the ability to be better...
But again no one has said he couldn't be better, what I have been saying is that in the last two games he has been better and his game is starting to turn around and he is starting to look like the Smytty that we all know and love.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:34 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
Buddy you have to be joking! You must be a much smarter hockey mind because you have posted 300+ times? If you think Smyth is playing to potential then you are seriously lacking any sort of hockey knowledge. In fact - if you thinks Hemsky is playing to potential than you are even in worse shape. To take a personal shot at me because I feel - like many other I must say, because I am expressing dissapointment about a player that is so much more skilled than he has shown is extremely immature on your behalf. Have you ever been to an Oilers game? Have you ever played hockey? Can you even skate? I bet you are like the goof on Mystery Alaska that got chased out of the town because he skated like a queer. Ye of 300+ posts give me a break. You are such the hockey mind. Good effort.

Wait a minute...

This is a HOCKEY board?

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:35 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spaz44
I think he is starting to look more like Ryan Smyth in the last couple of games and the results are starting to show.
I will have to agree to disagree on some of this stuff but this part of the quote I can agree on whole heartedly. For future reference try not to use the "I have watched this team since before they were in the NHL" line - this is the present and Ryan Smyth has not been in the league since before the Oilers were in the NHL. I am 22 years old have been to the majority of games in Edmonton over the past 7 years and went to 10-20 games per year prior to that. I too am knowledgeable about this team and even though I have only been around since '81.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:38 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
I will have to agree to disagree on some of this stuff but this part of the quote I can agree on whole heartedly. For future reference try not to use the "I have watched this team since before they were in the NHL" line - this is the present and Ryan Smyth has not been in the league since before the Oilers were in the NHL. I am 22 years old have been to the majority of games in Edmonton over the past 7 years and went to 10-20 games per year prior to that. I too am knowledgeable about this team and even though I have only been around since '81.
Fine let me rephrase. I have watched Smytty from his first training camp till now and I rarely if ever miss an Oiler game.

Again just thought I would put my original comment from my original post for you.

"He has played a lot better in the last two games, created some good chances but his hustle along the boards"

Notice that this would show that I thought he didn't play to his potential in the previous games before the last two!

Isnt that point very similar to the point that you just agreed with in my last post.

"I think he is starting to look more like Ryan Smyth in the last couple of games and the results are starting to show"

These are really the exact same thoughts, so what was it that you orginally disagreed with?

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:48 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
Buddy you have to be joking! You must be a much smarter hockey mind because you have posted 300+ times? If you think Smyth is playing to potential then you are seriously lacking any sort of hockey knowledge. In fact - if you thinks Hemsky is playing to potential than you are even in worse shape. To take a personal shot at me because I feel - like many other I must say, because I am expressing dissapointment about a player that is so much more skilled than he has shown is extremely immature on your behalf. Have you ever been to an Oilers game? Have you ever played hockey? Can you even skate? I bet you are like the goof on Mystery Alaska that got chased out of the town because he skated like a queer. Ye of 300+ posts give me a break. You are such the hockey mind. Good effort.

Wait a minute...

This is a HOCKEY board?

I had to edit out the rest of what I was going to say

I'll answer your questions in order.

You must be a much smarter hockey mind because you have posted 300+ times?
Never said that...but I know hockey, and there are many people on this board that put me to shame

Have you ever been to an Oilers game?
No. Who are they?

Have you ever played hockey?
Only on my computer. I HAVE OVECHKIN@!#@^$Q#@$WRARRR

Can you even skate?
Like a frickin bat outta hell.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
I bet you are like the goof on Mystery Alaska that got chased out of the town because he skated like a queer.
Heh. I would actually say my skating style is somewhat reminicent of Glenn Anderson...I do a lot of things on one skate, albeit with far less control. I actually used to live in Canmore, where they filmed a large number of scenes from Mystery, Alaska. In fact, the lake they play on is called "The Quarry" and it's a local swimming hole. Sadly, they are developing the area around it now to build even more houses for Canmore's growing rich-people community.

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Old
11-11-2003, 07:56 PM
  #36
Walsher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemmer
You must be a much smarter hockey mind because you have posted 300+ times?
Never said that...but I know hockey, and there are many people on this board that put me to shame
.
I admit much of that post of mine was out of anger due to the somewhat uncalled for slander on myself by you. For that I appologize it was uncalled for and quite childish. However, you seemed to mock me based solely on my limited number of posts. It doesn't make sense coming from a person with limited exposure themself. I too know hockey. I have missed only a handful of Oilers home games in the past few years since living in Edmonton and attended a large percentage while living 3 hours away prior to that. Either way your criticism of me was misguided and offbase. Like you said it is a hockey forum and my points were valid and truthful. I have nothing against any of the Oilers players. I want the best for the team like everyone else. When a player or players are contributing less than what they are capable of I make the point of criticizing them like everyone else does on these forums. These opinions are made just like in your post considering a Comrie for Draper + Fischer trade. To me that seems more offbase than any criticim of Ryan Smyth. But that is neither here nor there and I would never refer to you as a stupid hockey fan for submitting that post.

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Old
11-11-2003, 08:36 PM
  #37
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What does number of posts have to do with Hockey knowledge?
Nothing. We are all just regular people who live a regular life who love the Oil and have our own opinions.

