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What's the most lopsided trade in NHL history?

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Old
09-04-2006, 06:43 PM
  #76
Nalyd Psycho
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
That was a brilliant deal by the Pens and a classic example of how to make a trade - and the EXACT OPPOSITE of how trades are insufferably suggested on this board. As you mentioned, Cullen's stock was through the roof at the time, he was having a superb year statistically (a Marc Savard of his time, in many ways). Zalapski was young and skilled, meaning he was "untouchable" by the standards of many of the GMs on this board.

Pens demonstrated why often the best deals are made when you "sell high". The trade value of both JC and ZZ would never be greater.
Gotta disagree with you.

Two things have changed:

1. Salary cap. Francis and Samuellson would both have come with hefty contracts while Cullen and Zalapski relatively cheap.

2. The 92,94,95,96,98 & 99 drafts sucked. And 93 and 97 weren't that good. Be it development, dillution or statistical anomolly, drafts in the 90's were generally really bad and few players drafted then are impact players today. There simply aren't Ron Francis type players available today. The best offensive players are becoming younger and younger because drafts this decade have been superior. So it vastly changes things. That sort of trade just isn't as feasable nowadays due to demographic switches in the NHL's player base.

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Old
09-04-2006, 07:13 PM
  #77
CrazyCanucks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolemite View Post
One of Milbury's Many Gems:


The Canucks Trevor Linden for Todd Bertuzzi, Brian McCabe and a Third Round Pick which was used to Draft Jarrko Ruutu.
You know that trade keeps on giving...

Linden traded for Bert, Macabe, and 3rd rd pick (Ruttu)
Macabe traded to Chi for a pick, to pick one of the Sedins.
Linden got traded back for a crappy 1st rd pick to Wash
Bert traded for Luongo.

So at the end of it, it became Linden for the, Twins and Luongo, a criminal case and a civil case as well. And we got Linden back!

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Old
09-04-2006, 07:50 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
Gotta disagree with you.

Two things have changed:

1. Salary cap. Francis and Samuellson would both have come with hefty contracts while Cullen and Zalapski relatively cheap.

2. The 92,94,95,96,98 & 99 drafts sucked. And 93 and 97 weren't that good. Be it development, dillution or statistical anomolly, drafts in the 90's were generally really bad and few players drafted then are impact players today. There simply aren't Ron Francis type players available today. The best offensive players are becoming younger and younger because drafts this decade have been superior. So it vastly changes things. That sort of trade just isn't as feasable nowadays due to demographic switches in the NHL's player base.
First, you're allowed to disagree.

After reading this, however, I'm unclear about where we disagree.

Do you not think it was a brilliant deal for the Pens?

Do you not think it was a case of a team trading assets (Cullen, Zalapski) at their highest value?

Do you not think such an approach is diametrically opposite of the trash we get on the trade board here daily? As in: "This guy sucks, let's trade him now...for some other team's talent!"

If you answer "no" to any of the above, I guess we disagree. But from your points above, I see no disagreement. To be sure, the economics of today are different. So what? It was a great deal when it was made. And if somehow through magic the two teams could be transformed to today, and the Pens could fit Francis and Ulf under their cap, bet your bottom dollar they would do it - it helped win them Stanley Cups! (Did Carolina worry about Weight and Recchi fitting in their cap long-term? No.)

You lost with me with the draft logic. Not debating it, just do not understand what you are suggesting. That's me, not you.

In my lifetime, along with the Isles acquisition of Butch Goring (and to a lesser extent, Edmonton's acquisition of Roloson this past March) the Francis deal ranks among the greatest deadline deals ever orchestrated, IMO.

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Old
09-04-2006, 08:11 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by JayzinSmith View Post
But Beauregard turned into Christian Ruuttu (then Murray Craven, then the illustrious Petri Varis), and the FCs was the pick that became Eric Daze. Not a complete loss.
Yay 6 time Vezina winner for checking forward and forward who's spent more games on the IR then on the ice. Yup, fair deal.

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Old
09-04-2006, 08:13 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by CrazyCanucks View Post
Bert traded for Luongo
I'd wait until each player plays atleast one game with those teams before judging that trade.

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Old
09-04-2006, 08:42 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Nihilism View Post
I'd wait until each player plays atleast one game with those teams before judging that trade.


Amen.

Was dumfounded seeing a thread on the main board about how this team or that team "won" the Luongo deal.

Based on what? None of the players involved in that transaction are yet to register a second of game action for their new teams....Yet the HF crowd has rendered a verdict. (This when, typically, it takes years to truly evaluate deals.) Truly bizarre.

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Old
09-04-2006, 08:44 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Nihilism View Post
Yay 6 time Vezina winner for checking forward
I'd call Christian Ruuttu a two-way forward, not a checker. The term checker would describe a one-dimentional player such as Stefan Yelle, which Ruuttu was not. Ruutu averaged near 50 points a season with the Hawks.

