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Pens/Habs proposal

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Old
01-03-2007, 04:26 PM
  #1
AK-Evgeni71*
 
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Pens/Habs proposal

I have noticed that so far this season, Kovalev has been underperforming along with Samsonov (although Sergei isnt on the same level as Kovy is when they are both on). I remember during free agency last season, I was hoping for CP to deal for Kovalev but instead got Palffy, who ended up retiring from injury halfway through the season.


On the record, I can remember Kovy would love to come back to the Penguins given the chance, especially if he got the chance to be fed by Crosby, who would no doubt be able to snap him out of the slump he currently has been in all season.

Dealing Staal, Fluery, Crosby and Malkin are ALL out of the question, so I'm not going to even think about including any of them in a proposal.


To Montreal:

Noah Welch
Ryan Stone
Colby Armstrong

To Penguins:

Alexei Kovalev

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01-03-2007, 04:30 PM
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Blind Gardien
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I guess I'll say "Done!" to that proposal. Well, so long as we're talking about a June/July transaction date, that is. The hidden benefit to us would be re-signing Markov and Souray for pretty much whatever they want, and maybe getting a shot at Bonk or Johnson too. Not that we need more prospects, and not that I'm convinced those guys on offer are really going to make an impact, but it's a good enough return on Kovalev's occasional headachiness, given our needs wrt the salary cap and our impending UFAs.

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01-03-2007, 04:35 PM
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Habs13
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We already have too many forwards and another swarm coming up from the AHL. Plus, Kovalev is one of the most clutch guys on the team and looks to be over his cold spell that he had to start the year. He's been puting up points of late!

We do need quality D though, what with 4 of ours being UFA at years end. Personally, I'd want the following included in a deal for Kovalev; Orpik & Malone.

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01-03-2007, 04:36 PM
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That's a nice package but I'd rather keep him for the playoffs.

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01-03-2007, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Habs13 View Post
Personally, I'd want the following included in a deal for Kovalev; Orpik & Malone.

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01-03-2007, 04:40 PM
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No way, Kovalev is a huge part of this team, specially in the playoffs. He does so much for this team besides putting up points. If Kovalev were to get injured or traded you would notice the huge void this team would have, as there was a prime example last year when he went down with the knee injury.

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01-03-2007, 04:43 PM
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ChemiseBleuHonnete
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I guess I'll say "Done!" to that proposal. Well, so long as we're talking about a June/July transaction date, that is. The hidden benefit to us would be re-signing Markov and Souray for pretty much whatever they want, and maybe getting a shot at Bonk or Johnson too. Not that we need more prospects, and not that I'm convinced those guys on offer are really going to make an impact, but it's a good enough return on Kovalev's occasional headachiness, given our needs wrt the salary cap and our impending UFAs.
I would agree with that. I would keep Kovy for the playoffs, and he will perform well I'm sure of that. But after the playoffs, that would allow us to sign both Markov and Souray while getting good players in exchange Kovy. I'd say it's interesting, but I wouldn't actively look to trade Kovalev at this point, he's a playoff performer and he'll rebound pretty soon imo.

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01-03-2007, 05:37 PM
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Even if Kovalev isn't 'on' every night, without him in our lineup we would be MUCH less scary to the other team. He has the ability to come out of nowhere and score a key goal at any time in a game. I'm not sure any other player on our roster could do the same. We should keep him until his contract runs out.

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Old
01-03-2007, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by AK-Evgeni71 View Post
I have noticed that so far this season, Kovalev has been underperforming along with Samsonov (although Sergei isnt on the same level as Kovy is when they are both on). I remember during free agency last season, I was hoping for CP to deal for Kovalev but instead got Palffy, who ended up retiring from injury halfway through the season.


On the record, I can remember Kovy would love to come back to the Penguins given the chance, especially if he got the chance to be fed by Crosby, who would no doubt be able to snap him out of the slump he currently has been in all season.

