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Time to eat Crow.....

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Old
01-04-2007, 03:50 PM
  #26
Captain Chaos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
This is just another example of a word that not many Kings fans know........patience.
Many of us have been patient for a long time.

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Old
01-04-2007, 10:58 PM
  #27
The Tikkanen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingFan24 View Post
This is a pretty ridiculous statement. Wake up and smell the crow. Last year at this time Frolov was playing on a super-hot line with Demitra and Conroy, and was, for the most part (offensively) the beneficiary of being on that line. Recall the stat sheet - Demitra, Conroy and Frolov were leading the WEstern Conference in scoring, with Marcus Naslund in the mix. Then, he (1) SEPARATED HIS ****ING SHOULDER at the Olympics, and came back not 100% for the playoff push, and (2) lost his primary offensive catalyst (Demitra) for the most of the late portion of the season (first, the Olympics injury, then the Keith Ballard elbow).

This year, he's being shuffled by Crow from one line to another, and now HE is the one that's serving as the offensive catalyst, wherever he's put. Look at the stat sheet now. Fro is top-5 in Western Conference scoring, but where are the two linemates next to him, as was the case last year? Right now he's 10th in the NHL in goals, 13th in the NHL in points. According to the stat sheet, by your logic, the only 1st line NHL LW suitable to play on the 1st line of a good NHL team is Ovechkin, because right now he's the only LW ahead of Frolov in scoring.

He shoots, he makes great passes, he protects the puck like no other, almost never turning it over, not to mention his defensive play, that's been there last year, and is present now.

The season isn't over yet. You can tell me he's a great player when the year is over. Until then the jury is out on whether or not this guy can put together a full season putting up points without dissapearing for large chunks of games. You guys know the season is 82 games, right?

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Old
01-04-2007, 11:40 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
The season isn't over yet. You can tell me he's a great player when the year is over. Until then the jury is out on whether or not this guy can put together a full season putting up points without dissapearing for large chunks of games. You guys know the season is 82 games, right?


you know that there's far more to the game than just numbers, right?

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Old
01-04-2007, 11:50 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
Frolov went on a tear last season around this time as well then dissapeared to finish the season. He's a streaky player and is a 2nd line LW on a good team. Nothing has changed in my book, therefore no crow for me.
I thought they (Demitra, Conroy, and Frolov) started out the season hot and by this time last year were cooling off. As stated by KF24 mostly due to injuries.

I think Frolov has come around this year. He's actually SHOOTING the puck. Not sure who's got to him, but I can't remember seeing Frolov score off a one-timer before this year. Also, not sure if you noticed but he doesn't hold onto the puck in the corners as much as he used to. He cycles and tries to get into shooting position. HOPEFULLY it continues.

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:02 AM
  #30
Scottkmlps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
The season isn't over yet. You can tell me he's a great player when the year is over. Until then the jury is out on whether or not this guy can put together a full season putting up points without dissapearing for large chunks of games. You guys know the season is 82 games, right?
You know that he was injured at the Olympics, and missed a chunk of games after that, and never really got back on track, right?

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:28 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Captain Chaos View Post
Many of us have been patient for a long time.
Preach it brother!

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:35 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Zad View Post
puhlease. That is like...number 10 on the list of words most Kings' fans do not know. There are MANY ahead of it! Here is the official list.

1. 2nd round
2. 3rd round
3. Semi-Final
...
7. Top draft pick
8. Consistency
9. Reasonable ticket prices
10. Patience

actually I've been to #1 and 2 and I can remember watching 3 on tv (granted it was some time ago). but #1 wasn't.

patience?!?! you're going to throw in patience?! you can't say 1-8 and then throw in patience on top of it. can't have it both ways same with top draft pick. which do you want - to win the first or 2nd round of the playoffs or draft #1 overall? I don't think anyone's complaining about Kopitar meanwhile. if we drafted 11 overall every year and got that kind of talent, I sure wouldn't care about drafting higher

about the only ones I can definitely nod my head on are 4&5 (the same thing), 8 and 9

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:37 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Shootmaster_44 View Post
Since everyone seems upset that the Kings traded away Grebeshkov, should the Kings go and sign him back? With the young team DL is putting together I could see Grebs being a decent asset to have.

