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Old
11-15-2003, 12:15 PM
  #1
Jamie
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Seriesof trades...

Well seeing Mowzie's awful attempt(no offense) at trying to make a series of trades to help the Oilers, I thought I'd have my go at it and see if I can do any better.

#1 - Comrie for Hannan (SJ)

#2 - Chimera and Salmalainen for Noronen (Buffalo)

#3 - Horcoff and Laraque for Stefan (Atlanta)

#4 - Ferguson for a 4th rounder (anybody)

#5 - Salo for Charlie Stephens (Colorado)

Reasons for both teams:
#1: Ricci and Damphousse are probably gone at the deadline, maybe sooner, and they're going to need a center, they've allready said they were interested. For Edmonton, our defense sucks big time. Hannan is a very good defensive defensman, low salary and is young, perfect fit. And value wise, is worth less than Stuart so this looks very feasible IMO.

#2: Buffalo has to many goalies. Biron is their starter and they'd be fine with Miller as their backup, getting additional NHL playing time. Dumont, Briere, Drury and Pyatt is a good group of young guys for the top 2 lines, but it looks like Satan is on his way out of there, meaning they essiantly have 4 guys for the top 2 lines. Kotalik can go there, but he's nothing special. Chimera fills in the 6th spot, as they really don't have an LW's. Salmalainen would make their roster for sure IMO, proably as a 4th liner, but they definetly could use him, he's young and talented. Hate to deal him off, but Noronen is worth it.

#3: Stefan seems to be out of favour in Atlanta, and supposedly, they have been interested in aquiring Horcoff. As far as I know Atlanta does not really have an enforcer. Cowan maybe... Laraque is no longer a useful forward hear in Edmonton IMO. He tries to play a game that's just not in him and it's hurtign the Oilers. I love BG, but he either needs to know his role, or get out of here.

#4: If we could get a 4th for Ferguson, I'd be happy.

#5: Dangerous dealing Salo to a team in our own division, but he's sucked for us, and is overpaid. I'd rather give the time to Noronen and Conks. His value isn't all that high like it was a year or two ago, but I think we could probably snag Stephens for the Av's who's a pretty good young center.

And the mandatory new lines after trade proposals...

Smyth-Stefan-Hemsky
Torres-York-Dvorak
Moreau-Reasoner-Pisani
Isbister-Stephens-Rita

Brewer-Semenov
Hannan-Staios
Cross-Smith

Noronen
Conklin

PB Stoll, Sarno, Bergeron
I feel that with that set of forwards, injuries would not be a problem no matter where. Any one from that 4th line can easily step into a top 6 role. Stoll can replace Reasoner, Sarno can fill in where needed. Bergeron would be alternating with Semenov in the lineup anyways. Hate to have cut him, as I'd prefer him in over Cross, but thats politics.

Alright, now bash away, please and thank you

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Old
11-15-2003, 12:18 PM
  #2
LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
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Scott Hannan....c'mon now. Not to bash but if we got that in return, Lowe should be fired on the spot and never allowed to GM in this league again.

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11-15-2003, 12:32 PM
  #3
boxall9
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Comrie for Hannan?
Are you drunk? There has been talk about Frolov and you think Hannan would be fair? I highly doubt it, I didn't get to read the other trades because this one floored me!

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11-15-2003, 12:40 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxall9
Comrie for Hannan?
Are you drunk? There has been talk about Frolov and you think Hannan would be fair? I highly doubt it, I didn't get to read the other trades because this one floored me!
Have you ever seen Hannan play? He's exactly what this team needs. Frolov is an offensive LW, we don't need any more of those. Also, I doubt that LA ever offered Lowe that. I've seen some rumours of Comrie for Stefan and Coburn which is absolutely ridiculous, Lowe couldn't get a pick to take Suter or Coburn at last years draft, so why would they throw in Stefan now? Hannan for Comrie is fair value. Comrie is not Hemsky.

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11-15-2003, 12:44 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie
Have you ever seen Hannan play? He's exactly what this team needs. Frolov is an offensive LW, we don't need any more of those. Also, I doubt that LA ever offered Lowe that. I've seen some rumours of Comrie for Stefan and Coburn which is absolutely ridiculous, Lowe couldn't get a pick to take Suter or Coburn at last years draft, so why would they throw in Stefan now? Hannan for Comrie is fair value. Comrie is not Hemsky.
The chances of Hannan coming in and solving the Oilers problems is zero! He is good but he is not worth Comrie, Comrie would fetch way more in a trade than that. Horcoff for Hannan, ok, Comrie, no way! Have you ever seen Comrie play?

