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Old
12-22-2006, 02:39 PM
  #26
HockeyBasedNYC
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I would want to hear some specifics with all this before the media and fans turn this into a circus like the New York Gaints.

Would like to know whos got beef with who.

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Old
12-22-2006, 02:58 PM
  #27
ChrisKreider20
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I think if we got a new coach, we'd get much better. With the offensive talent we have, we should be top 3 in the league. Also, I think in Ozo's case, he has been terribly misused. Despite the fact that he sucked this year, I think under a new coach, no PK minutes, alot of Power Play minutes and time with the Jagr line, he could go back to 1/2 of what he used to be. Malik, Roszival should be our 5-6 pairing not playing a ton with Jagr.
Its sad what Renney's done. We need a new coach...badly.
Lines should be:
Straka-Nylander-Jagr
Shanahan-Immonen- Prucha (If after a long period of time, its obvious that Immonen isn't NHL material and we're in playoff contention(maybe by the NHL deadline, we can get a temp fix (Weight, Allison w/e) , and give Immonen another shot next year)
Hollweg- Cullen- Hall
Hossa-Betts- Ward

Defense should be:
Ozolinsh-Ward
Kasparaitis- Tyutin
Malik- Roszival

PP should be:
Shanahan-Nylander-Jagr
Cullen-Ozolinsh

Prucha-Immonen-Hall
Straka-Tyutin

The ones who aren't needed are: Rachunek or Orr
Rachunek doesn't bring anything special and Orr is just useless

God help this team.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:04 PM
  #28
Bluenote13
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I'm all for drama, but it is just TOO ridiculous these days with the NY sports teams. I mean, everyone of them is just insane....

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:05 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
recently commented about how Jagr takes his sweetass time getting to the bench on a line change. It seemed odd because I had never heard someone say that before. He was right on the money though.
I never noticed it really either untill Joe mentioned it, but when you look back its pretty obvious.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:07 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
Guys being mad at Renney is understandable if you're not Jagr, Nylander, Straka, Shanny, Cullen, and the top four defensemen.
we have top four defensemen???

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:17 PM
  #31
Anthony Mauro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingHenrik35 View Post
I never noticed it really either untill Joe mentioned it, but when you look back its pretty obvious.
thats nylander too not just jagr.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:18 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingHenrik35 View Post
I never noticed it really either untill Joe mentioned it, but when you look back its pretty obvious.
That's been a pet peave of mine with Jagr for a while, and Joe M. comments on it regularly now. He even commented on plus/minus being a flawed statistic after a goal because someone stepped on the ice right as Jagr stepped off and a goal was scored.

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12-22-2006, 03:19 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by BuRe#9 View Post
yea losing sucks... we just need everyone to get healthy and get back to playoff form
Easier said than done and I'm sure you realize that too, just pointing it out for empahsis because winning does seem to be the cure-all.

I just get the feeling that some of the tensions and divisions may be over what is preventing this team from getting into playoff form. Or rather, it may be over the issues that led to our "playoff form" last year. In other words, they might be fighting over the direction and management of the team.

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Originally Posted by Tuxman View Post
renney getting it from some players. if we lose on saturday, i'd guess renney would be fired
Way too soon and I am someone who is not happy with Renney. He might not be the answer but he does deserve more time. I have said it before, my frustrations with Renney seem to gravitate towards his stubborness and inability to learn from mistakes. Maybe it is the players tuning him out, maybe it's him constantly putting the wrong guys in the lineup (Malik/Hossa) or guys in the wrong spots (Prucha on the 4th/Ward on the 1st). He just doesn't seem to get away from the things that don't work.

I'd like for this all to change and maybe he'll get there, but I really don't want to get into a situation where we have 4 coaches in 3 years or 7 coaches in 7 years... that's not a recipe for success.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:20 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SickNice View Post
That's been a pet peave of mine with Jagr for a while, and Joe M. comments on it regularly now. He even commented on plus/minus being a flawed statistic after a goal because someone stepped on the ice right as Jagr stepped off and a goal was scored.
Yeah he was commenting on Shanny's +/- I think. But he was also saying that Jagr has appologized to him several times, I dont know take that to mean what you will because after all its still happening.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:28 PM
  #35
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winning cures all woes.....if the rangers string a couple wins together, this will all go away,,,

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12-22-2006, 03:31 PM
  #36
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A couple of thoughts.

