HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Atlantic division

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-24-2006, 08:32 AM
  #26
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryGigantic View Post
Despite an arguably stronger team on paper than last year, I think the Rangers will finish in fourth place -- gasp! -- and will struggle for points in the low 90's. I have a very strong feeling Jagr's shoulder will continue to pay negative karmic dividends and trouble him all year -- causing him to miss a lot of games and be frustrated in the games he does play. No way does he repeat 123 points, in fact, I'm predicting under 100 points, possibly significantly under.
Jagr is a proven point producer plus Rangers do not have to rely on him like they did last season. I am surprised that you point out Jagrs injury but neglected Elias health problem. Rangers added a few good character players on both offense and defense who will produce. Devils will have to subtract one or two player(s), plus you are not a deep low scoring team.
P.S I suggest you check Rangers current roster, check moves they made this summer before yapping.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryGigantic View Post
But relative to the other elite teams in the Eastern conference, Philly's defense pretty much sucks and their goalie situaiton is unremarkable. And despite the "new rules" NHL, the play of all six players counts towards the results. So this is at least as big a question mark as the salary cap is with Jersey, and even with an injured Matvichuk, the Devils "D" is better all around and add Marty and the Madden/Pando "shut down" line -- and this really is "strength against strength" and should lead to some epic battles.
Flyers defense is a concern but I believe it will be addressed during the season Clarke will make one move on D and Flyers defense will be better then Devils D. I seriously doubt that Madden/Pando will be able to shut down 3 scoring lines Rangers have andd Flyers have 4. Devils will have one line.

1. RANGERS/FLYERS
2. DEVILS
PENGUINS
ISLANDERS

Enjoy...


Last edited by Kaktus*: 08-24-2006 at 09:32 AM.
Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 08:51 AM
  #27
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryGigantic View Post

Despite an arguably stronger team on paper than last year, I think the Rangers will finish in fourth place -- gasp! -- and will struggle for points in the low 90's. I have a very strong feeling Jagr's shoulder will continue to pay negative karmic dividends and trouble him all year -- causing him to miss a lot of games and be frustrated in the games he does play. No way does he repeat 123 points, in fact, I'm predicting under 100 points, possibly significantly under. And without his production at the highest level, the young roster will be a headless snake, the life wrung out of it. And with the high expectatons of the New York media and fanbase, it has the makings of another glorious fiasco season. They may have a better core, but their youth and questionable leadership at the top will be exposed -- and the media will kill them for it (a la Arod...). No playoffs, again, I'm afraid, for the Blueskirts. The status quo asserted back into place, rightfully, despite their up and coming goalie, improved depth and relative youth.

And bringing up the rear, for another year, the now perrenial fifth place Islanders. They made only marginal improvements to a terrible team, have a streaky goalie that doesn't measure up, and a front office that is a well discussed travesty. They will try hard, compete every night, and finish a few points ahead of their performance last season. But will ultimately disappoint.

In conclusion;

DEVILS*
FLYERS*
PENGUINS*
RANGERS
ISLANDERS

(*Playoffs)

Enjoy...

Speaking of taking the galsses off Jerry you now predict even the Pens from finishing ahead of the NYR's? That's some unbiased posting if I ever saw it.

Elias is going to get 115 but Jagr will struggle to reach 100 and may get significantly less?

The Rangers are significantly deeper than last yrs squad, especially on the blueline, and especially when they fill out the roster with the SIX million they have yet to spend on even further upgrades to this years roster.

So while the Devils will have Elias for a full season that is negated by that fact that they will have to cast off some core guys to get under the cap by camp so while your going to have to take away 5-6 million from you roster the rangers will be ADDING 5-6 million in improvements to a roster that was already more complete then last years was.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 10:04 AM
  #28
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,655
vCash: 500
Awards:
Interesting takes. Jagr will become a dud for reasons ranging from a model not returning his phone calls to karma. Truly facinating.

On the flip side Elias is a lock for 105-115 points (a level he's never even come close to approaching).

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 11:04 AM
  #29
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Interesting takes. Jagr will become a dud for reasons ranging from a model not returning his phone calls to karma. Truly facinating.

On the flip side Elias is a lock for 105-115 points (a level he's never even come close to approaching).
go ask cap fans how he took getting dumped a couple of years ago. personally, i think the much more likely scenario is that you do not get the goaltending you got the first 3/4 of the season... however, if Henrik is as good as he was during that stretch, then you'll be very tough.

Elias' production coming off of illness impressed everyone i think. i'm not enamoured with the Devs until i see what Lou does with that roster.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 11:12 AM
  #30
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,655
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
go ask cap fans how he took getting dumped a couple of years ago. personally, i think the much more likely scenario is that you do not get the goaltending you got the first 3/4 of the season... however, if Henrik is as good as he was during that stretch, then you'll be very tough.

