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Hamrlik to Boston: What would it take?

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11-27-2003, 09:44 AM
  #1
VeddarRants
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Hamrlik to Boston: What would it take?

If the Islanders are thinking about moving Hamrlik (which I don't know if they are; I only know that the Islanders are trying to trim salary) I'm curious as to what it would take for Hamrlik to land in Boston... I'm sure a top level defensive prospect or NHL ready-now dman would have to be going the Islanders way as part of the package. Thoughts?

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11-27-2003, 10:30 AM
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I would start

Quote:
Originally Posted by VeddarRants
If the Islanders are thinking about moving Hamrlik (which I don't know if they are; I only know that the Islanders are trying to trim salary) I'm curious as to what it would take for Hamrlik to land in Boston... I'm sure a top level defensive prospect or NHL ready-now dman would have to be going the Islanders way as part of the package. Thoughts?

with either Lars Jonsson or Shaone Morrisson

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11-27-2003, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kvashinator12
with either Lars Jonsson or Shaone Morrisson

Honestly, I don't consider either Jonsson or Morrisson to be high level prospects at this point. But, then again, I haven't scouted either personally and am just going on what I've read.

I would think the Isles would want Jillison. I'm sure they'd ask for Boynton, but I assume his trade value is higher than Hamrlik's.

The two teams are unlikely to deal except under special circumstances. In the book Fishsticks, Alan Hahn noted that Boston and Islander management are wary of each other because they are in the same conference and for historical animosity due to some personel moves (like Lavy signing with the Isles). Hahn was saying Allison didn't become an Islander becaue the B's wanted more than market value to deal with a conference foe. And, O'C made some similar remarks last year after the Isles attempts to acquire McLaren did not pan out.

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11-27-2003, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeddarRants
If the Islanders are thinking about moving Hamrlik (which I don't know if they are; I only know that the Islanders are trying to trim salary) I'm curious as to what it would take for Hamrlik to land in Boston... I'm sure a top level defensive prospect or NHL ready-now dman would have to be going the Islanders way as part of the package. Thoughts?
Boyton and Samsonov.

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11-27-2003, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasting time
Boyton and Samsonov.
Personally, I suspect that both players have more trade value than Hamrlik on their own, so I don't think we can get both. Obviously, Hamrlik is a better player than Boyton right now, but young inexpensive players are at a premium. And, Samsonov has huge upside.

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11-27-2003, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasting time
Boyton and Samsonov.
Last time I checked, Hamrlik wasn't putting up ppg figures..

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11-27-2003, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kvashinator12
with either Lars Jonsson or Shaone Morrisson
I was going to do a proposal with Shaone Morrison and a 1st for Hamrlik... of course then the next priority for the B's if this deal did go down would be to sign Hamrlik to a long term deal, which they haven't shown they're willing to do with the upcoming CBA.

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11-27-2003, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
Last time I checked, Hamrlik wasn't putting up ppg figures..
Well I'm a Leafs fan and if I can get Hamrlik for my #1 prospect in the system (who happens to be a defenseman - Carlo Colaiacovo) straight up then I make that trade so fast your head will spin.

Boyton is a year or so older but similar upside to Coli.

So, if Mad Mike is expecting only a top D prospect for Hamrlik then the line up will be a mile long I suspect.

So, it will take more. How much more?

It's bidding time...

And I think in the flurry of the opportunity of landing a legitimate proven #1 guy like Hamrlik, someone the quality of Samsonov could get thrown in. Keep in mind that Samsonov has tailed off a bit in the last year and his salary is in the $4 million range.

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11-27-2003, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
Personally, I suspect that both players have more trade value than Hamrlik on their own, so I don't think we can get both. Obviously, Hamrlik is a better player than Boyton right now, but young inexpensive players are at a premium. And, Samsonov has huge upside.
I don't know how much more upside you get with Samsonov. I think you have seen his full ability. It just remains to be seen how consistent he can be, will he lose a step, will he get injured?

