HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

When did Tom Renney turn into a genius?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-16-2007, 10:16 AM
  #1
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
When did Tom Renney turn into a genius?

OK I've been Renney's most vocal critic, and I'm still not convinced he'll lead us to the playoffs, or coach well if we do make the playoffs. But I have to give the man credit for how he's handled the team the last week, when we were in danger of falling of the face of the playoff earth. And it's not just the winning streak, I was calling for Renney to be fired even during the five game winning streak in December, because I thought he had nothing to do with it.

It's only four games, but SO FAR he has handled Avery perfectly. Something tells me when things are going bad Avery may go from driving the other team crazy to driving fans and teammates crazy, but so far Avery and Renney have done everything right. Putting Avery with Shanahan was obvious, but Renney has missed some obvious things in the past. This time he got it right.

I've also been critical of Renney's hockey sense, as it seemed like every decision he made blew up in his face. Recently it's been the opposite, most every decision he's made has paid off for him.

If you had told me two weeks ago Lundqvist would play every game, including back-to-back nights, I would have told you it was a mistake. Especially after what happened last year. So far it's not a mistake, Lundqvist seems to be getting stronger.

He finally put Cullen back on the power play, and it seems like that's helped Cullen's coinfidence both on the power play and at even strength.

We were all wondering here about tinkering with a lineup that blew out two pretty good teams the last two games, but he replaced Prucha with Dupuis on the third line and Dupuis played well and scored a goal.

He's stuck with Malik when I was leading the call for him to be traded, and Malik had an outstanding game last night. It was just one game, but Malik was impressive.

The new top two lines have worked out perfectly so far. He seems to have revitalized both Hossa and Shanahan.

Renney seems to have the whole team ready to play now, right from the opening shift. I've been critical of Renney when the team has come out flat, I have to give him props when they take it to the other team right from the opening faceoff.

Three games does not make a season, but if we'd lost the last three games we'd all be singing quite the different tune about a lot of things.

dave4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 10:25 AM
  #2
SML
Registered User
 
SML's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 3,743
vCash: 500
He's not a genius. If your PP goes 3 for 3 on a nightly basis, it will make anybody look like Scotty Bowman. Granted, I haven't been able to watch lately b/c MSG chooses to show the SABRES lately, but IMO, the key is having a second distinct PP unit and being able to throw two completely different looks at the other temas PK. For some reason, I think Renney was afraid to alienate the Euros and let them run the PP. When they got Avery, they built a good solid second unit that played very Canadian, simple hockey. That's the difference. Your mistakes don't look nearly as big when you arent in one goal games every night.

SML is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 10:26 AM
  #3
abev
HFBoards Sponsor
 
abev's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 3,588
vCash: 500
He's been what you call a genius the whole time.

It's just tough for some people to understand that the Rangers will not win every night and that when you need to change the philosophy of your players sometimes it takes steps back before going forward.

__________________
Fantasy sports betting at FakePuppy - Pick moneylines, over/unders and spreads. Totally free.
abev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 10:30 AM
  #4
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,445
vCash: 500
I've been on Renney side all along and alone... He's not genius, just a good coach, esp. for new NHL. No surprise.

94now is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 10:39 AM
  #5
kickice
Registered User
 
kickice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Orange County, NY
Country: Wales
Posts: 538
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to kickice
Renney is a good coach. And he's the best we've had for years, some seem to forget that fact. There aren't many 'genius' coaches out there, in fact, there probably isn't a single one now since Bowman retired. Renney may not be the best, but he's done a heck of a job for the Rangers in the last couple years. Be thankful for that, and when you forget (cos it seems some have very short memories), just think back a few short years.

It amazes me some of the childish BS on here about him with the avatars and the signatures wanting him fired. Seriously, have a word with yourselves and grow up.
I get embarrassed when I see those popping up on the general NHL forum and other forums here. Maybe I'm just used to more patience shown towards decent coaches.

kickice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:05 AM
  #6
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,512
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by SML View Post
He's not a genius. If your PP goes 3 for 3 on a nightly basis, it will make anybody look like Scotty Bowman. Granted, I haven't been able to watch lately b/c MSG chooses to show the SABRES lately, but IMO, the key is having a second distinct PP unit and being able to throw two completely different looks at the other temas PK. For some reason, I think Renney was afraid to alienate the Euros and let them run the PP. When they got Avery, they built a good solid second unit that played very Canadian, simple hockey. That's the difference. Your mistakes don't look nearly as big when you arent in one goal games every night.
so Renney gets the blame for the bad powerplays, and doesn't get credit for the good ones right?

Thirty One is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:05 AM
  #7
Pizza
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,058
vCash: 500
In for a Penney in for a pound Dave? You also need to credit "The Edmonton Genius" for the Avery trade if you've not already done so

I agree with everything you listed. It's damn funny how things work out sometimes. If we have the opportunity to look back on this surge fondly, the turning points rest squarely with the Rangers deciding to play 60 mins. and moves that both Renney and Slats have made.

