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National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Are the Penguins already a top tier NHL side?

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:21 PM
  #76
Clarence Beeks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Compared to the NHL? Absolutely not.

Heck, while at it, why not throw in PeeWees?

We're talking about the most intense two+ months of hockey grind that exists, at the highest level of competition on earth.

Does anyone really think otherwise?
It's not the same, but to say that it doesn't matter at all is absurd.

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01-28-2007, 10:21 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
So QMJHL playoffs, WJC pressure, AHL playoffs experience counts for nothing?
I stated a fact, he has no NHL playoff experience.

I stated nothing as to other NHL experience. Take it for what it is worth.

I stated that his lack of NHL playoff experience, may or may not be a factor. We just don't know.

If you do, please tell me.

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01-28-2007, 10:22 PM
  #78
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Compared to the NHL? Absolutely not.

Heck, while at it, why not throw in PeeWees?

We're talking about the most intense two+ months of hockey grind that exists, at the highest level of competition on earth.

Does anyone actually think otherwise?
I didn't say it was comparable but it is still experience.

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:23 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence Beeks View Post
It's not the same, but to say that it doesn't matter at all is absurd.
You ice a team of AHL playoff vets then, chief. I'm sure that "moxie" will serve them well in the big show.

The only thing that is "absurd" is that a few members of "Generation Instant Gratification" have either no knowledge or appreciation of what it takes to win a championship.

One hundred years of evidence to the contrary? Matters little. Colby Armstrong, Ryan Whitney and their fellow AHL playoff playoff warriors will waltz through the NHL post-season.

Experience matters little...to those who have none in life.


Last edited by Trottier: 01-28-2007 at 10:33 PM.
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Old
01-28-2007, 10:23 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence Beeks View Post
I knew what you meant. I was actually trying to support your argument. Sorry for the confusion. I was just saying that it really is a wildcard, but there may be some upside due to his AHL playoff experience. Even though the Pens have sucked every year he's been there before this year, WBS has been great and gone far in the playoffs. That's something that most people probably don't realize about him.
I know, I know.

I knew your point, but I figured, someone would jump on it, and as you can in other posts after that, someone did, so I knew I better clarify.

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:27 PM
  #81
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
You ice a team of AHL playoff vets then, chief. I'm sure that "moxie" will serve them well in the big show.
Would you stop insulting everyone who disagree's with you, you are one arrogant man. Every damn person on these boards watches the playoffs, to say we don't understand because we believe a team is close to becoming contenders is simple arrogant and short sighted. You can bash me all you want but a sure fire hockey hall of fame goaltender who won three Stanley Cups in the best system running also agrees with me. Go ahead, see if you can bash Brodeur, you never have before.

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:28 PM
  #82
Clarence Beeks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
You ice a team of AHL playoff vets then, chief. I'm sure that "moxie" will serve them well in the big show.
What does that have to do with my post that you quoted? Did I ever say anything about icing an entire team of AHL playoff vets? No. Did I say that AHL playoff experience was equal to NHL playoff experience? No. I said that it counts for something, and that's what you come back with? I will go with absurd.

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:30 PM
  #83
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Let me look at the standings....




No.

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:30 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
Would you stop insulting everyone who disagree's with you, you are one arrogant man. Every damn person on these boards watches the playoffs, to say we don't understand because we believe a team is close to becoming contenders is simple arrogant and short sighted. You can bash me all you want but a sure fire hockey hall of fame goaltender who won three Stanley Cups in the best system running also agrees with me. Go ahead, see if you can bash Brodeur, you never have before.
LOL. I can't wait to see his response to this...

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Old
01-28-2007, 10:30 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence Beeks View Post
What does that have to do with my post that you quoted? Did I ever say anything about icing an entire team of AHL playoff vets? No. Did I say that AHL playoff experience was equal to NHL playoff experience? No. I said that it counts for something, and that's what you come back with? I will go with absurd.
He has been changing everyones posts so they fit his arguement, its actually making him look pretty little at the moment.

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01-28-2007, 10:36 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
Would you stop insulting everyone who disagree's with you, you are one arrogant man.
No, simply do not suffer fools kindly.

Such as those who ignore history, completely. Like you, in this case.

If you care to continue to make this personal, go right ahead.

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01-28-2007, 10:41 PM
  #87
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The Penguins have been pretty inconsistent all season, which is expected for a team this young. When they are playing like they have these last five games (four wins, one OT loss), they can look pretty darn good. But when they go on five game losing streaks like they did back in December, their weaknesses become more apparent to any level-headed fan.

I hope they make the playoffs (and the games they have in hand are certainly encouraging) - but while the team is sitting right in the middle of that crowded Eastern Conference, its probably best to remain only cautiously optimistic at this point.

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01-28-2007, 10:45 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
No, simply do not suffer fools kindly.

Such as those who ignore history, completely. Like you, in this case.

If you care to continue to make this personal, go right ahead.
Please don't beat him up

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01-28-2007, 10:45 PM
  #89
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
No, simply do not suffer fools kindly.

Such as those who ignore history, completely. Like you, in this case.

If you care to continue to make this personal, go right ahead.
Who is to say you are no fool? Don't be so quick to point the gun at others. One who predicted Buffalo, Carolina and Edmonton last year were once considered fools.

You have already made it personal with many posters in this thread with your inside cuts at them. You always cover your insults with your wording.

History is a good way to base predictions on but it is not sure fire. In the past a team with a european captain was not to win a stanley cup or no team with a european goaltender could accomplish the feat. Surely Detroit, New Jersey, Calgary or Ottawa are cup contenders.

