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Proposal: Cujo to Vancouver

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Old
12-06-2003, 09:01 AM
  #1
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Proposal: Cujo to Vancouver

The Ottawa Sun reported that Cujo's agent called a member of the ottawa brass to see if the Sens were interested. No dice. But according to the reporter, the Wings are willing to eat the entire $8M salary for next year (taking the gamble that a lockout will eat most or all of the salary).

That's should get rid of most of the grumbling about Cujo's salary.

So how about this:

Cujo to Vancouver for Matt Cooke.
Detroit may even throw in a second tier prospect like Tomas Kopecky.

Those Canucks fans who believe Cloutier resembles a playoff goalie need not reply. Vancouver is only a serious goalie away from being a serious contender. Until then, they remain pretenders.
(Don't believe me? Look at the list of recent Cup winning goalies: Broduer, Hasek, Roy, Brodeur, Belfour, Roy, Osgood, Vernon Brodeur)

Osgood is the only goalie that won't make the hall of fame.
Cloutier clearly does not belong on that list.

IMO, Cujo would excel in Vancouver and be motivated like no goalie we've ever seen.

Wow, would a Detroit-Vancouver series be one hell of a treat.

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Old
12-06-2003, 09:04 AM
  #2
IslesFan17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
The Ottawa Sun reported that Cujo's agent called a member of the ottawa brass to see if the Sens were interested. No dice. But according to the reporter, the Wings are willing to eat the entire $8M salary for next year (taking the gamble that a lockout will eat most or all of the salary).

That's should get rid of most of the grumbling about Cujo's salary.

So how about this:

Cujo to Vancouver for Matt Cooke.
Detroit may even throw in a second tier prospect like Tomas Kopecky.

Those Canucks fans who believe Cloutier resembles a playoff goalie need not reply. Vancouver is only a serious goalie away from being a serious contender. Until then, they remain pretenders.
(Don't believe me? Look at the list of recent Cup winning goalies: Broduer, Hasek, Roy, Brodeur, Belfour, Roy, Osgood, Vernon Brodeur)

Osgood is the only goalie that won't make the hall of fame.
Cloutier clearly does not belong on that list.

IMO, Cujo would excel in Vancouver and be motivated like no goalie we've ever seen.

Wow, would a Detroit-Vancouver series be one hell of a treat.
Cloutier is probably going to start in the all-star game.

And last I checked, Cloutier is at least starting games for an NHL team. Can't say the same for Cujo

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12-06-2003, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslesFan17
Cloutier is probably going to start in the all-star game.

And last I checked, Cloutier is at least starting games for an NHL team. Can't say the same for Cujo
1) cloutier winning a popularity contest or a who can stuff the most ballots contest doesnt have any bearing on his skill

2) i fail to see how cujo is better than cloutier. its not like cujo did much with the games he was given

3) the Canucks problems arent in net. that cliche is almost as bad as the cliche that the Sens need more grit.

DR

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12-06-2003, 09:19 AM
  #4
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The wings are not going to get anything for Joseph yet alone a quality player like Cooke, they will have to give him away and pay part of his contract. Vancouver fans are going to flame you down.

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Old
12-06-2003, 09:30 AM
  #5
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From a Vancouver fan - NO *** WAY.

Matt Cooke is one of the most underrated players, I think, in the NHL, and for what he makes he does a very good job. I wouldn't give a damn thing for Cujo. We have to decent goaltenders, no need to mix them up as they've been playing well, and especially not for a hard worker like Cooke.

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12-06-2003, 09:40 AM
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Yeah.
I'm a wings fan and even I think this is a terrible proposal.
I'm not a cloutier fan at all but Cujo wouldn't help the Canucks become a contender. Why spend 8 million dollars on a goalie who is only going to get you as far as your 2.5 million dollar goalie?

Vancouver would NOT give up cooke for Cujo.
He's cheap, he's young, he's got talent and has been improving year in year out. We'd be lucky to get Fedor Fedorov or some other longshot prospect.

