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Old
01-11-2007, 09:14 AM
  #51
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LoL.
Wow, 2.5 words after i said that spelling/grammar is not what it's about you try and make fun of my spelling/grammar.




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01-11-2007, 09:37 AM
  #52
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Old
01-20-2007, 07:57 PM
  #53
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Well that's it for Zhitnik's plus/minus .. for the rest of the year it will delve deep into the minus. I know +/- isn't the only thing to measure defensemen by but it should be telling that he's had only 1 game as a flyer that he was a positive in. IMO, and people will disagree, he is an aging dman whose skating skills are in the decline and is a #4 dman on an average team.

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01-20-2007, 10:49 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Flyers_01 View Post
Well that's it for Zhitnik's plus/minus .. for the rest of the year it will delve deep into the minus. I know +/- isn't the only thing to measure defensemen by but it should be telling that he's had only 1 game as a flyer that he was a positive in. IMO, and people will disagree, he is an aging dman whose skating skills are in the decline and is a #4 dman on an average team.
Exactly why i didnt want to trade Meyer for him. Meyer wasnt a star, but he was playing very well for us and at least could get better. The only direction Zhitnik can go now is down. Not to mention the salaries.

I hope they move Zhitnik at the deadline and take that money to someone else next year.

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01-20-2007, 10:51 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Exactly why i didnt want to trade Meyer for him. Meyer wasnt a star, but he was playing very well for us and at least could get better. The only direction Zhitnik can go now is down. Not to mention the salaries.
Meyer had taken a step backward. Instead of building on last year's solid season, his play had deteriorated. Randy Jones had passed him and was certainly playing better.

I know that Jones is the whipping boy here, but he's played quite well, a big difference from his game last year.

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01-20-2007, 10:58 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
Meyer had taken a step backward. Instead of building on last year's solid season, his play had deteriorated. Randy Jones had passed him and was certainly playing better.

I know that Jones is the whipping boy here, but he's played quite well, a big difference from his game last year.
That was the case at the beginning of the season, up until Meyer got hurt before he was traded he was playing more like he was last year. He and Hatcher were playing great together for several weeks.

Anyway, doesnt matter, he is long gone and unless they move him we are stuck with an aging Zhitnik for the next two years instead of signing someone better in the offseason.

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01-20-2007, 11:16 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
That was the case at the beginning of the season, up until Meyer got hurt before he was traded he was playing more like he was last year. He and Hatcher were playing great together for several weeks.

Anyway, doesnt matter, he is long gone and unless they move him we are stuck with an aging Zhitnik for the next two years instead of signing someone better in the offseason.
There is plenty of money to sign two defenseman.

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Old
01-20-2007, 11:34 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
There is plenty of money to sign two defenseman.
Approx 23 million available

Pitkanen $3-$3.5 million
Top forward $5-6 million
Top Dman $5-6 million
Forsberg $3-4 million or other forward
Nitty or other goalie $1-2 million+
Backup Goalie $750k-$1 million
Fedoruk $500k
Eager $600K
Potulny $800k-$1 million (He better be on this roster next year, he has earned it)

That is about $20-$23 million right there and that doesnt include Calder or Kapanen depending on what they do with them. Plus, it remains to be seen what it is going to take to sign those top FAs. It could easily be at least $6 I know there is a cap increase so they will probably have about $3 million available but I just dont see how they get a dman with that. Now, just think if we didnt have $3.5 million of ****nik on the books. We could definitely sign another dman around $5 million, and still have a couple under the cap.

I dont see, unless we take that Forsberg money for a dman or move one of Gauthier, Hatcher or ****nik but we will see what happens.

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Old
01-20-2007, 11:40 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Approx 23 million available

Pitkanen $3-$3.5 million
Top forward $5-6 million
Top Dman $5-6 million
Forsberg $3-4 million or other forward
Nitty or other goalie $1-2 million+
Backup Goalie $750k-$1 million
Fedoruk $500k
Eager $600K
Potulny $800k-$1 million (He better be on this roster next year, he has earned it)

That is about $20-$23 million right there and that doesnt include Calder or Kapanen depending on what they do with them. Plus, it remains to be seen what it is going to take to sign those top FAs. It could easily be at least $6 I know there is a cap increase so they will probably have about $3 million available but I just dont see how they get a dman with that. Now, just think if we didnt have $3.5 million of ****nik on the books. We could definitely sign another dman around $5 million, and still have a couple under the cap.

I dont see, unless we take that Forsberg money for a dman or move one of Gauthier, Hatcher or ****nik but we will see what happens.

Personally I would drop the Forsberg/other forward money down to $2-2.5M, and I think we move one of Gauthier or Hatcher freeing up another $2.2 - 3.5 million

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01-20-2007, 11:43 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Approx 23 million available

Pitkanen $3-$3.5 million
Top forward $5-6 million
Top Dman $5-6 million
Forsberg $3-4 million or other forward
Nitty or other goalie $1-2 million+
Backup Goalie $750k-$1 million
Fedoruk $500k
Eager $600K
Potulny $800k-$1 million (He better be on this roster next year, he has earned it)

That is about $20-$23 million right there and that doesnt include Calder or Kapanen depending on what they do with them. Plus, it remains to be seen what it is going to take to sign those top FAs. It could easily be at least $6 I know there is a cap increase so they will probably have about $3 million available but I just dont see how they get a dman with that. Now, just think if we didnt have $3.5 million of ****nik on the books. We could definitely sign another dman around $5 million, and still have a couple under the cap.

