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Brian McGrattan Potential?

View Poll Results: Cna McGrattan become an everyday player worthy of playoff icetime?
Yes 38 50.00%
No 38 50.00%
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Old
09-17-2006, 06:44 AM
  #1
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Brian McGrattan Potential?

Can Brian McGrattan improve to the point where he would be a valuable everyday 4th liner and worthy of ice time in the playoffs?

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09-17-2006, 09:10 AM
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Can he? Sure, there have been examples of enforcers that have managed to develop enough to be forth or better line players.

Will he? It remains to be seen is if McGrattan can improve in that manner.

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09-17-2006, 09:24 AM
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Well, he needs to improve other aspects of his game. He has a decent shot right now. He isn't too bad defensively for the type of player that he is, but not good enough to earn a spot on the roster based on it.

Unfortunately for Pebbles, with Ottawa's depth, it's harder for a guy like him to do it. On a weaker team, he'd likely get some more playing time, to improve the other aspects of his game. In Ottawa, he's used very sparingly, and strictly counted on for that fighting element. However, Chris Neil managed to become a more potent scorer, and, it was said that he picked up a lot of his skills by regularly practicing with the fleet of talented forwards that have come through Ottawa. If McGrattan takes the same approach, and dedicates himself to it, it's possible.

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09-17-2006, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by discostu View Post
He isn't too bad defensively
I would say the exact opposite. He always looks like hes just scrambling around in the defensive end to me. I think he takes himself out of postion to try and hit a guy or get a fight started too much right now. I'm sure he'll develop into a fourth line guy but right now, unless hes improved over the summer, I want him on the ice for the shortest period of time possible for him to get in a fight.

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09-17-2006, 01:46 PM
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He got outsmarted by Donald Brashear.

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Old
09-17-2006, 05:00 PM
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Gratts came into camp in great shape and has improved his skating. I think he can be more than just an enforcer if he continues to work at it.

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09-17-2006, 05:13 PM
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I would say the exact opposite. He always looks like hes just scrambling around in the defensive end to me. I think he takes himself out of postion to try and hit a guy or get a fight started too much right now. I'm sure he'll develop into a fourth line guy but right now, unless hes improved over the summer, I want him on the ice for the shortest period of time possible for him to get in a fight.
I was comparing his defensive presence compared to the other fourth line goons. I think there was a reason why McGrattan played such a regular role for Ottawa, while guys like Colton Orr hit the waiver wire.

As I said in my post, his non-fighting skills won't get him in the line-up soon. He still doesn't bring enough to the table. But, compared ot other guys that are trying to crack the NHL as a fighter, I think some of those core skills are farther along than his competition.

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09-17-2006, 05:46 PM
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There are a number of reasons why McGratton should be an everyday player;
1. In his first year in the league he proved that he was a very good heavyweight and lost very few fights.
2. With Gratts in the lineup our skilled players played without fear and every guy on the roster seemed to be energized when he won.
3. He has improved his skating, has a very good shot and plays very decent defensively.
4. I love it when he hits people he drives them into the boards. When he is on the ice everybody on the opposing team is watching out for him taking them out of their game.
5. With Chara leaving town, it is even more important now to assure that nobody takes advantage of our skilled players. Remember when we only had Neil to stick up for them teams pushed us around, but with Gratts in the lineup that doesn't happen anymore.
6. Name how many guys will stick up for their teammates and fight: McGratton, Neil and Fisher, that's it ... oh yea, and Emery if management will let him.

The NHL is trying to eliminate fighting from the game but they are not their yet and the NHLPA is pushing to get rid of the instigator rule which I would love to see but the NHL refuses. Fighting is still part of the game and will be for this season anyway.

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09-17-2006, 07:09 PM
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I think he will get better evrey time he steps onto the ice. it's like riding a bike, everytime you ride you get a little better. Everytime he steps on the ice and plays with the quality forwards that the Sens have, he will improve.

