HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Washington Capitals
Notices

For next season . . .

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-08-2007, 02:19 PM
  #101
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
So would I. As I stated. If he takes a lesser salary, then I'm on board with the Zubrus support movement.

If Drury and Zubrus come in at the same price, though, in the $5M range, I'd take Drury. He plays the same way every game and he gets better and better in the postseason. Drury is a rock, a metronome. You always know what you're getting.
Okay, I'll definitely agree with that. If you get rid of Zubrus though, and start bringing in all these new players, it will be like starting all over again. The team will have to develop chemistry, and it'll go through its own share of struggles. Our team, the way it is, without having changed very dramatically or significantly from last year to this year (other than a changed defensive look and Semin) has improved A LOT. Next year, with the same level of change our team will IMO be a surefire playoff team. The addition next year wuold be guys like Backstrom, Fehr and maybe a defenseman.

So, right now, the way things are, this team can win, even without the guys we'll be seeing next year. That's saying something.

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:21 PM
  #102
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
You mean all 3 times he has done that.

1999-2000 he played in 73 games and got 42 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward.

2001-2002 he played in 71 games and got 43 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward

2005-2006 he played in 71 games and got 57 points, that is really only averege for a top line forward. But still by far his best year.

Thats a 4.5-5 million dollar man?
No one said we should pay him 4.5-5 million. But around 3.75-4 million also isnt out of the question because he brings a lot of intagibles to this team that isnt seen on the stat sheet.

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:21 PM
  #103
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
You mean all 3 times he has done that.

1999-2000 he played in 73 games and got 42 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward.

2001-2002 he played in 71 games and got 43 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward

2005-2006 he played in 71 games and got 57 points, that is really only averege for a top line forward. But still by far his best year.

Thats a 4.5-5 million dollar man?
You do realize that in 99-00 he was like 22 years old. People forget that he broke in the league at the age of 18! 42pts for a 22 year old in a clutch n grab league is not terrible..especially since he was playing for a terrible Montreal team.

He is still very young and just hitting his prime.

Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:21 PM
  #104
TempusFugit
 
TempusFugit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapitalPunishment View Post
I'll have to disgree with this one.

Drury, who is on a SIGNIFICANTLY better team than the Capitals has only produced 5 more points than Zubrus in 2 more games played.

Drury his entire career has NEVER been more than a 60 point guy and you want to pay him 5 million for that?
Drury is a BEAST in the playoffs. I remember Red Wings fans were ecstatic when Colorado traded him, because they knew he wouldn't torment them in the postseason anymore. He's a guy the Caps have never had (other than John Druce for one year), the guy who comes up with the big goal, when it's most needed in a tight playoff game

TempusFugit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:22 PM
  #105
Jasper17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,309
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
But what about the rest of the team. Last year we had Halpern too who was a good face off guy that would take the tough draws. Thats why I wanted the rest of the players on our teams too.
last year...

Halpern - 55.2
Zubrus - 50.3
Laich - 49.7
Sutherby - 48.7

This year ...

Gordon - 50.4
Beech - 49.2
Zubrus- 48.5
Sutherby - 48
Laich - 47.9
Klepis - 41.8

Jasper17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #106
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gas House Gorilla View Post
Drury is a BEAST in the playoffs. I remember Red Wings fans were ecstatic when Colorado traded him, because they knew he wouldn't torment them in the postseason anymore. He's a guy the Caps have never had (other than John Druce for one year), the guy who comes up with the big goal, when it's most needed in a tight playoff game
Dale Hunter

Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #107
Chokingdogs
Registered User
 
Chokingdogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,204
vCash: 500
the zubrus dynamic will be THE most interesting thing, to watch play out, the rest of the season.

to this point he is, still, statistically better than cole on a PPG basis. cole has 2 more points, but has played in 4 or 5 more games.

if he continues like this, he'll get 4 or more on the open market as a UFA. the "hometown discount" will be right at four, maybe a hair less, but i imagine it will take at least three years if not 4 to get that done.

chemistry is critical, and he's got it here with ov and ( currently ) clark. but at what price is chemistry overruled?

Chokingdogs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #108
Langway
Moderator
Intangibles
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,674
vCash: 500
I'm jumping in late here, but here's my two cents:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
yes it will, it will help him get used to the speed and strengh at the NHL level.

