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What will happen to Begin ?

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12-19-2006, 08:43 AM
  #1
red alert 23
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What will happen to Begin ?

Carbo seems to like the new 4th line combo of Streit-Latendresse -Lapierre.
When Bégin is available to play; were will he fit in ?

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Old
12-19-2006, 08:45 AM
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Slew Foots
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Quote:
Originally Posted by red alert 23 View Post
Carbo seems to like the new 4th line combo of Streit-Latendresse -Lapierre.
When Bégin is available to play; were will he fit in ?
I like that line a lot too, but you can be sure that Begin will claim his spot on the 4th line as soon as he's ready.

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12-19-2006, 09:03 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by red alert 23 View Post
Carbo seems to like the new 4th line combo of Streit-Latendresse -Lapierre.
When Bégin is available to play; were will he fit in ?
The season is long. There will be more injured players. I don't know the % of games a team can have its full healthy squad, but it must be very low.

Streit can now play both on defence and offence, which give Carbo great options.

Bégin will be back when he is 100%, or if another forward got injured in the next few games. The Habs have even the luxury to ask Rivet to rest and nurse his old injuries.

So, we should not worry too much about it. And a trade can happen at anytime.

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12-19-2006, 09:34 AM
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22SteveBegin22
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Lapierre has had a great start, but I don't think he's going to take Begin's spot when Begin is healthy again. He's too valuable to us as a penalty killer and spark plug.

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Old
12-19-2006, 09:35 AM
  #5
Mike8
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Begin will return, and Lapierre will be sent down.

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Old
12-19-2006, 09:38 AM
  #6
Dan K
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In an ideal world, you would find that amazing, young, big, fast second line centre in return for Samsonov or Ryder, and Plekanec, and then have a perfect line-up for this year, like...

Higgins - Koivu - Ryder/Latendresse
Latendresse/Samsonov - NEW CENTER - Kovalev
Perezhogin - Bonk - Johnson
Begin - Lapierre - Streit

However, that is unlikely, and Plekanec will be counted on as a big part of the team next year anyway.

Since this will likely not happen, Begin returning does become a bit problematic. Honestly, I love Steve, but he is no more than a 4th liner, and has not had a good start to the season. He also has a cap hit of $1M, which is pretty high for a 4th line guy. So... Not that I'm advocating trading him by any means, and even though it WILL NOT HAPPEN IN A MILLION YEARS, if the right offer came along, I personally would pounce on it.

But since that won't happen either, we're looking at sending Lapierre down to Hamilton and letting Begin reclaim his spot on the 4th line. Or perhaps keeping Lapierre around and letting him and Begin split the remaining games (or sit Streit some day if he ever cools off from his current level of play), but that kinda seems like a waste.

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12-19-2006, 09:43 AM
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Whitesnake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Begin will return, and Lapierre will be sent down.
Unfortunately.

But without Pleks or Lapierre centering the 4th line, any combination that would see Murray or Bégin centering the 4th automatically means a much weaker line......Both guys are no centermen.....

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12-19-2006, 10:36 AM
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Guy Germaine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Begin will return, and Lapierre will be sent down.
Not necessarily.

The way Streit has been playing, he's showing that he definetly deserves a regular spot either on the 4th line or on the blue line.

play Begin w/ Lats and Laps (Bash Brothers) and move Streit back on D.

Now I know that won't leave any room for Bou, but he's making a lot of cash for a #6 guy, so ya never know what could happen.

But you're probably right and Laps will go back down even though his speed, size and physical presence is an extremely valued commodity.

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12-19-2006, 10:53 AM
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loudi94
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I wonder if we will hear of an incident in practice in which Begin is accused of being "too intense". Afterall, he has a fight on his hands to keep his spot.

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12-19-2006, 10:57 AM
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Evil Ted
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loudi94 View Post
I wonder if we will hear of an incident in practice in which Begin is accused of being "too intense". Afterall, he has a fight on his hands to keep his spot.
I thought it was Downey that was to intense?

Begin has almost no offensive upside, he has the slapshot and thats about it.

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12-19-2006, 11:15 AM
  #11
loudi94
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Originally Posted by Evil Ted View Post
I thought it was Downey that was to intense?

