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Old
02-11-2007, 01:24 AM
  #51
Cerebral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
It isn't so much weak as there isn't a Crosby or Ovechkin. But the projected top 5-8 all have all-star potential, maybe not elite level(save Turris and Alzner imho), but all-star.

And there are good players to be found throughout the top 60. I wouldn't even be opposed to picking up some more 1st and 2nds in trades. This is a good year to have lots of high picks. It's just not a good year to have the top pick.

And I would like a top 5 pick at some point. Top 5 picks are always useful, no matter the year. And we haven't had one in soooo long.
I'm definitely not as high on the top-end of the draft as you are. Heck, I've seen Alzner play a ton out here in Calgary and I'm not even sold he'll develop into a top pairing defenceman. I haven't personally seen Turris play but I've read nothing but good things - of all the players in the draft, he's the one who intrigues me the most.

There are certainly good players to be found throughout the top 60 (especially if we're talking about defencemen in the WHL - there are about 6 or 7 guys I love amongst that pool of players) but it's simply not the kind of year where we should be hoping the Oilers sell the ship and drop down the standings. This is the kind of draft where a whole bunch of picks made from 20-30 could very well be better than those made from 10-20.

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Old
02-11-2007, 01:25 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Cerebral View Post
I'm definitely not as high on the top-end of the draft as you are. Heck, I've seen Alzner play a ton out here in Calgary and I'm not even sold he'll develop into a top pairing defenceman. I haven't personally seen Turris play but I've read nothing but good things - of all the players in the draft, he's the one who intrigues me the most.

There are certainly good players to be found throughout the top 60 (especially if we're talking about defencemen in the WHL - there are about 6 or 7 guys I love amongst that pool of players) but it's simply not the kind of year where we should be hoping the Oilers sell the ship and drop down the standings. This is the kind of draft where a whole bunch of picks made from 20-30 could very well be better than those made from 10-20.
Which means there will be a lot of trades on draft day as teams lists will be all over the map.

Makes it more exciting.

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Old
02-11-2007, 02:37 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by graveyardshift View Post
But Stuart makes the Flames that much better and gives them something without giving up very much

This makes the flames a better team

realistically--the oilers are now chasing the Nucks and Wild and it looks to be 8 points down from both

If Lowe waits to the deadline to do a deal

I would rather see Pisani, Horcroff, Smyth or Smith go then any of the kids
Who cares how much better the shames got if we're chasing vancouver and minny. I dont think anyone ever thought the oilers were chasing the shames, nor did anyone think we were going to catch up to them.


The only positive i can bring out of this is: With the shames being better, they will more than likely take away lots of points from both minny and vancouver allowing us to catch them. They have 4 games left against minny...2 at the end of march, a few days before we play our last 2 against minny. Then they see us twice, and the nucks once. But those 4 games against minny will help us (hopefully).

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Old
02-11-2007, 06:23 AM
  #54
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Bottom line?

We're ****ed.

Brewer ain't comin here.

Stuart is in Cowtown now. In a word, they're deep.

Pitkanen is NOT coming here, unless we're selling the farm, which would be stupid because we don't have any sure-thing prospects anyways, let alone a minor league affiliate of our own to accomodate and develope them.

And actually, theres no way the Flyers are looking to deal him anyways. Look at their d-core, work the rest out in your own, logical head.

Everything else out there, ALL the rest now is garbage.

If Lowe wanted to help this team out at all, he should of made a move at LEAST one month ago, for ANYTHING, just to prove that he has faith and wants to make some sort of an impact.

Yes, patience is a virtue but this year he bought into his own foolish intuition, it's too late now. Stuart would have been a GREAT start.

Stupid, just stupid, this makes me more angry.

But I guess I shouldn't get worked up, because we don't deserve to be/won't be making the playoffs in the first place anyways?!?!?!

*********.

I've lost count of how many times I've thrown up in my mouth this season, from watching, waiting and wondering about this team.


