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Old
07-30-2006, 07:05 PM
  #76
Osprey
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Originally Posted by King Blazer View Post
Thanks for pulling the numbers together to support my statement...
You also ignored my first response to that statement. How is O'Sullivan "padding" his stats any different than any other star, AHL or NHL? Are you saying that abusing weak teams is "unusual" for stars? Show me one star who scored only against strong teams and not against weak teams. Every star abuses weak teams. The mark of a real star, however, is to also produce against strong teams, and O'Sullivan certainly did that, as I've shown.

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07-30-2006, 07:06 PM
  #77
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I meant to imply that winning the AHL Rookie of the Year award doesn't necessarily translate to a player having "nothing left to prove at the AHL level" as some have suggested...
Ok, if that's what you're reacting to, I can understand that. Similarly, what I'm reacting to is your seeming implication that he does have more to prove. If you're not suggesting that, then, perhaps, we do agree. I think that he has developed to the point where he will earn a spot with the Kings out of training camp. If he struggles, a return to the AHL is a possibility, but we'll cross that bridge if we come to it.

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07-30-2006, 07:15 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
You also ignored my first response to that statement. How is O'Sullivan "padding" his stats any different than any other star, AHL or NHL?
No different really....

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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
Do one's stats only count if they're against good teams?
Not on the sheets. Some of us that have been following the AHL for years tend to apply a discount to some of the stuff that shows up on sheets...

For example, the Monarchs brass spent last season bragging about how they had the fewest PMs in the league. Those of us that follow the Monarchs closely knew it was really a load of PR. Sure they had the fewest PMs, but they still had their share of minor penalties. The just weren't accumulating the 5s, 10s and games that come with fights...

Grebeshkov, a 2-time All-Star???


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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
Show me one star who scored only against good teams and not against bad teams. Every star abuses bad teams. The mark of a real star, however, is to also produce against good teams, and O'Sullivan certainly did that, as I showed.
You're point is well taken. Look, O'Sullivan is a good player, no doubt. I never said differently. What do you think about Ryan Shannon?

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Old
07-30-2006, 07:26 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
Ok, if that's what you're reacting to, I can understand that. Similarly, what I'm reacting to is your seeming implication that he does have more to prove. If you're not suggesting that, then, perhaps, we do agree. I think that he has developed to the point where he will earn a spot with the Kings out of training camp. If he struggles, a return to the AHL is a possibility, but we'll cross that bridge if we come to it.
I tend to react the the nothing left to prove statement in general. I believe that at 21 and having played one professional season, he might have more to learn....

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Old
07-30-2006, 07:28 PM
  #80
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Why is it that Osprey is so quick to point out that people do not need to "humiliate" other posters when they post, but when someone calls KB a "weasil", Osprey's compassion is no where to be found?

I'm just sayin'.

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Old
07-30-2006, 07:35 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by King Blazer View Post
What do you think about Ryan Shannon?
He must be good because he scored at the same pace as O'Sullivan, while being a rookie, himself. He's most likely not at O'Sullivan's level, though, because he scored 19 fewer goals and the large assist numbers might've been thanks to Getzlaf, Perry and Penner. He's also two years older. He's still a really good prospect, though.


Last edited by Osprey: 07-30-2006 at 07:41 PM.
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Old
07-30-2006, 07:39 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by David A. Rainer View Post
Why is it that Osprey is so quick to point out that people do not need to "humiliate" other posters when they post, but when someone calls KB a "weasil", Osprey's compassion is no where to be found?
Haha Please quit badgering me, David


Last edited by Osprey: 07-30-2006 at 07:46 PM.
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Old
07-30-2006, 07:48 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
He must be good because he scored at the same pace as O'Sullivan, while being a rookie, himself. He's most likely not at O'Sullivan's level, though, because he scored 19 fewer goals and made up the rest with assists (possibly thanks to Getzlaf, Perry and Penner). He's also two years older. He's still a really good prospect, though.
That's the catch right there, Shannon didn't really play all that much with those three....FWIW, I would have had the same "possibly" if I didn't know better...Shannon is small, but the kids got game...

As you've said, Shannon scored at the same pace as O'Sullivan. He could have been the Rookie of the Year in the AHL this season and not many folks would have had a problem with that....Well except for maybe Kings fans...


Last edited by King Blazer: 07-30-2006 at 08:03 PM.
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Old
07-30-2006, 08:07 PM
  #84
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That's the catch right there, Shannon didn't really play all that much with those three....
You know his situation better than I do. It's just that, when a player has far more assists than goals, it usually means that he's either being propped up by his linemates or he's just an exceptional playmaker (like a Weight or Gomez). The occurrance of the latter is a lot less frequent than the former, so, yeah, it's a natural concern in the beginning.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Blazer View Post
As you've said, Shannon scored at the same pace as O'Sullivan. He could have been the Rookie of the Year in the AHL this season and not many folks would have had a problem with that....Well except for maybe Kings fans...
Not with his goal total, IMO. In the NHL, goals go a really long way toward determining end-of-year awards, and I would imagine that the same holds true in the AHL. O'Sullivan also had more points and more Rookie of the Month honors. I think that he walked away with it quite handedly.


Last edited by Osprey: 07-30-2006 at 08:14 PM.
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Old
07-30-2006, 08:12 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
You know his situation better than I do. It's just that, when a player has far more assists than goals, it usually means that he's either being propped up by his linemates or he's just an exceptional playmaker (like a Weight or Gomez). The occurrance of the latter is a lot less frequent than the former, so, yeah, it's a natural concern in the beginning.
The kid is an incredible playmaker and former captain at BC...