As for Osgood? He's approaching 300 wins, and is has only 158 losses with 5 seasons of 30 wins or more not including the one he'll have this season, 40 shut outs. Last I checked, he's got a second all star team, a jennings and 2 stanley cups under his belt to go along with the 4th highest winning percentage of any goalie who has played more than 500 games. You make it sound like he's a complete scrub when he's arguably been the best goalie in the western conference this season, minus his last game against the wings.
Give him 4 or 5 seasons and you're looking at a goaltender with 400+ wins. Last I checked, they get into the hall.

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Old
12-06-2003, 09:55 AM
  #7
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Vancouver is not going to have the same problem that has hurt Detroit and that is carrying 3 goalies. To demote Hedberg or Cloutier and lose them for nothing (neither make 8 million, so I'm sure someone would jump on that) would be a huge mistake espically for what they gave up for them in the first place. To get Cujo, they have to have another deal getting rid of another goalie in place, and not many teams are willing to trade for a goalie.

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Old
12-06-2003, 09:57 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
The Ottawa Sun reported that Cujo's agent called a member of the ottawa brass to see if the Sens were interested. No dice. But according to the reporter, the Wings are willing to eat the entire $8M salary for next year (taking the gamble that a lockout will eat most or all of the salary).

That's should get rid of most of the grumbling about Cujo's salary.

So how about this:

Cujo to Vancouver for Matt Cooke.
Detroit may even throw in a second tier prospect like Tomas Kopecky.

Those Canucks fans who believe Cloutier resembles a playoff goalie need not reply. Vancouver is only a serious goalie away from being a serious contender. Until then, they remain pretenders.
(Don't believe me? Look at the list of recent Cup winning goalies: Broduer, Hasek, Roy, Brodeur, Belfour, Roy, Osgood, Vernon Brodeur)

Osgood is the only goalie that won't make the hall of fame.
Cloutier clearly does not belong on that list.

IMO, Cujo would excel in Vancouver and be motivated like no goalie we've ever seen.

Wow, would a Detroit-Vancouver series be one hell of a treat.
last time i checked Cloutier has been MUCH better than Joseph thusfar. also last time i checked, Joseph doesn't belong in the list mentioned about either. in fact his win % in the playoffs is .475 on much better teams than the Canucks in past years.

if Joseph was aquired he'd be the #2 to Cloutier who has possibly been our team MVP. we already have a backup capable of being a #1 with playoff success. and even if half of Joseph's remaining salary was paid we're still getting that backup for $3 million a year cheaper.

on top of that, if Joseph's salary for next year is eaten, what about this year? Vancouver just gave Bertuzzi a huge raise. and with upcoming contracts to be dealt with are already over their budget.

so what you are proposing, is Vancouver makes a trade to get put in the same mess Detroit is in (three #1 capable goaltenders), and give up a valuable member of the team making PEANUTS in the process?

this wasn't thought through very well.

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12-06-2003, 10:01 AM
  #9
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na cujo isn't the nucks answer but i wouldn't feel comfortable going into the playoffs with cloutier as my starter if i were a nucks fan. just my opinion of course.

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12-06-2003, 10:20 AM
  #10
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I don't think CuJo today would be a significant improvement over Cloutier. Even if the Wings eat the 8 million next year, I don't think any teams would ante up more than a mid round pick and/or 2nd tier prospect. At this rate, the only way I see CuJo being dealt is if a Cup contending team's #1 goalie goes down with an injury, and they don't feel overly comfortable with their backup.

Although under the current parameters, I would toss the Kings' name out there. Cechmanek has been a bit shaky at times, but I'm not sure CuJo would be an improvement there either.

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Old
12-06-2003, 10:32 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslesFan17
Cloutier is probably going to start in the all-star game.

And last I checked, Cloutier is at least starting games for an NHL team. Can't say the same for Cujo
Right.
Vancouver fans stuffing the ballots for a meaningless all-star game equates to playoff greatness.

Oh well, maybe the bombardment in the all-star game will prime Vancouver fans for the beating he'll take in the playoffs again.

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12-06-2003, 10:36 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DementedReality
1) cloutier winning a popularity contest or a who can stuff the most ballots contest doesnt have any bearing on his skill

2) i fail to see how cujo is better than cloutier. its not like cujo did much with the games he was given

3) the Canucks problems arent in net. that cliche is almost as bad as the cliche that the Sens need more grit.