Either Rosen or Micheletti, or one of the writers mentioned that Jagr asked for Ward as his center when Nylander went down. I believe it was the Ottawa game. If true, that shouldn't be a cause of friction.

Over the summer I read interesting posts about Rucinsky on Rodent's site. It was by a respected Czech poster there, Coat. To paraphrase, he wrote that Martin was the off-ice leader of the Czechs on this team and will be sorely missed if let go, regardless of playing contributions. Could this have something to do with it?

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:32 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuxman View Post
i give more credit to jagr for that than renney.
So would I, but Sather isn't going to disrupt a team in first place to make a coaching change. At least not yet.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:47 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I dunno maybe it's just me, but this doesn't seem that surprising.

It's just always seemed like their is a kind underlying tension with this team. Between which parties and over what, I don't know. But just something about interviews, little things here and there, little things on TV on the bench, it just seems like a divided group.

I can't quite put my finger on it, but something always seems a little off if you will.
I tend to agree with you, based on the limited games I've seen. Shanahan was interviewed a couple weeks ago and it seemed like he had something on his mind, but he was holding back.

Renney's recent handling of the goalies is suspect (particularly not starting Weekes in Toronto when it's his hometown and he has less pressure on the road, then leaving Lundqvist in despite giving up 5 goals in first period and taking a knee to the head). I can't blame him for keeping Czechs together (along with Nylander, that group has done very well the past two years), especially as there is little depth to allow flexibility.

I can see why some players might want more ice time, but other than Prucha (based on last season), Immonen (called up recently), and possibly Pock, who has legitimately earned more ice time through their play?

Many seem to worry that Jagr "gets his way", but then why would Prucha be given the cold shoulder this season? Jagr gets frustrated when he's not playing well (usually due to injury) or the team isn't winning (especially if it's due to poor defense/goaltending).

It would help if the team was healthy, but the Rangers will have to decide whether they want to try to make it far in the playoffs or start really rebuilding. The defense has to be addressed if they are hoping to make it to the ECF this year or next. It would also help to add more depth at forward.

If they try to rebuild, who are they going to trade that wouldn't be part of the rebuild? Jagr may only play another couple years and seems to like New York (not sure if he'd reconsider and play for another team). Straka is only going to stick around as long as Jagr, if even that long. Nylander and Shanahan are free agents at the end of this year. Weekes is a decent backup goalie, hardly a hot property.

If they don't right the ship soon, would expect a coaching change and/or a trade. Perhaps Jagr or Shanny can call a "players only" meeting and clear the air, if there is indeed some conflict.


Last edited by Czech Your Math: 12-23-2006 at 04:47 AM. Reason: n
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Old
12-22-2006, 03:55 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
A couple of thoughts.

Either Rosen or Micheletti, or one of the writers mentioned that Jagr asked for Ward as his center when Nylander went down. I believe it was the Ottawa game. If true, that shouldn't be a cause of friction.

Over the summer I read interesting posts about Rucinsky on Rodent's site. It was by a respected Czech poster there, Coat. To paraphrase, he wrote that Martin was the off-ice leader of the Czechs on this team and will be sorely missed if let go, regardless of playing contributions. Could this have something to do with it?
Jagr has said himself that he has to play with centers who understand his game (and how the line functions) in order for him to be most effective. I don't know why Renney wouldn't accomodate him in that instance (Nylander out).

I would have liked to seen Rucinsky stay with Rangers too.

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12-22-2006, 03:56 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isles4ever11 View Post
So would I, but Sather isn't going to disrupt a team in first place to make a coaching change. At least not yet.
It worked for the Devils, twice.

