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Julien, White and Oduya spout off to the press.

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Old
02-03-2007, 12:31 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
Hale got in a late right that seemed to stun Big Ben. Janssen will be there for the next match. And I can't comment about the slewfoot, but the hit on Oduya from behind was cheap.
not as cheap as Lemieux punching the guy whilst sitting on the bench... it was a late hit, they're big boys out there.

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02-03-2007, 01:03 PM
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What's that have to do with the fact that he hasn't been able to do anything in the NHL. It's certainly concerning.
I didn't say it had **** to do with his performance in the NHL. I apologize for appreciating junior hockey.

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02-03-2007, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I really fell in love with this kid during those playoffs. 28 points in 15 games, he took that Ranger team on his back like I've never seen anyone do. He single-handedly won two playoff series and pushed the best team in CHL history (the London Knights of that year) to the brink of insanity because he just wouldn't give up.

I really wish the people who get on his case could've seen him play then. I know it's just juniors, but it was such a special performance. You'd love him as much as CG and me.
Add me to that list. I still expect great, great things from Richie on the NHL level--I can't wait to see that 'C' on his chest.

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02-03-2007, 02:20 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I didn't say it had **** to do with his performance in the NHL. I apologize for appreciating junior hockey.
But you said, "i wish people that get on his case would..." which seems to suggest we should get off his back because of his junior career.

I personally don't care what he did in the OHL. Maybe i would if i had any possible way of watching junior hockey but since i live in Philadelphia i don't. The Flyers are all i got to care about around here so i don't see why i should be concerned with what Mike Richards did 3 years ago.

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02-03-2007, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Add me to that list. I still expect great, great things from Richie on the NHL level--I can't wait to see that 'C' on his chest.
I'd like nothing more than for that to happen, but at this point he's still very far away from that point. He needs to prove something in my mind before we slap some C on his chest

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02-03-2007, 03:01 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by kz View Post
But you said, "i wish people that get on his case would..." which seems to suggest we should get off his back because of his junior career.

I personally don't care what he did in the OHL. Maybe i would if i had any possible way of watching junior hockey but since i live in Philadelphia i don't. The Flyers are all i got to care about around here so i don't see why i should be concerned with what Mike Richards did 3 years ago.
I'm not asking you to care. I was just making a comment. I happen to feel that more people wouldn't be so quick to call him a bust if they knew more of what he was capable of. And as I've already said, junior is just junior. But tell that to these kids when they're out there. It's better and more entertaining hockey than the NHL and these players are fighting for their lives. What he did back then made me a huge fan of his and all I meant to say, which evidently was lost in the ringing in America's ears that Mike Richards is a bust, is that if some people around here got to see him then they'd be a fan of him too.

It's not a big ****ing deal at all. It had NOTHING to do with what he's done in the NHL. Jester posted a video from him in junior, so I made a ****ing comment about how special that time was. Christ.

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02-03-2007, 03:10 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by kz View Post
What's that have to do with the fact that he hasn't been able to do anything in the NHL. It's certainly concerning.
OH NO!!! Mike Richards is struggling in his second year of pro-hockey, and he's already 21!!

(I'm not worried.)

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02-03-2007, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
It's not a big ****ing deal at all. It had NOTHING to do with what he's done in the NHL. Jester posted a video from him in junior, so I made a ****ing comment about how special that time was. Christ.
I wasn't making a big deal out of it either. We were talking about richards and i added my 2 cents. Relax.

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02-03-2007, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Roger's Pancreas View Post
OH NO!!! Mike Richards is struggling in his second year of pro-hockey, and he's already 21!!

(I'm not worried.)
I'm not saying he's a bust but i think what he will end up being in the NHL is a bit different than what many of us originally thought. Offensively, he does so many things that make you shake your head.

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02-03-2007, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
It's better and more entertaining hockey than the NHL and these players are fighting for their lives.
I'm with you 100%. I wish i had the opportunity that many of you do to watch real hockey outside of the flyers (barely real hockey this season anyway)

But keep in mind how frustrating it is as a hockey fan living in Philadelphia hearing people rave on and on about our players in juniors while many of them are sucking it up around here. A lot of us don't have the juniors to fall back on.

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02-03-2007, 03:25 PM
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I'm not saying he's a bust but i think what he will end up being in the NHL is a bit different than what many of us originally thought. Offensively, he does so many things that make you shake your head.
I think the same could be said about Preems....and look at the type of Captain he turned out to be.

I'm not amongst those that think Richie needs to score every night in order for him to be successful. Is two goals/season acceptable? Certainly not. But my favorite professional athletes always posess 'intangibles' that many others do not--that's why I like Richards so much. I'd rather have a team of players like him, players that play with their hearts on their sleeves each and every night, than some of the sorry saps we have this year.