Dealing Staal, Fluery, Crosby and Malkin are ALL out of the question, so I'm not going to even think about including any of them in a proposal.


To Montreal:

Noah Welch
Ryan Stone
Colby Armstrong

To Penguins:

Alexei Kovalev

You are not offering us nothing but spare parts. Which we have plenty of depth and much more getting NHL close.

Maybe Whitney and a #1 pick for Kovalev at the draft. But otherwise...no reason for us to deal him. Kovalev usually shows up for the playoffs

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01-03-2007, 06:06 PM
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tmc
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Originally Posted by Rather Gingerly 1 View Post
You are not offering us nothing but spare parts. Which we have plenty of depth and much more getting NHL close.

Maybe Whitney and a #1 pick for Kovalev at the draft. But otherwise...no reason for us to deal him. Kovalev usually shows up for the playoffs
there's no way we can get a low 1st for kovalev

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01-03-2007, 06:10 PM
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there's no way we can get a low 1st for kovalev
Should be mid-first round. It's also a weaker draft...so nothing really to get excited about

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01-03-2007, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Rather Gingerly 1 View Post
You are not offering us nothing but spare parts. Which we have plenty of depth and much more getting NHL close.

Maybe Whitney and a #1 pick for Kovalev at the draft. But otherwise...no reason for us to deal him. Kovalev usually shows up for the playoffs

Colby Armstrong is gritty, young and potentially a 25-30 goal a season wingman who is defensively responsible for a 24 year old as well. Noah Welch will be a top pairing defenseman in a season or two and Ryan Stone in a few seasons could be a good 3rd/4th line centre. Kovalev is already in his 30s and thus far hasnt been performing for you guys (certainly not like his last 46 goal season with us). I think, as most others on here think, that the deal is very fair, infact I think it favors you guys slightly.


If you think Kovalev in his current form is worth a 1st rounder and a young franchise offensive defenseman (who has 6 goals, 17 assists and a 0 plus minus rating currently on a side with one of the worst defenses in the NHL), you are deluding yourself. Its about as realistic as a couple of the Habs fans offering mid range prospects and washed up second and third line players for Sidney Crosby. Unrealistic, and a slap in the face

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01-03-2007, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rather Gingerly 1 View Post
Should be mid-first round. It's also a weaker draft...so nothing really to get excited about
it's not a weak draft at all...it just lacks a top end talent like recent years.

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01-03-2007, 06:41 PM
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I'd do it in a heartbeat...even though we're not looking to trade Kovalev and I know Gainey won't trade him. Noah Welch would immediatley find a place in our d core. He's young and improving.

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01-03-2007, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK-Evgeni71 View Post
Colby Armstrong is gritty, young and potentially a 25-30 goal a season wingman who is defensively responsible for a 24 year old as well. Noah Welch will be a top pairing defenseman in a season or two and Ryan Stone in a few seasons could be a good 3rd/4th line centre. Kovalev is already in his 30s and thus far hasnt been performing for you guys (certainly not like his last 46 goal season with us). I think, as most others on here think, that the deal is very fair, infact I think it favors you guys slightly.
Habs are pretty well set on wings for three lines as it is and then there are guys like Latendresse Kostitsyn and others around the corner. Habs have no need for another young winger. Same for Stone - we have Plekanec/Lapierre/Chipchura coming up in that department.

I suppose Welch could be interesting - but personally I wouldnt want to wait another two years. It seems Habs are developing into "now" rather than future team - 4th seed would give us great position to do some damage postseason, where a veterans (like Kovalev) are most valuable.

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01-03-2007, 07:01 PM
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if we are serious about making a cup run THIS YEAR, then we cant think about trading kovalev. It goes without saying that he would have to be one of the biggest or the biggest reason for any habs success in the post season.

Yes, kovalev is a tease in the regular season. He is much more consistent in the playoffs though. You gotta stick with him unless you want to severely lessen your cup hopes for this season.