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09-17-2006, 10:24 PM
  #10
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Originally Posted by aragorn View Post
There are a number of reasons why McGratton should be an everyday player;
1. In his first year in the league he proved that he was a very good heavyweight and lost very few fights.
2. With Gratts in the lineup our skilled players played without fear and every guy on the roster seemed to be energized when he won.
3. He has improved his skating, has a very good shot and plays very decent defensively.
4. I love it when he hits people he drives them into the boards. When he is on the ice everybody on the opposing team is watching out for him taking them out of their game.
5. With Chara leaving town, it is even more important now to assure that nobody takes advantage of our skilled players. Remember when we only had Neil to stick up for them teams pushed us around, but with Gratts in the lineup that doesn't happen anymore.
6. Name how many guys will stick up for their teammates and fight: McGratton, Neil and Fisher, that's it ... oh yea, and Emery if management will let him.

The NHL is trying to eliminate fighting from the game but they are not their yet and the NHLPA is pushing to get rid of the instigator rule which I would love to see but the NHL refuses. Fighting is still part of the game and will be for this season anyway.
A few comments. Chris Kelly also has proven he will fight for his teammates. THough he is not a very good fighter.

While I like McGrattan and his fighting and the team clearly were motivated by his presence and fights he is not "very decent defensively". He is simply not that good of a player in every single aspect of the game. Schubert when he was forward (a job he stole from McGratt's for the stretch and playoffswhen not on D) was a harder hitter and laid far more hits per shift than any other Senator player did. Plus he is far faster, has better passing, shooting and defensive skills.

I think McGrattan will play a signifcant role again in the regular season, but in the playoffs he will have to VASTLY improve his play to get a shot at playing at all if all the forwards are healthy. Otherwise Schubert, or someone else will again steal his spot come playoff time.

Chris Neil has vastly improved his game since making the team but he was always a far more skilled player than McGratt's was last season. Ever see him on a breakaway? He has hands of steel. He is quite slow, does not have a ton of hockey sense. He is big and aggressive and displays effort. But he is likely to try to force a hit and give the other team a break more than the other Sens physical forwards.

Is McGrattan likely going to be able to stick in the NHL and on the Sens for a while on his fighting abilty with a gradual increase in his skills.? Yes

Is McGrattan likely to see ice time in the playoffs on a Stanley Cup contender that isn't rife with forward injuries? No

Can he increase his skills and game enough to be an effective player aside from fighting? Maybe but I lean towards no on this. I hope he does becuse I like him but he just has very little finesse and just being aggressive, determined and physical won't cut it, especially on a Sens team with 6 D-Men who can move the puck and with every forward having decent offensive skills anyone that is on the ice for the Sens need to be able to have the finesse and skills to continue and finish plays. I don't think McGratts has that kind of skill. The Sens could have anyone from Vermette, Kelly, Neil, Kaigodorov, McAmmond on the fourth line. Playing with those type of players in a playoff game means you need linemates capable of making and finishing plays. I don't think Gratt's can do that.

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Old
09-17-2006, 10:42 PM
  #11
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IF he works hard and this is a big IF he may develop into an enforcer that gets more than 4 minutes a game. However, he will never see over 10 minutes a game.... unless of course Ottawa hires Pat Quinn and tries to convert him to a defenceman. He is, however, a better than a shift or two a game like Colton Orr.

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09-18-2006, 07:20 AM
  #12
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Why are some people people talking about skill? You rarely see real skillful players on the fourth lines of any team. The fourth line, as a unit, is only required to bang some bodies and not allow a goal. Thats it for the most part. Simple job for for 40 seconds 6 to 10 times a game.

Gratts has the potential to be an everyday player, even in the playoffs. He needs to work on his skating, and from what I saw yesterday he has definately worked on this aspect.

The second thing he needs to improve is his hockey smarts. Every year, Ottawa has a rookie or two in the lineup. Most fans understand that these rookies make stupid mistakes and an adjustment period is necessary to learn what works in the NHL and what doesn't. Lets give Gratts the benefit of the doubt here. We should extend the same patience to him that we grant the other higher profile rookies we've seen in Ottawa.

IMO, the biggest requirements for the fourth line guys is hustle, grit, heart and the ability to check their egos at the door. If Gratts continues to improve his skating, I can't see why he can't be an everyday 4th line player.

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09-18-2006, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Cup 2007 Sens Rule! View Post
A few comments. Chris Kelly also has proven he will fight for his teammates. THough he is not a very good fighter.

