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Old
01-22-2007, 09:16 AM
  #26
PuckNut
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Originally Posted by jcoldwell View Post
As for the coaching staff...I would clean house and hire all new bodies that have no ties to Edmonton.

PP Coach: Mike Bossy
Goaltending Coach: Patrick Roy
Assistants: Cam Neely, Mike Gartner
Head Coach: Don Cherry
As for Roy, is he really the type of guy you want around? He's too much of an idiot, even if he was an amazing goalie. This is the latest news worthy item from him.

Quote:
Saguenay police are investigating a complaint that Roy, who coaches the Quebec City Remparts of the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League, shoved a representative of the Chicoutimi Sagueneens following a game pitting the two teams Friday night in Chicoutimi, north of Quebec City.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/junio...21_195833_3040

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Old
01-22-2007, 10:01 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by PuckNut View Post
As for Roy, is he really the type of guy you want around? He's too much of an idiot, even if he was an amazing goalie. This is the latest news worthy item from him.



http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/junio...21_195833_3040
Ol' chicken bob head? No thanks!

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Old
01-22-2007, 10:13 AM
  #28
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Send Petersen to the minor, put Bergeron in the Press box and get him some Buckeys for that cough, and then evaluate whether this team is a contender this year, or whether it's time to build for next year.

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01-22-2007, 10:22 AM
  #29
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blow up the team and start from scratch?

Dunno

but It is obvious the oilers need to decide if they want to try to do what they did last year again this year

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01-22-2007, 12:47 PM
  #30
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1. Get some control over Roloson and make sure Jussi plays 1 out of every 4 games minimum down the stretch.

2. Get a defenseman. That should've been here months ago. Already. Pay the price. Offer up Schremp and a 1st. Offer up Lupul. Get it done. Stuart, Visnovsky, etc.

3. Throw a pick for a guy like Matvichuk who can play on the bottom pairing.

4. Pray like hell too much time wasn't wasted on Smid and Greene.

5. If this team is within 4 points of the division crown at the deadline, part with the necessary parts to bring in a Martin Gelinas type.
I like the goaltending idea, just unbelievable this hasn't been done since day one. I'm sure that the top D guy is in the works, I can appreciate how hard it is to get it done. The Matvichuk idea I don't like. I think if we can add a couple of top 4 guys to our D, the rest of the guys will fall into place nicely. We don't need more bottom pairing guys, we seem to be stocked with them.

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Originally Posted by jcoldwell View Post
As for the coaching staff...I would clean house and hire all new bodies that have no ties to Edmonton.

PP Coach: Mike Bossy
Goaltending Coach: Patrick Roy
Assistants: Cam Neely, Mike Gartner
Head Coach: Don Cherry
I'm glad that others are in agreeance that we need some coaching changes... but I gotta admit, your choices are a head scratcher. Mike Bossy, Cam Neely and Mike Gartner were all fabulous players and great at what they did, but what exactly qualifies them to coach at the NHL level (do we need more Craig Simpsons)? Patrick Roy is a HUGE **** and Don Cherry, as I'm sure most have noticed, has really started to lose his marbles over the past couple of years. I honestly don't think he's competent to coach.

Before I fired the Oilers coaching staff, I'd let the rumor out to the players that it was gonna happen to see if it lit a fire under their a$$es.

Hire Pat Burns, and let him pick his assistants. Pat is a winner (Stanley Cups AND 3 Jack Adams Trophies), he's a tactician, and a bit of a hard-ass (which this team DESPERATELY needs). I'd def keep MacT around... he's a great guy and has done alot for the team. If Pat didn't want him on the coaching staff, I'd move him to scouting or Assistant GM or something.

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01-22-2007, 12:54 PM
  #31
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Am i the only one who would think todd bertuzzi would help us, we've always been looking for a power forward who can score and provide team toughness... he will have 1.1 mil left on his contract and the oilers have the cap room to do it.

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01-22-2007, 12:59 PM
  #32
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Am i the only one who would think todd bertuzzi would help us, we've always been looking for a power forward who can score and provide team toughness... he will have 1.1 mil left on his contract and the oilers have the cap room to do it.
Yes, yes you are. There's nothing like trading away high picks and blue chippers for a guy who can't stay healthy and has no heart.