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Old
12-22-2006, 03:57 PM
  #41
ChrisKreider20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Czech Your Math View Post
Jagr has said himself that he has to play with centers who understand his game (and how the line functions) in order for him to be most effective. I don't know why Renney wouldn't accomodate him in that instance (Nylander out).

I would have liked to seen Rucinsky stay with Rangers too.
We should have kept Rucinsky definately but also we should have signed a guy like Jason Arnott and not gotten Cullen. Dom Moore was fine.

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Old
12-22-2006, 04:09 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Kostik View Post
and did you know Euro players are eating one year old kids?
Its true, they also spit on all of the fans after games

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Old
12-22-2006, 04:16 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I dunno maybe it's just me, but this doesn't seem that surprising.

It's just always seemed like their is a kind underlying tension with this team. Between which parties and over what, I don't know. But just something about interviews, little things here and there, little things on TV on the bench, it just seems like a divided group.

I can't quite put my finger on it, but something always seems a little off if you will.
There's no real "lockerroom" guy here. Last year's team was full of younger and hungrier players.... Ortmeyer and Moore, as well as Niemenen, to keep everyone light and laughing about "candies" or whatever. Couple that with Kondratiev hanging with Toots and Kaspar, and Rucchin who seems too much a veteran to get involved with problems, and it was all a bit of a non point.

They need a "Johnny Damon" player who can settle the ARod - Jeter [Shanny/Jagr] thing... IF that's even what it is...

All in all, I wouldnt be the least bit surprised. Renney's been absolutely dismal.

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Old
12-22-2006, 04:53 PM
  #44
Esa 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Czech Your Math View Post
Jagr has said himself that he has to play with centers who understand his game (and how the line functions) in order for him to be most effective. I don't know why Renney wouldn't accomodate him in that instance (Nylander out).

I would have liked to seen Rucinsky stay with Rangers too.
I don't disagree, just pointing out that Ward on the 1st line should NOT be a source of friction with Jagr.

From what I remember, the sticking point with Rucinsky was length of contract. Sather didn't want to give 2 years to a 35-year old. They also had Straka, Prucha and maybe Dawes penciled in as scoring LW's. Plus Hossa, Hollweg, maybe Cullen. It would be ironic if Dawes/picks end up going to St.Louis for Martin in January. I can see it happening though if things don't turn around.

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12-22-2006, 04:56 PM
  #45
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There's also been a change in the mindset of the organization--going from no real expectations at the start of last season to the thought that this team can compete for a Stanley Cup. Players like Cullen and Ward came here because of that notion. Yet, while this team may have looked good on paper, it really hasn't been that great (even when winning) on the ice. I can't help but wonder if some of the (supposed) unrest has to do with the growing realization, that without some real changes, this team could miss the playoffs. Throw in the fact that Renney hasn't been able to cover up the lack of depth this year and that too many players are playing out of position and I can see why there is some grumbling going on.

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Old
12-22-2006, 06:05 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartman27 View Post
It worked for the Devils, twice.
That's a fair point, but those instances are very rare.

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Old
12-22-2006, 07:07 PM
  #47
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No doubt this is the Jagr camp vs the Shanahan camp

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12-22-2006, 07:13 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by abev View Post
No doubt this is the Jagr camp vs the Shanahan camp
who is in the Shanny camp? the whole freaking team is from Jagrs side of the world. Cullen and Ward suck so they don't count lol

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Old
12-22-2006, 07:13 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
recently commented about how Jagr takes his sweetass time getting to the bench on a line change. It seemed odd because I had never heard someone say that before. He was right on the money though.
I made a post about this last year in the very beginning of the season. It always amazed me how he just skates off the ice when his shift was over no matter what was going on around him. But that's who he ice. He knows when he's done better than I do. I can find the post if you like.

The only problem was that I posted it favorably towards Jagr, that he really knew what he was doing. I guess it's all perception.

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12-22-2006, 07:14 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polako View Post
Its true, they also spit on all of the fans after games
No but I really don't know why that darn salute is so popular. If i was on the other side i would take that as a huge insult. That would never have happened in the pre NHL Europe days.

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