8-10 min a game is all this kid needs, especially at first (through 20-30 games or so).

But there is no chance you can go into next season expecting Fehr, with his track record of 1st year growing pains, and expect him to be a top 6 winger.

Backstrom to be an instant top 6 forward, yes. Fehr, No.
I agree. I think Fehr will be ushered into the league similar to how Anaheim started some of their younger guys last year...getting 8-12 minutes a game with some of that time on the second PP unit.

With that said, if Fehr outperforms a RWer that's getting more minutes then I'd expect the lineup to shuffle as a result.

I'm also of the mindset that unless Backstrom has a dazzling training camp, that he should start out with Semin on the second line. From there, if he performs well, then you contemplate moving him up to the first line.

As for letting Zubrus walk, unless he's replaced by someone with similar talent (which I doubt), then that would be a terrible idea for team progress. For stability's sake, you've got to lean towards him coming back unless his contract demands are unreasonable. I just don't see the Caps making a shrewd decision with Zubrus in favor of bringing a guy like Gomez into the fold.

This is what I'd project for next year:

Ovechkin - Zubrus - Clark
Semin - Backstrom - Pettinger
Brashear - Laich/UFA - Fehr
Sutherby - Gordon - Bradley

I agree with the point about Pettinger's inconsistency. However, he provides solid two-way play that would compliment Semin and Backstrom well.

More and more, I see Clymer as a fairly expensive (for the Caps, at least) healthy scratch.

Langway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #109
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
Zubrus's faceoff % is at 48.5 this season.

It was 50.3 last season.
And he's getting kicked out a lot more often. Difference though this year is that he's taking the majority of the FO's. I think last year Halpern was taking the most. That's also important. Just like goalies, the more shots you have against you the higher your GAA will be. The more faceoffs yuo take, the higher than chance is your FO % will drop (i think, i might be talkin out of my *** on that one )

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:23 PM
  #110
Langway
Moderator
Intangibles
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,674
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
What about some of the negatives.

The main couple of those are...

1) Inconsistent - Sure this guy can look great at times, but he can also go through a month without being noticed

2) Injuries - He is often injured. You can pretty much count on him to miss at least 10 games a season every year, at least. He only averages 67 games per year.

And you can't tell me that this guy is always a "bull in the corners". For a guy who is 6'4 220 he doesn't play like it every game.
Don't forget all of the dumb penalties. I thought for a while in the Atlanta game that his penalties would cost them the game. It didn't but he's got to stop it with the lazy, dumb penalties.

I'm not a fan of letting Zubrus walk, just pointing out something that really annoys me.

Langway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:24 PM
  #111
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
last year...

Halpern - 55.2
Zubrus - 50.3
Laich - 49.7
Sutherby - 48.7

This year ...

Gordon - 50.4
Beech - 49.2
Zubrus- 48.5
Sutherby - 48
Laich - 47.9
Klepis - 41.8
Without Halpern both Sutherby and Laich % went down also. You cant expect to lose one of the better face off men in the league (halpern) and not let that effect everyone else.

Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:24 PM
  #112
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gas House Gorilla View Post
Drury is a BEAST in the playoffs. I remember Red Wings fans were ecstatic when Colorado traded him, because they knew he wouldn't torment them in the postseason anymore. He's a guy the Caps have never had (other than John Druce for one year), the guy who comes up with the big goal, when it's most needed in a tight playoff game
We havnt really seen what our guys can do in the playoffs yet, for the most part.

And I think Ovechkin can handle taking all the pressure, which will leave other guys better off.

Ovechkin = Definition of Clutch.

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:25 PM
  #113
Jasper17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,309
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
He is still very young and just hitting his prime.
Players hit their prime at around 24. Zubrus is going to be 29 in June and is only just now putting together his first above average point total.

Jasper17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:26 PM
  #114
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ididitlangway View Post
Don't forget all of the dumb penalties. I thought for a while in the Atlanta game that his penalties would cost them the game. It didn't but he's got to stop it with the lazy, dumb penalties.

I'm not a fan of letting Zubrus walk, just pointing out something that really annoys me.
I agree that penalties are a problem with him. They were with Bondra too. And Dale Hunter as well.