Elias' production coming off of illness impressed everyone i think. i'm not enamoured with the Devs until i see what Lou does with that roster.

Say what you will about Jagr's play in WAS, he was still a point-per-game or better player for the Caps.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 12:45 PM
  #31
BringBackStevens
Registered User
 
BringBackStevens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 12,847
vCash: 500
i'll never understand the unnecisary criticism jagr gets around here. sounds like jealousy. he's and elite player and will be again this season

BringBackStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 01:11 PM
  #32
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 15,981
vCash: 500
I believe all three teams will make the playoffs. And I do like the Rangers to win the division this time. They made a couple of good moves. However, I thought many of the Rangers played over their heads last season, not talking about Jagar or Lundqvist, more on the defensive side and their third and fourth lines where great for the first three quarters of the season. It will be interesting to see if a number of these players repeat those efforts.

As for the Devils, I also need to wait and see what Lou does; however, I don't believe they will lose one of their core players. They already have $2.2 in I.R. money coming off the cap from injuries to Matvichuck and Wiemer and another $2.2 million for McGillis. And regarding the Flyers, they do have some defensive and goaltending questions but are still a very good team. Should be another fun year in the Atlantic.

Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 01:29 PM
  #33
BobbyClarkeFan16
Registered User
 
BobbyClarkeFan16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: London Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kz View Post
i'll never understand the unnecessary criticism jagr gets around here. sounds like jealousy. he's and elite player and will be again this season
Exactly. Of all teams, we're the last people who should be criticizing Jagr. The last time this team had a 100 point scorer was over 10 seasons ago. Eric Lindros had 115 points back in 1995-1996 and nobody has come close since then. The last time we had a forward who averaged a point per game, other than the 2005-2006 season was the 2000-2001 season. So, I think Jagr's performance is the last thing anyone on this board can argue about because he's outperformed every single Flyer player during the past ten years.

BobbyClarkeFan16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 01:48 PM
  #34
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Exactly. Of all teams, we're the last people who should be criticizing Jagr. The last time this team had a 100 point scorer was over 10 seasons ago. Eric Lindros had 115 points back in 1995-1996 and nobody has come close since then. The last time we had a forward who averaged a point per game, other than the 2005-2006 season was the 2000-2001 season. So, I think Jagr's performance is the last thing anyone on this board can argue about because he's outperformed every single Flyer player during the past ten years.
i'll take Flyers team record over the record of Jagr's teams over that stretch.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 02:18 PM
  #35
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
i'll take Flyers team record over the record of Jagr's teams over that stretch.
I guess Jagr;s team winning 2 Cups is lost in that equation then.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 02:51 PM
  #36
BobbyClarkeFan16
Registered User
 
BobbyClarkeFan16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: London Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
i'll take Flyers team record over the record of Jagr's teams over that stretch.
And once again, you fail to read the entire statement. Why doesn't that surprise me? Bias aside, Jagr has outperformed every Flyer player over that tenure and it isn't even debatable. Even during his Washington stint, he outperformed every Flyer player. It's not even close. Give your pathetic argument a rest. People were talking about individual performances and during the past ten years, not one Flyer player has come close to the individual performances that Jagr has had.


Last edited by BobbyClarkeFan16: 08-24-2006 at 03:00 PM.
BobbyClarkeFan16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 03:23 PM
  #37
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
And once again, you fail to read the entire statement. Why doesn't that surprise me? Bias aside, Jagr has outperformed every Flyer player over that tenure and it isn't even debatable. Even during his Washington stint, he outperformed every Flyer player. It's not even close. Give your pathetic argument a rest. People were talking about individual performances and during the past ten years, not one Flyer player has come close to the individual performances that Jagr has had.
i quoted your ENTIRE statement. your statement was that no individual player on the Flyer roster had outperformed Jagr over that stretch. so what... our team outperformed his team.

Jagr has outperformed a LOT of players on a LOT of good teams... great for him. Peyton Manning outperforms a lot of people too.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 03:27 PM
  #38
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
I guess Jagr;s team winning 2 Cups is lost in that equation then.
ah... they weren't in that stretch. outside of that... he wasn't exactly alone on those squads... and his teams haven't seen a ton of playoff success since then.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 03:35 PM
  #39
JerryGigantic
Respect Patrik
 
JerryGigantic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New York
Country: Ireland
Posts: 6,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Interesting takes. Jagr will become a dud for reasons ranging from a model not returning his phone calls to karma. Truly facinating.