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11-15-2003, 12:49 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie
I've seen some rumours of Comrie for Stefan and Coburn which is absolutely ridiculous, Lowe couldn't get a pick to take Suter or Coburn at last years draft, so why would they throw in Stefan now? Hannan for Comrie is fair value. Comrie is not Hemsky.
The way I remember it (correct me if I am wrong) was that when Lowe tried to move up for the pick, the asking price at the other end was for Comrie. That was how this whole "will Comrie be traded" stuff got started.

At that time, Lowe wasn't about to deal the kid and the offer fell apart. I am assuming at that point Lowe figured Comrie was going to be re-signed.

Now that Comrie is intent on moving on, there is no reason to assume that he won't still fetch a Stefan and Coburn imo.

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11-15-2003, 12:51 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxall9
The chances of Hannan coming in and solving the Oilers problems is zero! He is good but he is not worth Comrie, Comrie would fetch way more in a trade than that. Horcoff for Hannan, ok, Comrie, no way! Have you ever seen Comrie play?
lmao. Nevermind... if you could ever get Hannan for Horcoff as a GM, you would be god. You are highly overrating the Oilers players here.

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11-15-2003, 01:07 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie
lmao. Nevermind... if you could ever get Hannan for Horcoff as a GM, you would be god. You are highly overrating the Oilers players here.
You're incredibly highly overrating Scott Hannan........to say the least.

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11-15-2003, 01:14 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
You're incredibly highly overrating Scott Hannan........to say the least.
I don't think so, Hannan is a highly underrated player, he is used up against the oppositions top lines and is an extremely valuable asset.

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11-15-2003, 01:15 PM
  #10
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Originally Posted by Boomhower
I don't think so, Hannan is a highly underrated player, he is used up against the oppositions top lines and is an extremely valuable asset.
A valuable asset would indicate limited availability. There are an alot of Hannan-type or better defencemen out there. That's why you don't make that kind of deal. A very limited commodity for a fairly abundant commodity. No way.

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Old
11-15-2003, 01:19 PM
  #11
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most of those seem fine but I have 5 problems-
1)As much as I want to Rita in the line-up he is not in for a reason and has not earned it there is no guarantee that he can cut it.
2)Rw depth on the 4th line is kind of shallow.
3)Damn it! I want Stoll playing , 4th line atleast
4)I prefer these d-pairings:
Brewer-Hannan
Staios-Smith
Cross-Semenov
5)I think were over-paying for both Stefan and Noronen I would like some picks back and would prefer not to deal Salemelainen

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Old
11-15-2003, 02:25 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie
Well seeing Mowzie's awful attempt(no offense) at trying to make a series of trades to help the Oilers, I thought I'd have my go at it and see if I can do any better.

#1 - Comrie for Hannan (SJ)

#2 - Chimera and Salmalainen for Noronen (Buffalo)

#3 - Horcoff and Laraque for Stefan (Atlanta)

#4 - Ferguson for a 4th rounder (anybody)

#5 - Salo for Charlie Stephens (Colorado)

Reasons for both teams:
#1: Ricci and Damphousse are probably gone at the deadline, maybe sooner, and they're going to need a center, they've allready said they were interested. For Edmonton, our defense sucks big time. Hannan is a very good defensive defensman, low salary and is young, perfect fit. And value wise, is worth less than Stuart so this looks very feasible IMO.

#2: Buffalo has to many goalies. Biron is their starter and they'd be fine with Miller as their backup, getting additional NHL playing time. Dumont, Briere, Drury and Pyatt is a good group of young guys for the top 2 lines, but it looks like Satan is on his way out of there, meaning they essiantly have 4 guys for the top 2 lines. Kotalik can go there, but he's nothing special. Chimera fills in the 6th spot, as they really don't have an LW's. Salmalainen would make their roster for sure IMO, proably as a 4th liner, but they definetly could use him, he's young and talented. Hate to deal him off, but Noronen is worth it.

#3: Stefan seems to be out of favour in Atlanta, and supposedly, they have been interested in aquiring Horcoff. As far as I know Atlanta does not really have an enforcer. Cowan maybe... Laraque is no longer a useful forward hear in Edmonton IMO. He tries to play a game that's just not in him and it's hurtign the Oilers. I love BG, but he either needs to know his role, or get out of here.

#4: If we could get a 4th for Ferguson, I'd be happy.

#5: Dangerous dealing Salo to a team in our own division, but he's sucked for us, and is overpaid. I'd rather give the time to Noronen and Conks. His value isn't all that high like it was a year or two ago, but I think we could probably snag Stephens for the Av's who's a pretty good young center.

And the mandatory new lines after trade proposals...

Smyth-Stefan-Hemsky
Torres-York-Dvorak
Moreau-Reasoner-Pisani
Isbister-Stephens-Rita

Brewer-Semenov
Hannan-Staios
Cross-Smith

Noronen
Conklin

PB Stoll, Sarno, Bergeron
I feel that with that set of forwards, injuries would not be a problem no matter where. Any one from that 4th line can easily step into a top 6 role. Stoll can replace Reasoner, Sarno can fill in where needed. Bergeron would be alternating with Semenov in the lineup anyways. Hate to have cut him, as I'd prefer him in over Cross, but thats politics.