I'd rather have someone like that who gets into the play and fights as opposed to someone like Adam Oates who worries about his Lady Bing chances.

When you play on the edge sometimes you go over.

Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:27 PM
  #115
TempusFugit
 
TempusFugit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
You mean all 3 times he has done that.

1999-2000 he played in 73 games and got 42 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward.

2001-2002 he played in 71 games and got 43 points, that is not that good for a top 6 forward

2005-2006 he played in 71 games and got 57 points, that is really only averege for a top line forward. But still by far his best year.

Thats a 4.5-5 million dollar man?
Show me where in my post I said that he was a 4.5-5 mill man. In fact, if you had read the entire post, you would have noticed where I wrote that I would let him walk at over 4 mill.

Points don't tell the whole story. As Tinordi24 pointed out, he does a lot more for his line, going into the corners, playing physically, leadership etc. Any other FA centers at that price aren't gonna give you those things

TempusFugit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:27 PM
  #116
strungout
Professional Killer
 
strungout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Maryland
Posts: 28,952
vCash: 500
Im not buying the Zubrus/Ovechkin chemistry thing.

strungout is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:28 PM
  #117
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
Players hit their prime at around 24. Zubrus is going to be 29 in June and is only just now putting together his first above average point total.
24? Dang, better trade Ovechkin before its too late.

There are some late bloomers in this league; that's a fact. Zubrus is one of them.

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:29 PM
  #118
Drake1588
UNATCO
 
Drake1588's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 27,841
vCash: 500
This is just opinion, but I think Ovechkin would have chemistry with a brick.

Drake1588 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:29 PM
  #119
Jasper17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,309
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
Without Halpern both Sutherby and Laich % went down also. You cant expect to lose one of the better face off men in the league (halpern) and not let that effect everyone else.
Well Zuby, Gordon and Sutherby are the guys who have had to take more draws with Halpern gone. Laich mostly plays wing and I don't think takes to many.

So out of the 3 that have had to step up. Zubrus's face-off % has dropped the most and a pretty decent amount 1.8 % compared to Sutherby's who's dropped .7 %.

Even though I know you don't like Gordon, to me he is really the only guy I want taking an important faceoff.

Jasper17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:29 PM
  #120
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Japser17 View Post
Players hit their prime at around 24. Zubrus is going to be 29 in June and is only just now putting together his first above average point total.
I think the people in the BeechBandwagon will disagree with you there!


Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:30 PM
  #121
TempusFugit
 
TempusFugit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
Dale Hunter
Ummmmm, one overtime goal to win a series in 12 years with an organization doesn't qualify a player as a beast

TempusFugit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:30 PM
  #122
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by strungout View Post
Im not buying the Zubrus/Ovechkin chemistry thing.
I know what I'm buying into. Semin/Ovechkin chemistry. Oh god would I like to see a healthly Forsberg-ish player center Ovechkin and Semin at even strength and on the power play.

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:30 PM
  #123
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
This is just opinion, but I think Ovechkin would have chemistry with a brick.
Nope. We tried that with Klepis. Didnt work out.

What is our record without Zubrus in the lineup the last couple years? I dont remember winning many games without him.

Tinordi24* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:31 PM
  #124
CapitalPunishment
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Maryland
Country: Armenia
Posts: 4,476
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
This is just opinion, but I think Ovechkin would have chemistry with a brick.
So.. then can we bring back Grier?

CapitalPunishment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-08-2007, 02:31 PM
  #125
Langway
Moderator
Intangibles
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,674
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24 View Post
I agree that penalties are a problem with him. They were with Bondra too. And Dale Hunter as well.

I'd rather have someone like that who gets into the play and fights as opposed to someone like Adam Oates who worries about his Lady Bing chances.

When you play on the edge sometimes you go over.
To be sure, but a lot of the time they result from mental errors and him not seeming to 'get' where the line is between what will and will not be called. There's a way to play on the edge and know not to cross the line into what will be called. It differs from ref-to-ref and night-to-night but it seems like a constant problem with Zubrus.

On this general topic, I hate it when players (and Zubrus does this fairly often) commit an infraction and then throw their hands up. It's like, 'hey, call a penalty on me...I'm guilty and trying to fake like I never touched the guy!'

Langway is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:39 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.