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11-28-2006, 06:29 AM
  #1
phil666
 
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What would you want for Souray?

Ok, I myself don't want to trade him, and I'd rather risk loosing him at the end of the season but that is not the point of this thread so please don't discuss it. Assuming we were 100% sure that Souray wouldn't re-sign with us at the end of the season, what return would you want for trading Souray?

Keep in mind it doesn't have to be a pacific team, but the return could be higher since there would be a greater chance he would resign with a pacific team since it's close of his daughter.

To Montreal: M-E. Vlasic, 2nd rd pick 2007
To San Jose: Souray

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11-28-2006, 06:45 AM
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yvresgyros
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If we are just wishing, then:
Beauchemin
(from tsn.ca: "Owns one of the hardest point shots in the NHL. Usually keeps the game simple from the back end. Uses his 6-0 frame efficiently." I like that.)
and I'd shoot at a 1st but it's Burke we're dealing with here, so it's more reasonable we'd get a 2nd.

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11-28-2006, 06:52 AM
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Le Tricolore
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Alex Ovechkin would be nice. Or Dion Phaneuf.

Sure, they're not realistic in the least, but it's what I'd like.

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11-28-2006, 07:18 AM
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If we trade Souray and don't get a solid PP defenceman in return, we're srewed. Can you imagine Rivet being on the first PP unit?

Any good PP defencemen available? Jovo?

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11-28-2006, 07:24 AM
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SpreeEndaz
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I'd say Souray and some ex-4th liners if they want them like Murray, Begin and so on for Frolov.

Lines I would really like to see:

Samsonov - Koivu - Ryder
Frolov - Higgins - Kovalev
Latendresse - Bonk - Johnson
Perezhogin - Plekanec - Kostitsyn

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11-28-2006, 07:32 AM
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crosby and ryan whitney

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Old
11-28-2006, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habber View Post
If we trade Souray and don't get a solid PP defenceman in return, we're srewed. Can you imagine Rivet being on the first PP unit?

Any good PP defencemen available? Jovo?
I wouldn't touch Jovo with a 20 feet pole with the contract he has. Absurd. And the point of trading Souray would be to get a defenseman that doesn't ask for too much money. And any defenseman that doesn't ask for the big bucks will usually be a young and cheap RFA. Jovo is far from fitting that description.

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11-28-2006, 07:49 AM
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Eric Lindros + 3rd round draft pick for the 2007 entry draft or Datsyuk + draft pick.

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11-28-2006, 07:52 AM
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AD
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To Dallas: Souray
to Montreal: Boucher + 2nd rounder

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11-28-2006, 08:01 AM
  #10
tinyzombies
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Mtl: Souray, Samsonov, Kostitsyn
SJ: Bernier, McLaren

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11-28-2006, 08:04 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raketheleaves View Post
Mtl: Souray, Samsonov, Kostitsyn
SJ: Bernier, McLaren
So we get a better propspect/established NHLer, a better Defenseman (under contract no less) and we lose a soon to be UFA, an unproven AHLer and Samsonov (who seems to be everyones favorite trade bait these days)



I like it. Where do I sign. Maybe they can throw in Marleau while we're at it.

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11-28-2006, 08:24 AM
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ChuckyToGally
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Originally Posted by AymanD View Post
So we get a better propspect/established NHLer, a better Defenseman (under contract no less) and we lose a soon to be UFA, an unproven AHLer and Samsonov (who seems to be everyones favorite trade bait these days)



I like it. Where do I sign. Maybe they can throw in Marleau while we're at it.
Souray and McLaren are so different, you can't even compare them. Saying he's better than Souray is far from being a fact.

However, I have to agree that SJ would never trade Bernier for such a package.

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11-28-2006, 09:22 AM
  #13
felixd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AymanD View Post
To Dallas: Souray
to Montreal: Boucher + 2nd rounder
That's the best one in this thread so far that is kind of realistic. I stilll don't think Dallas would do it, but it's better than the McLaren/Bernier one.