Alright, now bash away, please and thank you
Ouch. Horrible. Oh right, no offence

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Old
11-15-2003, 02:27 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxall9
Comrie for Hannan?
Are you drunk? There has been talk about Frolov and you think Hannan would be fair? I highly doubt it, I didn't get to read the other trades because this one floored me!
Yes, there has been talk about Frolov... but it has been an Oiler homer pipedream. Just because someone mentioned him as a possible return for Comrie on this site, doesn't mean that it is a realistic deal or that KLo and DT have had discussions.

Second of all, Horcoff for Hannan??? lmao. Ron Wilson recently said that Hannan is easily his best d-man. This guy is young, dynamite in his own zone, makes a great first pass on the breakout. He is exactly what the Oilers need, and I GUARANTEE you Horcoff isn't even close to enough for Hannan. Throw in the fact that he's young, and inexpensive and that his offensive game will only get better, and I don't know if the Sharks would give up Hannan for Comrie.

The value that some of you have been asking for Comrie is simply unbelievable. You guys need to make up your minds. You're bashing him in one thread for wanting out, saying he's an overrated bum, and then asking the moon for him in the next.

Suffice to say, Comrie isn't worth what the majority here expect for him, and his value isn't increasing as he sits on the shelf.

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Old
11-15-2003, 02:28 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
You're incredibly highly overrating Scott Hannan........to say the least.
Try watching a Sharks game before making that statement.

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Old
11-15-2003, 02:32 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by Boondock Saint
Try watching a Sharks game before making that statement.
I have thanks. For this team, I'd acquire Brad Stuart or Mike Rathje before I'd acquire Hannan. Both for value to our club, and for what we'd have to deal to get them.

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Old
11-15-2003, 03:44 PM
  #16
Jamie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
I have thanks. For this team, I'd acquire Brad Stuart or Mike Rathje before I'd acquire Hannan. Both for value to our club, and for what we'd have to deal to get them.
First off, Rathje is nearing UFA status. He makes $750,000 more than Hannan as well and Hannan has improved his game enough that I'd say he is now a better player. He's top on their team right now for points from defensman. He averages the most ice time of all San Jose defensman for very good reason, he's their best defensman. Stuart would be nice, but IMO, he's more offensivly one dimenenial. I never had any idea Hannan was so underrated around here. I've only seen a handful of Sharks games the last 2 years, and Hannan has been the most impressive each game. He's a 24 year old defensman that leads his team in ice time, he must be doing something right. Rathje worth more is the most ridiculous thing I've heard. He'd most likely be UFA after the lockout year. A lot of good that would do us.

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11-15-2003, 03:50 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie
First off, Rathje is nearing UFA status. He makes $750,000 more than Hannan as well and Hannan has improved his game enough that I'd say he is now a better player. He's top on their team right now for points from defensman. He averages the most ice time of all San Jose defensman for very good reason, he's their best defensman. Stuart would be nice, but IMO, he's more offensivly one dimenenial. I never had any idea Hannan was so underrated around here. I've only seen a handful of Sharks games the last 2 years, and Hannan has been the most impressive each game. He's a 24 year old defensman that leads his team in ice time, he must be doing something right. Rathje worth more is the most ridiculous thing I've heard. He'd most likely be UFA after the lockout year. A lot of good that would do us.
I didn't say Rathje was worth more. I said that Rathje, in terms of his value to the team combined with what we'd have to give up to get him, would be chosen ahead. You wouldn't have to deal as much, and he'd still be a large benefit to the Oilers.

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Old
11-15-2003, 03:54 PM
  #18
Jamie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
I didn't say Rathje was worth more. I said that Rathje, in terms of his value to the team combined with what we'd have to give up to get him, would be chosen ahead. You wouldn't have to deal as much, and he'd still be a large benefit to the Oilers.
Okay, fair enough then, thought since you said both for value to the club and what we'd have to give up that you meant he was worth more as well as we'd have to give up less. Misunderstood you there. But I'm still in large disagreement here. If we got Hannan for Comrie I'd be very happy. He is a #1 defensman after all, even if some choose not to think that.

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11-15-2003, 05:14 PM
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jamie, good job man, Hannan is the *explitive.* Mike Rathje sucks, no matter if it does require less to get him, its because he's a big guy that doesn't use his size or his shot and he can't skate all that well....

Hannan for all the reasons Jamie mentioned and also because he hits, fights and leads by example busting his butt every shift.