The Oilers need Bertuzzi like they need Niniimaa, or a hole in the head.

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Old
01-22-2007, 01:03 PM
  #33
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What does everyone think of trying to get Jason Blake from the NYI??? He can score, not defensively liable, tough on the forecheck, gritty, and is a RWer.

MAybe a line of:

Smyth-Horcoff-Blake??

What do you guys think?

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Old
01-22-2007, 01:12 PM
  #34
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I don't mean to rag on Huddy, but how effective has he been as an assistant coach? I say this in response to the call for MacT to be demoted to assistant & for Simpson to be fired: are the players being sent too many messages because there are too many guys behind the bench? (keep Moores, BTW). I also like the suggestion of bringing in Pat Burns, given his track record.

Head coach: Burns
Assistant coach: MacT & Moores

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01-22-2007, 01:33 PM
  #35
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In my opinion, this just isn't our year. I think (hope?) Lowe recognizes this, too. As such I'd rather not see him make any panic trades or any deals that sacrifice our immediate future just so that we can "salvage" the season, scrape into the playoffs, only to be (likely) bounced in the first round. There is just something "wrong" with this team as-is.

Unless this team turns things around dramatically in the next few weeks, I think Lowe should be a seller at the deadline, regardless of our divisional position, but only to the extent that he deals away non-core players and acquires assets that will help within a ~5 year window. I kind of see this team as being similar to Carolina & Anaheim: nearly go all the way one year, then royally suck the following year or two, but having the same core group of mostly youngsters go through both situations and coming out stronger and better because of it. If Lowe can keep the core (Hemsky, Stoll, Torres, Pisani, Reasoner, Smid, Greene, Lupul, Smyth, Staios, Moreau, plus or minus a few players) of this team together, I see a bright future for the next 5 years or so...

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Old
01-22-2007, 01:48 PM
  #36
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I think last year gave a lot of people skewed ideas about his year. We were never a Cup contender, so why panic now?

Sure we aren't playing anywhere near potential, but two major team leaders (Staios and Moreau) are out long term and if you think they are just pilons that eat up great cap space then you don't pay enough attention to this team. The leadership and heart that those two bring would and will turn around a lot of games.

I have no problem with being a seller at the deadline, as long as its smart. Move Sykora if he's not willing to talk or sign a realistic two year deal. His chemistry with Hemmer is more than enough to justify that.

Moving Smyth is rediculous in my opinion, unless he's going to test the FA market. He is the Oilers right now.

Rollie is struggling but I think its becacuse he needs down time. Jussi is capable of playing more and should. Rollie struggled last year and then stood on his head in the playoffs...hopefully the team can squeak in to give him a chance to do it again. A goalie doesn't seem realistic to me right now. Expecially one like Biron heading into UFA and hasn't been that great this year.

Nedved is an Oiler until the season is out...who'd give up anything to get him unless he has a HUGE 4 weeks? A late round pick isn't worth giving up to keep him in the lineup with Hemmer and Sykora.

A puck moving PP QB Dman would make a world of difference to this team. Vishnovsky was my first pick, then Stuart and now...Brewer I guess...not sure who else is out there?

Off topic...but what do you allthink about the Brewer rumours?

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Old
01-22-2007, 02:13 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Send Petersen to the minor, put Bergeron in the Press box and get him some Buckeys for that cough, and then evaluate whether this team is a contender this year, or whether it's time to build for next year.
yes, and with 6 defensive defencemen our problem of lack of breakouts from our end will be resolved.

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Old
01-22-2007, 02:28 PM
  #38
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i'd move mact upstairs somewhere rather than demote him to ass't coach. this team seriously needs to blow up it's coaching staff to pitch the oiler ties to the past and get in some proven winners.

i like moores, and i honestly don't think that huddy is doing a bad job, but simpson has GOT to go, like 3 seasons ago. MacT has oodles of hockey smarts and could do the organization a lot of good in the front office, but i don't think he's great head-coach/bench-boss material.