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Old
07-30-2006, 08:16 PM
  #86
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The kid is an incredible playmaker and former captain at BC...
Good to hear. Thanks.

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Old
07-30-2006, 08:20 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
Not with his goal total, IMO. In the NHL, goals go a really long way toward determining end-of-year awards, and I would imagine that the same holds true in the AHL. O'Sullivan also had more points. I think that he walked away with it quite handedly.
He may have walked away with it, maybe not. We really don't know...

The year Briere won it, he had a lot more assists than goals BUT was probably a leading goal scorer for the league just the same...


Last edited by King Blazer: 07-30-2006 at 08:42 PM.
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Old
07-30-2006, 08:23 PM
  #88
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Ryan Shannon doesn't impress me. He played in a weak AHL last year, too. Hell, he didn't have nearly as many goals as O'Sullivan did, either.

He sucks. He should get traded to Edmonton, too.

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Old
07-30-2006, 09:45 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David A. Rainer View Post
Why is it that Osprey is so quick to point out that people do not need to "humiliate" other posters when they post, but when someone calls KB a "weasil", Osprey's compassion is no where to be found?

I'm just sayin'.
If everyone followed Osprey's personal code of conduct, this entire board would be like a giant episode of Leave It To Beaver.

When you read an Osprey post, you run it through a sieve, keeping the factual material and throwing the rest out.

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Old
07-30-2006, 10:05 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Riposte! View Post
If everyone followed Osprey's personal code of conduct, this entire board would be like a giant episode of Leave It To Beaver.

When you read an Osprey post, you run it through a sieve, keeping the factual material and throwing the rest out.
Well, gee wiz...Ward won't like this.

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Old
07-30-2006, 11:17 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Riposte! View Post
If everyone followed Osprey's personal code of conduct, this entire board would be like a giant episode of Leave It To Beaver.

When you read an Osprey post, you run it through a sieve, keeping the factual material and throwing the rest out.

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Old
07-30-2006, 11:41 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
Haha Please quit badgering me, David
I was just sayin'.

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Old
07-30-2006, 11:59 PM
  #93
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It seems like Duck prospects always end up in these kind of threads.

Fact is, even if Shannon outperformed O'Sullivan, he (Shannon) would stay in Portland for a longer period of time due to the extreme depth Anaheim has over LA.

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07-31-2006, 12:33 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by hockey nut View Post
It seems like Duck prospects always end up in these kind of threads.

Fact is, even if Shannon outperformed O'Sullivan, he (Shannon) would stay in Portland for a longer period of time due to the extreme depth Anaheim has over LA.
While the Ducks may have a deeper prospect pool than the Kings, it's not that much. I certainly wouldn't call it extreme.

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07-31-2006, 02:10 AM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockey nut View Post
It seems like Duck prospects always end up in these kind of threads.

Fact is, even if Shannon outperformed O'Sullivan, he (Shannon) would stay in Portland for a longer period of time due to the extreme depth Anaheim has over LA.
I'm sure you mean "extreme" like "snap into a Slim Jim"-extreme or "Do The Dew!"-extreme. Or maybe even Poochie's "Recycle, dudes - to the extreme"-extreme, b/c it's just tired and incendiary to say that the Ducks prospect pool, which is very good, has "extreme" depth over LA. It's close, and one team nudges barely ahead based on opinion, but it's not "extreme".

/Return thread to actual topic

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Old
07-31-2006, 02:23 AM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riposte! View Post
If everyone followed Osprey's personal code of conduct, this entire board would be like a giant episode of Leave It To Beaver.

When you read an Osprey post, you run it through a sieve, keeping the factual material and throwing the rest out.
I'm not sure if this is a backhanded compliment or a flame attempt, but I would put it out there that w/o a couple of posters here that actually rely on facts and logical argument, we'd end up with a forum full of this kinda drivel.

And yes, I did read all 11 pages. It's like a car wreck... I admit, I couldn't help myself after the first post...

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Old
07-31-2006, 02:28 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Riposte! View Post
If everyone followed Osprey's personal code of conduct, this entire board would be like a giant episode of Leave It To Beaver.

When you read an Osprey post, you run it through a sieve, keeping the factual material and throwing the rest out.
Osprey is one funny girl.

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Old
07-31-2006, 06:10 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by hockey nut View Post
It seems like Duck prospects always end up in these kind of threads.

Fact is, even if Shannon outperformed O'Sullivan, he (Shannon) would stay in Portland for a longer period of time due to the extreme depth Anaheim has over LA.
To be clear, (and it doesn't seem that you're suggesting it) I didn't bring up Shannon because he's a Duck prospect. Rather that when you look at the rookie scoring in the AHL last season, Shannon and O'Sullivan finished out in front. Also because Shannon came out of BC and was a captain there. Something that he has in common with Harrold and Boyle...


Last edited by King Blazer: 07-31-2006 at 07:25 AM.
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Old
07-31-2006, 09:06 AM
  #99
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He didn't say that. Although, if he did, there are a few of us around here who would agree.

He just said that Frolov needed to produce more. And apparently he indicated to GM that he would be open to trading Frolov.

And as has been mentioned (and this is purely opinion), you get the sense that DL does have some of the issues with Frolov's character as he did with Demitra's.
He said it after the breakfast was over.

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Old
07-31-2006, 09:19 AM
  #100
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He said it after the breakfast was over.
I wasn't discrediting your claim...I believe that he spoke to you afterwards.

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