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Well thats funny...

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Old
11-20-2003, 05:40 AM
  #1
Bob Bastards
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Well thats funny...

Can somebody tell me why Pierre Marc Bouchard is so hype? I was reading somwhere and I take on me to compare Pierre-Marc Bouchard and Mike Ribiero Q number in regular season and in playoff. One was taken in the first round and the other one in the second. Both are small and seem to have difficulty in defense.
So now, can you tell me from what you know, why one should be better then the other one? Is it work ethic, plain talent or just the environement? It look to me that we handle Mike very poorely (wow, why it does not shock me, I wonder...) over what the Wild is doing with Bouchard. I don't follow the Q that much so please enlighted me.

Oh and by the way, please no "Rib is crap! I don't want him on my team! Get rid of him for a back of puck!" OK! I know some people don't like him and I don't want to trade to have Bouchard, so get over it and be a little more constructive then this.

71 - C Mike Ribeiro
Age: 23
Date of birth: February 10, 1980
Place of birth: Montreal, Que., Canada
HT: 6-0 WT: 177
Shoots/Catches: L
Salary: $847,000
NHL Seasons: 4
Drafted by Montreal in 1998 (2/45).

Regular season
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
1998-99 Rouyn-Noranda 69 67 100 167 +50 137 2.42
1997-98 Rouyn-Noranda 67 40 85 125 +35 55 1.87

QMJHL 159 125 216 341 +104 222 2.14

Playoff
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
1998-99 Rouyn-Noranda 11 5 11 16 - 12 1.45
1997-98 Rouyn-Noranda 6 3 1 4 - 0 0.67

QMJHL 28 11 32 43 +8 50 1.54


96 - C/RW Pierre-Marc Bouchard
Age: 19
Date of birth: April 27, 1984
Place of birth: Sherbrooke, Que., Canada
HT: 5-10 WT: 165
Shoots/Catches: L
Salary: $1,185,000
NHL Seasons: 1
Drafted by Minnesota in 2002 (1/8).

Regular season
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
2001-02 Chicoutimi 69 46 94 140 +25 54 2.03
2000-01 Chicoutimi 67 38 57 95 E 20 1.42

QMJHL 136 84 151 235 +25 74 1.73

Playoff
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
2001-02 Chicoutimi 4 2 3 5 -5 4 1.25
2000-01 Chicoutimi 6 5 8 13 +3 0 2.17

QMJHL 10 7 11 18 -2 4 1.80


OK now help yourself and tell me why we want to get rid of one and the other one is consider a building block of the Wild franchise?

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Old
11-20-2003, 05:49 AM
  #2
EquabaleAce
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i remember reading a post in the summer where someone said that riberos problem was a lack of character. he said that ribs and dagenas would never make it at the dance because the 2 of them have got no character or heart.

that could be the deciding factor between ribs and bouchard

just a thought

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Old
11-20-2003, 05:52 AM
  #3
Darz
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Bouchard is a better skater than Riberio which imo makes a huge difference.

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Old
11-20-2003, 06:02 AM
  #4
Bob Bastards
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darz
Bouchard is a better skater than Riberio which imo makes a huge difference.
1 point for Darz...

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Old
11-20-2003, 07:06 AM
  #5
StanleyCH25
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Darz hit it right on the nail. You can have all the skill in the world but if you are both:

A) Small
B) A slow player

Then you're journey to making it in the NHL will be a difficult one. PM Bouchard is considered a fast skater and although he doesn't possess Ribeiro's vision and creativity with the puck, he makes up for it in speed to get around players. However, if Ribeiro keeps improving on his skating and size (which he has) then he could potentially become a great player. It's just that not very many players in Ribeiro's situation are able to improve enough in speed and size to become the great players. Corey Locke is another example of this type of player. They become somewhat risky picks that could turn out to be steals.

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Old
11-20-2003, 07:41 AM
  #6
markov`
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I really like Ribeiro, but I got to say that he's no "PM Bouchard material".