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01-03-2007, 07:04 PM
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znk
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do we really need 3 more bodies?

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01-03-2007, 07:04 PM
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I think value wise it's very interesting, but since Habs wants to go deep in the play-off, they would need something that would help them more than Kovalev already do. So that's why there is no deal, but I do like Welch a lot.

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01-03-2007, 07:14 PM
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I would say no to this deal.

Montreal is a much bigger threat with Kovalev on the team.
There are so many things he brings :

- Powerplay
- dekes
- wrist shot
- leadership for our young Russian core

There is also the intangibles : other teams have to focus on him which gets the Koivu line away from the other team`s top checkers.

WE DO NOT NEED MORE FORWARD PROSPECTS !

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01-03-2007, 07:14 PM
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I agree with Hackett, and not just this year but in the next 2 years also, we need that kind of key player in our lineup. Like a lot of people I think Kovalev doesn't play like he can every night but even when he's not playing is 110%, he got respect from opponent and create space on the ice for teammates.

Also, about Welch, sure this guy does have a nice future. But in 1 or 2 years, he'll be 25 or 26.. So we would have this guy for 1 or 2 years before he become Unrestricted free agent. Could be good if Kovalev was free agent at the end of the season and we would want a guy that could help the team for few years but it's not the case.

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01-03-2007, 07:19 PM
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Mats NAslund
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I guess I'll say "Done!" to that proposal. Well, so long as we're talking about a June/July transaction date, that is. The hidden benefit to us would be re-signing Markov and Souray for pretty much whatever they want, and maybe getting a shot at Bonk or Johnson too. Not that we need more prospects, and not that I'm convinced those guys on offer are really going to make an impact, but it's a good enough return on Kovalev's occasional headachiness, given our needs wrt the salary cap and our impending UFAs.
Agreed, this is an off season trade that would work for the habs no sooner. Despite Kovalev's up's and down's he too important to this teams success right now. Especially witht the second line woes.

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01-03-2007, 07:30 PM
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QUOTE FROM AK-Evgeni71
"Colby Armstrong is gritty, young and potentially a 25-30 goal a season wingman who is defensively responsible for a 24 year old as well. Noah Welch will be a top pairing defenseman in a season or two and Ryan Stone in a few seasons could be a good 3rd/4th line centre.

If you think Kovalev in his current form is worth a 1st rounder and a young franchise offensive defenseman (who has 6 goals, 17 assists and a 0 plus minus rating currently on a side with one of the worst defenses in the NHL), you are deluding yourself. Its about as realistic as a couple of the Habs fans offering mid range prospects and washed up second and third line players for Sidney Crosby. Unrealistic, and a slap in the face[/QUOTE]


If you think you can get a superstar like Kovalev for players who by your own definition are a few years away from being big contributers to our team it is

UNREALISTIC AND A SLAP IN THE FACE.

Notice how you use the words "potential" & "žn a few seasons".

We are a cup contending team right now, if we trade kovalev it will be for players who can help us make a cup run. We are not in a re-building phase and we have tons of forward prospects.

The one constant rule in hockey trades is you have to trade talent to get talent.

If you want Kovalev then include put Staal, Malkin or Crosby in the deal.

Dont bother including Fleury, we also have tons of goaltending depth..

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Old
01-03-2007, 07:48 PM
  #23
AlexeiKovalev27
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do we really need 3 more bodies?


Bingo, nuff said!

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Old
01-03-2007, 08:08 PM
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No!

It's an old hockey saw that the team who gets the best player wins the trade. I like saws. So I agree.

Souray and Ryder for Malkin + 3rd rdr. maybe, but c'mon!!

(and that trade would never happen!)

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01-03-2007, 08:13 PM
  #25
znk
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No!

It's an old hockey saw that the team who gets the best player wins the trade. I like saws. So I agree.

Souray and Ryder for Malkin + 3rd rdr. maybe, but c'mon!!

(and that trade would never happen!)
That offer is laughable.

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