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11-28-2006, 09:38 AM
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another thread about trading souray? oh my!

some facts first. souray will likely be traded to western team most probably in the pacific division.

we will need to get a defenseman in return maybe not in this deal directly, but in another deal involving abby or ryder

You better beleive that Gainey is not going to get fleeced in a souray deal!

my bet. one of LA, Anh, or SJ

hey if u want to dream:
SJ:
souray+Ryder
vs
Vlasic+Bernier

this could happen, with balancing picks in there possibly. i would love to get Marleau off them somehow, but i just dont see it happening, they are making a push for the cup, and they need all the help they can get. we also need to get something out of the deal, hence the ryder bernier swap..

Anh:
Souray+Plekanec/Ryder+2nd+conditional 3rd if souray doesn't sign
vs
Beauchemin+Getzlaf

i know some ppl think getzlaf will not be traded, but i have a feeling he is not a favorite in the organization for some reason. IMO he should be playing 2nd line right now, but he seems to be on the 4th, getting less than 13mins on average. he is a big strong right handed center, and gainey should be very interested in that! anh have a couple other big wingers, so fitting in plekanec could help them with their speed. they have some other centers as well, but they may be interested in ryder instead of pleks...

LA:
Souray+Abby+3rd+(A. Kostisyn)
vs
Conroy+LaBarbera +sopel+(Trevor Lewis)
http://hockeysfuture.com/prospect/trevor_lewis

now the kost vs Lewis part is only a minor thought, i dont really want to trade kost, but LA seem to have alot of C and need help on the wing. Conroy could help us now, and lewis could help us in the future. sopel shot can replace sourays shot, and i think even though he gets 2.4mil, he is signed for 3 years? this wouls depend on how interested La is in Abby, and we would receive Labarbera as a backup.

so those are 3 possible deals or structures to deals, that make some sense, that i could actually beleive. I would see souray goto a playoff team instead of a non playoff team, as they are likely to offer more to get his services...

sorry to those who will get angry i included ryder, its not that i hate him, in fact i like him, but its fair to say that dealing him for either bernier or getzlaf would definitly be an improvement to our team. plus gainey has been hard balling him with the 1 yr contracts, and i dont think ryder is liking that.

that is all, cheerS!


Last edited by Habitants: 11-28-2006 at 09:44 AM.
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11-28-2006, 09:43 AM
  #15
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What I'd like is a Nabaztag.

With or without Souray going the other way.

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11-28-2006, 09:48 AM
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Souray is off-limits. This season, he's an untouchable.

That's saying a lot, coming from a guy who's bashed Souray many times in the past. His defensive shortcomings give me headaches on a regular basis, sure. But where would this team be without him?

The guy single-handedly carries our PP...it's crazy. Try to picture where we'd be in the standings without our PP success...optimistically, we'd be hovering around .500 maybe.

But it's more than just his shot, it's his leadership. Based on everything I've seen and heard, this guy is loved by his teammates, and is a great leader. Trading him could really mess with the chemistry the team's got going right now. Sounds cliche, but chemistry is maybe the most important ingredient towards building a cup contender...if you think you have it, you just don't mess with it. If Gainey trades Souray, I'd be shocked and severely disappointed.

I don't want him signed long term, cuz I think his wrist won't hold up for much longer (i.e. 2-3 years), and we can find a much more sound defenceman for much cheaper than he'll be able to command after this season (due to potentially huge production this season). I don't want him traded either.

We have a realistic shot at the Stanley cup this year. So I say we keep him, and if we lose him at the end of the year for nothing, too bad.

To answer the question: what would I want for Souray? I want him to hoist the Stanley Cup as a Montreal Canadien in 2006-2007. That's all. I want nothing else for him...don't mind losing him for nothing. Nothing just means cap space anyway.

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11-28-2006, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NRG87 View Post
Souray is off-limits. This season, he's an untouchable.