I dont see, unless we take that Forsberg money for a dman or move one of Gauthier, Hatcher or ****nik but we will see what happens.
Hatcher just needs to be waived and then sent to the AHL if noone claims him if the Flyers have the opportunity to replace his minutes.

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01-20-2007, 11:49 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
Personally I would drop the Forsberg/other forward money down to $2-2.5M, and I think we move one of Gauthier or Hatcher freeing up another $2.2 - 3.5 million
I would be fine with that. I just want to move one of Hatcher, Gauthier or Zhitnik so that we can pick up 2 dmen next year with Picard being the 6th. Problem is Zhitnik is probably the easiest to trade. If we trade Hatcher or Gauthier, we better sign someone that is physical cause our d will be really soft.

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Old
01-21-2007, 01:29 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
Meyer had taken a step backward. Instead of building on last year's solid season, his play had deteriorated. Randy Jones had passed him and was certainly playing better.

I know that Jones is the whipping boy here, but he's played quite well, a big difference from his game last year.
As mike said, at the beginning of the year this may have been the case. Meyer found his game about a month before he was traded (and got hurt). Jones has regressed a good deal since Meyer was traded.

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Old
01-23-2007, 08:04 AM
  #63
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Are you guys serious?

Zhitnik even at this point in his career is better than Meyer will ever be.

Meyer with NYI: 6 games, averaging about 11:45 mins in icetime.

We weren't winning with Meyer, who is a 5/6/7/AHL tweener. The only thing I think we can complain about is the cap hit (Zhitnik 3.5mil), but I'd rather have Zhitnik at 3.5 for the next couple of years (if only as a tradeable asset) than Meyer who was in danger of being waivered or sent down if we had been healthy. Anybody who thinks that the 06-07 Meyer was/is better than Hatcher, Gautheir, Zhitnik, Pitkanen, Picard, (hell even Jones) needs to look again.

The guy over achieved last year and was pretty less than average this year. Good luck to him, but (even though) Zhitnik hasn't set the world on fire) I can't say I miss Meyer IV.

Look at Dennis Seidenberg, god knows I love him, but he was awesome that first season, looked great in the NHL Young Guns Game, but has shown he's barely a NHLer. Just got traded for an average 4th line veteran to a team desperate for dmen.

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01-23-2007, 08:14 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Fedoruk $500k
Thats far too low. He has shown he can play on the top line in Annaheim. Easily worth over 1 mil, possibly as high as 2.

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01-23-2007, 08:51 AM
  #65
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Pitkanen 3-3.5M? Is this a joke? We better sign him long term then for that kind of money. I'd say 4-5 years.

If Forsberg is trade at the dead line and then resigns with the Flyers I do not see why he should take a big pay cut. He doesn't own us anything. Nothing at all. I would take Peter back at 4M a year if he comes back after trade. He is helping us rebuild.

Also, I would take Hatcher (if we can not trade him) to arbitration. One point after 47 games and I am not talking about "worthless" plus minus stats.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 01-23-2007 at 08:57 AM.
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Old
01-23-2007, 08:57 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
If Forsberg is trade at the dead line and then resigns with the Flyers I do not see why he should take a big pay cut. He doesn't own us anything. Nothing at all. I would take Peter back at 4M a year if he comes back after trade. He is helping us rebuild.

Also, I would take Hatcher (if we can not trade him) to arbitration. One point after 47 games so far and -22.
I wouldn't pay Forsberg $4 million.

Also Hatcher can't be taken to arbitration, he's in the middle of a contract.

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01-23-2007, 09:35 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Hammerwise View Post
Are you guys serious?

Zhitnik even at this point in his career is better than Meyer will ever be.

Meyer with NYI: 6 games, averaging about 11:45 mins in icetime.

We weren't winning with Meyer, who is a 5/6/7/AHL tweener. The only thing I think we can complain about is the cap hit (Zhitnik 3.5mil), but I'd rather have Zhitnik at 3.5 for the next couple of years (if only as a tradeable asset) than Meyer who was in danger of being waivered or sent down if we had been healthy. Anybody who thinks that the 06-07 Meyer was/is better than Hatcher, Gautheir, Zhitnik, Pitkanen, Picard, (hell even Jones) needs to look again.

The guy over achieved last year and was pretty less than average this year. Good luck to him, but (even though) Zhitnik hasn't set the world on fire) I can't say I miss Meyer IV.

Look at Dennis Seidenberg, god knows I love him, but he was awesome that first season, looked great in the NHL Young Guns Game, but has shown he's barely a NHLer. Just got traded for an average 4th line veteran to a team desperate for dmen.