I saw Bouchard play in the Sagueneens, two years ago. 5 or 6 games. What a player he is! He possess a good vision, while Ribeiro possess an outstanding one. But IMO, the skill that put Bouchard ahead Rib is the skating. I don't think Bouchard is overhyped, and I really believe that he could become a NHL star.

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Old
11-20-2003, 07:59 AM
  #7
EquabaleAce
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speaking of funny

my pickup hockey just got cancelled when i got to the rink this afternoon
for a private schools hockey torney.
i hate them rich little ******
this happens way too much

aaarrrrgghhh

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Old
11-20-2003, 10:27 AM
  #8
SuperUnknown
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob *******s
71 - C Mike Ribeiro
Age: 23
Date of birth: February 10, 1980
Place of birth: Montreal, Que., Canada
HT: 6-0 WT: 177
Shoots/Catches: L
Salary: $847,000
NHL Seasons: 4
Drafted by Montreal in 1998 (2/45).

Regular season
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
1998-99 Rouyn-Noranda 69 67 100 167 +50 137 2.42
1997-98 Rouyn-Noranda 67 40 85 125 +35 55 1.87

QMJHL 159 125 216 341 +104 222 2.14

Playoff
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
1998-99 Rouyn-Noranda 11 5 11 16 - 12 1.45
1997-98 Rouyn-Noranda 6 3 1 4 - 0 0.67

QMJHL 28 11 32 43 +8 50 1.54


96 - C/RW Pierre-Marc Bouchard
Age: 19
Date of birth: April 27, 1984
Place of birth: Sherbrooke, Que., Canada
HT: 5-10 WT: 165
Shoots/Catches: L
Salary: $1,185,000
NHL Seasons: 1
Drafted by Minnesota in 2002 (1/8).

Regular season
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
2001-02 Chicoutimi 69 46 94 140 +25 54 2.03
2000-01 Chicoutimi 67 38 57 95 E 20 1.42

QMJHL 136 84 151 235 +25 74 1.73

Playoff
Year Team GP G A Pts +/- PIM PPG
2001-02 Chicoutimi 4 2 3 5 -5 4 1.25
2000-01 Chicoutimi 6 5 8 13 +3 0 2.17

QMJHL 10 7 11 18 -2 4 1.80


OK now help yourself and tell me why we want to get rid of one and the other one is consider a building block of the Wild franchise?
You can't analyze only Junior hockey stats. Many players scored tons of points in the QMJHL which didn't translate into an NHL career at all.

PM Bouchard has more intangibles than Mike Ribeiro. Honestly, I haven't seen anything in Ribeiro that would give him "franchise player" status, whle PM Bouchard has shown things that put him on the doorstep of being a "franchise player".

Mike Ribeiro is more like a Randy Robitaille. Tons of skill but lack of speed and defensive awareness.

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Old
11-20-2003, 10:34 AM
  #9
Jag68Sid87
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Robitaille is actually a pretty decent skater but his offensive instincts are nowhere near Ribeiro.

Ribeiro should try to follow in the footsteps of Adam Oates because his skill set is virtually identical. Oates is small and never had speed but was always one step ahead of his defender and racked up points because of his passing skills, brain and hand/eye coordination.

Ribeiro is above-average in all three areas, as well. IF he can improve his face-off skills, Ribeiro will have a long, productive career in the NHL.

Can he become Oates? Maybe, maybe not but he can become an above-average NHLer on production alone.

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Old
11-21-2003, 03:35 AM
  #10
Bob Bastards
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smail
You can't analyze only Junior hockey stats. Many players scored tons of points in the QMJHL which didn't translate into an NHL career at all.

PM Bouchard has more intangibles than Mike Ribeiro. Honestly, I haven't seen anything in Ribeiro that would give him "franchise player" status, whle PM Bouchard has shown things that put him on the doorstep of being a "franchise player".

Mike Ribeiro is more like a Randy Robitaille. Tons of skill but lack of speed and defensive awareness.
This is my question? What is the intangible that did not translate into statistic that make PM Bouchard a better NHLer than Mike? For now Darz say skating and I think its the most important one. Is there another?

