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Old
02-03-2007, 03:50 PM
  #76
Dig Out Your Soul
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the lack of hockey certainly helped the Richards hype... but he was going out and earning it as well. when he came in and was such a force in the AHL playoffs, that pretty much cemented it.
And that's the kind of player I still expect him to be. Again, a little patience, the right situation, he'll get there.

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02-03-2007, 03:52 PM
  #77
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it's called negadelphia.
I'm finally starting to see that.

I'm definitely one of the biggest culprits in my pessimism about the day-to-day, but over the long haul I'm still willing to bet our young players turn out the way we want them to, especially the ones that have never encountered a losing season in their career (like Richards).

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02-03-2007, 03:53 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
And that's the kind of player I still expect him to be. Again, a little patience, the right situation, he'll get there.
i'm fine with him except for the offense... what really concerns me is the fact that he was doing fine and then it fell off the cliff for so long. i personally don't like some of his tendencies with the puck at this point, he tends to take it way too low and not be in good scoring positions on the ice. he has a good shot he should be willing to shoot when he's a bit further out and has an angle still...

just looks like he's lost a lot of confidence with the puck in the offensive zone... you don't see the kid who took the pass and shielded the puck for a blast in his first NHL game against the Rangers anymore.

THAT is what concerns me so much... it seems like he's regressed offensively from where he started.

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02-03-2007, 03:53 PM
  #79
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i was discussing the defensive play that Primeau brought to the table... as a captain Richards can be every bit as good as anyone else. while size isn't what it once was, Richards will have some problems against forwards who are good at establishing body position down low and physically beating you in areas of the ice... Primeau was big enough to deal down there (a big reason why we got past Sundin and the Leafs).
Sorry, I misunderstood your post, then. I was under the impression that you were saying an individual is incapable of being a captain unless they have decent offensive output.

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02-03-2007, 03:55 PM
  #80
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Sorry, I misunderstood your post, then. I was under the impression that you were saying an individual is incapable of being a captain unless they have decent offensive output.
i think Richards is capable of being an excellent captain... my concerns with him are purely based in the fact that he needs to be good enough to earn that level of trust in his play from the organization.

he's nowhere near that yet.

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02-03-2007, 04:05 PM
  #81
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i'm fine with him except for the offense... what really concerns me is the fact that he was doing fine and then it fell off the cliff for so long. i personally don't like some of his tendencies with the puck at this point, he tends to take it way too low and not be in good scoring positions on the ice. he has a good shot he should be willing to shoot when he's a bit further out and has an angle still...

just looks like he's lost a lot of confidence with the puck in the offensive zone... you don't see the kid who took the pass and shielded the puck for a blast in his first NHL game against the Rangers anymore.

THAT is what concerns me so much... it seems like he's regressed offensively from where he started.
I would absolutely agree. It has a lot to do with confidence. He trailed off last year but was admittedly worn out by March (being one of the only players to play all season more or less and not being entirely ready for the grind of the NHL). This year we know how much the team **** the bed early on and then it got to that point where he was squeezing the stick a little too tight. That first goal was nice but then he got hurt. I'm hoping his goal the other day will get him going.

You're right, he has a good slapshot (which is surprisingly rare because slapshots actually suck if you're a forward) and should use it more. When he finds his offensive game and gets the trust to take some PP time, I'd like to see him above the off-wing face-off dot looking for one-timers. It's what he did in juniors and he was lethal from there.

Speaking of that, the one thing I don't like about or powerplay is how Forsberg passes from his off-wing and since almost everyone on the team is a left-handed shot, there's almost no opportunity for one-timers. The few times Knuble gets open, more often than not he doesn't have the hands to convert.

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02-03-2007, 04:34 PM
  #82
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Richards doesn't have the size to be the player that Primeau was... he probably won't be nearly as effective defensively as Primeau was due to this.

