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GDT: Penguins @ Flyers, Oct. 28th, 7:00PM

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Old
10-29-2006, 07:06 AM
  #376
Jester
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Penguin, clearly you have not been watching this board closely enough. Gagne is a gift sent to us directly from God. He is the greatest LW in the game today who is on pace to score 50+ goals this year. Don't let his -412 rating fool you, he is also the best defensive forward in the game today, Brind'Amour-Shmind'Amour, Gagne is a clear future Selke winner. Also, the $5.25 million he's making is also irrelevant--as I've already mentioned he's on pace to score 50+ goals this season for cryin' out loud.

As for his lack of heart-also irrelevant and do not address it again in the future, because clearly you are wrong. Simon God-ne does not, I repeat not float around the ice-EVER!! He is in good offensive/defensive positioning (again, don't let the +/- rating fool you) at all times, for you to suggest otherwise just further proves your "lack of knowledge about the game." And since you mentioned his collision with Forsberg, yup, you guessed it, you're wrong again. He's Simon 'Freakin' Gagne for cripes sake--people get out of his way, not the other way around. Sheesh, what is wrong with you?

"Richards plays with heart" is also irrelevant and totally incorrect. Look at the Atlanta GDT and you will see that he is solely responsible for our collapse last season. What's that? Injuries you say? Crappy goalie starting most of the games? No siree, once again you are incorrect. Mike Richards will be brought back behind the barn that Kapanen keeps missing after that game and 'taken care of' due to sole responsiblity for this team being a big 'ole lump of dog doo-doo that it is.

To sum up my far too long-winded post, please remember these simple facts:
a) Gagne walks on water
b) Richard "Sux" (yup, it's true, I read that here myself as well), and
c) Don't bother watching games anymore as clearly your eyes and everything you know about hockey has deceived you. In the future, come to HFBoards to get all relevant Flyers-related information--especially as it relates to God-ne and this piece of crap Richards.
wow. just wow.

learn to read, and grow up. i mean.. that post is a real gem. no one, and i mean no one, has blamed Richards for the decline last year. if you ever seen ANY of my analysis (and i'm going it interject my analysis, since you're clearly referring to me and just don't have the gumption to say my name in this rant) it's always focused on the injuries and the lack of cohesion that they caused with the team. KJ was specifically the biggest lost because it pushed our defense into the current troop essentially, that just ain't getting it done.

go read my thoughts on Richards game... since NO ONE has said he sucks. we're just saying he isn't scoring and it's a problem. prove me wrong about that... please. i want you to PROVE TO ME that Richards is providing any significant offense to this club. no one argues about his heart or his effort. you want to watch heart and effort alone? go watch a beer league game with guys blowing off steam after work... this is big boy hockey and you need to provide something more than "trying hard." i love Richards, i want him to be the CAPTAIN of this team, but there is a significant problem in his lack of production over the last 40+ games of his NHL career.

a lot of guys try hard in this league and can't stick because they can't find the other side of the net...

keep ragging on Gagne's heart, because you have this gem of logic floating around:

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Jester, I don't really care how "silly" you think I look. Money sure does have a lot to do with it. When he was in negotiations, what did you constantly say, 'he's a PPG type of player' so he scores two in one game and that excuses him for the next? Before last night, he hadn't scored in four games. The reason I'm 'ragging on' Gagne is precisely because of his paycheck. Yes, he is doing more than others, but I still constantly see him coasting into the zone. He deserves to be 'ragged on' because when you sign a big contract, people expect big things from you. Again, I am not real happy that Richards hasn't been scoring, put to put the blame squarely on his shoulders and let Gagne off the hook is just plain ludicrous IMO. I could make a similar argument as you and say that if Gagne played with the same heart, desire and tenacity that Richards did he'd have twice as many goals and we'd be a
.500 team (although I doubt we would be, but that's a different discussion).
You are right about one thing though, Carter better start stepping it up as well.
you're right... if he just tried a bit harder on a nightly basis, he'd be the best goal-scorer in the league.

meanwhile, since you want to personalize every argument with passive aggressive attacks on anyone that looks at statistics and observable fact.