DR
Cloutier has proven that he's a meltdown waiting to happen. Two playoff years, two meltdowns.
Cujo has had some bad playoff series (he wasn't as bad as people painted him in Detroit and he was injured).
But Cujo has also shown he can be a dominating playoff goalie.
Oh well, perhaps Canucks fans will come around if Cloutier melts down yet again.
Heaven knows there are still Wings fans who think Osgood was a great goalie.

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12-06-2003, 10:40 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canucklehead17
From a Vancouver fan - NO *** WAY.

Matt Cooke is one of the most underrated players, I think, in the NHL, and for what he makes he does a very good job. I wouldn't give a damn thing for Cujo. We have to decent goaltenders, no need to mix them up as they've been playing well, and especially not for a hard worker like Cooke.

~Canucklehead~
Fair enough. Cooke is a very valuable player, which is why the Wings would love to have him.
But, on the other hand, you do have two decent goaltender. *Decent* goaltending isn't enough to win the cup.
Brian Burke needs to get that through his head.
You must have a goalie who can steal games when it is absolutely neccessary, unless your team is worlds better than everyone else.

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12-06-2003, 10:43 AM
  #14
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Cujo to Vancouver.. spare me the details, NO.

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Old
12-06-2003, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PigPen
Yeah.
I'm a wings fan and even I think this is a terrible proposal.
I'm not a cloutier fan at all but Cujo wouldn't help the Canucks become a contender. Why spend 8 million dollars on a goalie who is only going to get you as far as your 2.5 million dollar goalie?

Vancouver would NOT give up cooke for Cujo.
He's cheap, he's young, he's got talent and has been improving year in year out. We'd be lucky to get Fedor Fedorov or some other longshot prospect.

As for Osgood? He's approaching 300 wins, and is has only 158 losses with 5 seasons of 30 wins or more not including the one he'll have this season, 40 shut outs. Last I checked, he's got a second all star team, a jennings and 2 stanley cups under his belt to go along with the 4th highest winning percentage of any goalie who has played more than 500 games. You make it sound like he's a complete scrub when he's arguably been the best goalie in the western conference this season, minus his last game against the wings.
Give him 4 or 5 seasons and you're looking at a goaltender with 400+ wins. Last I checked, they get into the hall.
Come off it. Osgood got 300 wins by being a decent goaltender with the greatest lineup of the 90s.
He has two cup rings, but he was no more integral than kevin Hodson was in one of those victories.

Ozzie is a goalie who is nothing more than a reflection of his team.
On an average team, he looks like an average goalie.
On a great team, he puts up great stats.

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12-06-2003, 10:47 AM
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with hedberg and cloutier, this makes no sense at all for the nucks

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12-06-2003, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
Cloutier has proven that he's a meltdown waiting to happen. Two playoff years, two meltdowns.
Cujo has had some bad playoff series (he wasn't as bad as people painted him in Detroit and he was injured).
But Cujo has also shown he can be a dominating playoff goalie.
Oh well, perhaps Canucks fans will come around if Cloutier melts down yet again.
Heaven knows there are still Wings fans who think Osgood was a great goalie.

Right and Grant Fuhr once proved that he was one of the great playoff goaltenders of all time as did Billy Smith. But, like Cujo, both are past their time. CuJo is a shadow of his former self and he hasn't done anything in the last two years that suggests he could supplant Cloutier.

And, btw, exactly how many cups has Cujo won?

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12-06-2003, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
Right and Grant Fuhr once proved that he was one of the great playoff goaltenders of all time as did Billy Smith. But, like Cujo, both are past their time. CuJo is a shadow of his former self and he hasn't done anything in the last two years that suggests he could supplant Cloutier.