Begin has almost no offensive upside, he has the slapshot and thats about it.
That's right. Begin was the one complaining. Maybe now when it's his job on the line, he'll start picking up the intensity in practice to show he wants to keep his spot.

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12-19-2006, 12:16 PM
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Lord Horse
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It's basically:

a) send down Lapierre.
b) play Streit on D.

I'm firmly for (b) at this point, rotating out D-men with bumps and bruises. We can win games without Souray. We can even win without Markov. We can definitely win without Rivet. Big-minute defensemen get hurts during the year, so why not let's rotate and give guys every 4th game off or something.

I like Streit as a forward, no question, but so long as Lapierre is outplaying Murray, Downey AND Begin, he's earning his NHL time. Actually now that I think of it Streit is outplaying all 3 of those guys too. I just don't want Steve-o @ center again this year. The guy's a heart-and-soul Hab, but good play is good play.

What the heck, let's get the ball rolling a bit harder......

I'm a fan of the guy, and I think every Habs fan at one point or another has gone "Hey Bégin! Wicked!" when seeing a crushing hit at a key time in the game. He was a spark for us last year, and among the league leaders in hits this year. So we know what we have in him: a team leader, physical punisher, popular fan favorite with the right ethnicity for playing in Montreal.

However..... he's currently being outplayed by Mark Streit and Max Lapierre.

Streit will never hit in the same league, but he's #25 part 2 and deserves his time on PP & PK. As a forward he'd be on any team's fourth line right now.

Max Lapierre, on the other hand, is playing much like Begin but with a bit better touch; maybe not quite as physical. Again has the right ethnicity for the Montreal crowd. And let's be honest, French Canadians really are helping every team win.


So like with everything my stance starts with the question: who's gonna get it done in the playoffs??

Advantage - Bégin. Leadership from veterans is a staple food for every team that drinks out of the Cup. That's my take as it stands.

THAT SAID, here's the other argument:

Lots of posters here are plainly ready to replace Samsonov or even Kovalev with Kostitsyn, and ready to call up Grabovsky ASAP despite Plekanec's playoff experience. Hell, Latendresse was going to replace Ryder in some people's minds (dream on, for now).

If those huge leaps are being made, isn't it just a tiny leap to say Lapierre, who's played better, should replace Steve Bégin, whose absence has gone unnoticed on the ice ?


Last edited by Lord Horse: 12-19-2006 at 01:51 PM.
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Old
12-19-2006, 04:45 PM
  #13
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I feel sorry for Carbo, he has to make such hard decisions every game with this surplus of wingers.

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12-19-2006, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
I feel sorry for Carbo, he has to make such hard decisions every game with this surplus of wingers.
It's a great problem to have. Lapierre not only deserves a spot in our lineup....we need him in the lineup. He's been fantastic in his role and adds a lot speed, spark, and toughness in terms of hits.

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12-19-2006, 08:44 PM
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Turbo
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I really like Begin, but Lapierre-Latendresse-Streit are now outplaying him this season.

Begin still deserves his spot for the intensity he brings.

Lapierre is becoming indispensable and will be hard to take out of the line-up (if you take him out of the line-up, he shouldn't be on the bench and should go to Hamilton).

Streit is playing the best hockey in his carreer and is so versatile.

And Latendresse is coming into his own, creating chances and using his body.

I think the only solution is putting Streit back on defense and rotating out guys with minor injuries. Streit is even playing better than Bouillon IMO so it would be a shame to put him on the bench.

All this is because of Lapierre's play. If he slows down, the solution becomes easy.

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Old
12-20-2006, 11:00 AM
  #16
habfan1968
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Looks like the problem is solved for now, tsn reported that Lapierre is sent today already.


Last edited by habfan1968: 12-20-2006 at 11:14 AM.
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Old
12-20-2006, 11:08 AM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habfan1968 View Post
Looks like the problem is solved for now, tsn repoted that Lapierre is sent today today already,
Only until after the Christmas transfer freeze is over and then Max will be back. I think Murray and Downey will be sent to the Bulldogs to make room. Max has certainly shown more then those two.

4th line combo...
Latendresse-Begin-Lapierre

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12-20-2006, 11:11 AM
  #18
Turbo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drive425 View Post
Only until after the Christmas transfer freeze is over and then Max will be back. I think Murray and Downey will be sent to the Bulldogs to make room. Max has certainly shown more then those two.