Gagne: 5-1-6 -5
Richards: 0-1-1 -6

do what Richards is doing, no matter how much you try, for an entire season and you're barely hanging on in this league... cuz the fact of the matter is that you can find a player who is being paid a lot less to bring exactly what Richards is to this club, and possibly more... keep that up for a year and you're an AHL player.

the thing that's truly fantastic about the Gagne bashing is that 2 years ago all we ever heard was "he's completely overrated" all he is, is a defensive forward with some moderate offensively ability... not that good. blah blah... now he's on the first line scoring goals, and he's being criticized as a "floater" and not producing enough... kid just can't win. you sound like a yankee fan moaning about A-rod while he's putting up perfectly fine numbers... hopefully people don't start riding Gagne to the point where he's a section 8.

offensive players float through the neutral zone and offensive zone and then slide, or explode into space... go watch tape of ANY of the great offensive players of any era, including this one, they sorta just roll around and then boom they burst into space and the puck is on net. like Ilya on that breakaway the other night... he was just sorta hanging around by the point and then he just took off and was gone. Jagr, Hull, Bure, etc. they all float around... christ, Hull probably skated less than any player in the history of the league, en route to 800 goals.

even Gretzky floated a LOT... as he let the game move around him and picked it apart. this game isn't about skating hard 100% of the time, it's about skating hard at the RIGHT time to be skating hard... as i've said before, it's something that BOTH Richards and Carter need to learn to do. you NEVER see them do the stutter step move that Pitkanen put on a guy last night to get around him, because they're always moving too fast to do anything like that... both need to slow down a lot more and let the play come to them a bit more. it's one of the reasons they both end up so far wide and low when they enter the zone so often. Carter's starting to cut into the slot a bit more, but still chest-sniping... the patented Richards move right now is tome down the right wing at full speed and then cut into the crease and try to jam the puck... the problem is the goalies are just holding the pipe and he has nowhere to go with the puck. every time.


Last edited by Jester: 10-29-2006 at 07:45 AM.
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Old
10-29-2006, 08:40 AM
  #377
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For future reference, I read less than 1% of your post. However, here's what you had to say about Richards on the Atlanta GDT, post #364, I believe you were addressing 'Panasonic Youth:'

"actually, Richards, Umberger, Carter, and Calder are the focal point of my "constant *****ing." however, Carter recovered for the second half of last season. Richards has been having these same offensive woes since the midpoint of last season... and yes, you can tie that directly to the decline of the team during last season... however, Carter blossomed last spring in the same situation. go figure. what's going on with him now is very frustrating.

however, he produced pretty much nothing since last december, which isn't a good sign and that has continued into this year.

Umberger and Carter should be providing more offense for this club than Richards... and Calder is a complete f'ing mystery. i don't care how much effort, how good of defense, whatever... until THAT group starts producing we will not be a competitive team on a regular basis" (Sorry, don't know how to quote from a different thread, but you will see that I copy and pasted your post exactly as written).

I rest my case...Richards is solely to blame for our collapse. Thanks for setting the record straight for the rest of us who thought he was at least playing with heart.

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Old
10-29-2006, 09:02 AM
  #378
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On a happier note, Crosby was given the first star by nhl.com for last night's performance.

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Old
10-29-2006, 09:11 AM
  #379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
I rest my case...Richards is solely to blame for our collapse. Thanks for setting the record straight for the rest of us who thought he was at least playing with heart.
Heart is overrated. "Heart" is something you tag a guy with when he's not producing but you like him anyway.

Such is the case with Mike Richards.

He's not the reason for some downfall but if we were handing out grades for this year thus far he'd get an F like just about everyone else.

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Old
10-29-2006, 10:20 AM
  #380
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“The problem is that when we face adversity, how do we react? To me, that is the concern right now,” said John Stevens after the game.
...
“We come out and play 20 minutes and look like we are the superior team and then the next 40, we’re not even close.”

At least he recognizes one of the problems..

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Old
10-29-2006, 10:54 AM
  #381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
For future reference, I read less than 1% of your post. However, here's what you had to say about Richards on the Atlanta GDT, post #364, I believe you were addressing 'Panasonic Youth:'

"actually, Richards, Umberger, Carter, and Calder are the focal point of my "constant *****ing." however, Carter recovered for the second half of last season. Richards has been having these same offensive woes since the midpoint of last season... and yes, you can tie that directly to the decline of the team during last season... however, Carter blossomed last spring in the same situation. go figure. what's going on with him now is very frustrating.

however, he produced pretty much nothing since last december, which isn't a good sign and that has continued into this year.

Umberger and Carter should be providing more offense for this club than Richards... and Calder is a complete f'ing mystery. i don't care how much effort, how good of defense, whatever... until THAT group starts producing we will not be a competitive team on a regular basis" (Sorry, don't know how to quote from a different thread, but you will see that I copy and pasted your post exactly as written).