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Old
02-11-2007, 06:49 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by philthy mcnasty View Post
Bottom line?

We're ****ed.

Brewer ain't comin here.

Stuart is in Cowtown now. In a word, they're deep.

Pitkanen is NOT coming here, unless we're selling the farm, which would be stupid because we don't have any sure-thing prospects anyways, let alone a minor league affiliate of our own to accomodate and develope them.

And actually, theres no way the Flyers are looking to deal him anyways. Look at their d-core, work the rest out in your own, logical head.

Everything else out there, ALL the rest now is garbage.

If Lowe wanted to help this team out at all, he should of made a move at LEAST one month ago, for ANYTHING, just to prove that he has faith and wants to make some sort of an impact.

Yes, patience is a virtue but this year he bought into his own foolish intuition, it's too late now. Stuart would have been a GREAT start.

Stupid, just stupid, this makes me more angry.

But I guess I shouldn't get worked up, because we don't deserve to be/won't be making the playoffs in the first place anyways?!?!?!

*********.

I've lost count of how many times I've thrown up in my mouth this season, from watching, waiting and wondering about this team.


How do you know Lowe wasn't trying to work on a deal to bring Stuart here? How do you know Brewer isn't coming here? How do you know it will take the farm team to bring Pitkanen?

Nobody but the GM's of the sport know the answer to all these questions and more.

Please tune in Feb 27th after the trade deadline. Thank you, and have a good day!




P.S...that last little bit was just an attempt to lighten the mood.

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Old
02-11-2007, 07:00 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Rin View Post
How do you know Lowe wasn't trying to work on a deal to bring Stuart here? How do you know Brewer isn't coming here? How do you know it will take the farm team to bring Pitkanen?

Nobody but the GM's of the sport know the answer to all these questions and more.

Please tune in Feb 27th after the trade deadline. Thank you, and have a good day!




P.S...that last little bit was just an attempt to lighten the mood.

How do I know?

Look at what Beantown got in return. Yes it isn't a lopsided trade by any means but if Lowe was truly desperate and wanted to make any sort of a run at the guy, we could have EASILY matched this kind of an offer to Boston.

Ask yourself, who should be the more desperate team, Edmonton or Calgary? If Lowe wanted this guy, and thought we needed him (which we did, and do), he would have brought him in 3-4 weeks ago.


At the same time I can't blame Lowe because he did have his mind set 110% (apparently) before the season even started that we would at the very least be in a playoff position by this time of year, no questions asked.

This team is completely ****ed up.

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:30 AM
  #57
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Why does a team have to either sell, or buy? What is wrong with the status quo? The Oilers aren't THAT bad, so selling makes them that much worse for next year. Keep what you have, don't try to sell the farm to add one or two impact players, and work in the off-season.

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:32 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philthy mcnasty View Post
How do I know?

Look at what Beantown got in return. Yes it isn't a lopsided trade by any means but if Lowe was truly desperate and wanted to make any sort of a run at the guy, we could have EASILY matched this kind of an offer to Boston.[/b]

Maybe Boston WANTED Kobasew and Ference, which why they pulled the trigger.

[Ask yourself, who should be the more desperate team, Edmonton or Calgary? If Lowe wanted this guy, and thought we needed him (which we did, and do), he would have brought him in 3-4 weeks ago

Ask yourself, who is the team in the better position to make this trade, with Stuart the Flames are among the contenders, if they werent already there. With the Stuart the Oilers are stilling 10, maybe 9th at the end of the year.


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Old
02-11-2007, 08:34 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by metallicat View Post
Why does a team have to either sell, or buy? What is wrong with the status quo? The Oilers aren't THAT bad, so selling makes them that much worse for next year. Keep what you have, don't try to sell the farm to add one or two impact players, and work in the off-season.
Exactly,

although some people are set on getting a 6th round pick for any UFA, or anyone over 27

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Old
02-11-2007, 09:34 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metallicat View Post
Why does a team have to either sell, or buy? What is wrong with the status quo? The Oilers aren't THAT bad, so selling makes them that much worse for next year. Keep what you have, don't try to sell the farm to add one or two impact players, and work in the off-season.
Because then we are in the same situation as every other year we don't make the playoffs. Fight is out for the 14th spot and get neither the playoffs of a good draft pick. I am sick of mediocrity.