I bet he could be had cheaper now... might be worth a shot, say a 4th round pick? or anything close to that (add a conditional pick or swap another pick)

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:46 AM
  #34
Darth Milbury
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Originally Posted by Shootmaster_44 View Post
Since everyone seems upset that the Kings traded away Grebeshkov, should the Kings go and sign him back? With the young team DL is putting together I could see Grebs being a decent asset to have.
Grebeshkov is not an UFA. He can't be signed by the Kings, unless you are prepared to give up picks in compensation.

And, no a 4th round pick is not going to do it. Not even close.

About Frolov: You're looking at a future 90-point scorer who every team in the league would love to have. He is a tad streaky, but I see that as a manifestation of youth.

IF LA ever wants to give up on him, there will be teams waiting on line with bids.

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Old
01-05-2007, 12:47 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
The season isn't over yet. You can tell me he's a great player when the year is over. Until then the jury is out on whether or not this guy can put together a full season putting up points without dissapearing for large chunks of games. You guys know the season is 82 games, right?
I don't mean to add to the dogpile on you, but aren't you the poster who I read just 30 seconds ago saying that the Ducks are far and away better than the Kings? That's over the same half season that has Frolov playing as a point-per-game player. I'm curious as to why you're reserving judgment on him, but not on the Ducks. Sure, they may be a little different, but it's over the same half season. I agree that it's important to see Frolov over an entire season, but I think that he's earned the same early credit that the Ducks get.

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01-05-2007, 01:31 AM
  #36
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You know, it's amazing to think that Frolov was "only" a #20 overall pick. To think that the Kings got one of the best players in the draft with it is hard to comprehend. I've just gone through the entire list of drafted players that year and only two players (Heatley and Gaborik) have better PPG stats over their NHL careers. Also, Frolov and Visnovsky look to me to be between the 4th and 6th-best players to come out of that draft. Al Murray and the rest of the scouts deserve a lot of credit for both of those great picks. The Kings didn't have any of the first 19 picks and came out like bandits. Now that I think of it, I suppose that we can add this as yet another example to counter the "you need top picks to get top players" argument.

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Old
01-05-2007, 01:53 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
Grebeshkov is not an UFA. He can't be signed by the Kings, unless you are prepared to give up picks in compensation.

And, no a 4th round pick is not going to do it. Not even close.

About Frolov: You're looking at a future 90-point scorer who every team in the league would love to have. He is a tad streaky, but I see that as a manifestation of youth.

IF LA ever wants to give up on him, there will be teams waiting on line with bids.
Well, I'm not so sure that Frolov is a perennial 90-point scorer in the making. The only way he'll get there, IMO, is if Kopitar helps him along...

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Old
01-05-2007, 02:06 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by kingsfan25 View Post
Well, I'm not so sure that Frolov is a perennial 90-point scorer in the making. The only way he'll get there, IMO, is if Kopitar helps him along...
Don't look now, but Frolov is on pace for 88pts. I do agree, though, that, more likely than not, he'll drop slightly off of his pace. I think that he'll end up with a very good 75pts or so and maintain around that (barring injuries) for the bulk of his career, occasionally going above the PPG mark now and then in years with really good linemates and/or teams.

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Old
01-05-2007, 10:23 AM
  #39
The Tikkanen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
I don't mean to add to the dogpile on you, but aren't you the poster who I read just 30 seconds ago saying that the Ducks are far and away better than the Kings? That's over the same half season that has Frolov playing as a point-per-game player. I'm curious as to why you're reserving judgment on him, but not on the Ducks. Sure, they may be a little different, but it's over the same half season. I agree that it's important to see Frolov over an entire season, but I think that he's earned the same early credit that the Ducks get.
Didn't the Ducks do well last season too?

