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Old
01-08-2007, 02:05 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
umm, doesn't this just prove my point?
Yep. And to further why he could and should be in the top 6 next year too.

At least Fehr has played a North American brand of hockey as opposed to the more lightly combative SEL. He also has experience and size to his advantage.

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01-08-2007, 02:05 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
Fehr:

Well I'm not sure that keeping him in Hershey wont be a better idea then. He is certainly the farthest thing from a 4th line player. I'm not sure that he will get anything playing a few minutes a night on an energy line. Probably best to keep him in Hershey until he is ready to take the 2nd line RW position. Butch and Ron Wilson were notorious for doing that. The latest example being Semin who wallowed on the 4th line playing 2 minutes a night until Hanlon took over and the "purge" took place.

I'd rather he get significant ice time in Hershey.
Isn't Fehr subject to waivers next year along with Flash? If he is, then if you start him in Hershey he has to stay there for the year.

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01-08-2007, 02:05 PM
  #28
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Why is there so much Zubrus dislike/hate?

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01-08-2007, 02:06 PM
  #29
Jasper17
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Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
So the DumpZubrusNow club has:

Japser
Strungout
Drake

Anyone I am missing?

I would love to know who you guys think is going to replace him? Beech? Klepis? Steckel? Stumpel?
I would much rather suffer through one more year of Beech and draft another center this year than pay Zuby 4 million + per.

Getting into term contract that overpay average players is not the way to build a team. Especially for one with a lack of money.

Let me ask you this, would you rather have Beech and a defensman like Hannon. Or Zubrus and a 2nd tier defensman (hopefully one as good as Pothier)?

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01-08-2007, 02:08 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by CapitalPunishment View Post
Why is there so much Zubrus dislike/hate?
Well Drake told me that Zubrus beat him up and took his lunch money when he played in Montreal.

Strungout loves the bears and feels that Joey tenute is ready to take the next step and he could have 30 goals playing with Ovy.

Japser at some bad calzone at Sbarro...a disgusting establishment

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01-08-2007, 02:09 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by CapitalPunishment View Post
Why is there so much Zubrus dislike/hate?
Personally its not that I hate Zubrus. I just hate the idea of paying this guy a penny over 3 million per. He just isn't that good.

If the Caps could sign him to a deal that is fair for his talent than I would love to keep him. But if what others are saying is true, and this guy could command close to 4.5-5 per than the Caps should intentionally make the door hit him on the a$$ on the way out.

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01-08-2007, 02:09 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
Well Drake told me that Zubrus beat him up and took his lunch money when he played in Montreal.

Strungout loves the bears and feels that Joey tenute is ready to take the next step and he could have 30 goals playing with Ovy.

Japser at some bad calzone at Sbarro...a disgusting establishment
Listen, their is a line you don't cross.

You want to talk about my mom or my girlfriend then go ahead. But never imply I eat at Sbarro's

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01-08-2007, 02:10 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
Yep. And to further why he could and should be in the top 6 next year too.

At least Fehr has played a North American brand of hockey as opposed to the more lightly combative SEL. He also has experience and size to his advantage.
I disagree, i think that proves that once again he took a full year at a new level to become a good all around top 6 forward.

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01-08-2007, 02:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
I would much rather suffer through one more year of Beech and draft another center this year than pay Zuby 4 million + per.

Getting into term contract that overpay average players is not the way to build a team. Especially for one with a lack of money.

Let me ask you this, would you rather have Beech and a defensman like Hannon. Or Zubrus and a 2nd tier defensman (hopefully one as good as Pothier)?
First off McPhee would never sign a dman like hannan.

2nd a dman like Hannan would cost much more than what Zubrus will.

3rd: We'd be throwing in the towel if we go into next season with the Beech/Klepis combo at 2nd line.

4th: We dont even know if Backstrom is definitley coming over or whether he will have any sort of impact on the club. What if he doesnt come over and we let Zubrus walk? Klepis centering AO? Beech centering Semin? Could you think of a worse scenario?

What if we get rid of Pothier and Beech, resign Zubrus and then sign a competent dman in the Aaron Ward mold?

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01-08-2007, 02:16 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
Personally its not that I hate Zubrus. I just hate the idea of paying this guy a penny over 3 million per. He just isn't that good.