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Originally Posted by Nihilism View Post
and forward who's spent more games on the IR then on the ice. Yup, fair deal.
Excluding the last few season, that's not true at all. The first 8 seasons Daze spent with the Hawks he scored 20+ goals every year while reaching the 30 goal mark 4 times. Not bad for a 4th round pick.

The deal was still obviously won by the Sabres, but it wasn't a complete loss for the Hawks which was the original point.

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Old
09-05-2006, 01:44 AM
  #83
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Glenn Hall traded by Detroit (with Ted Lindsay) to Chicago Black Hawks for John Wilson, Forbes Kennedy, William Preston and G Hank Bassen, July 1957.

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Old
09-05-2006, 05:40 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by David Puddy View Post
Ricci was a very good two-way centerman for most of his career, and he helped Colorado win the Stanley Cup in 1996.

Ricci was also traded to San Jose for the 1st Round pick that was used to draft Alex Tanguay. San Jose also got a 2nd Round pick and C

Jocelyn Thibault was a pretty decent goalie, and he was a major part of the trade, along with Martin Rucinsky and Andrei Kovalenko, that got Colorado Patrick Roy.

If Lindros turned out to be "The Next One" like many thought that he be, it would have been a steal for Philadelphia. He looked like the best player in hockey for a season or two, but he wasn't Gretzky-like in his statistical domination. That's what he was supposed to be, better than Wayne Gretzky. That's why several good young players, two 1st Round draft picks and $15 million were traded for him. If it was just Forsberg for Lindros, I would say that it was a slight edge to Quebec, but the other players, picks and cash, $15 million is a lot of cash, move it heavily in favor of Quebec/Colorado.
It still is not lopsided, all it is, is Lacroix doing a good job with asset management, the actual trade itself was not lopsided IMO. It is basically equal to making a trade for Ovechkin and Crosby, would you not do a similar trade?

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Old
09-05-2006, 06:57 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by petrskudra1 View Post
To Wash: Jagr

To Pitt: Beech, Sivek, Lupaschuk
terrible trade for Wash, they are paying Jagr 4.5M to play in NY

terrible trade for Pitts, they could have got much better for Jagr.

This can be nominated for the worst trade for both sides

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Old
09-05-2006, 07:02 AM
  #86
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To Pittsburgh
Ron Francis
Ulf Sammuelson
Grant Jennings

To Hartford
John Cullen
Zarley Zalapski
Jeff Parker

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Old
09-05-2006, 07:40 AM
  #87
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To Detroit:
Hasek

To Buffalo:
Slava Kozlov
2002 1st round draft pick
Future considerations

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Old
09-05-2006, 09:48 AM
  #88
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A couple of others...

To the Leafs : Greg Hubick
To the Habs : Doug Jarvis

The all time NHL ironman acquired for a song, it always amazed me because he was not big and played much of his career facing off against the best centers in the game.

To the Oilers: Barrie Moore and Craig Millar
To the Sabres : Miro Satan

What?

The Esposito trade in the '60's has always fascinated me. He was a big part of the Bruins winning two Cups and the Hawks have not won since (Hockey's version of the curse of the Bambino?).

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Old
09-05-2006, 12:19 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Zetterberg4Captain View Post
Glenn Hall traded by Detroit (with Ted Lindsay) to Chicago Black Hawks for John Wilson, Forbes Kennedy, William Preston and G Hank Bassen, July 1957.
That was to punish Terrible Ted for his role in trying to organize a players' union.

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Old
09-05-2006, 12:46 PM
  #90
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Toronto and Los Angeles

L.A. giving up a solid young defenseman for a couple scrubs (Cammalleri/Mair)

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Old
09-05-2006, 12:56 PM
  #91
12# Peter Bondra
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Originally Posted by Aki Berg View Post
Toronto and Los Angeles

L.A. giving up a solid young defenseman for a couple scrubs (Cammalleri/Mair)

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Old
09-05-2006, 12:57 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyCanucks View Post
You know that trade keeps on giving...

Linden traded for Bert, Macabe, and 3rd rd pick (Ruttu)
Macabe traded to Chi for a pick, to pick one of the Sedins.
Linden got traded back for a crappy 1st rd pick to Wash
Bert traded for Luongo.

So at the end of it, it became Linden for the, Twins and Luongo, a criminal case and a civil case as well. And we got Linden back!
...AND Keenan was removed from his position shortly after both trades involving Bertuzzi.

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Old
09-05-2006, 01:56 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raad_luongo View Post
I would say any trade with NYI was lopsided.
Not exactly true...hard to admit, but Milbury did make a handful of smart deals among his handfuls of blunders:

Wendel Clark, Mathieu Schneider, and DJ Smith traded to Toronto for Kenny Jonsson, Darby Hendrickson, Sean Haggerty, and a 1st round pick (Roberto Luongo).

Adrian Aucoin and Alexander Kharitonov for NYI's Mathieu Biron and a second round pick (traded to Washington - Denis Grot).

Jason Blake for NYI's 5th round pick (Joel Andresen).

Kevin Weekes, Kristian Kudroc, and a 2nd round pick (traded to Phoenix - Matt Spiller) for Tampa's 5th overall pick (Raffi Torres), a fourth round pick (Vladimir Gorbunov), and 7th round pick (Ryan Caldwell).