That's saying a lot, coming from a guy who's bashed Souray many times in the past. His defensive shortcomings give me headaches on a regular basis, sure. But where would this team be without him?

The guy single-handedly carries our PP...it's crazy. Try to picture where we'd be in the standings without our PP success...optimistically, we'd be hovering around .500 maybe.

But it's more than just his shot, it's his leadership. Based on everything I've seen and heard, this guy is loved by his teammates, and is a great leader. Trading him could really mess with the chemistry the team's got going right now. Sounds cliche, but chemistry is maybe the most important ingredient towards building a cup contender...if you think you have it, you just don't mess with it. If Gainey trades Souray, I'd be shocked and severely disappointed.

I don't want him signed long term, cuz I think his wrist won't hold up for much longer (i.e. 2-3 years), and we can find a much more sound defenceman for much cheaper than he'll be able to command after this season (due to potentially huge production this season). I don't want him traded either.

We have a realistic shot at the Stanley cup this year. So I say we keep him, and if we lose him at the end of the year for nothing, too bad.

To answer the question: what would I want for Souray? I want him to hoist the Stanley Cup as a Montreal Canadien in 2006-2007. That's all. I want nothing else for him...don't mind losing him for nothing. Nothing just means cap space anyway.
I would tend a fair offer... I would agree on being a bit hardline in negotiations... we also have Emelin, Jancevski, Streit, and Cote all available as cheaper options for next year, and we can add a body from within our system, and potentially use the free money to garber better contracts to UFA's... Such as Markov, whom Souray did say was 1st priority... What gets me thinking, is that plenty of people are speculating about Souray departing... But maybe its a sign to say if Bob is going to talk team solidarity (i.e. longer term contracts) I believe he would stick around. Gotta remember, many hockey players dream about being on the team that built their way to a Stanley cup... Sheldon has a lot to think about... Montreal is quite a city to win a Stanley cup... just ask the 24 other teams

At the end of the day its a very tough call...
Markov is definately should be FIRST priority... Souray should be the # 2.

All things aside, I am VERY comfortable with Markov, Souray, and Bouillon being our top 3 LD for the time being at least..
In contrast, the RD is shaping up very nicely as well..
A very physical stay at homer in Komi... Is rounding nicely in to form to become Markovs partner... Rivet is a very solid # 4 d man, and IMO could propel us to a strong run in April matched with Souray... Rivet is a second half onwards player... Typically has been for the past 5-6 years now... Finally with Dandenault, who is one of the more pure skaters, along with Bouillon who is just as quick... They are very conscious and both guys add key points here and there and can play stellar d themselvs...

To be very honest, Our defence IMO is very underrated around the league, and has been for quite some time... Lots of character within these 6...
IMO drop Niinima, keep hopefully somehow 2 of Jancevski, Cote, Streit
Bring over Emelin, give O"Byrne another year to hone his skill..
Consider signing Fischer...

IMO were sharp on d.

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Old
11-28-2006, 10:16 AM
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Blind Gardien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NRG87 View Post
Souray is off-limits. This season, he's an untouchable.
...
To answer the question: what would I want for Souray? I want him to hoist the Stanley Cup as a Montreal Canadien in 2006-2007. That's all. I want nothing else for him...don't mind losing him for nothing. Nothing just means cap space anyway.
100% agreed. Sure, I'd take Phaneuf for him, or you could construct other ridiculously impossible fantasy scenarios, but there's no point in it, the overpayment we'd need would make it impossible, so why bother? It's like trying to put together a trade proposal for Sidney Crosby. It just can't be done.

We can't really lose in the Souray sweepstakes. If we can re-sign him for $5M or under, we have a decent shot at getting all 3 of our D back. If we can't, well, that's $5M we can spend any way we want to... which could include retaining Bonk and Johnson, or just one of them and picking up another solid D, or could be used toward a big-name UFA center like Gomez or Briere or whoever is available. There's no real "loss" anymore in having a guy walk as a UFA, there's such a huge marketplace that the cap space is just as valuable as getting anything in a trade.

