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Another Latendresse Thread: WJC

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Old
11-05-2006, 12:15 AM
  #26
Taupy
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Originally Posted by Evil Ted View Post
He wouldnt make the team and if he did he wouldnt see much icetime anyway.
Yeah, cause you must be some kind of coach.

And you probably know him well, talk to him each day, see how he react outside of the game.

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Old
11-05-2006, 12:41 AM
  #27
Mr. Hab
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Latendresse should go to the WJC.
It's only what? 3 weeks long (including pre-tournament practices...).

If Carbo lets Lats go, (IMO) then I think Lats will be the 1st line power forward
on the team...bringing some NHL experience is of high value to the Canadian Jr. team that they cannot afford to pass on...

By the way...Carey Price is definitely going, right?

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Old
11-05-2006, 09:47 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by MarkovForNorris View Post
How can an NHLer be not good enough to be part of a 20-man Junior squad? It doesn't make any sense to me.
Because he wouldln't be an NHLer on any other team in the NHL and his point totals and +/- when compared to his ice time and quality of linemates in some of the games he's played this year dictate that he shouldn't be an NHLer here either.

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11-05-2006, 10:36 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I suppose it would be asking for trouble if they said now that they would release him, but Team Canada ultimately said they didn't even want him? So far he's doing ok with the Habs, but I think you could patch his spot easily enough with a well-deserved recall to Lapierre, of course. But it would be kind of embarrassing to all involved if they released him but he didn't even make the team, which some folks out there seem to think is still a possibility.
The Mario Lemieux story won't happen twice. WJC could count on how many NHL experienced players this season?

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11-05-2006, 11:47 AM
  #30
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Just keep him away from the Devils. High stick to the eye and a skate to the head, this kid is dangerous.

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Old
11-05-2006, 05:38 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
I've been wondering about whether Latendresse should be released by the Canadiens to play for Team Canada at the WJC since the beginning of the year.

So far, unlike most, I'm pleased with Latendresse's play on the team. I think he's progressing significantly, and I don't think he would have progressed in the Q.

With that said, the Latendresse project is a unique project in the sense that it's a long-term investment as opposed to looking at Latendresse and judging him according to whether he helps Montreal right now.

Most prospects only make teams when they're going to help a team in the short-term; few make it because the team wants to take a hands-on approach to the kid's development.

Given this long-term project approach to Latendresse's development, I would think that Montreal should release him for the WJC. He would be playing with the best players of his age group, and thus he would be challenged. Being challenged results in good development.

The only way I can see Latendresse not being released to the WJC is if the team ran into injury problems, or if the team didn't value WJC experience all that much (which would be peculiar, in my view).

I think it would be great if Latendresse would be loaned to the WJ team.

He would get some more quality ice time, develop some leadership skills and perhaps, come back to the habs with more confidence. Plus, if he has any pride at all, he would want to show sutter that he made a mistake last season.

Unless we severely hit the injury bug, I have no problem with this idea. Infact, I love it

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Old
11-05-2006, 05:47 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
As to whether it would be a good thing, Mike, I can't see the positives out weighing the potential negaitives. The learning curve is going well right now, why mess with it.
Because, while I agree with the decision to keep Latendresse in the NHL, he is not NHL-ready. The decision to keep him in the NHL was made due to a flawed system which does not make it easy to develop certain players who are too good for junior, but not eligible for the in-between leagues. As such, when an opportunity arises to have Latendresse play at a level which is not below him and not above him, the team should look at having him play there.

He would be adequately challenged, but playing well and being a factor in every game is within his reach.

It would be a good barometer to gauge his development to date.

The experience in itself would be invaluable, in my view.

And, at least in my past experience, whenever I'm challenged in a day-to-day grind and learning situation, it can be mentally exhausting. When I then get a break and work at a level more to my capabilities, I can excel at that level and come back with more confidence, feeling more refreshed for the day-to-day, challenging grind.


Furthermore, while I want Latendresse up with the big-team for the remainder of the season, I do not think he is an asset for the short-term. I don't think he'll contribute much until perhaps very late this year. I do think a WJC experience would be helpful towards his development, and as a sidebar, a player like Lapierre or Kostitsyn would very likely have a more positive impact on today's Habs than Latendresse would.

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Old
11-05-2006, 06:04 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by MarkovForNorris View Post
How can an NHLer be not good enough to be part of a 20-man Junior squad? It doesn't make any sense to me.
Because he isn't really an NHLer. I don't know what the real reasons are for keeping him up here but his play is not one of them.

Except for a few hits Latendresse has really shown nothing. I know Carbo and Gainey know more about hockey than I do but I also know what I can see with my own eyes. Tender should not be in the NHL. The Habs are making the same mistake with him as they did with Ribeiro. They're rushing him.

Can you name any other player from any other organization in the recent past that has been treated this way and has shown so little to deserve his spot?

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Old
11-05-2006, 06:13 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Taupy View Post
Yeah, cause you must be some kind of coach.