Dan Lacouture for Mariusz Czerkawski. Czerkawski went on to two 20+ goal seasons and two 30 goal seasons with the Isles, then was traded to Montreal for Arron Asham and Marcus Pahlsson. Was re-acquired as a cheap alternative for Yashin's line and was released.

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Old
09-05-2006, 02:16 PM
  #94
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Weren't dumping Selanne and Draper for next to nothing purposeful moves by outgoing Jets management in order to screw with those who were moving the team to Phoenix? I could swear I read that somewhere.
Draper was gone well before the team even went up for sale, in the 1993 waiver draft.

Selanne was dealt in February 1996, during the 1995/96 "lame duck" season (after the team was sold, but before they moved). The new owners already owned the team and had to give approval for any trades, so it wasn't a "screw you" kind of thing.

It was the subject of much conjecture at the time. The most common speculation (and I stress the word speculation) was that they traded him in order to build the team around Tkachuk - an American superstar for an American market. They sold the deal to the public as a "hockey" trade as opposed to a financial one, but I don't recall a more specific reason given.

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Old
09-05-2006, 02:21 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Chili View Post
The Esposito trade in the '60's has always fascinated me. He was a big part of the Bruins winning two Cups and the Hawks have not won since (Hockey's version of the curse of the Bambino?).
for the record, CB never won a cup with Espo on the roster either.

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Old
09-05-2006, 02:56 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by arrbez View Post
An MVP-calibre player is well worth it. The fact that Forsberg exceeded all expectations is what throws it out of whack.

However, don't forget what kind of a phenom Lindros was. The best prospect since Lemieux, and he proved it the second he stepped onto the ice. There's a difference between a bad trade and an unfortunate one.

Put it this way: Would you trade your teams top prospect, 2 first rounders, and a few other solid players for Sidney Crosby? I would.

If Lindros had flopped it would have been lopsided. Clearly he did not.
To even complicate matters further, it is arguable if the Philly package was even the best offer on the table. The Nordiques preferred the the Rangers deal, which apparently included:

Alexei Kovalev
Doug Weight
Tony Amonte
John Vanbiesbrouck
2 first rounders
$12 million

As good as the Philly deal was, that's a pretty impressive offer. It took an arbitrator's decision that indicated that while the Nords preferred the Rangers deal, they had agreed in principal with the Flyers already. I think with Vanbiesbrouck in goal, and more players that could contribute immediately, that the Nordiques have a better shot at winning a cup while still in Quebec, which may have been the neccessary catalyst for the funding to get a new arena to keep the team in town.

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Old
09-05-2006, 03:21 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by discostu View Post
To even complicate matters further, it is arguable if the Philly package was even the best offer on the table. The Nordiques preferred the the Rangers deal, which apparently included:

Alexei Kovalev
Doug Weight
Tony Amonte
John Vanbiesbrouck
2 first rounders
$12 million

As good as the Philly deal was, that's a pretty impressive offer. It took an arbitrator's decision that indicated that while the Nords preferred the Rangers deal, they had agreed in principal with the Flyers already. I think with Vanbiesbrouck in goal, and more players that could contribute immediately, that the Nordiques have a better shot at winning a cup while still in Quebec, which may have been the neccessary catalyst for the funding to get a new arena to keep the team in town.
Could you mention a top nine of Kovalev, Weight, Amonte, Sakic, Sundin, Nolan, Kamensky, Ricci and Rucinsky

You have to wonder whether the Rangers win the cup without Noonan, Matteau, and Tikkanen

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Old
09-05-2006, 03:26 PM
  #98
Chili
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for the record, CB never won a cup with Espo on the roster either.
He was just a young player coming into to his own when he was dealt. He had not reached his prime in Chicago.

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Old
09-05-2006, 04:06 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by discostu View Post
To even complicate matters further, it is arguable if the Philly package was even the best offer on the table. The Nordiques preferred the the Rangers deal, which apparently included:

Alexei Kovalev
Doug Weight
Tony Amonte
John Vanbiesbrouck
2 first rounders
$12 million

As good as the Philly deal was, that's a pretty impressive offer. It took an arbitrator's decision that indicated that while the Nords preferred the Rangers deal, they had agreed in principal with the Flyers already. I think with Vanbiesbrouck in goal, and more players that could contribute immediately, that the Nordiques have a better shot at winning a cup while still in Quebec, which may have been the neccessary catalyst for the funding to get a new arena to keep the team in town.

Detroit was offering Yzerman and some veteran players for Lindros, but Quebec also wanted Lidstrom and Fedorov included in the deal.

Anyways here's a link with what some other teams were offering for Lindros (it's about halfway down the page): http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...e.183bfd8.html

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Old
09-05-2006, 04:13 PM
  #100
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I'm going the homer route here sorry but

To Montreal: Mark Recchi

To Philly: John LeClaire, Eric Desjardin, Gilbert Dionne

While Dionne was a dud we basically got Rico for free!

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