Sell, take the proceeds and the high pick and regroup next season. The status quo is the last thing I want.

And no one is talking about blowing the team up. Just moving some UFAs and others for some good kids to add to the team for next yer.

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Old
02-11-2007, 11:09 AM
  #61
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The non-moves by Lowe were telegraphed during the Summer of 06:

- When it was Pronger for Lupul, Smid, and picks
- When it was Tjarnquist not Tarnstrom or Spacek
- When it was Hejda, not some other NHLer with >=240 GP on his resume

Then they gave Smid 41 games in the first 41 GP when Hejda would have been a decent alternate.

Lowe went into a game of blackjack with a 7 showing, the dealer had a face card. He turns up a 6 (Moreau, Tjarnquist, and Staios injuries) and is now at 13. The tight standings and the 1 year wiser GM's are like realizing that all the 8's have gone by.

We didn't have a winning hand (team) at the start, and there is no guarantee, even with landing the best player down ths stretch, that we would make it.

It was never in the cards for this year. Lowe knew it. Smart fans know it too. Relax.

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Old
02-11-2007, 11:29 AM
  #62
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With Stuart's agent saying he is going to test free agency I think with our current standing it would have been to much to pay for him short term with possibly still missing playoffs. It's not the 27th yet and I hope Lowe is looking for a non-rental D-man. Really changes dynamics of Flames team and who knows might even tank for a few games until they get chemistry again. I am also sure I heard Sutter quoted this week that he didn't like trading for rental types, must really think he has cup contender this year. I don't but I am a little biased.

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Old
02-11-2007, 12:39 PM
  #63
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Wow, severe overreaction guys. Stuart has struggled and by all accounts, will test the FA market. Is it because it's Calgary that we're getting upset by this? Come on. There are other options, but it's contingent on how we do in the next several games. Who knows, Lowe may just end up trading Smyth if Smyth feels he would like to go to a cup contender *now*. Maybe Lowe will pull a miracle and con Pitkanen out of Philly? I dunno, but the reactions of some are way overboard considering it is just Stuart.

Let's see how we do in the next couple of games, and then either way we'll have a much better idea if we're going to start trading the likes of Smith, Roloson, Sykora, and maybe even Ryan Smyth. I doubt Lowe will dismantle the team like that to re-enter a rebuilding phase; the city and the owners have likely had enough of that. I'm expecting small pickups, rentals that will help us (hopefully) squeak into the playoffs. One thing I do see, is if Lowe can get a really good young D-man back in return for say, Lupul, he'd do it.

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Old
02-11-2007, 12:42 PM
  #64
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hi everyone

Quote:
Originally Posted by philthy mcnasty View Post
Bottom line?

We're ****ed.

Brewer ain't comin here.

Stuart is in Cowtown now. In a word, they're deep.

Pitkanen is NOT coming here, unless we're selling the farm, which would be stupid because we don't have any sure-thing prospects anyways, let alone a minor league affiliate of our own to accomodate and develope them.

And actually, theres no way the Flyers are looking to deal him anyways. Look at their d-core, work the rest out in your own, logical head.

Everything else out there, ALL the rest now is garbage.

If Lowe wanted to help this team out at all, he should of made a move at LEAST one month ago, for ANYTHING, just to prove that he has faith and wants to make some sort of an impact.

Yes, patience is a virtue but this year he bought into his own foolish intuition, it's too late now. Stuart would have been a GREAT start.

Stupid, just stupid, this makes me more angry.

But I guess I shouldn't get worked up, because we don't deserve to be/won't be making the playoffs in the first place anyways?!?!?!