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11-28-2006, 10:52 AM
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stop discussing if we should trade him or not, thats not the point of this thread. I said if you had you to trade him, what would you try to get in return(realisticly)? *sighs* If you want to discuss it, go talk about it in one of those 10 threads on the main page.

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11-28-2006, 11:03 AM
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Sign Souray... point final.. I'd rather see Rivet go. After Niinimaa horrible performance this season and the fact that he was already going downhill, he has become untradeable. So it might benifit the team better to just let him walk and give the money to Souray.

Those are my two cents!

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11-28-2006, 11:09 AM
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Marleau + Prospect/Pick
VS
Souray + Ryder

Marleau is UFA too but he gonna ask for about 5M and it's this season Ryder+Souray' contract. Marleau is our 2nd center and he plays the point very well so I guess it's what we need right now.

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11-28-2006, 11:21 AM
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Slew Foots
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Originally Posted by phil666 View Post
stop discussing if we should trade him or not, thats not the point of this thread. I said if you had you to trade him, what would you try to get in return(realisticly)? *sighs* If you want to discuss it, go talk about it in one of those 10 threads on the main page.
Montreal is a contender this year...i.e. we're buyers not sellers. "Trading Souray" and "realistic" are oxymorons. If we're hovering near the top of the standings with 30 games left, the Habs would view Souray as a rent-a-player.

Doesn't matter how you slice it, trading him would be a very bad move, b/c his value to the team this year is much greater than anything you could reastically get in return via a trade.

But, for argument's sake, if I'm Gainey, and for some strange reason, somebody pointed a gun at my head, or we're not contending anymore, I'd try to pull a deal like this:

To San Jose: Souray

To Montreal: 1st round pick 2007, conditional 2nd round pick in 2008 (if SJ can sign Souray)

Remember that the team that would take Souray on would have to view itself as a contender, as he'll be a UFA at the end of the season. Contenders want to acquire NHL talent without giving any NHL talent up.

The best you could hope for is a parallel move, which is highly unlikely b/c it's hard to properly quantify fair compensation for the intangibles you lose by trading a character guy.

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11-28-2006, 11:56 AM
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I think Detroit will panic sometime this year and trade either Datsyuk or Zetterberg.Datsyuk would be a great fit for us and Kovalev. I can only dream I guess

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11-28-2006, 12:00 PM
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Mats NAslund
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Originally Posted by phil666 View Post
Ok, I myself don't want to trade him, and I'd rather risk loosing him at the end of the season but that is not the point of this thread so please don't discuss it. Assuming we were 100% sure that Souray wouldn't re-sign with us at the end of the season, what return would you want for trading Souray?

Keep in mind it doesn't have to be a pacific team, but the return could be higher since there would be a greater chance he would resign with a pacific team since it's close of his daughter.

To Montreal: M-E. Vlasic, 2nd rd pick 2007
To San Jose: Souray
No way I would take prospects for Sourray...
2nd line C or try and sign him then trade him in the off season or at the draft table to move up ion the draft. I keep for this year unless Montreal gets a quality C in return. Montreal has some very good D prospects that a 1 or 2 away and a guy like Cote when completely healthy and back into shape (missed training camp) is a solid stay at home defenceman. Montreal will need Sourray if they want to go far in the playoffs

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11-28-2006, 12:24 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phil666 View Post
stop discussing if we should trade him or not, thats not the point of this thread. I said if you had you to trade him, what would you try to get in return(realisticly)? *sighs* If you want to discuss it, go talk about it in one of those 10 threads on the main page.
But that's the problem: there is NOTHING that you could get "realistically" that would make sense for us, hence it's a moot point discussion. Unless you start making crazy assumptions like *if* we're out of the playoffs in February, or *if* Souray changes his mind and demands a trade to the West Coast... but personally I'd prefer not to entertain such doomsday scenarios yet...

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