While I like McGrattan and his fighting and the team clearly were motivated by his presence and fights he is not "very decent defensively". He is simply not that good of a player in every single aspect of the game. Schubert when he was forward (a job he stole from McGratt's for the stretch and playoffswhen not on D) was a harder hitter and laid far more hits per shift than any other Senator player did. Plus he is far faster, has better passing, shooting and defensive skills.

I think McGrattan will play a signifcant role again in the regular season, but in the playoffs he will have to VASTLY improve his play to get a shot at playing at all if all the forwards are healthy. Otherwise Schubert, or someone else will again steal his spot come playoff time.

Chris Neil has vastly improved his game since making the team but he was always a far more skilled player than McGratt's was last season. Ever see him on a breakaway? He has hands of steel. He is quite slow, does not have a ton of hockey sense. He is big and aggressive and displays effort. But he is likely to try to force a hit and give the other team a break more than the other Sens physical forwards.

Is McGrattan likely going to be able to stick in the NHL and on the Sens for a while on his fighting abilty with a gradual increase in his skills.? Yes

Is McGrattan likely to see ice time in the playoffs on a Stanley Cup contender that isn't rife with forward injuries? No

Can he increase his skills and game enough to be an effective player aside from fighting? Maybe but I lean towards no on this. I hope he does becuse I like him but he just has very little finesse and just being aggressive, determined and physical won't cut it, especially on a Sens team with 6 D-Men who can move the puck and with every forward having decent offensive skills anyone that is on the ice for the Sens need to be able to have the finesse and skills to continue and finish plays. I don't think McGratts has that kind of skill. The Sens could have anyone from Vermette, Kelly, Neil, Kaigodorov, McAmmond on the fourth line. Playing with those type of players in a playoff game means you need linemates capable of making and finishing plays. I don't think Gratt's can do that.
First, I don't remember Schubert ever stealing the position away from anyone, what I remember is Schubert replacing injured players. Of course, in the playoffs it was well documented that Gratts likely wouldn't be playing because in this new NHL there is no fighting in the playoffs. If Schubert was a forward than he would likely be on the 4th line, I like Chris at forward too but he has said in the past that he is a defenceman, not a forward. This could develop into a rift between Murray and Schubert if Murray prefers him at forward rather than on D full time.

Chris Kelly fighting for teammates - good one, but sorry no comparison.

Gratts knows his role and plays it very well but at the same time he knows he must get better and I think he is a guy who works very hard at the other aspects of his game to improve. But if they ever do take fighting completely out of the game and we are already starting to see some teams without enforcers, than certainly his time will be up. I'm kinda sorry they signed McAmmond now because I would rather see Hamel and Gratts on that 4th line, even Schubert over McAmmond.

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09-19-2006, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by pjbth View Post
I would say the exact opposite. He always looks like hes just scrambling around in the defensive end to me. I think he takes himself out of postion to try and hit a guy or get a fight started too much right now. I'm sure he'll develop into a fourth line guy but right now, unless hes improved over the summer, I want him on the ice for the shortest period of time possible for him to get in a fight.
I saw McGratton, Kelly, Emery and a couple of other guys (likely) Bingo guys at the Baton Rouge last night. I gave him a copy of this post, he's looking for you ... to discuss the matter ...

Even in the restaurant he had that snide grin about him ...

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09-19-2006, 10:18 AM
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oh, dont get me wrong i love gratts, Andre Roy is my favourite senator. Fighters are my thing. I just want him to pick his places better and thats one of the things that will come with time. He's crazy and i love it.

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09-19-2006, 10:28 AM
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Well, he needs to improve other aspects of his game. He has a decent shot right now. He isn't too bad defensively for the type of player that he is, but not good enough to earn a spot on the roster based on it.

Unfortunately for Pebbles, with Ottawa's depth, it's harder for a guy like him to do it. On a weaker team, he'd likely get some more playing time, to improve the other aspects of his game. In Ottawa, he's used very sparingly, and strictly counted on for that fighting element. However, Chris Neil managed to become a more potent scorer, and, it was said that he picked up a lot of his skills by regularly practicing with the fleet of talented forwards that have come through Ottawa. If McGrattan takes the same approach, and dedicates himself to it, it's possible.
You can't compare McGratton to Chris Neil... Neil put up atleast decent numbers in Junior... and all the way up to the NHL, and McGrattan hasn't so McGratton will never turn out to be as good as Neil is... he just doesn't have the same talent.