*********.

I've lost count of how many times I've thrown up in my mouth this season, from watching, waiting and wondering about this team.
I gotta agree, besides the Cinderella cup run, we have been battling for a 8th place Play off spot for ever now. Is Low capable for putting together a team that can have us comfortablely in the playoffs? I too am very tired of the same old same old. We have
a level playing field now, and besides the run ( there's one every year ), nothing has changed.
I am losing faith that the Oilers even want to be a contender, instead of a fluke.

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Old
02-11-2007, 05:36 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Declassified View Post
breathe

relax

it's out of our hands

if something happens it happens, if it doesnt, it doesnt. it's as simple that
such a useless post. what is the point of this statement? it adds nothing to the discussion, obviously its out of our hands, but the whole point of coming on a message board is to speculate about this.

gerald78

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Old
02-11-2007, 05:39 PM
  #66
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such a useless post. what is the point of this statement? it adds nothing to the discussion, obviously its out of our hands, but the whole point of coming on a message board is to speculate about this.

gerald78
you are taking it out of context, dude was going all ******* and losing his mud last night.

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Old
02-11-2007, 05:52 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by graveyardshift View Post
With the fracking Flames getting Stuart, it is obvious the oilers can not wait till the dead line to do something

Oilers can no longer wait for the deadline
Why does the Flames getting a dman neccesitate the Oilers now doing something. I dont understand why the Flames making a trade makes it obvious that the Oiler cannot wait?

The Oilers were at the "no longer wait" point before christmas. By my count, it was when we lost 7-6 at home to Denver. That was my "we can no longer wait" point. Losing 6-2 to LA at home right after that was the "ok, really, we can no longer wait" point. Losing 6-2 to Van at home after that was the "ok, for real now, we can no longer wait" point.

Last I checked, we are still waiting over a month after that. **** what the Flames do. They are just one of many teams we are competing with.

This team was supposed to hold on so Lowe doesnt have to deal from a position of weakness. Lowe didnt address the need, the team didnt put him in a position to be able to address the need. Now it's most likely too late, unless this team (once again) makes the late run.

I'm sure we will all stay tuned...

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Old
02-11-2007, 06:03 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
Chicken Little.

Stuart wasn't the answer for the Oilers. He helps the Flamers, but they are still catchable. In the end I still think Lowe needs to be a seller simply because this team needs too much help to make a serious run. Adding one Dman, regardless of who it is, likely isnt going to save this team. Even if we win 6 of 8 before the deadline, I think Lowe will proceed cautiously and make minor deals to add depth, but nothing big.
I agree... any deal that Lowe makes this year, even if it marginally improves us this year was done with next year and 2009 in mind.

If he can get a #1D who will be in his prime at the same time as Hemsky, he will. But other than that, it will be UFA additions to make a modest push for some more playoff experience (sacrificing fringe prospects), or he'll actually be a seller.

I could easily see us sell/rent Smyth and Smith, while still buying a guy like Pitkanen.

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Old
02-11-2007, 06:12 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by I must be Bored View Post
I gotta agree, besides the Cinderella cup run, we have been battling for a 8th place Play off spot for ever now. Is Low capable for putting together a team that can have us comfortablely in the playoffs? I too am very tired of the same old same old. We have
a level playing field now, and besides the run ( there's one every year ), nothing has changed.
I am losing faith that the Oilers even want to be a contender, instead of a fluke.
You have one and a half data points to make your conclusions... in season-one post level playing field we came in with a team full of problems. We addressed the issues and rolled through to game seven of the stanley cup. In season-two, we have another glaring weakness (which Lowe had no control over) it changed the gameplan.... Lowe now needed to focus his team around a long-term contract to our (new) best player, Ales Hemsky. Focussing the build around Hemsky means seeing how close you are and making sound judgements on *when to spend*. Obviously Lowe hasn't seen the long-term value in the deals that have crossed his desk *yet*.

Why would you ever assume that means he is incapable of following his own plan for this team?

Would you go all in on a pair of queens when there are two tens and an ace on the board?

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