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how will Lindros's career ultimately be assessed?

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Old
08-27-2006, 08:27 AM
  #26
12# Peter Bondra
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Well, Stevie Y should have been there in my opinion.

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08-27-2006, 08:58 AM
  #27
Hawker14
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i think lindros' career will be viewed for what it was in his later years.

too bad, as he was an elite player (possibly best in the world for a few seasons) who did in fact achieve his terrific potential. unfortunately injuries took their toll, and he became a shell of his former self.

had he retired in 2000, i have no doubt he'd get into the hall, as he was as good a player as neely, if not better, in their primes. unfortunately, his play after 2000 has not been at an elite level which has hurt the perception of his career, especially among those too young to see him live in his prime.

i don't think he'll get elected to the hall, nor be remembered by many as one of the game's best which is unfortunate. i will remember him though, like i do pavel bure, as one of the game's best ever.

as for the off ice stuff that took place in philly, i don't forget what the flyers did to dave babych, so i'm not quite so quick to jump all over lindros.

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08-27-2006, 09:01 AM
  #28
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double post,sry

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08-27-2006, 12:44 PM
  #29
jiggs 10
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Lindros was a fairly dominating player for 3 years. Never did score 50 goals, however. Not even in a "lower-scoring" era that saw other players do it who were supposedly inferior to him. Only got 100 points once. Yes, he missed a lot of games in some seasons, but in my opinion he will be remembered as a great talent who never reached his potential due to many reasons: he was a baby, his style of play came back to haunt him, his attitude, messing around with Brind'Amour's wife, concussions, etc. He could have been a top 75 player all-time, had he stayed healthy longer. He WAS better than Cam Neely (who should NOT be in the HOF), but was not much better. Had he kept his head up, his stick down, and played in Quebec with Sakic at the get-go, he very well could have had a completely different career. But we'll never know.

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08-27-2006, 01:20 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger Bob View Post
He made Team Canada, fresh out of the OHL.

http://www.hhof.com/html/TeamRosterCCUP1991CAN.shtml

No Stevie Y, Pierre Turgeon (with good reason!) or Joe Nieuwendyk on that squad.
Yep. I vaguely remember one team looking into trying to draft him when he was a 16 year old!

Phrase I remember summer he was drafted was "a combination of Messier and Lemieux". It's a shame that he suffered so many injuries; our loss.

Does talk to the "skill" of knowing how to pace yourself on the ice. Some of his injuries were surely unavoidable, but the guy was pretty reckless (carefree) and didn't always play smart when it came to sparing his body unnecessary stress in high traffic areas of the ice. Not suggesting he should have ever played a wimpy perimeter game, however, there is a reason why some of the greats endure long-term - they pick their spots (and keep their head up).

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08-27-2006, 03:37 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Actually, the player I was referring to was Clark Gillies and the dynasty was the NY Islanders. Was not talking about Neely at all, sorry for the confusion.
That's good, I think disagreeing with something in one of your posts is a sign of the apocalypse. I never saw Gillies play so when I read "premiere power forward" in a HOF debate 9 times out of 10 it refers to Neely.

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08-27-2006, 03:41 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Does talk to the "skill" of knowing how to pace yourself on the ice. Some of his injuries were surely unavoidable, but the guy was pretty reckless (carefree) and didn't always play smart when it came to sparing his body unnecessary stress in high traffic areas of the ice. Not suggesting he should have ever played a wimpy perimeter game, however, there is a reason why some of the greats endure long-term - they pick their spots (and keep their head up).
I think this was all a part of Lindros's game. His recklessness amounted to more spectacular goals than injuries, but that's a game of attrition someone with his body can't play. His game was, to bring in another cliche, played on the edge. He was fast, big, skilled, and strong and could do things virtually nobody else could do. He just didn't have the skull to match.

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08-27-2006, 04:03 PM
  #33
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He'll be remembered for what could have been, but in time people may remember what he was like between 94 and 99. He was one of the most dominant hockey players I've ever seen, even with all the "what if's". He was the biggest, badest, meanest, most gifted player in the world for a time (well Jagr was pretty gifted too). He could go through you, he could go around you, or if he really wanted to he could end your season.

For me as a Flyers fan, I will remember the great times. I will remember Lindros against the Rangers in '97, his hit on Andreas Dackell, his first fight against Scott Stevens, and how much I enjoyed watching him play the game. There hasn't been a player like Lindros since Eric came in and there might not be for some time in the future, he was pretty special.

If Lindros had retired in '00, I think he would have been lock for the HOF even with some of the negative connotations associated with his name at that time. He had, I believe, the 5th highest PPG in history playing in the "dead puck" era. He was the most physical player in the league and he made everyone around him better, what else could you ask for (I know, for him to stay healthy)? If Cam Neely's in, Eric Lindros should be a mortal lock. Outside of putting the puck in the net, I'm not sure there was anything Cam Neely did better then Eric Lindros. He might not get in, but he'll have been better then many who are.