On the flip side Elias is a lock for 105-115 points (a level he's never even come close to approaching).
I loathe Jagr for a number of reasons, as he has had a history of strecthes of unmotivated play and of quitting on teams, he is a diva and despite monster HOF-style career numbers lacks the leadership gene, and I will readily admit this has been expanded a thousand fold since he joined the Rangers -- as it went from just disliking him just as a lifelong hockey fan, for submarining the Capitals and Pens, among other inglorious moments, to him being the much overhyped centerpiece of the biggest rival of my favorite team.

But my comments and predictions were not about a healthy Jagr, who was a machine last season and but for a late season swan dive should have won the Hart (probably still should have), nor did I make silly suggestions about model girlfriends as the potential reason for his diminished production this upcoming season (although I did find those very entertaining), but rather point to his injured shoulder -- which is still significantly bothering him -- and will bother him that much more after being run, and run, and run next season. Which will happen. That is how the game of hockey is played and why teams tend to leave accounts of injuries deliberately vague.

And without the ability to lift a stick, his production will go from best in the conference to zero every game he is out (which I think will be a significant number of games). What will play out in ACTUAL REALITY we are going to watch together...but that is what I think will happen. I didn't beat my chest, saying "oooooo look out for such and such Devil player, he's coming for you...", as I think every team in the division has it in their best interest to go for that shoulder. Cleanly if possible, and in the context of how the game is played, but test it again and again none the less. As a Jagr-less Rangers will lose hope quickly, as no combination of role players equal him.

Personally, I think a healthy Elias could give a healthy Jagr a run for his money this year, but I am huge fan of one and not the other, and without the help of my own homer glasses that is hard to say in light of the statistical history. But if JJ is in street clothes, the debate is moot.

Hence the fourth place prediction. If he puts up 123 points again, this does not hold up. I am saying he won't due to injury. (Not because I dislike him.)

JerryGigantic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 04:01 PM
  #40
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
i quoted your ENTIRE statement. your statement was that no individual player on the Flyer roster had outperformed Jagr over that stretch. so what... our team outperformed his team.

Jagr has outperformed a LOT of players on a LOT of good teams... great for him. Peyton Manning outperforms a lot of people too.
Yeah, I'm sure you wouldn't LOVE to have Jagr on your squad, right?

Say whatever you want but the guy is simply a machine and one of the most dominate players ever to play the game.

And once again, the guy has 2 Cups since entering the league so trying to compare him individually vs the entire Flyer Org doesn't work in your favor either so I'd let that one be as well.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 04:15 PM
  #41
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
Yeah, I'm sure you wouldn't LOVE to have Jagr on your squad, right?

Say whatever you want but the guy is simply a machine and one of the most dominate players ever to play the game.

And once again, the guy has 2 Cups since entering the league so trying to compare him individually vs the entire Flyer Org doesn't work in your favor either so I'd let that one be as well.
2 Cups with Pittsburgh don't get much done for you in NYC, do they? that's completely asinine.

sure, i'd like to have Jagr on this team... that isn't really the point. the point was it's ridiculous to sit there and chastise the Flyers, which is essentially what he was doing, for not having someone that outperformed Jagr through those years when the Flyers consistently, as a team, outperformed the teams that Jagr was playing for.

not to mention that Lindros at his height was just as, if not more, effective as Jagr... he was simply injured more.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 04:20 PM
  #42
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
2 Cups with Pittsburgh don't get much done for you in NYC, do they? that's completely asinine.

sure, i'd like to have Jagr on this team... that isn't really the point. the point was it's ridiculous to sit there and chastise the Flyers, which is essentially what he was doing, for not having someone that outperformed Jagr through those years when the Flyers consistently, as a team, outperformed the teams that Jagr was playing for.

not to mention that Lindros at his height was just as, if not more, effective as Jagr... he was simply injured more.
So that's completely assinine but trying to compare Jagr vs an entire franchise is not?

And then to discount his 2 Cups when the Flyers haven't won one since the early '70's just continues in that same path.

And please don't try and compare Lindros' career to that of Jagr because it is just ridiculous.

I can see there is no point in trying to continue this one...later.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 04:28 PM
  #43
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
So that's completely assinine but trying to compare Jagr vs an entire franchise is not?

And then to discount his 2 Cups when the Flyers haven't won one since the early '70's just continues in that same path.

And please don't try and compare Lindros' career to that of Jagr because it is just ridiculous.

I can see there is no point in trying to continue this one...later.
i wasn't comparing... he was critical of THE FLYERS. my point was that it is idiotic to get on their players over that span because they didn't match-up with Jagr (almost no one does) in that time period, given that they were largely BETTER than any team that Jagr was on. isn't as if we're talking about a team that was failing to win games.

