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Buf/Van and Buf/NYI proposals

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Old
11-22-2003, 06:38 AM
  #26
Takeo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
satan is a franchise winger...an ELITE sniper...
OK, you keep telling yourself that...and dishing out the 4.5 mil.

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11-22-2003, 06:40 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame
I feel that Satan is overrated when he's playing well and underrated when he's playing bad. he's really just somewhere in the middle of all that.
I think the truth is that Satan is a great player who the Canucks couldn't afford at this point. I think valuewise it's close, but at Satan's salary it's a no go.

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Old
11-22-2003, 06:45 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
Make it a 4th or 5th and I'd go for it. Cooke has averaged around 35 points the last three seasons and was a +21 last year. He plays the agitator role but is certainly capable offensively...and he can play both wings. A very nice player at 25 yoa and 525K.

That said, the Nucks won't deal him.
yeh,, maybe a 4th,

i can see the Nucks being interested, definatly, maybe not for sure. but i can see them being interested, when the trade dealine comes around.

we've proved we can win without satan, maybe trading him for someone like that.

or even: (AT A STRETCH, consider iginla's contract and lackluster play)

CAL: Satan, campbell, 2nd rounder.
Buf: Iginla

approximate deal.

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Old
11-22-2003, 06:47 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jin
I think the truth is that Satan is a great player who the Canucks couldn't afford at this point. I think valuewise it's close, but at Satan's salary it's a no go.
$5mill, save about a $1mill (dunno contracts of cooke and allen) on those 2, yeh, it isnt too cheap, but it isnt too bad.

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Old
11-22-2003, 06:51 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
yeh,, maybe a 4th,

i can see the Nucks being interested, definatly, maybe not for sure. but i can see them being interested, when the trade dealine comes around.

we've proved we can win without satan, maybe trading him for someone like that.

or even: (AT A STRETCH, consider iginla's contract and lackluster play)

CAL: Satan, campbell, 2nd rounder.
Buf: Iginla

approximate deal.
Calgary has no use for Campbell. And I think Satan + 2nd is plenty for Iginla anyway. They're both overrated IMO and I lump them in the same category. But, to end this, no way Regier takes on Iginla's contract. Unless maybe you get Calgary to take CuBro too. Derek Roy will be manning the third line after the CBA anyway.

Satan, Brown + 4th for Iginla...I don't know.

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11-22-2003, 06:56 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
Calgary has no use for Campbell. And I think Satan + 2nd is plenty for Iginla anyway. They're both overrated IMO and I lump them in the same category. But, to end this, no way Regier takes on Iginla's contract.
yeh, id be with him, im just throwing ideas, as other bonefide goal getter's like hedjuk will take a hefty deal and us getting hosed to pull thru.

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Old
11-22-2003, 06:59 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
yeh,, maybe a 4th,

i can see the Nucks being interested, definatly, maybe not for sure. but i can see them being interested, when the trade dealine comes around.

we've proved we can win without satan, maybe trading him for someone like that.

or even: (AT A STRETCH, consider iginla's contract and lackluster play)

CAL: Satan, campbell, 2nd rounder.
Buf: Iginla

approximate deal.
Nope. Calgary doesn't need to trade Iginla financially, and especially not for the deal you are proposing. Calgary would get ripped. And Buffalo can't take on Iginla's salary.

Satan and a 4th for Cooke and Allen is the right type of trade for Buffalo- young defenseman, tough 3rd line winger. I'm not saying Vancouver would go with that trade, but it's the type that Buffalo management should seek if trading Satan.

 
Old
11-22-2003, 07:15 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
I just don't buy into the "holier than thou" (no pun intended) status of Satan like most posters around here. I'm a huge Sabres fan, but Satan is no "premiere player" plain and simple. On most teams, he's a second line winger...and has actually been that for part of this season on Buffalo. If he's not scoring, he's a waste. I'd take Allen and Cooke for Satan and his 4.5 mil and run for the hills. I'm sick and tired of soft, streaky wingers...
last time i checked, 40 goal/70 point players don't grow on trees. to add to this fact he did it with much lesser linemates and on a defensive team.

Satan would easily reach the 40 goal level again on a 1-dimensional offensive team like Vancouver. $4.5 million for a 40 goal scorer is pretty decent nowadays. especially when player like Lapointe are being paid $5.5 million to score 8.

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Old
11-22-2003, 07:22 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabot55
Nope. Calgary doesn't need to trade Iginla financially, and especially not for the deal you are proposing. Calgary would get ripped. And Buffalo can't take on Iginla's salary.

Satan and a 4th for Cooke and Allen is the right type of trade for Buffalo- young defenseman, tough 3rd line winger. I'm not saying Vancouver would go with that trade, but it's the type that Buffalo management should seek if trading Satan.
just satan for those 2, tho it wouldnt happen. satan is a good player, 40G, 70P scorers are a worthwhile investment, his had a lousy team recently and still put up 70P, he would be good fit for any team.

we cant really take iginla's salary, but considering his salary and the fact his not exatly doing, well, anything much this season what i said seemed pretty fair. only once Satan snaps his slump.

im not looking to trade satan really, we can win without him, and once his back his an excellent player for us.