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08-27-2006, 09:10 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by jiggs 10 View Post
Lindros was a fairly dominating player for 3 years. Never did score 50 goals, however. Not even in a "lower-scoring" era that saw other players do it who were supposedly inferior to him. Only got 100 points once. Yes, he missed a lot of games in some seasons, but in my opinion he will be remembered as a great talent who never reached his potential due to many reasons: he was a baby, his style of play came back to haunt him, his attitude, messing around with Brind'Amour's wife, concussions, etc. He could have been a top 75 player all-time, had he stayed healthy longer. He WAS better than Cam Neely (who should NOT be in the HOF), but was not much better. Had he kept his head up, his stick down, and played in Quebec with Sakic at the get-go, he very well could have had a completely different career. But we'll never know.
i think it's misleading to judge him by his lack of 50 goal seasons. he had 5 seasons ('92-'97 where he was on pace for at least 50, and he did have four 40 goal seasons. forsberg in comparison, in his best season, only scored 30 goals. and putting lindros down because he only had 1 100 point season sort of loses it's merit when forsberg, who is seemingly universally regarded as having a superior career has a grand total of 2.

you make a good point about what would have happened had lindros played in quebec with sakic, sundin, nolan et all - it's hard to say the nords (or avs if they still were sold out by aubut) wouldn't still have won cups. there would've been alot of talent on those teams. if lindros had won a Cup in the career he put up i doubt there'd be any question as to his hall of fame status today.

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08-27-2006, 09:15 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by 12# Peter Bondra View Post
Well, Stevie Y should have been there in my opinion.
he would've been if possible.

"Canada's great depth was besides the fact that Lemieux, Ray Bourque, Steve Yzerman, Adam Oates, Joe Sakic, Patrick Roy and Cam Neely all missed the tournament for various reasons."

http://www3.telus.net/worldcuphockey/1991page.html

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08-27-2006, 09:50 PM
  #36
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Thats a good call Kruez. Jerk or not, for a short while his numbers were at an elite level and its not like he was a one year wonder. Even more than stats, he dominated like very few have IMO. In the end, I'll take Lindros at his best over Neely and alot of other players in the Hall but thats not to say that he belongs there. IMO he's getting badly undervalued because of the way he's going out.
Definetaly, I think he had the ability to be better than Jagr at his peak, and I think its becoming clear that Jagr is a top 25 player all time, therefore I think Lindros could definetaly have been top 20. That all said, just because he was better than a certain player in the HHOF is a brutal reason to put a player in I think, making the HHOF should be based on many more things than simply being statistically better than someone else.

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08-27-2006, 10:59 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
I wouldn't put Lindros in the Hall, but if Neely is in Lindros should be in as well. Lindros was a much better hockey player than Neely. Both should be out.

u I like

got into a hell of a fight about Neely going in

He should not go in

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08-28-2006, 02:17 AM
  #38
jiggs 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawker14 View Post
i think it's misleading to judge him by his lack of 50 goal seasons. he had 5 seasons ('92-'97 where he was on pace for at least 50, and he did have four 40 goal seasons. forsberg in comparison, in his best season, only scored 30 goals. and putting lindros down because he only had 1 100 point season sort of loses it's merit when forsberg, who is seemingly universally regarded as having a superior career has a grand total of 2.

you make a good point about what would have happened had lindros played in quebec with sakic, sundin, nolan et all - it's hard to say the nords (or avs if they still were sold out by aubut) wouldn't still have won cups. there would've been alot of talent on those teams. if lindros had won a Cup in the career he put up i doubt there'd be any question as to his hall of fame status today.
I never put him up against Forsberg (although if I did, Lindros would lose). I just said he never scored 50 goals in a season, while players like Ray Sheppard and Adam Graves did it. Are they considered greater players? No. But Forsberg IS better than Lindros in every aspect of the game, if that's who you want me to compare him to. A better skater, passer, stickhandler, checker, scorer, leader. Both cannot seem to stay healthy, due to their styles of play, but Forsberg is a much better all-around player in his prime than Lindros was. Because Lindros is a Canadien, he was given much better press in North America, but real hockey fans know the truth: Forsberg is the better hockey player.

But back on topic: We'll never know what Lindros could have been, because his reckless style of play led to his numerous injuries and concussions. He was among the most hated players in the NHL (due to his permanently high stick) for a few years, but his peak was only 4 years. Not enough to warrent consideration for the HOF by any stretch of the imagination.

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08-28-2006, 03:32 AM
  #39
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he was hyped as the next lemieux

think about the trade, a number one goaltender, a first round pick, a future team captain and the top player in Europe to come along since Stastny.

since i was too young when mario was in the QMJHL, i would say that Lindros is the most hyped amateur in my lifetime including Ovechkin and Crosby because it started earlier with Lindros.

there was a period where he could have been considered the best player in the league and certainly top five but he did a lot of *****ing, had a bunch of concussions and all in all did live up to the hype. i mean there is no question that forsberg has had a better career and he has not exactly been the picture of health.

the neely comparison isnt there either, neely was a model player on the ice where as lindros was a whiner; that mentality (among other things) affected Lindros' consistency even when healthy, i think.

is he HHOF material? probably, but he didnt make a lot of friends so it will not be easy for him to get in. there are guys in every sport who CLEARLY deserve to get in but dont because they are jerks (or perceived that way); best example i can think of is adrian dantley in the nba.

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