And you probably know him well, talk to him each day, see how he react outside of the game.

Latendresse would be a huge sideshow to the Canadian team. In a short term tournament like the wjc coaches will want to avoid these sort of distractions. The negatives outweigh the positives for the team.

Pretty much every team in the NHL besides montreal would have sent Latendresse back to jr, and if that was the case sending him to the wjc to reedeem himself from last years benching it would be great for his development.

Even Bobby Mac said on TSN Tenderness would have to make this team, could you imagine his confidence if he was sent to camp and was cut? or made the team and saw limited icetime?

Montreal wont permit him to go I bet.

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11-05-2006, 06:17 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil Ted View Post
Latendresse would be a huge sideshow to the Canadian team. In a short term tournament like the wjc coaches will want to avoid these sort of distractions. The negatives outweigh the positives for the team.

Pretty much every team in the NHL besides montreal would have sent Latendresse back to jr, and if that was the case sending him to the wjc to reedeem himself from last years benching it would be great for his development.

Even Bobby Mac said on TSN Tenderness would have to make this team, could you imagine his confidence if he was sent to camp and was cut? or made the team and saw limited icetime?
Montreal wont permit him to go I bet.

then he doesn't deserve to be in the NHL in the first place.

Latendresse is a real tweener. He's not good enough for the NHL but he's too big of a man to be playing junior hockey. The WJ's might be the perfect fit. The only way he gets cut is if he doesn't work hard enough. If he doesn't do that, then we should be deeply concerned about his maturity level.

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11-05-2006, 06:38 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Astroboy View Post
\


I am sure if he played for the Leafs MacKenzie would have said he was a sure bet to make the team.
There are tons of Leafs homers in Ontario.

Bob McKenzie is NOT one of them.

I disagree with his opinion about Latendresse, but he's no Leafs homer. He's as unbiased as it gets. Bob is teh awesome.

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Old
11-05-2006, 11:57 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Transported Upstater View Post
There are tons of Leafs homers in Ontario.

Bob McKenzie is NOT one of them.

I disagree with his opinion about Latendresse, but he's no Leafs homer. He's as unbiased as it gets. Bob is teh awesome.
There's no NHL analyst that I respect more than Bob McKenzie

I agree, he doesn't bias towards the leafs

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Old
11-06-2006, 01:08 AM
  #38
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What would honestly be accomplished by sending Latendresse to the WJC?

Nothing. If anything, his NHL learning would actually regress due to playing in the juniors.. exactly why he's up with the Habs in the first place! There's no benefit to les Canadiens, so I don't see him being released.

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Old
11-06-2006, 07:42 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Because, while I agree with the decision to keep Latendresse in the NHL, he is not NHL-ready. The decision to keep him in the NHL was made due to a flawed system which does not make it easy to develop certain players who are too good for junior, but not eligible for the in-between leagues. As such, when an opportunity arises to have Latendresse play at a level which is not below him and not above him, the team should look at having him play there.

He would be adequately challenged, but playing well and being a factor in every game is within his reach.

It would be a good barometer to gauge his development to date.

The experience in itself would be invaluable, in my view.

And, at least in my past experience, whenever I'm challenged in a day-to-day grind and learning situation, it can be mentally exhausting. When I then get a break and work at a level more to my capabilities, I can excel at that level and come back with more confidence, feeling more refreshed for the day-to-day, challenging grind.


Furthermore, while I want Latendresse up with the big-team for the remainder of the season, I do not think he is an asset for the short-term. I don't think he'll contribute much until perhaps very late this year. I do think a WJC experience would be helpful towards his development, and as a sidebar, a player like Lapierre or Kostitsyn would very likely have a more positive impact on today's Habs than Latendresse would.
I can't argue with your reasoning. Instictively, I think it could be a problem going forward. In the end, it depends on how the staff, Carbo in particular, views the kid. If they feel that they are adding to his confidence, and his comfort factor in the league,game by game, a stint at the WJC could undo that. If Carbo decides, 'sure why not, the kid's mentally tough, it'll be a good experience', well ok.

They've made progress, it's obviously a project they wanted to take on at the NHL level, I'm just concerned that some of the progress could be undone.

Carbo/Gainey could care less about media pressure, but I wonder if they would want to shield the kid from more scrutiny.

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Old
11-06-2006, 09:00 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkovForNorris View Post
How can an NHLer be not good enough to be part of a 20-man Junior squad? It doesn't make any sense to me.
Different style of play sometimes

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Old
11-06-2006, 09:27 AM
  #41
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Suppose Latendresse were eligible to play in Hamilton. We can't assume he'd be a productive AHLer at this point in his career. He might, but there's a good chance he wouldn't shine bright. For one thing, he wouldn't receive the same quality of coaching that he gets in Montréal, and he'd be playing with less skilled teammates.

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Old
11-06-2006, 04:09 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
I can't argue with your reasoning. Instictively, I think it could be a problem going forward. In the end, it depends on how the staff, Carbo in particular, views the kid. If they feel that they are adding to his confidence, and his comfort factor in the league,game by game, a stint at the WJC could undo that. If Carbo decides, 'sure why not, the kid's mentally tough, it'll be a good experience', well ok.