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11-27-2003, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasting time
I don't know how much more upside you get with Samsonov. I think you have seen his full ability. It just remains to be seen how consistent he can be, will he lose a step, will he get injured?

I understand your point. I don think Hamrlik has lots of on ice value. My concern, however, is that his market value will be decreased by his age and contract status.

I think the truth is in the middle here. I think he would bring more than Morrison and pick (as suggested above), but less than guys like Samsonov.

Boston got Jillison for McLaren, and McLaren's market value is no higher than Hamrliks. I think Jillison and a 2nd rounder woudl be fair return.

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11-27-2003, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasting time
Keep in mind that Samsonov has tailed off a bit in the last year and his salary is in the $4 million range.
Samsonav hasn't tailed off at all this year. He's been playing on the second line with a rookie center (Bergeron) and a third line grinder (Lapointe)for the past ten games or so. Before that, the second line center was Travis Green... and through it all, he's got 15 points in 21 games after sitting most of last year with an injury... I think Samsonav has been solid.

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11-27-2003, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasting time
Well I'm a Leafs fan and if I can get Hamrlik for my #1 prospect in the system (who happens to be a defenseman - Carlo Colaiacovo) straight up then I make that trade so fast your head will spin.
A package of Samsonov and Boynton is significantly more valuable then Colaicovo...Comparing the two is ludicrous.

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11-27-2003, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
A package of Samsonov and Boynton is significantly more valuable then Colaicovo...Comparing the two is ludicrous.

I think he was comparing Boynton straight up to Colaicovo. His argument was that there relatively equal as young defensemen. I think Boynton has accomplished more at this point, however.

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11-27-2003, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nillson2Berge2Weinie
I'm taking a stance of Isles needing more then anything stability but if that offer was on the table i'd say change Morrison to Zinovjev and a first and I will fly to Lagaurdia go to the Island pack up the Hammers bags drive him up 95 myself. But of course we do this deal in March cause I still want to see what this current squad is made of. If the Isles falter from here to March I think he could definately be had...

Are you out of your mind? Of what use would Zinovjev be to the isles? A small 3rd line foward? No thanks, isles have plenty of those.

I don't think Morrisonn and a 1st would get Hamrlik, but I'd much rather have Morrisonn then Zinovjev.

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11-27-2003, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslesFan17
Are you out of your mind? Of what use would Zinovjev be to the isles? A small 3rd line foward? No thanks, isles have plenty of those.

I don't think Morrisonn and a 1st would get Hamrlik, but I'd much rather have Morrisonn then Zinovjev.

In all honesty, I don't know how much Hamrlik is worth on the market right now. I think it would be a lot more than Morrison and a pick, but $ are so wacky in the NHL. It could be another Jason Wiemer situation - a valuable commodity lost for nothing.

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11-27-2003, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
A package of Samsonov and Boynton is significantly more valuable then Colaicovo...Comparing the two is ludicrous.

He wasnt. He was comparing Boyton alone to what Colaiacovo could be in a couple years.

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11-27-2003, 01:04 PM
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Disagree

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
In all honesty, I don't know how much Hamrlik is worth on the market right now. I think it would be a lot more than Morrison and a pick, but $ are so wacky in the NHL. It could be another Jason Wiemer situation - a valuable commodity lost for nothing.

i think their is a big difference between a top 15 dman in the league, and jason wiemer.

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11-27-2003, 01:05 PM
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I imagine the Isles could get Patrice Bergeron or Jeff Jillson straight across for Hamrlik.

Coliacavo wouldn't quite be enough I don't think. I love the kid, but he has to proove he's an NHL player first.

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11-27-2003, 01:14 PM
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Morrisonn, Hilbert and a #2 would get the job done.

Isles save $$$, Morrisonn is very young and remains a strong prospect, and Hilbert needs legitimate icetime to show if he is an NHLer. Neither are proven, but you don't get sure things AND save $$$.