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02-03-2007, 03:31 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by kz View Post
I'm with you 100%. I wish i had the opportunity that many of you do to watch real hockey outside of the flyers (barely real hockey this season anyway)

But keep in mind how frustrating it is as a hockey fan living in Philadelphia hearing people rave on and on about our players in juniors while many of them are sucking it up around here. A lot of us don't have the juniors to fall back on.
I'm of the opinion that what a player does before the NHL is important. A lot of people around here seem to disagree with that or don't care because they're too impatient. Players take time to develop into their NHL projections but what a player does before the NHL matters because not only is it an insight into the kind of player he is, he wouldn't even be in the NHL if those leagues didn't matter.

I'm not saying you're the main culprit of this thought either, I sometimes see a post and it sets me off on a broader issue.

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02-03-2007, 03:31 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
I think the same could be said about Preems....and look at the type of Captain he turned out to be.

I'm not amongst those that think Richie needs to score every night in order for him to be successful. Is two goals/season acceptable? Certainly not. But my favorite professional athletes always posess 'intangibles' that many others do not--that's why I like Richards so much. I'd rather have a team of players like him, players that play with their hearts on their sleeves each and every night, than some of the sorry saps we have this year.
Richards doesn't have the size to be the player that Primeau was... he probably won't be nearly as effective defensively as Primeau was due to this.

Primeau was also a decent offensive forward in this league when asked to be one...

and that's all fine and good, but unless there is production to go along with that then that team goes out and loses proud every night, which no one wants. it's not about scoring every night, but the organizational expectation for Richards is a guy that is going to bring all those intangibles and also be a 50+ point player... that's his expectation level, he's falling far short of expectation as an offensive player, which is a problem.

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02-03-2007, 03:34 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I'm of the opinion that what a player does before the NHL is important. A lot of people around here seem to disagree with that or don't care because they're too impatient. Players take time to develop into their NHL projections but what a player does before the NHL matters because not only is it an insight into the kind of player he is, he wouldn't even be in the NHL if those leagues didn't matter.

I'm not saying you're the main culprit of this thought either, I sometimes see a post and it sets me off on a broader issue.
obviously what a player was doing before matters to an extent... we don't live in a vacuum. however, once you're a professional results in the present matter. you can have patience, which i think everyone does with Richards... but evaluation is immediate and progress is expected.

you can have the nicest resume in the world, but if you show up for your job and blow, you're going to get fired... same in all jobs.

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02-03-2007, 03:37 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I'm of the opinion that what a player does before the NHL is important. A lot of people around here seem to disagree with that or don't care because they're too impatient. Players take time to develop into their NHL projections but what a player does before the NHL matters because not only is it an insight into the kind of player he is, he wouldn't even be in the NHL if those leagues didn't matter.

I'm not saying you're the main culprit of this thought either, I sometimes see a post and it sets me off on a broader issue.
I hear you. I'd bet most of those people of that opinion are Americans. You can't blame us really... we get next to ZERO exposure to other hockey. The only way i can possibly keep interest in juniors is by coming onto this board or watching an occasional web cast (which sucks immensely)

For that reason, once a player is here, that's all i care about. What he does here is what matters cause that's all we've got.

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02-03-2007, 03:39 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Richards doesn't have the size to be the player that Primeau was... he probably won't be nearly as effective defensively as Primeau was due to this.

Primeau was also a decent offensive forward in this league when asked to be one...

and that's all fine and good, but unless there is production to go along with that then that team goes out and loses proud every night, which no one wants. it's not about scoring every night, but the organizational expectation for Richards is a guy that is going to bring all those intangibles and also be a 50+ point player... that's his expectation level, he's falling far short of expectation as an offensive player, which is a problem.
Can you explain how captains like Derian Hatcher, Michael Peca and Jason Smith were effective then?

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02-03-2007, 03:39 PM
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obviously what a player was doing before matters to an extent... we don't live in a vacuum. however, once you're a professional results in the present matter. you can have patience, which i think everyone does with Richards... but evaluation is immediate and progress is expected.

you can have the nicest resume in the world, but if you show up for your job and blow, you're going to get fired... same in all jobs.
He doesn't blow at his job. He's taking time to find a consistent offensive game. He performs well in every other area. He's showing improvements every game, I think he'll continue to get stronger this year and we'll see closer to the player we want next year.

Comparing professional hockey to a real job is great when you're talking about contracts, but it is slightly different when it comes to their play. Should Pitkanen be fired because he hasn't played the same way as last year? Should the whole team be fired because they've underperformed? You have to give young guys a chance to learn and grow into their roles. If I work at McDonalds, I'm not given 2 years to learn how to make fries. Not so when it comes to hockey. If you don't have patience for a 21 year old defensive centreman to find offensive consistency at the highest level, well, I'm starting to see why Flyers fans get the reputations they do.