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09-19-2006, 12:00 PM
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You can't compare McGratton to Chris Neil... Neil put up atleast decent numbers in Junior... and all the way up to the NHL, and McGrattan hasn't so McGratton will never turn out to be as good as Neil is... he just doesn't have the same talent.
I don't know how people can say these things when in fact we really don't know how good a person will become and more importantly what their value to the team is. Tie Domi, hate him or love him was a valuable member to the Leafs because he did whatever it took to spark the Leafs, not to mention what he does off the ice which team's also value to the organization.

McGratton has some skills to go with his size and ability to fight. IMO the Senators still need him to protect their skill and it was proven in the past that Neil was not enough. If he can continue to improve his checking ability, watch when he takes penalties and contribute a little on offence he could be an everyday player on the 4th line. If they put Neil back in front of the net on the PP, McGratton could also do the same since he is bigger, tougher and can take more punishment.

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09-19-2006, 01:03 PM
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I don't know how people can say these things when in fact we really don't know how good a person will become and more importantly what their value to the team is. Tie Domi, hate him or love him was a valuable member to the Leafs because he did whatever it took to spark the Leafs, not to mention what he does off the ice which team's also value to the organization.

McGratton has some skills to go with his size and ability to fight. IMO the Senators still need him to protect their skill and it was proven in the past that Neil was not enough. If he can continue to improve his checking ability, watch when he takes penalties and contribute a little on offence he could be an everyday player on the 4th line. If they put Neil back in front of the net on the PP, McGratton could also do the same since he is bigger, tougher and can take more punishment.
McGrattan is important to the team in the regular season. I think he is probably one of the top 3 fighters in the league.. but he will never be able to play in the playoffs.
and McGratton never has and probably never will play on the power play.. you can't compare McGratton to domi for skill either. If you want to compare him to a fighter for skill maybe someone like peter Worrell

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09-19-2006, 01:18 PM
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You can't compare McGratton to Chris Neil... Neil put up atleast decent numbers in Junior... and all the way up to the NHL, and McGrattan hasn't so McGratton will never turn out to be as good as Neil is... he just doesn't have the same talent.
When you look at their time in the IHL and AHL respectively, their numbers are not that far off from each other, if you disregard McGratts last season in the AHL, where he pretty much focused himself on the fighting exclusively.

While I have used Neil as a comparison, I don't expect McGrattan to work his way up to a 3rd liner who can also contribute on the powerplay like Neil has done. The most that he can do is round his game enough to earn that 12th forward spot. I don't think anyone has visions of him doing what Neil has done.

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Old
09-19-2006, 03:17 PM
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oh, dont get me wrong i love gratts, Andre Roy is my favourite senator. Fighters are my thing. I just want him to pick his places better and thats one of the things that will come with time. He's crazy and i love it.
Andre "Punching Bag" Roy and the word "fighter" don't belong together. The only fight Roy ever won convincingly was against Kelly "Mr. Speed Bag" Buchberger.

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09-20-2006, 06:43 AM
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Apparently Gratts has worked on his skating in the off season and Murray also mentioned using him in front of the net on the PP which I would love to see as he did with Chara and Neil last year.

http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Sena...67169-sun.html

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/...a01e34&k=51073

If two different newspapers are writing about the improved changes of his skating and the coach has noticed the changes it would seem to indicate he has an opportunity to be an everyday player for this team.


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09-20-2006, 08:18 AM
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Fantastic ! I would love to see him on the Powerplay in front of the net. Very happy to hear his conditioning and skating has improved. Hard work can pay off!

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09-20-2006, 09:41 AM
  #23
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I voted yes ONLY if he brings back his mohawk.

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09-20-2006, 11:41 AM
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Andre "Punching Bag" Roy and the word "fighter" don't belong together. The only fight Roy ever won convincingly was against Kelly "Mr. Speed Bag" Buchberger.
I dont think he can hear you with that cup ring of his stuffed in his ear

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09-20-2006, 11:56 AM
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I dont think he can hear you with that cup ring of his stuffed in his ear
Only he would be so stupid as to stuff it up his ear

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