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Old
11-11-2003, 08:42 PM
  #38
Walsher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky01
What does number of posts have to do with Hockey knowledge?
Nothing. We are all just regular people who live a regular life who love the Oil and have our own opinions.
Thats what I thought as well. I meant nothing personally by my criticism of Smytty I just had an opinion and wanted to share it. not everyone thinks he is playing to his ability and I was making that point. I didn't know my understanding of the game would be measured by my contributions to this board. Moreover, I average more than a post per day since joining which also shows since becoming a member I have been active in participating. Anyways this is all opinion anyway thats what makes it fun.

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Old
11-11-2003, 08:52 PM
  #39
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I never have been good at trade proposals though. That said, yes they are missing a valuable part of their blueline, but they don't have much up front either, with Yzerman ailing and Zetterberg out. Addition by subtraction I suppose. I don't really care to defend it, because it was just a thought, off the top of my head. Probably won't work. Too bad.

They always say, opinions are like ***holes...everybody has one. You've managed 30 in the past 45 minutes. It is kinda funny how you've managed 30+ posts in time it took me to watch 1 tv show.

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Old
11-11-2003, 09:04 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemmer
I never have been good at trade proposals though. That said, yes they are missing a valuable part of their blueline, but they don't have much up front either, with Yzerman ailing and Zetterberg out. Addition by subtraction I suppose. I don't really care to defend it, because it was just a thought, off the top of my head. Probably won't work. Too bad.

They always say, opinions are like ***holes...everybody has one. You've managed 30 in the past 45 minutes. It is kinda funny how you've managed 30+ posts in time it took me to watch 1 tv show.
Actually I only have time to post every once in a while. Thus when I do post I like to read and post lots. You are quite the beauty buddy. Once again the only thing that you can do is rip me for contributing to the board. Lonely? Definately not, but if that helps you justify some witty little joke all the power to you. I suggest that maybe you are the lonely one needing to pick pissing contests with people to satisfy some kind of fetish or something. Like I have been saying the whole time my posts were just opinions also - but I never had the balls or stupidity to take personal shots at people who disagreed with me. I am here to discuss hockey not to argue with someone about how many times they post. Your post about the wings trade was so offbase and brutal, yet no one ripped at you personally. Any hockey fan or follower would have laughed histaricaly at that proposal. And that coming from the great Hemmer poster of well over 300. You new your hockey so well you proposed the worst trade since I have been on this forum. You are right - opinions are like *** holes.... but the difference you are one!

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Old
11-11-2003, 09:37 PM
  #41
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Ok guys. Back to your corners. :p

Seriously, though. There is a big reason why you don't see exactly the same Ryan Smyth any longer.

1) He is getting older and injuries have played a role in his career certainly.

2) He has had to adapt his game continually due to the loss of Bill Guerin and now Doug Weight.

When Ryan played alongside Bill and Doug, he could afford to crash the net all the time and fight along the boards. He never had to worry about his other linemates being out of position because they were experienced. Now, his role has expanded. Ryan Smyth has to be able to setup plays at times as well as finish them. He also has to make sure someone goes back on defense should the need arise.

This center ordeal isn't helping him either. No, Smyth hasn't been playing up to potential and he has struggled this year. But he isn't the same kind of player he was before and isn't in the same role either. Naturally, his play is going to have to adapt and change accordingly.

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Old
11-11-2003, 09:49 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
Naturally, his play is going to have to adapt and change accordingly.
This is one fact that almost makes me teary eyed.. Although Smyth's passing ability is a lot better than it was previously and he is starting to become a more well-rounded hockey player, I miss the old crash into the corners Smytty! As you mentioned, this tranformation has a lot to do with the linemates he has in comparison to who he had before.. I'd love to see Smyth play on a line again with a legitimate center. I think his play will improve ten-fold if we can find someone to play pivot beside him not named Sarno (not a knock on Sarno but he's just not number one line talent in my mind).

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Old
11-12-2003, 08:00 AM
  #43
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The All-Milbury Team

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabi_sultan
palffy, torres, salo, bertuzzi, brewer and i am sure there are more anyone wanna add?

Let's see:

Redden traded for Berard

Bertuzzi and McCabe traded for Linden

Luongo and Jokinen traded for Parrish and Kvasha

Brewer traded for Hamrlik

Torres and Isbister traded for Niinimaa

Chara and Spezza traded for Yashin

Pyatt and Connolly traded for Peca

J.P. Dumont and Michael Rupp unsigned


Pyatt-Jokinen-Bertuzzi
Torres-Spezza-Isbister
Dumont-Connolly-Rupp


Redden-Chara
Brewer-McCabe


Luongo



Not a bad nucleus......................

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Old
11-12-2003, 04:08 PM
  #44
Hemmer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
Your post about the wings trade was so offbase and brutal, yet no one ripped at you personally. Any hockey fan or follower would have laughed histaricaly at that proposal.
Offbase because the value isn't there? Or offbase because it isn't going to happen. If you are referring to the latter, you might find more than a few proposals on this board that you could stack in that category. If my idea was so bad, how come others are discussing it in another thread? Granted, Fischer may not be available unless we throw in a D, but the idea behind the deal was sound. Look at it again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
You new your hockey so well you proposed the worst trade since I have been on this forum.
So, you've never read any Hab's or Leaves fans proposals then?

Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in furthering this argument with you - it takes up valuable board space and bandwidth for no good reason. Obviously, we don't agree on our assesment of Ryan Smyth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
You are right - opinions are like *** holes.... but the difference you are one!
Takes one to know one

FYI, the remark about the post count wasn't a crack at you trying to contribute. It was more a crack at the fact that I ripped you for your post count, and you went ahead and posted like 30 times, which I thought was funny. Sorry if we don't share the same sense of humor.

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