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11-16-2003, 07:48 AM
  #20
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That's important. I'd think hard working is one of the more important traits for a defenseman.

I've been thinking of Salo to Colorado also. I don't think they have anything we'd want except for Tanguay though. Do you think Comrie and Salo for Tanguay and maybe a G prospect would work? I would say Sauve but I think that that might be too much (I don't know how good he is though). Is Salo and Aebischer an upgrade over Aebischer and Sauve? Having said this, I don't think Colorado would ever do this. What if we threw in Rita?

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11-16-2003, 11:03 AM
  #21
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Jamie, I'm guessing that you are either related to or buddies with Hannan (since you are both from BC). I'm not saying he is brutal, he is a good player, I just don't think he is worth Comrie staright up. There would have to be something else in the deal.

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11-16-2003, 11:15 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hairball
That's important. I'd think hard working is one of the more important traits for a defenseman.

I've been thinking of Salo to Colorado also. I don't think they have anything we'd want except for Tanguay though. Do you think Comrie and Salo for Tanguay and maybe a G prospect would work? I would say Sauve but I think that that might be too much (I don't know how good he is though). Is Salo and Aebischer an upgrade over Aebischer and Sauve? Having said this, I don't think Colorado would ever do this. What if we threw in Rita?
Alex has been the best Av so far this year, he's not available IMO. I would be happy with a Comrie + deal for Tanguay, but I don't see it happening as the Avs have Sakic and Forsberg already up the middle.

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11-16-2003, 11:57 AM
  #23
Jamie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxall9
Jamie, I'm guessing that you are either related to or buddies with Hannan (since you are both from BC). I'm not saying he is brutal, he is a good player, I just don't think he is worth Comrie staright up. There would have to be something else in the deal.
No, I'm not related to Hannan, I've just liked from what I've seen of him. He is San Jose's #1 defensman, and thats a clear #1, not like Brewer here, Hannan actually plays with intensity every shift. Hannan, IMO, is Smith when he was at his prime, with more offensive ability and a harder hitter, and a lot younger. To be quite honest, I think there's less chance the Sharks would do this deal than the Oilers. The Sharks definetly wouldn't add to the deal though. Next time you watch a Sharks game, try focusing in on Hannan and you'll see what I mean, he's their top unit PP, PK, and gets the most even strength on their entire roster for a reason.

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11-16-2003, 01:21 PM
  #24
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What's the point of giving up Ferguson for a 4th-round pick, though? Fergie's a steady, unspectacular defenseman who plays a simple game and usually doesn't get into too much trouble. Perfect as a PB guy, won't get any slower by sitting a few games and won't miss out on any further development by sitting, either.

I'm actually starting to wonder if Semenov is becoming less of an 'untouchable' after a poor camp and slow start to the season. I'm not saying Lowe would be shopping him, but that in the right deal he could be had. Considering how we were looking at Semenov at the end of last year, that's quite a shift (if that's really true). Lowe knows (just as many others do) that defensemen often take longer to develop to their full potential, so giving up on Semenov now isn't necessarily a good (long-term) thing to do, but he's definitely not giving the coaches what they want when he does get a chance to play... Or is it just that Bergeron has given much more than Semenov? And Ferguson, too, then??

Bart

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11-17-2003, 12:24 PM
  #25
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hey Jamie, I think your trade ideas are at least Waaaay better than mowzie.

1) Comrie for Hannan. Interesting. It sounds like both Oiler and Sharks posters don't like this deal. Perhaps it IS equal value then... LOL. I have not watched Hannan enough, but it sounds intriguing.

2) Ferguson for 4th. nah. Keep Fergie around. He's a solid 7th d. I don't think anyone would be willing to trade a 4th pick for Fergie. Maybe a sixth.. Maybe.

3) Nironen deal - I"d rather not deal away Salmolainen. Strange as it may sound, I'm still content with Salo and Conklin duo. Although, seeing as Kiprusoff was picked up for 2nd pick, I wonder if Chimera alone would do it. (or maybe throw in a 4th round pick or something).

4) Salo for Stephens. can't tell you since I don't recall Stephens. How about trading Salo for 2nd round pick and flipping that pick to NJ for below?

5) Laraques + Horcoff for Stefan. Not bad. But I"m not sure what Stefan's role on the Oilers would be. Is he capable of being a #1 center here? I doubt it. We already have #2, and #3 centres. Maybe we can somehow pick up Gomez instead? How about upgrading the Laraques + Horcoff with a 2nd round pick (for Salo) for Gomez + 4th?

Result:

Smyth - Gomez - Hemsky
Torres/Isbister - York - Dvorak
Moreau - Reasoner - Pisani
Isbister/Torres - Stoll - Salmolainen

Brewer - Hannan
Staios - Smith
Semenov - Cross/Bergeron
Ferguson

Noronen
Conklin

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