4th line combo...
Latendresse-Begin-Lapierre
The problem right now is that even with Murray AND Downey off the team, there is still no room for Lapierre in the line-up!

Koivu-Higgins-Ryder
Plekanec-Kovalev-Samsonov
Bonk-Johnson-Perezhogin
Begin-Streit-Latendresse

Souray-Rivet-Markov-Komisarek-Bouillon-Dandenault

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Old
12-20-2006, 11:30 AM
  #19
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Bégin is a popular player, no doubt about it, but sometimes it's necessary to make unpopular decisions in the best interests of the team.

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12-20-2006, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
Bégin is a popular player, no doubt about it, but sometimes it's necessary to make unpopular decisions in the best interests of the team.
Bégin is one of the reasons why our PK is that great.

I don't know why everyone wants to replace him for Lapierre,... why not put Lapierre AND Bégin together? A Bégin - Lapierre - Streit line could be pretty good! Then you put Lats with Koivu and Higgins so they could feed him.

Higgins- Koivu - Lats
Samsonov - Plekanec - Kovalev
Johnson - Bonk - Perez
Bégin - Lapierre - Streit

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Old
12-20-2006, 11:43 AM
  #21
Dan K
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
Bégin is a popular player, no doubt about it, but sometimes it's necessary to make unpopular decisions in the best interests of the team.
I kinda feel that way as well. Just like Bouillon, Begin is a fan favourite here, and partially as a result, both got somewhat inflated contracts.

$1M is a lot for a 4th liner/penalty killer, and while I really like Begin, the kids are kicking at the door. I don't know what kind of value a Steve Begin would have on the trade market. If we can get a decent asset back for him, I would strongly consider it. If not, I'm certainly not ready to just give him away for future considerations or whatnot, and he can still be a valuable contributor to this club.

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12-20-2006, 11:58 AM
  #22
Teufelsdreck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seb_Rafter View Post
Bégin is one of the reasons why our PK is that great.

I don't know why everyone wants to replace him for Lapierre,... why not put Lapierre AND Bégin together? A Bégin - Lapierre - Streit line could be pretty good! Then you put Lats with Koivu and Higgins so they could feed him.

Higgins- Koivu - Lats
Samsonov - Plekanec - Kovalev
Johnson - Bonk - Perez
Bégin - Lapierre - Streit
According to your thinking, Bégin is more valuable than Ryder. But if we go along with your lineup, trading Ryder to hold a spot on the fourth line for Bégin would create other problems. Where would the player who replaces Ryder play? Would Lats make a good RW? How would A. Kostitsyn crack your lineup?

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Old
12-20-2006, 12:03 PM
  #23
Slew Foots
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seb_Rafter View Post
Bégin is one of the reasons why our PK is that great.

I don't know why everyone wants to replace him for Lapierre,... why not put Lapierre AND Bégin together? A Bégin - Lapierre - Streit line could be pretty good! Then you put Lats with Koivu and Higgins so they could feed him.

Higgins- Koivu - Lats
Samsonov - Plekanec - Kovalev
Johnson - Bonk - Perez
Bégin - Lapierre - Streit
So basically, let's get rid of Ryder to make room for a 4th liner...right...

While I'm not Ryder's biggest fan, I think people need to take a step back and think about the situation more clearly...why on earth would we get rid of a guy who can score 25-30 goals a year to make room for a guy who will bring energy to a 4th line?

We all love Lapierre, but come on people! Relax...let him get some ice time in Hamilton...his time will eventually come.

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Old
12-20-2006, 12:12 PM
  #24
Seb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
According to your thinking, Bégin is more valuable than Ryder.
In my heart

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Old
12-20-2006, 12:49 PM
  #25
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This may already have been posted, but I think having Streit playing on the fourth line is far too valuable from an adaptability standpoint. For instance, if and D gets injured, or gets a misconduct, we aren't stuck with 5 D for the rest of the game. When Streit's on the 4th line, we have that flexibility. It's the same way with Dandenault being able to jump in up front.

I like Begin, but he's got something to prove if he really wants to keep a regular spot on the fourth line. That being said, I expect that the regular 4th line will be Latendresse-Lapierre-Begin (or the opposite) once a roster spot is freed up.

Man Montreal has some sweet depth.

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