Primeau was also a decent offensive forward in this league when asked to be one...

and that's all fine and good, but unless there is production to go along with that then that team goes out and loses proud every night, which no one wants. it's not about scoring every night, but the organizational expectation for Richards is a guy that is going to bring all those intangibles and also be a 50+ point player... that's his expectation level, he's falling far short of expectation as an offensive player, which is a problem.
The same can be said about Gagne...projected to be a 50 goal scorer/PPG player. He too has fallen well short of that margin this year. How come you are so willing to judge Richards, but not Gagne? They both play on the same crappy team--the only difference is that Gagne gets to play with a future HOF on his line on many nights. If we cannot judge Gagne based on this crappy season, than we sure as he11 shouldn't be judging Richie either.

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02-03-2007, 04:36 PM
  #83
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i'm fine with him except for the offense... what really concerns me is the fact that he was doing fine and then it fell off the cliff for so long. i personally don't like some of his tendencies with the puck at this point, he tends to take it way too low and not be in good scoring positions on the ice. he has a good shot he should be willing to shoot when he's a bit further out and has an angle still...

just looks like he's lost a lot of confidence with the puck in the offensive zone... you don't see the kid who took the pass and shielded the puck for a blast in his first NHL game against the Rangers anymore.

THAT is what concerns me so much... it seems like he's regressed offensively from where he started.
Agreed, but you also have to admit that he is clearly snake-bitten. I think he thinks that bringing it down low will help his cause...clearly it has not and he has to try something 'new' at this stage of the game.

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02-03-2007, 04:39 PM
  #84
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The same can be said about Gagne...projected to be a 50 goal scorer/PPG player. He too has fallen well short of that margin this year. How come you are so willing to judge Richards, but not Gagne? They both play on the same crappy team--the only difference is that Gagne gets to play with a future HOF on his line on many nights. If we cannot judge Gagne based on this crappy season, than we sure as he11 shouldn't be judging Richie either.
he's on pace for almost 40 goals playing with a hobbled Forsberg for most of the season and no back up that was even remotely decent at playing with him outside of Robitaille... who they traded away... that's not a crappy season. team having a crappy year... offensively, Knuble and Gagne are the only players on this team above criticism. that future HOF hasn't been on his line on a regular basis and for most of the season Forsberg hasn't even remotely resembled a HOF player.

a healthy Forsberg and Gagne is putting up 50 goals this year... Gagne is going to have a tough time being a ppg player given the fact that he isn't a playmaker... anyone who is "expecting" that from him is mistaken.

you're just not objective about players on this team.

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02-03-2007, 04:43 PM
  #85
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Agreed, but you also have to admit that he is clearly snake-bitten. I think he thinks that bringing it down low will help his cause...clearly it has not and he has to try something 'new' at this stage of the game.
doesn't matter if he's snake-bitten or just sux offensively (which he doesn't), he's not putting the puck in the net or taking the puck to good offensive areas on the ice enough (which would lead me to conjecture that he's not snake bitten, he just has bad tendencies...). he doesn't need to try something 'new,' he needs to get back to where he was when he first came into the league...

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02-03-2007, 05:15 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
I'm finally starting to see that.

I'm definitely one of the biggest culprits in my pessimism about the day-to-day, but over the long haul I'm still willing to bet our young players turn out the way we want them to, especially the ones that have never encountered a losing season in their career (like Richards).
I don't think negadelphia is a fair title. The place is as rough as it gets for athletes and organizations, but all we want around here is something to cheer about. We probably care a little too much, but when you haven't had a championship in 20 years and 30 for hockey its understandable.

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02-03-2007, 05:20 PM
  #87
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I don't think negadelphia is a fair title. The place is as rough as it gets for athletes and organizations, but all we want around here is something to cheer about. We probably care a little too much, but when you haven't had a championship in 20 years and 30 for hockey its understandable.
i don't know dude... the tide turns so quick in Philly (and other NE cities) it's amazing. we're sitting around here -- for the most part -- having a rational discussion of Richards' struggles. that discussion ain't so rational in other parts of the region... especially with the Flyers who have been a win now organization for almost the entirety of the organizations history.

flyers have it both better and worse in some respects... given that we are, by and large, more faithful than the other fans in the city... that's a double-edged sword, however. if this team isn't showing significant signs of improvement when i'm back in philly next year, i'm going to be pissed.