They've made progress, it's obviously a project they wanted to take on at the NHL level, I'm just concerned that some of the progress could be undone.

Carbo/Gainey could care less about media pressure, but I wonder if they would want to shield the kid from more scrutiny.
Good points. Depends largely on his mental make-up regarding whether this would be a move to consider or not.

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11-06-2006, 04:18 PM
  #43
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I have heard that he won't even be playing at the WJC because he sustained a concussion during the selection camp. He was elbowed in the head by Steve Downie.

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11-06-2006, 04:19 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Because, while I agree with the decision to keep Latendresse in the NHL, he is not NHL-ready. The decision to keep him in the NHL was made due to a flawed system which does not make it easy to develop certain players who are too good for junior, but not eligible for the in-between leagues. As such, when an opportunity arises to have Latendresse play at a level which is not below him and not above him, the team should look at having him play there.

He would be adequately challenged, but playing well and being a factor in every game is within his reach.

It would be a good barometer to gauge his development to date.

The experience in itself would be invaluable, in my view.

And, at least in my past experience, whenever I'm challenged in a day-to-day grind and learning situation, it can be mentally exhausting. When I then get a break and work at a level more to my capabilities, I can excel at that level and come back with more confidence, feeling more refreshed for the day-to-day, challenging grind.


Furthermore, while I want Latendresse up with the big-team for the remainder of the season, I do not think he is an asset for the short-term. I don't think he'll contribute much until perhaps very late this year. I do think a WJC experience would be helpful towards his development, and as a sidebar, a player like Lapierre or Kostitsyn would very likely have a more positive impact on today's Habs than Latendresse would.

Personally, I don't see the system being flawed on the condition the player in question is ready to accept going back to juniors and if he's properly coached. I'm not sure if this was the case with Latendresse but I don't see the WJC as a means of him getting better. It can really end up being a gamble, he'd have to be given a spot first and then, he'd have to be properly utilized. He could potentially come back with a low confidence and a league like the NHL isn't kind to young players.

The way I've seen it up to now is that management has decided to mold him into a NHL player. Unlike most prospects I've seen, he didn't have to go through the classic Juniors/AHL/NHL route. If they really are taking a hands on approach on Latendresse, sending him to the WJC might go a different route from their initial plans. Of course, all of this is just speculation on my part.

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Old
11-06-2006, 05:12 PM
  #45
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The problem with Latendresse right now is that he seems to be putting too much pressure on himself and playing not to make mistakes instead of relaxing and letting his hockey instincts take over.

It's tough for any rookie, let alone a teenager, to adjust to both the NHL life and speed of the game. I remember Alexandre Daigles first shift in a pre-season game and he reportedly skated back to the bench after 30 seconds on a shift and told the trainer he couldn't see anything and that it was all blurry (due to the speed). Playing for the Habs, and being a francophone, puts an extra added amount of pressure.

Personally, I like what their doing with Guillaume. Reminds me of how Owen Nolan was brought along, and to a lesser extent Keith Primeau. Get him in games, get him comfortable, and get him used to the speed. But the big thing is, what do you do with Guillaume after Christmas?

Latendresse's junior team, Drummondville, is in shambles right now and not the kind of environment you would want to send a star prospect too as they aren't winning any games. It was supposed to be a division power in the Q, but when Derrick Brassard got injured (out for 6 months I believe in August), and Latendresse made the Hab's, they've struggled mightily and are now risking not making the playoffs in a league where near every team except 2 makes it! Sending Gui to the WJC team accomplish's nothing at this point, in terms of pure development. He's been there and he's won. If anything it may help build leadership and character but he can learn more hanging around guys like Rivet and Koivu than back in junior.

Personally, I think Carbo / Gainey, et al, are letting Latendresse make the decision for them based on his play. If he goes through the next 9 or 10 games in November and still isn't making noise, he goes to the WJC and ultimately back to the QMJHL. Drummondville will no doubt be auctioning off Gui to the highest bidder at the Q trade deadline, which is also coincedently just after Christmas, so the odds of him going to a contender and getting more playoff experience are bigger.

The next month will be crucial one in Guillaume's development, and I think show all of us if he is in fact really ready for full-time NHL duty.

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Old
11-06-2006, 05:37 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Glace Bay 'Bye View Post
The problem with Latendresse right now is that he seems to be putting too much pressure on himself and playing not to make mistakes instead of relaxing and letting his hockey instincts take over.
Good observation. I agree. He's also been quoted as saying it's most important to him to not make a mistake that costs the team out there.

Reminiscent of Komisarek's comments midway through last season, where he stated he was playing 'fearful' hockey; fearful of making a mistake and getting benched. But that changed under Gainey, where he was told not to worry so much.

The end result was that Komisarek did make mistakes, but fewer than he did when playing conservative hockey, and he became far more explosive physically and otherwise.

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