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Old
01-22-2007, 02:51 PM
  #39
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My hope: Trade Horcoff, MAB, and Anaheim 1st round pick to Chicago for Cam Barker. Hope that Chicago falls for two roster players and pick. Trade our first round pick to Boston for Brad Stuart. Call up MAP to replace Horcoffs "scoring prowess." Send Toby Peterson to the minors and keep him there, followed shortly by Thoreson. Bring up JFJ, Stortini, and shuttle them in and out of the lineup with Winchester. If you get 5 hits in the game or a goal, you stay in the lineup. You don't, the next guy rotates in. Ask for a show of hands in the dressing room, and anybody that isn't on board gets traded. Lines, when healthy become:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-Nedved-Lupul
Torres-MAP-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner- (JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Staios-Tjanrnqvist/Hejda
Smid-Greene
Roy in pb

In off-season, let Nedved and Tjarnqvist go. Use $3.6M saved on Horcoff to sign Smyths raise and Brad Stuart. Keep Sykora if possible, if not, live with it. Lines next year are:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-MAP-Lupul
Torres-Schremp-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner-(JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Barker-Staios
Smid-Greene
Roy or Gilbert in PB

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Old
01-22-2007, 03:31 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BudBundy View Post
My hope: Trade Horcoff, MAB, and Anaheim 1st round pick to Chicago for Cam Barker. Hope that Chicago falls for two roster players and pick. Trade our first round pick to Boston for Brad Stuart. Call up MAP to replace Horcoffs "scoring prowess." Send Toby Peterson to the minors and keep him there, followed shortly by Thoreson. Bring up JFJ, Stortini, and shuttle them in and out of the lineup with Winchester. If you get 5 hits in the game or a goal, you stay in the lineup. You don't, the next guy rotates in. Ask for a show of hands in the dressing room, and anybody that isn't on board gets traded. Lines, when healthy become:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-Nedved-Lupul
Torres-MAP-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner- (JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Staios-Tjanrnqvist/Hejda
Smid-Greene
Roy in pb

In off-season, let Nedved and Tjarnqvist go. Use $3.6M saved on Horcoff to sign Smyths raise and Brad Stuart. Keep Sykora if possible, if not, live with it. Lines next year are:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-MAP-Lupul
Torres-Schremp-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner-(JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Barker-Staios
Smid-Greene
Roy or Gilbert in PB
If we go into next season with MAP and Schremp as #2/3 on our centre list, then we're devoid of centre depth like a couple years ago. Meaning big trouble.

This is filling one hole to open up another.

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01-22-2007, 03:42 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by dasivon View Post
If we go into next season with MAP and Schremp as #2/3 on our centre list, then we're devoid of centre depth like a couple years ago. Meaning big trouble.

This is filling one hole to open up another.
How can Stoll/MAP/Schremp/Reasoner be any worse than the current Horcoff/Nedved/Stoll/Reasoner? Subsitute MAP for Horcoff and his current pace for 15 goals and things don't look bad. Schremp for Nedved is arguably a wash one year from today, and that is assuming we keep Nedved - which we probably won't. There you go.

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01-22-2007, 04:25 PM
  #42
dasivon
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How can Stoll/MAP/Schremp/Reasoner be any worse than the current Horcoff/Nedved/Stoll/Reasoner? Subsitute MAP for Horcoff and his current pace for 15 goals and things don't look bad. Schremp for Nedved is arguably a wash one year from today, and that is assuming we keep Nedved - which we probably won't. There you go.
Nedved is playing good hockey right now, and Schremp has proven nothing in the AHL, let alone the NHL.

MAP has proven he isn't an NHL player yet, let alone replacing Horcoff. It's not all about how many goals X and X player has. I will be the first to say Horc is struggling, but don't forget Hemmer and Smyth have had consecutive career years playing with him. Even when he plays like garbage on the offense, he opens things up for his wingers.

You think MAP can do that?

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Old
01-22-2007, 05:57 PM
  #43
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In my opinion, this just isn't our year. I think (hope?) Lowe recognizes this, too. As such I'd rather not see him make any panic trades or any deals that sacrifice our immediate future just so that we can "salvage" the season, scrape into the playoffs, only to be (likely) bounced in the first round. There is just something "wrong" with this team as-is.