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Old
11-21-2003, 04:48 AM
  #11
Habber
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patp77
Darz hit it right on the nail. You can have all the skill in the world but if you are both:

A) Small
B) A slow player

Then you're journey to making it in the NHL will be a difficult one. PM Bouchard is considered a fast skater and although he doesn't possess Ribeiro's vision and creativity with the puck, he makes up for it in speed to get around players. However, if Ribeiro keeps improving on his skating and size (which he has) then he could potentially become a great player. It's just that not very many players in Ribeiro's situation are able to improve enough in speed and size to become the great players.
I agree, sort of.

Ribs' skating is a big problem, but the problem isn't top-end speed. Ribs' is never going to be a guy to blow around d-men, and even if he had that speed, that's just not his game.

Look at Koivu. He's small and doesn't have great speed, but what he has is quickness in the offensive zone and the ability to protect the puck. This is what is lacking from Ribs' game. When Ribs has room, look out, but when someone is playing him tight he has troubles. He has to learn to protect the puck with his body and build up some strength to plant himself so he doesn't get knocked off the puck so easily. If he doens't learn to create room for himself he'll never be successful.

The good news is things like protecting the puck can be taught, and he has a damn good example of how things should be done in Koivu.

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Old
11-21-2003, 09:15 AM
  #12
montreal
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I don't have a problem with his skating, and his defensive coverage has improved and looks a lot better then it did in the past, where he just looked unsure of where he should be and what he should do.

But his biggest problem to me is his lack of lower body strength. He will always have a tough time fighting through checks, in the corners, along the boards, down low defensively, and in front of either net. Why, cause he cann't push off or make space for himself, and he can't go through a player, he will end up on the ice or lose the puck. I think he has gotten stronger, but he has a long way to go still.

I like that he's improved in every area, but it's been a slow process. Hindsight is 20/20, but why management thought a very weak, slow, somewhat lazy, defensive liability, poor skater, 6'0 165 19 year old would have any success in the NHL. He should never have been brought up at 19, or 20 or 21. He didn't have the basics down. I know he racked up the Q, but when your in your own end and don't know where to be or how to use body positioning, you don't understand the basics.

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Old
11-21-2003, 09:48 AM
  #13
Mike8
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Bouchard's stronger and quicker than Ribeiro. He doesn't have great speed by any means, but he is quicker to create more time and space for himself. Bouchard is able to make excellent plays at a high tempo, whereas Ribeiro often limits his options by taking too long to make a play. I don't think Ribeiro's adjusted fully to the pro game and how quickly the puck needs to be moved. This was one of his main problems in why he couldn't crack the lineup.

Bouchard's shorter than Ribeiro but more compact. This gives Bouchard an overall advantage down low. Too often we see a defenseman able to hold a helpless Ribeiro along the boards to render him ineffective. While this happens with Bouchard, it's not nearly as common. Bouchard keeps moving, and has a decent amount of lower body strength to work through checks.

From what I've seen, Bouchard simply has a better work ethic than Ribeiro. He doesn't look to make the pretty plays but looks to be effective (and since he's so incredibly talented, just being effective looks pretty). Ribeiro stills falls into the 'showboat' category, and I think this hurts his play overall.

The timing issue is a big one that seperates Ribeiro from effective small centers with skating issues. Ribeiro hangs on to the puck too long and he gets caught. He glides out there, with or without the puck and if you'll watch smaller players, they need to be moving at all times. Audette is a good example of this. While he's terribly ineffective at this point in his career, he's still always on the move in the offensive zone. He's always looking to get into good position, and tire out opposing defensemen. This is what Bergeron does in Boston as well, Comrie in Edmonton, Datsyuk in Detroit, Gomez in NJ... this is what small players do to survive and become more effective, to 'combat' the lumbering defensemen from simply pinning them along the boards, and Ribeiro doesn't do this.

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