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01-05-2007, 04:12 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
Didn't the Ducks do well last season too?
6th in the West (and 12th overall), not 1st. Similarly, Frolov did well last season (0.80PPG), but not this well (1.07PPG).

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01-05-2007, 04:29 PM
  #41
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You forgot conference finalist and the fact that Frolov might not ever see the playoffs again while playing in LA (except for that sweetheart deal he signed)

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01-05-2007, 04:32 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by TONGA View Post
You forgot conference finalist and the fact that Frolov might not ever see the playoffs again while playing in LA (except for that sweetheart deal he signed)
So ....Edmonton beat Anaheim....and I do not consider them to be an Elite team. Also....I guarantee that the Kings will make the playoffs before 2010.

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01-05-2007, 04:34 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Squidward View Post
So ....Edmonton beat Anaheim....and I do not consider them to be an Elite team. Also....I guarantee that the Kings will make the playoffs before 2010.
Anaheim took Edmonton's biggest piece for themselves... and lost nothing of consequence to do it. If they aren't "elite" who is?

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01-05-2007, 04:38 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by TONGA View Post
Anaheim took Edmonton's biggest piece for themselves... and lost nothing of consequence to do it. If they aren't "elite" who is?
The point that was being made is that Anaheim has had a great first half of the season. But they could also have a let down the second half and finish the season in the middle of the pack. It is still too early to come to that conclusion.

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01-05-2007, 05:15 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by TONGA View Post
You forgot conference finalist and the fact that Frolov might not ever see the playoffs again while playing in LA (except for that sweetheart deal he signed)
I didn't forget. Playoffs don't count for this discussion because we're talking about the regular season.

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01-05-2007, 05:28 PM
  #46
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If it involves the Kings it has to be about the regular season... they aren't good enough to get to the playoffs. Which is the point.

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01-05-2007, 05:44 PM
  #47
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This Frolov vs. Ducks comparison is getting to be a bit ridiculous. We're comparing apples and orange trees here. How is the assertion that Frolov "may not see playoffs while playing in LA" relevant to a discussion whether he's on the verge of having developed into a consistent premier player? Hockey is a team sport.

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Old
01-05-2007, 06:07 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by KingFan24 View Post
This Frolov vs. Ducks comparison is getting to be a bit ridiculous. We're comparing apples and orange trees here. How is the assertion that Frolov "may not see playoffs while playing in LA" relevant to a discussion whether he's on the verge of having developed into a consistent premier player? Hockey is a team sport.
I think that Tonga just misunderstood the core of the discussion. My point (made to Tikkanen) was that if you're ok with praising the Ducks, you should be able to do the same with Frolov, since they've played the same number of games. I don't get this (paraphrasing) "The Ducks are a great team, but Frolov hasn't proven anything yet" position.

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Old
01-05-2007, 07:41 PM
  #49
brianguy
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Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
Grebeshkov is not an UFA. He can't be signed by the Kings, unless you are prepared to give up picks in compensation.

And, no a 4th round pick is not going to do it. Not even close.

About Frolov: You're looking at a future 90-point scorer who every team in the league would love to have. He is a tad streaky, but I see that as a manifestation of youth.

IF LA ever wants to give up on him, there will be teams waiting on line with bids.

yeah you're right, OK 3rd round and we'll even swap a pick while we're at it

btw, my 2nd favorite team: Isles. hope they pull out of that slight funk quickly

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Old
01-05-2007, 07:41 PM
  #50
brianguy
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
I think that Tonga just misunderstood the core of the discussion. My point (made to Tikkanen) was that if you're ok with praising the Ducks, you should be able to do the same with Frolov, since they've played the same number of games. I don't get this (paraphrasing) "The Ducks are a great team, but Frolov hasn't proven anything yet" position.

it's an excellent point

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