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02-03-2007, 03:41 PM
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I hear you. I'd bet most of those people of that opinion are Americans. You can't blame us really... we get next to ZERO exposure to other hockey. The only way i can possibly keep interest in juniors is by coming onto this board or watching an occasional web cast (which sucks immensely)

For that reason, once a player is here, that's all i care about. What he does here is what matters cause that's all we've got.
I completely understand. All I'd ask for is a little belief in what us fans who have seen him before, and what every scout, GM, announcer, analyst, etc. see in him or other young players for that matter. If a tree falls in the forest, it still falls even if you didn't see it.

I'm already dreading this same argument when Downie gets to your city next year. He's not going to set the world on fire offensively and people are going to **** bricks sideways.

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02-03-2007, 03:42 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
He doesn't blow at his job. He's taking time to find a consistent offensive game. He performs well in every other area. He's showing improvements every game, I think he'll continue to get stronger this year and we'll see closer to the player we want next year.

Comparing professional hockey to a real job is great when you're talking about contracts, but it is slightly different when it comes to their play. Should Pitkanen be fired because he hasn't played the same way as last year? Should the whole team be fired because they've underperformed? You have to give young guys a chance to learn and grow into their roles. If I work at McDonalds, I'm not given 2 years to learn how to make fries. Not so when it comes to hockey. If you don't have patience for a 21 year old defensive centreman to find offensive consistency at the highest level, well, I'm starting to see why Flyers fans get the reputations they do.
i was using hyperbole... i don't think he "blows" at his job... he's just been underwhelming thus far.

professional hockey is a job... it's a real job. should players be fired because they're ceasing to meet their capabilities/expectations? no. should they be observed and judged? yes. Pitkanen obviously has his critics...

just because the method of judgment and time-period expectations are different, doesn't mean that the judgment scale is a completely different one... it's the same deal. a job, is a job, is a job.

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02-03-2007, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I completely understand. All I'd ask for is a little belief in what us fans who have seen him before, and what every scout, GM, announcer, analyst, etc. see in him or other young players for that matter. If a tree falls in the forest, it still falls even if you didn't see it.

I'm already dreading this same argument when Downie gets to your city next year. He's not going to set the world on fire offensively and people are going to **** bricks sideways.
i'm not sure anyone is expecting from Downie what is expected from Richards... high expectations are a problem for prospects. it certainly doesn't help that Carter has struggled to boot.

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02-03-2007, 03:44 PM
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i was using hyperbole... i don't think he "blows" at his job... he's just been underwhelming thus far.

professional hockey is a job... it's a real job. should players be fired because they're ceasing to meet their capabilities/expectations? no. should they be observed and judged? yes. Pitkanen obviously has his critics...

just because the method of judgment and time-period expectations are different, doesn't mean that the judgment scale is a completely different one... it's the same deal. a job, is a job, is a job.
Yes, he should be judged but over a larger period of time. I have no excuses for his play, all I know is that this isn't the end of his development and while the attitude "what have you done for me lately" is all well and good, a little patience never hurt anybody.

There's also the fact that everyone is already pretty negative about this season and that every bad move is exagerrated but every good one goes unnoticed.

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02-03-2007, 03:46 PM
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i'm not sure anyone is expecting from Downie what is expected from Richards... high expectations are a problem for prospects. it certainly doesn't help that Carter has struggled to boot.
I think Richie was hyped coming out of the lockout because there was nothing to talk about and fans are expecting too much of him because of it.

Downie is not being hyped because there's no reason to talk about prospects endlessly when there's real-world drama going on all the time in Flyer-land.

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02-03-2007, 03:47 PM
  #73
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Can you explain how captains like Derian Hatcher, Michael Peca and Jason Smith were effective then?
i was discussing the defensive play that Primeau brought to the table... as a captain Richards can be every bit as good as anyone else. while size isn't what it once was, Richards will have some problems against forwards who are good at establishing body position down low and physically beating you in areas of the ice... Primeau was big enough to deal down there (a big reason why we got past Sundin and the Leafs).

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02-03-2007, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I think Richie was hyped coming out of the lockout because there was nothing to talk about and fans are expecting too much of him because of it.

Downie is not being hyped because there's no reason to talk about prospects endlessly when there's real-world drama going on all the time in Flyer-land.
the lack of hockey certainly helped the Richards hype... but he was going out and earning it as well. when he came in and was such a force in the AHL playoffs, that pretty much cemented it.

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02-03-2007, 03:49 PM
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There's also the fact that everyone is already pretty negative about this season and that every bad move is exagerrated but every good one goes unnoticed.
it's called negadelphia.

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