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02-03-2007, 08:11 PM
  #88
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he's on pace for almost 40 goals playing with a hobbled Forsberg for most of the season and no back up that was even remotely decent at playing with him outside of Robitaille... who they traded away... that's not a crappy season. team having a crappy year... offensively, Knuble and Gagne are the only players on this team above criticism. that future HOF hasn't been on his line on a regular basis and for most of the season Forsberg hasn't even remotely resembled a HOF player.

a healthy Forsberg and Gagne is putting up 50 goals this year... Gagne is going to have a tough time being a ppg player given the fact that he isn't a playmaker... anyone who is "expecting" that from him is mistaken.
you're just not objective about players on this team.
Those were the EXACT words you fed me this summer when I was annoyed at his contract talks. You said he'd be "a PPG player." Clearly, you were and are mistaken.

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02-03-2007, 08:17 PM
  #89
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Those were the EXACT words you fed me this summer when I was annoyed at his contract talks. You said he'd be "a PPG player." Clearly, you were and are mistaken.
i would imagine my words were close to, but fair enough.

if he was, he'd be Brad Richards and making 7.5M a year... he's making 5.25. you really want to complain about that contract?

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02-03-2007, 08:35 PM
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i would imagine my words were close to, but fair enough.

if he was, he'd be Brad Richards and making 7.5M a year... he's making 5.25. you really want to complain about that contract?
Thank you, I was just looking for it exactly, and couldn't find it, so thanks for saving the rest of my evening.

I was not/am not a big fan of Gagne's contract--I think that's been well established. However, just about everyone on this team stinks this year. All I'm saying is if you're going to give Simon a pass for playing with crap, then you should do the same for Richards. IMO-the only free passes go to Knuble (who has cooled off mightily) and Sanderson.

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02-03-2007, 08:40 PM
  #91
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Thank you, I was just looking for it exactly, and couldn't find it, so thanks for saving the rest of my evening.

I was not/am not a big fan of Gagne's contract--I think that's been well established. However, just about everyone on this team stinks this year. All I'm saying is if you're going to give Simon a pass for playing with crap, then you should do the same for Richards. IMO-the only free passes go to Knuble (who has cooled off mightily) and Sanderson.
problem is that Richards IS THE CRAP... his play is a BIG reason why this team is struggling like it is. Richards, Umberger, Calder, and Carter were supposed to provide a lot for this club... and they simply haven't through 52 games.

Gagne, Knuble, and, yes, Sanderson are the only players that have played to their contracts this year.

Carter is starting to.

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02-03-2007, 08:52 PM
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Carter still needs about 30 lbs on his body IMO. And don't call Mikey 'crap' that's just mean.

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02-03-2007, 08:55 PM
  #93
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Carter still needs about 30 lbs on his body IMO. And don't call Mikey 'crap' that's just mean.
he's not going to add 30lbs... that's a HUGE amount of muscle... he'd need to get on roids to add that over a short period of time. 10lbs would be nice, but he's probably going to be that lanky/wirey body for a while... late 20s he might start to develop a bit more of an overall solid figure, but 30 is a lot of weight.

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02-04-2007, 12:16 AM
  #94
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he's not going to add 30lbs... that's a HUGE amount of muscle... he'd need to get on roids to add that over a short period of time. 10lbs would be nice, but he's probably going to be that lanky/wirey body for a while... late 20s he might start to develop a bit more of an overall solid figure, but 30 is a lot of weight.
Yeah well, he needs a lot of weight. Did you see that play tonight in the first? I swear, my 8-year old daughter could've withstood that hit better than he did. That boy needs some serious protein shakes.

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