I rest my case...Richards is solely to blame for our collapse. Thanks for setting the record straight for the rest of us who thought he was at least playing with heart.
hi...

by "tie directly" that means they both happened AT THE SAME TIME... not "Richards decline was the direct cause (notice the use of a verb) of the Flyers decline last year."

"tie directly" happen at the same time... does not mean "cause."

so good just "resting your case." essentially... not using critical reading skills to understand a statement. here's what's really humorous about that... the use of "tie directly" there is DIRECTLY in defense of Richards and the fact that you can only put so much weight in his statistical decline last year because EVERYONE went down hill (outside of Carter... which is the rest of the point there).


Last edited by Jester: 10-29-2006 at 11:05 AM.
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Old
10-29-2006, 10:58 AM
  #382
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JXC View Post
Heart is overrated. "Heart" is something you tag a guy with when he's not producing but you like him anyway.

Such is the case with Mike Richards.

He's not the reason for some downfall but if we were handing out grades for this year thus far he'd get an F like just about everyone else.
Knuble, Sanderson, Pitkanen, and Gagne are about the only guys living up to expectation thus far at all... Nitty had a .900 svpct going into last night, which is fine... but we really need a .910 out of him.

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10-29-2006, 03:16 PM
  #383
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Knuble, Sanderson, Pitkanen, and Gagne are about the only guys living up to expectation thus far at all... Nitty had a .900 svpct going into last night, which is fine... but we really need a .910 out of him.
I think you're giving too much credit to Pitkanen. Until last night, he was turning over the puck A LOT, and taking some very dumb penalties.

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10-29-2006, 03:54 PM
  #384
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Strangely, Robitaile is still a plus player at +1

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10-29-2006, 04:05 PM
  #385
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We need to trade Gange now for a Dman. Markov would be great
Thanks, but no thanks. You can have Bouillon and Souray though.

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10-29-2006, 05:36 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth View Post
I think you're giving too much credit to Pitkanen. Until last night, he was turning over the puck A LOT, and taking some very dumb penalties.
he's a young dman... he's creating offense and doing Pitkanen things... there are real growing pains with any player of that style. he remains dynamic, which is what i expect from him. he is NEVER going to be a shutdown dman... but he is racking up assists.

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10-29-2006, 05:43 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
he's a young dman... he's creating offense and doing Pitkanen things... there are real growing pains with any player of that style. he remains dynamic, which is what i expect from him. he is NEVER going to be a shutdown dman... but he is racking up assists.
True that. I wish he'd be a little bit more solid in his own zone, though. We need to stop the bleeding (blowouts).

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10-29-2006, 06:05 PM
  #388
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Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth View Post
True that. I wish he'd be a little bit more solid in his own zone, though. We need to stop the bleeding (blowouts).
it's going to take time for him to be "solid" defensively... especially when you're developing the "go screw with the other team" skill-set that he has. it's all fine and good... Brian Leetch was never a "shutdown guy," but he was good enough and caused more problems for the other team than he caused for you... which is what you should expect/want from Pitkanen long term.

blowouts are a team issue... not a single player, of course.

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10-30-2006, 05:45 PM
  #389
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anyone have a video clip of forsberg's hit on staal?

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10-30-2006, 06:20 PM
  #390
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[QUOTE=Jester;6921814]wow. just wow.

QUOTE]

Agreed with entire post.

Without contributing any offense, Mike Richards is an overpaid 4th line NRG center. Nothing more, nothing less. This guy needs to be contributing offensively, at least 50 points a year which I am sure he can possibly still get, but he better start soon, or in my mind, he is a bust as a first round pick.

People on here love to bash Gagne for some odd reason, and the only argument I have seen to date is that he is not Kovalchuk, Jagr or Bure, but hey, different things keep different people happy. If bashing our best player not named Forsberg is the way people keep themselves happy, go for it!

He is still on pace for 40+ goals while Carter and Richards are on pace for what, like 8 and 0, respectively??

There are 2 simple reasons this team is as bad as it is right now.

1) The defense is not good enough

2) The young players Carter/Umberger/Richards/Calder who we are relying on are not giving us anything!!!!!!!!!!

Yes. It is that simple.

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10-30-2006, 07:02 PM
  #391
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error

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11-01-2006, 02:35 PM
  #392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nhlyounggun11 View Post
anyone have a video clip of forsberg's hit on staal?
Check the game highlights on NHL.com.

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