And, btw, exactly how many cups has Cujo won?
cujo is a big baby, has to leave toronto where he was treated quite well because they wouldnt give him the world... he deserves what is happening to him... brian burke is no idiot, i think cloutier might surprise a few people. he is not the reason the canucks couldnt get by minn., the whole team fell apart... say no to cujo

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12-06-2003, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zetterberg40
with hedberg and cloutier, this makes no sense at all for the nucks
Having Hedberg and Cloutier is the last thing that would hold up such a deal.
Vancouver's interest in Cujo, the Wings ability to eat salary, and the return, IMO, are the only things to consider.

If Vancouver was interested, they'd simply to an un-Holland like thing and trade one of their goalies before making the deal.
Wings fans might not realize this having watched Ken Holland for a few years, but NHL GMs are allowed to think ahead and move one of their goalies to avoid creating terrible situations.

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12-06-2003, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
Come off it. Osgood got 300 wins by being a decent goaltender with the greatest lineup of the 90s.
He has two cup rings, but he was no more integral than kevin Hodson was in one of those victories.

Ozzie is a goalie who is nothing more than a reflection of his team.
On an average team, he looks like an average goalie.
On a great team, he puts up great stats.
so why can't cloutier/hedberg win behind a great team like ozzie did?

this is one of the worst ideas i've ever seen on here for a trade, and there have been some doozies

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12-06-2003, 11:07 AM
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If the Wings are willing to eat that much salary, they will get something decent in return. I don't think Vancouver, or anyone in the WC really, will be the trading partner, though. If the Wings are going to go that far to help a deal, they'll send him east or just keep him in the minors and pay the $8 million themselves.

Unless the Wings buy him out (which I consider highly unlikely), Joseph will be sitting around until late in the year when some teams perhaps start coming back to earth and others begin to hit the skids. Aside from the coach, the goalie is the easiest player to blame, and Cujo will start to draw some interest. And if the WIngs are willing to eat so much salary, basically any team will be able to afford him.

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Old
12-06-2003, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
Vancouver's interest in Cujo,
Source?

Nobody is interested in CuJo.

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12-06-2003, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
Having Hedberg and Cloutier is the last thing that would hold up such a deal.
Vancouver's interest in Cujo, the Wings ability to eat salary, and the return, IMO, are the only things to consider.

If Vancouver was interested, they'd simply to an un-Holland like thing and trade one of their goalies before making the deal.
Wings fans might not realize this having watched Ken Holland for a few years, but NHL GMs are allowed to think ahead and move one of their goalies to avoid creating terrible situations.
Regardless if they are interested in cujo, id think that yes that is gonna hold up. Both are great goalies who can play very good when they want to. Cloutier when he wants to can become one of the best goalies in the league. Hedberg with the poor pens played amazing for a good year or two, with a poor defense.... So, lets say they get cujo... That makes cloutier the back-up and hedberg the AHL'er? Thats stupid.. and then what if cujo fails and cloutier "cant handel" the playoffs... wouldnt it make more sense for burke to get a playoff experienced goalie, and thats not cujo thats for sure

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12-06-2003, 11:10 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reg dunlop
cujo is a big baby, has to leave toronto where he was treated quite well because they wouldnt give him the world... he deserves what is happening to him... brian burke is no idiot, i think cloutier might surprise a few people. he is not the reason the canucks couldnt get by minn., the whole team fell apart... say no to cujo

Forget it.

Canucks fans are hopelessly in denial
Again, I'll go through the list

2003 Brodeur
2002 Hasek
2001 Roy
2000 Brodeur
1999 Belfour
1998 Osgood
1997 Vernon
1996 Roy
1995 Brodeur
1994 Richter
1993 Roy
1992 Barasso
1991 Barasso
1990 Ranford
1989 Vernon
1988 Fuhr
1987 Fuhr
1986 Roy
1985 Fuhr
1984 Fuhr
1983 Smith
1982 Smith
1981 Smith
1980 Smith
1979 Dryden
1978 Dryden
1977 Dryden
1976 Dryden
1975 Parent
1974 Parent
1973 Dryden
1972 Cheevers/and the french guy
1971 Dryden?
1970 Cheevers


That's 30 years of hockey history for you.

IMO, Cloutier doesn't belong on that list.

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12-06-2003, 11:12 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsguyone
IMO, Cloutier doesn't belong on that list.
And Cujo does?


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