1) those cups came OUTSIDE OF THE F-ING TIME PERIOD WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

2) those cups have NOTHING to do with the year 2006-2007.

i focused to Lindros at his apex... i hate Lindros and his career has become of a joke due to a multitude of issues brought on both by injury and himself and his parents. however, at his HEIGHT, the comparison btwn Jagr and Lindros was an easy one, and an applicable one...

yes... go away.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 04:31 PM
  #44
Gert B Frobe
Registered User
 
Gert B Frobe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE PA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,635
vCash: 500
1. Flyers (can't possibly have as many injuries and much improved forwards)

2. Devils (Brodeur could get the River Rats into the post season)

3. Rangers (Lundqvist will keep them close)

out of the playoffs:

4. Penguins (one or two more players makes this team suck a little bit less)

5. Islanders (yuck)


Last edited by Gert B Frobe: 08-24-2006 at 08:25 PM.
Gert B Frobe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 05:11 PM
  #45
BobbyClarkeFan16
Registered User
 
BobbyClarkeFan16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: London Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
i wasn't comparing... he was critical of THE FLYERS. my point was that it is idiotic to get on their players over that span because they didn't match-up with Jagr (almost no one does) in that time period, given that they were largely BETTER than any team that Jagr was on. isn't as if we're talking about a team that was failing to win games.

1) those cups came OUTSIDE OF THE F-ING TIME PERIOD WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

2) those cups have NOTHING to do with the year 2006-2007.

i focused to Lindros at his apex... i hate Lindros and his career has become of a joke due to a multitude of issues brought on both by injury and himself and his parents. however, at his HEIGHT, the comparison btwn Jagr and Lindros was an easy one, and an applicable one...

yes... go away.
God, you whine like a little b-itch. Fact of the matter is that during the past ten years, there hasn't been a Flyers forward who has even compared to what Jagr has done. That's not slamming the Flyers, that's telling it like it is. Lindros had one comparable season to Jagr. And what happened in 1995 - 1996? That's right, the Flyers got eliminated in the opening round, yet again. Fact is fact. Jagr has been a more dominant player in those ten years than any other Flyers hockey player. Once again, I don't see how that's bashing the team. We haven't had a superstar on our roster like Jagr, and that includes Forsberg. Even during the poor days in Washington, Jagr outperformed every Flyers forward that we had. That's a statistical fact. Heaven forbid someone has a differing view point on the Flyers than what you do. Would you like a blanket to go along with crib? Maybe need your diaper changed. God damn man, just grow up a little bit.


Last edited by BobbyClarkeFan16: 08-24-2006 at 05:23 PM.
BobbyClarkeFan16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 07:43 PM
  #46
Pens75
Pens Fan Since 1975
 
Pens75's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Duquesne Gardens
Country: United States
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountaineer View Post
1. Flyers (can't possibly have as many injuries and much improved forwards)

2. Devils (Brodeur could get the River Rats into the post season)

3. Rangers (Lundqvist will keep them close)

out of the playoffs:

4. Capitals (AO will get even better)

5. Penguins (one or two more players makes this team suck a little bit less)

6. Islanders (yuck)
Hate to break it to you... Capitals are not in the Atlantic Division. There are only 5 teams.

Pens75 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-24-2006, 08:24 PM
  #47
Gert B Frobe
Registered User
 
Gert B Frobe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE PA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,635
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybax View Post
Hate to break it to you... Capitals are not in the Atlantic Division. There are only 5 teams.
it's been a long week...

Gert B Frobe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-25-2006, 07:05 AM
  #48
JerryGigantic
Respect Patrik
 
JerryGigantic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New York
Country: Ireland
Posts: 6,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybax View Post
Hate to break it to you... Capitals are not in the Atlantic Division. There are only 5 teams.
But those were the days... With "Jagr being Jagr", not wanting to play anymore...

JerryGigantic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-25-2006, 10:28 AM
  #49
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryGigantic View Post
But those were the days... With "Jagr being Jagr", not wanting to play anymore...
When Elias gets at least one Art Ross then maybe we start comparing those two. Jagr has 5, not easy to do. He had a few bad seasons producing decent points.

Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-25-2006, 10:43 AM
  #50
Roger's Pancreas*
 
Roger's Pancreas*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,363
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Roger's Pancreas*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
When Elias gets at least one Art Ross then maybe we start comparing those two. Jagr has 5, not easy to do. He had a few bad seasons producing decent points.
Five Art Ross trophies and only a single Hart to show for it. How appropriate.

Roger's Pancreas* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:04 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.