If the Caps could sign him to a deal that is fair for his talent than I would love to keep him. But if what others are saying is true, and this guy could command close to 4.5-5 per than the Caps should intentionally make the door hit him on the a$$ on the way out.
Have you seen some of his goals he's scored this season and some of the setups he's had? He makes some really good plays and he's probably a good locker room guy for our Russian Star Wingers. Plus Zubrus and Ovechkin both understand each others game very well. It would almost be like starting all over for Ovechkin if things dont work out with Backstrom. Having Zubrus here, someone who is developing steady production and espcially when he gets into his hot streaks, he can be a really good player. I don't see the issue of paying him 3.5 a season or so.


Here is a better question: What will happen to guys like Flash, Klepis, Beech, etc?

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01-08-2007, 02:16 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
First off McPhee would never sign a dman like hannan.

2nd a dman like Hannan would cost much more than what Zubrus will.

3rd: We'd be throwing in the towel if we go into next season with the Beech/Klepis combo at 2nd line.

4th: We dont even know if Backstrom is definitley coming over or whether he will have any sort of impact on the club. What if he doesnt come over and we let Zubrus walk? Klepis centering AO? Beech centering Semin? Could you think of a worse scenario?

What if we get rid of Pothier and Beech, resign Zubrus and then sign a competent dman in the Aaron Ward mold?
let me ask you this then, how much are you willing to pay to keep a guy like Zubrus.

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01-08-2007, 02:17 PM
  #37
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Listen, their is a line you don't cross.

You want to talk about my mom or my girlfriend then go ahead. But never imply I eat at Sbarro's
You're right. That was below the belt.

My bad.

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01-08-2007, 02:18 PM
  #38
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I think Zubrus too inconsistent to make the kind of money his numbers are going to net him as a UFA.

I also think the Caps are going to sign him, so I am resigned to just hoping that his good days (which can be very good) far outnumber his bad days for the rest of his tenure as a Cap (probably another four, five years).

My problem is not that on his bad days his numbers just aren't there. My problem is that on his bad days, he also fails to bring the intangibles that are his strength: hitting, physical play in the corners, grit, moxie, engaging on the forecheck. Those are among his strongest assets, and sometimes he's not doing those little things. When he is, Zubrus is great.

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01-08-2007, 02:19 PM
  #39
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I'm pretty much in the same boat as Drake, et. al. I like Zubrus as a player, but he's not a #1 center. He's going to ask for #1 center money, and I hope the Caps don't give it to him.

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01-08-2007, 02:20 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by CapitalPunishment View Post
Have you seen some of his goals he's scored this season and some of the setups he's had? He makes some really good plays and he's probably a good locker room guy for our Russian Star Wingers. Plus Zubrus and Ovechkin both understand each others game very well. It would almost be like starting all over for Ovechkin if things dont work out with Backstrom. Having Zubrus here, someone who is developing steady production and espcially when he gets into his hot streaks, he can be a really good player. I don't see the issue of paying him 3.5 a season or so.


Here is a better question: What will happen to guys like Flash, Klepis, Beech, etc?
He has had some great individual plays, he has always had a few. But his overall game is far from great. He is an average 2nd line player who is putting up solid top line #s because he is playing with Ovechkin.

3.5 per, i could live with as long as it was for no more than 3 years. But my hatred for Zubrus only started a couple months ago when people around here started talking about 4.5-5 per for this guy. There is just no way he is worth that.

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01-08-2007, 02:21 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
let me ask you this then, how much are you willing to pay to keep a guy like Zubrus.
Given that he is a 20-30 goal guy with 50-60 pt potential and:

he is 6'4" 220 and a bull in the corners,

he skates like he is 5'10' 180lbs

he can play any forward position

is responsible defensively and has improved in the face off circle

is Ovy's mentor, guide, buddy, and translator

is a team leader

has been with the team for some time....

Well 3.5-4 mil for 4 years is something I'd definitely do.

The other option is to sign a soft euro like Nylander for the same kind of money and he will have far less intangibles.

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01-08-2007, 02:21 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Marshall View Post
I like Zubrus as a player, but he's not a #1 center. He's going to ask for #1 center money, and I hope the Caps don't give it to him.
exactly

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01-08-2007, 02:22 PM
  #43
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I think Zubrus too inconsistent to make the kind of money his numbers are going to net him as a UFA.

I also think the Caps are going to sign him, so I am resigned to just hoping that his good days (which can be very good) far outnumber his bad days for the rest of his tenure as a Cap (probably another four, five years).
Well he does have some really nifty moves espcially near or in front of the net.

Remember that spin o rama goal near the net; and he has a wicked backhand to boot. I think his prescence is just as important as anyone elses on this team.