From a B's standpoint, given up a nice return of young talent, but nothing that they can do without, nothing that is contributing to their current success. And you would be getting a solid, proven, in-his-prime dman.


Last edited by Trottier: 11-27-2003 at 01:20 PM.
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11-27-2003, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
I understand your point. I don think Hamrlik has lots of on ice value. My concern, however, is that his market value will be decreased by his age and contract status.

I think the truth is in the middle here. I think he would bring more than Morrison and pick (as suggested above), but less than guys like Samsonov.

Boston got Jillison for McLaren, and McLaren's market value is no higher than Hamrliks. I think Jillison and a 2nd rounder woudl be fair return.
Oh, I would say that McLaren'smarket value is far below Hamrliks.

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11-27-2003, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
I think he was comparing Boynton straight up to Colaicovo. His argument was that there relatively equal as young defensemen. I think Boynton has accomplished more at this point, however.
Yes he has but he is also 3 years older. Coli is just in his first year of pro hockey this year. He was the highest point getter in the Junior Championships last year - as a D man.

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11-27-2003, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeddarRants
Samsonav hasn't tailed off at all this year. He's been playing on the second line with a rookie center (Bergeron) and a third line grinder (Lapointe)for the past ten games or so. Before that, the second line center was Travis Green... and through it all, he's got 15 points in 21 games after sitting most of last year with an injury... I think Samsonav has been solid.
he has played well, but has not been as dynamic. Another 20 goal year, but not 29 to 35 which is where people might expect with him now in his prime. Linemates do matter though, sure, but he gets lots of PP.

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11-27-2003, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
I imagine the Isles could get Patrice Bergeron or Jeff Jillson straight across for Hamrlik.

Coliacavo wouldn't quite be enough I don't think. I love the kid, but he has to proove he's an NHL player first.
Oh, I totally agree. If that deal was there Millbury is even dumber than we already think he is.

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11-27-2003, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeddarRants
If the Islanders are thinking about moving Hamrlik (which I don't know if they are; I only know that the Islanders are trying to trim salary) I'm curious as to what it would take for Hamrlik to land in Boston... I'm sure a top level defensive prospect or NHL ready-now dman would have to be going the Islanders way as part of the package. Thoughts?

I'd think they'd want the same things they told TB and Toronto at the 2003 draft-a young,cheap player with very high upside(Svitov,Alexeev,Antropov).

Looking back the nyi should be glad that TB refused to move Alexeev or Svitov and that the Leafs wouldn't move Antropov.

Alexeev+Antropov have had serious injuries this season and Svitov's struggled.

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11-27-2003, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
Looking back the nyi should be glad that TB refused to move Alexeev or Svitov and that the Leafs wouldn't move Antropov.

Alexeev+Antropov have had serious injuries this season and Svitov's struggled.
True about Antropov's injuries, but when healthy, he has clearly progressed as a player from what I've seen. Svitov is a baby (age-wise), so I wouldn't pass judgement on him at this stage. Frankly, if TB is in the hunt come March (they will be) and NYI is flatlining (possible), I could very easily see a deal of that sort being offered up again. And if I were NYI, looking to dump salary (and once again going back into re-building mode) and Hamrlik was not going to be re-signed, I'd strongly consider it. Kid has talent, just needs time.

***

Thing with NYI, Crew, is that they are at a point now where they are not going to be able to have it both ways. That is, as you've pointed out many times, they claim to want to maintain/add players in that "just-entering-their-prime" stage of their careers, e.g., Peca, Yashin, etc., as opposed to older vets or unproven kids. Problem is, those types of players (productive; in their mid-20s to early 30s) are generally harder to acquire AND they are not cheap! So, such a strategy is in direct contrast with the latest public suggestions that they are looking to cut payroll.

Which is why it is soooo hard to be too attached to this team.

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