Unless this team turns things around dramatically in the next few weeks, I think Lowe should be a seller at the deadline, regardless of our divisional position, but only to the extent that he deals away non-core players and acquires assets that will help within a ~5 year window. I kind of see this team as being similar to Carolina & Anaheim: nearly go all the way one year, then royally suck the following year or two, but having the same core group of mostly youngsters go through both situations and coming out stronger and better because of it. If Lowe can keep the core (Hemsky, Stoll, Torres, Pisani, Reasoner, Smid, Greene, Lupul, Smyth, Staios, Moreau, plus or minus a few players) of this team together, I see a bright future for the next 5 years or so...

I agree. Everybody talks about how few teams are willing to move any good players. That means it is a sellers market this year.

Teams will be willing to over pay for guys like Smyth, Smith, Staios etc. We have to be smart asset wise. For example, if we could get a 1st for Smith we should take it. Sure that 1st won't be a player for 4 years, but it is a better asset.

I think our team could come out looking much better for the next 5-10 years if Lowe is smart this deadline and doesn't try to force something that isn't there (make this team into a contender for this year)

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Old
01-22-2007, 08:22 PM
  #44
Jimmi Jenkins
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yes, and with 6 defensive defencemen our problem of lack of breakouts from our end will be resolved.
Bergeron is not good in anyway at breakout passes and the only thing he brings is a big shot.

Tom Gilbert could fill his shoes on the PP easily.

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01-22-2007, 10:58 PM
  #45
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Bergeron is not good in anyway at breakout passes and the only thing he brings is a big shot.
Wrong, he's made plenty of 2-line passes leading to goals.

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01-22-2007, 10:59 PM
  #46
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As for the coaching staff...I would clean house and hire all new bodies that have no ties to Edmonton.

PP Coach: Mike Bossy
Goaltending Coach: Patrick Roy
Assistants: Cam Neely, Mike Gartner
Head Coach: Don Cherry
You know how the Gretzky-Coffey-Fuhr trio is doing in Phoenix, right?

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01-23-2007, 06:38 AM
  #47
Jimmi Jenkins
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Wrong, he's made plenty of 2-line passes leading to goals.
Right, he both goes up the middle and throws the puck up the middle causing brutal turn overs that end up in the back of the net.

He's not playing well, all he's bringing to the table each night his the big shot, that's it.

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01-23-2007, 09:59 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by BudBundy View Post
My hope: Trade Horcoff, MAB, and Anaheim 1st round pick to Chicago for Cam Barker. Hope that Chicago falls for two roster players and pick. Trade our first round pick to Boston for Brad Stuart. Call up MAP to replace Horcoffs "scoring prowess." Send Toby Peterson to the minors and keep him there, followed shortly by Thoreson. Bring up JFJ, Stortini, and shuttle them in and out of the lineup with Winchester. If you get 5 hits in the game or a goal, you stay in the lineup. You don't, the next guy rotates in. Ask for a show of hands in the dressing room, and anybody that isn't on board gets traded. Lines, when healthy become:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-Nedved-Lupul
Torres-MAP-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner- (JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Staios-Tjanrnqvist/Hejda
Smid-Greene
Roy in pb

In off-season, let Nedved and Tjarnqvist go. Use $3.6M saved on Horcoff to sign Smyths raise and Brad Stuart. Keep Sykora if possible, if not, live with it. Lines next year are:

Smyth-Stoll-Hemsky
Sykora-MAP-Lupul
Torres-Schremp-Pisani
Moreau-Reasoner-(JFJ, Stortini, Winch)

Stuart-Smith
Barker-Staios
Smid-Greene
Roy or Gilbert in PB
Where do i sign?? I like it alot. We still need to dump Rolli in the offseason for a bag of pucks and sign Biron.

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01-23-2007, 01:53 PM
  #49
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If I were Kevin Lowe . . .

I would keep my eyes on the long term plan.
  • 05-06 was never a target for a run (2 playoff rounds was the expectation), do a deadline deal to be 95% likely to get to the playoffs and see what happens
  • 06-07 was never a target for a run (get to the playoffs is the minimum expectation, anything else is gravy), let some rookies fly 120 sorties and hope and pray it doesn't kill you. if you've got enough to get in, great, if you're uncertain -- then pray your youngsters get better
  • 07-08 is a target year, you build on youth, but veterans help you win, you need a UFA or two, both up front and inback.