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11-22-2003, 07:24 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaVal575
last time i checked, 40 goal/70 point players don't grow on trees. to add to this fact he did it with much lesser linemates and on a defensive team.

Satan would easily reach the 40 goal level again on a 1-dimensional offensive team like Vancouver. $4.5 million for a 40 goal scorer is pretty decent nowadays. especially when player like Lapointe are being paid $5.5 million to score 8.

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Old
11-22-2003, 09:19 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaVal575
last time i checked, 40 goal/70 point players don't grow on trees. to add to this fact he did it with much lesser linemates and on a defensive team.

Satan would easily reach the 40 goal level again on a 1-dimensional offensive team like Vancouver. $4.5 million for a 40 goal scorer is pretty decent nowadays. especially when player like Lapointe are being paid $5.5 million to score 8.
Fine, take him.

You obviously don't watch him play much.

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Old
11-22-2003, 09:24 AM
  #37
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the value of this deal is pretty good.. just that the Canucks's problems are more related to team defence and not offence.. Allen is our only hope for a tough crease clearing stay d-men..
ill rather see them trade prospects like umberger and smith for buffalo's defense

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Old
11-22-2003, 07:16 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
I just don't buy into the "holier than thou" (no pun intended) status of Satan like most posters around here. I'm a huge Sabres fan, but Satan is no "premiere player" plain and simple. On most teams, he's a second line winger...and has actually been that for part of this season on Buffalo. If he's not scoring, he's a waste. I'd take Allen and Cooke for Satan and his 4.5 mil and run for the hills. I'm sick and tired of soft, streaky wingers...

Is this Barrie Moore or Craig Millar in disguise?

2nd line winger...Yeah, 70 point wingers are so dime a dozen.Satan is a franchise player.Wow, Satan is going through a cold spell.He is still the Sabres main threat and is no way a second line winger.For the exception of maybe Vancouver, Satan would play on the first line.

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Old
11-23-2003, 02:14 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
OK, you keep telling yourself that...and dishing out the 4.5 mil.
I didn't know that SabresRule was B. Thomas Golisano.

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Old
11-23-2003, 02:18 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
Fine, take him.

You obviously don't watch him play much.
Have you watched him play his whole career in Buffalo because I hope you are not making these judgements based on his recent play this year.

2nd line player.

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Old
11-23-2003, 04:26 PM
  #41
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Bryan Allen for Kenny Jonsson would be a nice deal for both sides. Jonsson is a very solid , mobile defensive dman. The Isles might have to eat some salary here to get the deal done. I see him being a nice fit in VAN. and Allen being a nice fit on the Isle.

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Old
11-23-2003, 04:51 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggs
Bryan Allen for Kenny Jonsson would be a nice deal for both sides. Jonsson is a very solid , mobile defensive dman. The Isles might have to eat some salary here to get the deal done. I see him being a nice fit in VAN. and Allen being a nice fit on the Isle.
As a Canuck fan, no way jose. I don't mind moving Sopel, but not Allen unless we are getting a real terrific guy in return. Not that KJ isn't any good, but so many other factors with Jonsson. I don't think he's a good fit at all.

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Old
11-23-2003, 05:43 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Mizral
As a Canuck fan, no way jose. I don't mind moving Sopel, but not Allen unless we are getting a real terrific guy in return. Not that KJ isn't any good, but so many other factors with Jonsson. I don't think he's a good fit at all.
Hmm...I thought it was close to a fair trade. Of course KJ does have a history of "other factors" as you've mentioned, Mizral.

I interpreted VAN's defensive needs as a "positional" defensive-d partner for Ohlund-which Jonsson could fit very well. If a crease-clearer is what Van is after than KJ , obviously , would not fit the bill.

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Old
11-24-2003, 01:26 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freezerburn
I didn't know that SabresRule was B. Thomas Golisano.
sorry i couldnt find the quote, what were u referring to when you said that?

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Old
11-24-2003, 12:18 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
sorry i couldnt find the quote, what were u referring to when you said that?
It was a sarcastic response to what Takeo said to you:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo21
OK, you keep telling yourself that...and dishing out the 4.5 mil.
2nd page of the thread, the sarcasm wasn't directed at you.

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Old
11-24-2003, 01:11 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggs
Hmm...I thought it was close to a fair trade. Of course KJ does have a history of "other factors" as you've mentioned, Mizral.

I interpreted VAN's defensive needs as a "positional" defensive-d partner for Ohlund-which Jonsson could fit very well. If a crease-clearer is what Van is after than KJ , obviously , would not fit the bill.
Allen is Vancouver's only true stay at home crease clearing bruiser. he's quickly becoming a poor man's Hatcher. with Baron gone Vancouver needs his play... not to mention at his progression rate he'll be top-4 by the end of the season.

it's not like Jonsson isn't an appealing defensemen, it's just that we need Allen too much at this point.

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Old
11-24-2003, 01:51 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaVal575
Allen is Vancouver's only true stay at home crease clearing bruiser. he's quickly becoming a poor man's Hatcher. with Baron gone Vancouver needs his play... not to mention at his progression rate he'll be top-4 by the end of the season.

it's not like Jonsson isn't an appealing defensemen, it's just that we need Allen too much at this point.
I think Allen is just what the isles need too. Good to see him progressing for you guys.

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