Some here want to see Zubrus walk but would like to see Beech stay. That confuses the hell out of me. I personally would like to see Zubrus move to RW and let someone else take over center. Zubrus could be a great RW on a line with a good center and with Ovechkin flanking the LW.

Ovechkin-Backstrom-Zubrus
Semin-FA-Flash/Pettinger

The 3rd and 4th line possible combinations just confuse me too much to try and mess with right now. But speaking of inconsistency... you all badger Zubrus for it, but I think Pettinger is even more inconsistent and most here like to pencil him as our 2nd line RW (natural position LW to boot) and he definitely isnt a top 6 forward. He works as a great backup incase a top 6 guy gets hurt, but not for 82 games in a season.

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01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Marshall View Post
I'm pretty much in the same boat as Drake, et. al. I like Zubrus as a player, but he's not a #1 center. He's going to ask for #1 center money, and I hope the Caps don't give it to him.
Zubrus has done everything the organization has asked him to do from switching positions, mentoring Ovy, and being a leader.

He has been with the team thru thick and thin.

What kind of message would it send to NOT pay him and go out and Pay for a top 2 center (who will cost about the same anyhow) to come in?

Who do you guys have in mind? Nylander? Stumpel? Zubrus is superior to both by a wide margin.

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01-08-2007, 02:25 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by CapitalPunishment View Post
Well he does have some really nifty moves espcially near or in front of the net.

Remember that spin o rama goal near the net; and he has a wicked backhand to boot. I think his prescence is just as important as anyone elses on this team.

Some here want to see Zubrus walk but would like to see Beech stay. That confuses the hell out of me. I personally would like to see Zubrus move to RW and let someone else take over center. Zubrus could be a great RW on a line with a good center and with Ovechkin flanking the LW.

Ovechkin-Backstrom-Zubrus
Semin-FA-Flash/Pettinger

The 3rd and 4th line possible combinations just confuse me too much to try and mess with right now. But speaking of inconsistency... you all badger Zubrus for it, but I think Pettinger is even more inconsistent and most here like to pencil him as our 2nd line RW (natural position LW to boot) and he definitely isnt a top 6 forward. He works as a great backup incase a top 6 guy gets hurt, but not for 82 games in a season.

That is very disturbing indeed. A very perplexing issue. I do think the people who lean that way have been skewed by Hershey-itis syndrome...meaning they watched Beech dominate at the AHL level and feel he is the same kind of NHL player. Just not the case.

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01-08-2007, 02:26 PM
  #46
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Joey Tenute is god!

Ovechkin - Tenute - Fehr!

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Old
01-08-2007, 02:27 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
exactly
OK Japser,

Come at me with a list of 5-10 guys who you would get to replace him at an equivalent price. I'd like to see your list. I gave Drake my list of Dmen.

Your turn to step up.

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01-08-2007, 02:27 PM
  #48
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Given that he is a 20-30 goal guy with 50-60 pt potential and:

he is 6'4" 220 and a bull in the corners,

he skates like he is 5'10' 180lbs

he can play any forward position

is responsible defensively and has improved in the face off circle

is Ovy's mentor, guide, buddy, and translator

is a team leader
OK, if that was the whole story than yes I would pay him around 4 million per. But all you did was list all the positives about Zubrus. What about some of the negatives.

The main couple of those are...

1) Inconsistent - Sure this guy can look great at times, but he can also go through a month without being noticed

2) Injuries - He is often injured. You can pretty much count on him to miss at least 10 games a season every year, at least. He only averages 67 games per year.

And you can't tell me that this guy is always a "bull in the corners". For a guy who is 6'4 220 he doesn't play like it every game.

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01-08-2007, 02:28 PM
  #49
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Joey Tenute is god!

Ovechkin - Tenute - Fehr!
I KNEW IT!

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01-08-2007, 02:29 PM
  #50
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I don't know anyone who wants Beech at #2 center. Those who would argue Zubrus should be allowed to walk, do so because they want to see him replaced. If we're talking $5M, the Zubrus skeptics suggest playing the market, looking at other guys who are out there. There is a rich market for UFA centers this summer, including guys like Marleau, Gomez, Drury, Briere, Comrie, Nylander.

I like some of those guys more than others, to put it mildly, but the point is that there are a lot of scoring centers available, in addition to Zubrus. If he's really pulling down $5M/yr and term, then give some of the other options a hard look. Now if he signs for $3.5M, then that is different. You won't find better at that price, and props to him if he takes that little to stay in Washington. Yet I don't think he has to do so, and I don't think he will do so.

At the price he's going to be seeking, look at all the options, not just the bird in the hand.

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