A few pretty simple things have gone wrong with the 06-07 season:
They went into it knowingly with a big gamble on D.
1) Tjarnquist either didn't live up to the billing, or the injury has prevented him. He was to shoulder the load, and was unable to.
2) They went 41 games playing the rookies to the hilt, and got away with it before the wheels started to fall off. Just when they were ready to get into a "playoff alignment," the injuries meant that they needed to break in even more rookies.

The Oiler fans (and probably some of the players too) are frustrated because of the "win the division, win one more game" rhetoric being doled out. They went into the season with only about a 75% potential, and the odds drastically reduced due to the limitations on the D, and the post-post-season hangover of key players. Hey, you win some bets, and you lose some. This one was lost.

So, for next season, you reload (not rebuild). You're not going to have a winning season with as much inexperience on the back-end, so you're going to trade some of that (probably Greene(RD)), you're not going to have enough room for all the guys who are knocking (one Gilbert(RD), or Roy(RD) are gone), you need the 5-hole for Smid-Syvret-Chorney so MAB is sent away, Hejda is what you expected (but inexplicably hid) so you resign him, Tjarnquist is replaced with a UFA acquisition.

That makes the D:
newguy+Smith
Hejda-Staios
Smid-vetguy
and platoon in Syvret, Gilbert, Roy as is required

This forward lineup, sans Nedved, and either with Sykora or a Sykora-like veteran., still has all the right pieces. Stick with it.

Two things were made clear about the season's agenda.
1. The minute that it was Smid, not Salei in the Pronger deal, that gestures "future", not "this year."
2. That the system play remained the same, despite the inexperience of the D to play that system, tells me they were never training for this year, it was always about the future.

They may still make it in this year. And who knows, if they get to the dance, they could catch lightning in a bottle again. Pretty damn unlikely, so don't sell the farm when you knew your chances weren't that good to begin with.

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Old
01-23-2007, 03:10 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by namflashback View Post
I would keep my eyes on the long term plan.
  • 05-06 was never a target for a run (2 playoff rounds was the expectation), do a deadline deal to be 95% likely to get to the playoffs and see what happens
  • 06-07 was never a target for a run (get to the playoffs is the minimum expectation, anything else is gravy), let some rookies fly 120 sorties and hope and pray it doesn't kill you. if you've got enough to get in, great, if you're uncertain -- then pray your youngsters get better
  • 07-08 is a target year, you build on youth, but veterans help you win, you need a UFA or two, both up front and inback.

A few pretty simple things have gone wrong with the 06-07 season:
They went into it knowingly with a big gamble on D.
1) Tjarnquist either didn't live up to the billing, or the injury has prevented him. He was to shoulder the load, and was unable to.
2) They went 41 games playing the rookies to the hilt, and got away with it before the wheels started to fall off. Just when they were ready to get into a "playoff alignment," the injuries meant that they needed to break in even more rookies.

The Oiler fans (and probably some of the players too) are frustrated because of the "win the division, win one more game" rhetoric being doled out. They went into the season with only about a 75% potential, and the odds drastically reduced due to the limitations on the D, and the post-post-season hangover of key players. Hey, you win some bets, and you lose some. This one was lost.

So, for next season, you reload (not rebuild). You're not going to have a winning season with as much inexperience on the back-end, so you're going to trade some of that (probably Greene(RD)), you're not going to have enough room for all the guys who are knocking (one Gilbert(RD), or Roy(RD) are gone), you need the 5-hole for Smid-Syvret-Chorney so MAB is sent away, Hejda is what you expected (but inexplicably hid) so you resign him, Tjarnquist is replaced with a UFA acquisition.

That makes the D:
newguy+Smith
Hejda-Staios
Smid-vetguy
and platoon in Syvret, Gilbert, Roy as is required

This forward lineup, sans Nedved, and either with Sykora or a Sykora-like veteran., still has all the right pieces. Stick with it.

Two things were made clear about the season's agenda.
1. The minute that it was Smid, not Salei in the Pronger deal, that gestures "future", not "this year."
2. That the system play remained the same, despite the inexperience of the D to play that system, tells me they were never training for this year, it was always about the future.

They may still make it in this year. And who knows, if they get to the dance, they could catch lightning in a bottle again. Pretty damn unlikely, so don't sell the farm when you knew your chances weren't that good to begin with.
Wouldn't you want Greene figuring in the future of the D somewhere?

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