This whole arguement started because you did not take my post in context. Did I say Pittsburgh was my favorite to win the cup....no. Did I say with Chara or Blake Pittsburgh would win the Stanley Cup....no. Did I say at any point they are front runners to win the cup.....no. I merley said they were cup contenders and I will stand by that, they have as good a shot as any in the east, but needs things to happen in order to win the cup.

History remains a good way to predict but history is not 100%.

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01-28-2007, 11:01 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
You always cover your insults with your wording.

Actually, I think I used my wording to explain my opinions about your posts quite clearly. No covering anything, whatsoever.

"they have as good a shot as any in the east..."

No further words required. Night.

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Old
01-28-2007, 11:05 PM
  #91
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Obviously not, since you missed the whole point. But continue on.

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01-28-2007, 11:05 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
You ice a team of AHL playoff vets then, chief. I'm sure that "moxie" will serve them well in the big show.

The only thing that is "absurd" is that a few members of "Generation Instant Gratification" have either no knowledge or appreciation of what it takes to win a championship.

One hundred years of evidence to the contrary? Matters little. Colby Armstrong, Ryan Whitney and their fellow AHL playoff playoff warriors will waltz through the NHL post-season.

Experience matters little...to those who have none in life.
Way to edit your post to make it look like you said something that you didn't after people had already responded to you and picked your argument apart. There really should be some type of sanction on here for that. Mods... any help?

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Old
01-28-2007, 11:08 PM
  #93
Clarence Beeks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post

The only thing that is "absurd" is that a few members of "Generation Instant Gratification" have either no knowledge or appreciation of what it takes to win a championship.

...

Experience matters little...to those who have none in life.
Yep! Because you sure know how old everyone is and how long they've been watching hockey. Look folks, we've got the all knowing Mr. I can see through the computer and determine your age just by looking at a username, guy here!! Holy crap, that's awesome!

Hilariously enough you're probably younger the most of the people who you accuse to be young and have no experience. Good one there chief.

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Old
01-28-2007, 11:10 PM
  #94
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence Beeks View Post
Yep! Because you sure know how old everyone is and how long they've been watching hockey. Look folks, we've got the all knowing Mr. I can see through the computer and determine your age just by looking at a username, guy here!! Holy crap, that's awesome!

Hilariously enough you're probably younger the most of the people who you accuse to be young and have no experience. Good one there chief.
Not hard to put an age on him, late 20's maybe early 30's bandwagon fan of the dynasty Isles.

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01-28-2007, 11:12 PM
  #95
Clarence Beeks
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Not hard to put an age on him, late 20's maybe early 30's bandwagon fan of the dynasty Isles.
Doubt he's even that old. But if he is in that age range, that's just pathetic.

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01-28-2007, 11:14 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Clarence Beeks View Post
Way to edit your post to make it look like you said something that you didn't after people had already responded to you and picked your argument apart. There really should be some type of sanction on here for that. Mods... any help?


You got me there, clueless one!

One recognizes that bedtime is near for you (school night), but I'll gladly debate whatever you wish. Just try to put a coherent sentence together.

As for Mod sanctions, you better hope that one cannot be sanctioned for falling short of basic I.Q. requirements.

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01-28-2007, 11:16 PM
  #97
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post


You got me there, clueless one!

One recognizes that bedtime is near for you (school night), but I'll gladly debate whatever you wish. Just try to put a coherent sentence together.

As for Mod sanctions, you better hope that one cannot be sanctioned for falling short of basic I.Q. requirements.
I am pretty sure you just proved my earlier post correct.

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01-28-2007, 11:16 PM
  #98
Clarence Beeks
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post


You got me there, clueless one!

One recognizes that bedtime is near for you (school night), but I'll gladly debate whatever you wish. Just try to put a coherent sentence together.

As for Mod sanctions, you better hope that one cannot be sanctioned for falling short of basic I.Q. requirements.
LOL. I could take you to task on both accounts. Definitely not a school night and you'd go away with your tail between your legs in an IQ comparison.

By the way... way to duck the criticism of your shameless act. Way to go.

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01-28-2007, 11:30 PM
  #99
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"There are several teams, because of the young talent they have, that are in the category and Pittsburgh certainly is," Lamoriello said. "You can parallel a couple of those clubs to the Quebec era in which they had some great young players and eventually won in Colorado."

I leave this thread with that. They have a chance if they add a couple defesmen at the trade deadline.

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01-29-2007, 12:24 AM
  #100
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Cinderella teams may make it to the Stanley Cup finals, but they never win it all. Players need to learn just how much work, focus and intensity it takes to win in the playoffs and experience is the best teacher.

Look at the kind of playoff experience recent cup winners had:

Edmonton lost in the SCF the year before their dynasty began; Islanders lost in the semi-finals for a number of years before the their run started.

1989: Flames had lost in the 1986 SCF.
1993: Habs had lost in the 1989 SCF.
1994: The Rangers were routinely making the playoffs before 1993 and they made it out of the first round several times.
1995: Devils made lost in the 1994 ECF.
1997: Wings lost in the 1995 SCF and in the 1996 WCF.
1998: Wings again.
1999: Dallas lost in the 1998 WCF.
2000: Devils again.
2001: Avs again.
2002: Wings again.
2003: Devils again.
2006: Canes lost in the 2002 SCF.

A couple of Cup winners had less impressive PO records:

The Nordiques had a poor playoff record in the second half of their existence, but they did made the playoffs in 1995 and added two former Conn Smythe winners to their lineup in 1996.

The Pens and the Lightning had never been to the finals before winning the Cup, but they did make it two the second round a year or two before winning it all.

So recent history would suggest that the Pens need a playoff run or two before they have any real chance of winning the Cup and the smart money is on Ducks, Flames, Sabres etc.

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