I'm going to disagree with that. I think Meyer was turning his season around before he got hurt and traded. Also, I think he will continue to improve as he get's more NHL experience. I think he could be a decent #4 dman. Hatcher is a joke on the ice and Picard or Jones (esp. Jones) would benefit more from getting top pairing minutes in the AHL.

Zhitnik takes boneheaded penalties and constantly gets beat by the quicker forwards. How many pucks has he lost right in front of the Flyers goalie? There is a reason he has the worst +/- on the team since his arrival and it isn't just the amount of minutes he logs. Do you really think he improved the Flyers defense with his arrival? Even if you don't like Meyer, which I see you don't, he's off the books after this year while we're stuck with aging fossil Zhitnik for 2 more unless we trade him.

Neither Hatcher nor Zhitnik are capable of the minutes they are logging right now although their contracts all but demand they play those minutes. I wish the Flyers would play Timmonen and Lars Jonsson over both of them just to get them more experience for next year. What's the worst that can happen? Franchise worst losing streak? Check! Twice? Check! Worst defense in the league? Check!

The Flyers defense has broken just about every Flyers Hall of Shame record on the books this year with both Hatcher and Zhitnik in the lineup (our two highest paid dmen). Exactly what do the Flyers have to lose by letting the younger/cheaper guys take their lumps?

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01-23-2007, 09:50 AM
  #68
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Thats far too low. He has shown he can play on the top line in Annaheim. Easily worth over 1 mil, possibly as high as 2.
That depends on where the Flyers think they'll use him. If they don't see him as a top 2 line guy they can't afford to pay a 3rd line player 2 mill.

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01-23-2007, 10:52 AM
  #69
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he plays for the flyers, he is hardly going to be +25

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01-23-2007, 11:53 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Boston_Bruins View Post
he plays for the flyers, he is hardly going to be +25
Nolan Baumgartner had an even +/- after 6 games which included the 9-1 embarrassment to buffalo and was only a -1 for that game and was sent down to the AHL. Hatcher started off the season with a -2 and has never looked back (-3 for Buffalo embarrassment followed by a -3 in the following game so -6 in a two game stretch). Maybe the +/- stats wouldn't be as bad if the Flyers made smarter decisions about which players they send down and how much ice time is given.

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01-23-2007, 11:49 PM
  #71
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Thats far too low. He has shown he can play on the top line in Annaheim. Easily worth over 1 mil, possibly as high as 2.
Are you crazy??? $2 million for a career 4th line checker, a good one, but a 4th line checker none the less. The guy has had more then 20 points once. He is a good defensive player, but not enough to get that kind of money. Brashear has had better numbers over his career then Fedoruk, but when he was making $1.5 everyone complained about how overpaid he was.

I say 750k max for Fedoruk or goodbye. As much as I love the guy.

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01-23-2007, 11:51 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Flyers_01 View Post
Nolan Baumgartner had an even +/- after 6 games which included the 9-1 embarrassment to buffalo and was only a -1 for that game and was sent down to the AHL. Hatcher started off the season with a -2 and has never looked back (-3 for Buffalo embarrassment followed by a -3 in the following game so -6 in a two game stretch). Maybe the +/- stats wouldn't be as bad if the Flyers made smarter decisions about which players they send down and how much ice time is given.
I agree. They should have never sent him down. As with everything else, they paniced and made stupid moves at the beginning of the season.

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01-24-2007, 08:54 AM
  #73
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I agree. They should have never sent him down. As with everything else, they paniced and made stupid moves at the beginning of the season.
I hope they trade Baumgartner at the trade deadline because if I were him i'd be rather upset sitting in the minors, doing well, watching the disaster on D that is the Flyers and knowing that there's no way he'll get called up to the big club. Not to mention there were several defenseman on the Flyers that were playing worse than him when he was sent down (some of which are still on the team and playing badly). I'm sure he has lots of time to think on the long bus rides.

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01-24-2007, 09:07 AM
  #74
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Are you crazy??? $2 million for a career 4th line checker, a good one, but a 4th line checker none the less. The guy has had more then 20 points once. He is a good defensive player, but not enough to get that kind of money. Brashear has had better numbers over his career then Fedoruk, but when he was making $1.5 everyone complained about how overpaid he was.

I say 750k max for Fedoruk or goodbye. As much as I love the guy.
Someone would pay more than that for him. Agitators cant be quantified by their numbers alone, teams need more than players with numbers. Career fourth line checker is not accurate anyway since he was able to play very effectively next to Teemu Selanne in Annaheim. The difference between Brashear and Fedoruk is that Brash is the better fighter but Fridge can skate, which makes him much more useful in the new game.

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01-25-2007, 12:27 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by MojoJojo View Post
Someone would pay more than that for him. Agitators cant be quantified by their numbers alone, teams need more than players with numbers. Career fourth line checker is not accurate anyway since he was able to play very effectively next to Teemu Selanne in Annaheim. The difference between Brashear and Fedoruk is that Brash is the better fighter but Fridge can skate, which makes him much more useful in the new game.
I dont disagree with you. Teams need players like him, but with all the problems this team has, I am not spending $2 million on Fedoruk. If he hits $1 million, maybe, but not $2.

Brashear was a good skater as well.

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