Pizza is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:09 AM
  #8
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
Genius?

klingsor, I believe, was one of the first to suggest having Straka center Jags to move Nylander down to play with Shanny allowing Betts to be the fourth and Cullen to be the third line centerman. To me, that's one of the better changes. Another is the PP, which is doing what everyone in hear has been asked to do. Adding Avery helps because of the energy he brings, but I think the difference has been more than that. Also helps that Lundqvist has been on the last month.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:11 AM
  #9
Ola
Registered User
 
Ola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 17,786
vCash: 500
Anyone remember Canada's struggles in the mid-latter parts of the 90's? Loosing to the USA in the WC. Struggling in the WJCH, struggling in the WCH, really struggling to produce mega stars.

In 1994-1998 Tom Renney was a major part in enforcing a new system for all their National Teams. A mix between the trap played by Sweden (2-2-1, the forecheck) and the Czech's counter attack (the breakin out from their own end, with the center playing a huge role offensive role, compared to Swedens system were the center is pretty defensive). A huge diffrence from how Canada played before that, typical NYR in 1994 type of hockey, typical Mess/Oilers style...

The style a National team plays might not sound like a big deal. But if the Canadian National team changes their system, thats the system all amature/junior coaches will be thaught in in seminars ect, and there are plenty of thoose at that level. I don't know exactly how it works in Canada, but there are systems with licences ect to coach. Pretty fast that system is spread out through all levels. Nobody is obliged to use it, but if Hockey Canada says this is the way we want to play, allot of people will follow it.

Anyone saw the pice in the BB two numbers ago were the boss of Canada Hockey praised Renney like no tomorrow? He mentioned coaches who people said were the best, and said something like if one of them are supposed to be the number 1 in Canada, Renney is 1A...

Many people refer to Renney as somebody who never had any success, that he is unproven ect. But his creation defenitly turned Canada around, and have been successfully adopted by many great NHL teams, like Buffalo/Carolina/Anaheim/Calgary among others. In 2002' it were Renney who was in charge for how Canada played, despite having three other legends behind the bench.

Renney are one of the most educated coaches in these aspects in the World, and defenitly also got that reputation in the world of Hockey. In Europe he is always mentioned as the one who turned Canada around, we felt at that time that we had a huge advantage playing against Canada, almost like many feel today playing against Russia.

Renney is unproven as a real winner in the NHL, in the NHL thats how it is untill you prove otherwise. But he is defenitly at another planet when it comes to X's and O's compared with many many coaches in this league. He is very smart and knows extremely much about that game.

Its defenitly possible that the best option is to have Renney here to build something, and then let him turn it over to someone who will focus more on getting 125% out of the product when we are a real solid contender. If someone feels that Renney are making such bad personell/lineup decisions that he should be fired right away, they are entitled to that. But lets not talk about Renney as some kind of scout/nobody with zero expereince who we dug out of nowhere and who don't have a clue about what he is dooing, its quite the opposite...


Last edited by Ola: 02-16-2007 at 11:19 AM.
Ola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:20 AM
  #10
Ola
Registered User
 
Ola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 17,786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
klingsor, I believe, was one of the first to suggest having Straka center Jags to move Nylander down to play with Shanny allowing Betts to be the fourth and Cullen to be the third line centerman. To me, that's one of the better changes. Another is the PP, which is doing what everyone in hear has been asked to do. Adding Avery helps because of the energy he brings, but I think the difference has been more than that. Also helps that Lundqvist has been on the last month.
Something Renney tried pretty early this season, like 5-6 games in, Prucha-Straka-Jagr. It didn't work. Hossa playing great right now have certainly helped taking away Nylander from Jagr.

Ola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:24 AM
  #11
Larry Melnyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Gloomsville, USA
Posts: 4,376
vCash: 500
I've been pretty adamant that Renney and his mongolian cluster**** of lines and personnel decisions were a big reason for the lack of continuity and chemistry on a team that should have been doing better..

Was I right? WHo the hell knows? Doesn't matter.right now..What matters is from hereon in..And right now it looks like the Rangers are playing with chemistry, logical line combos, fire, smarts and everything else..And Renney is the one in control...ANd he's the one that needs to keep the team playing that same way for another 25 games...he does that and it will be a succesful season despite the lost points and chaos of early on..It's a longroad and how you end up...

Larry Melnyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 11:27 AM
  #12
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
In for a Penney in for a pound Dave? You also need to credit "The Edmonton Genius" for the Avery trade if you've not already done so

I agree with everything you listed. It's damn funny how things work out sometimes. If we have the opportunity to look back on this surge fondly, the turning points rest squarely with the Rangers deciding to play 60 mins. and moves that both Renney and Slats have made.
Obviously 'When did Renney turn into a genius' was facetious, but I feel it necessary to give the man credit where credit is due. Recently he's done what good coaches do, put his team in the best possible position to succeed. It's only three games, but it's been impressive.

Can he lead the team to playoff success? The jury is still out on that one, go back and read the threads from last April where a lot of people thought he mismanaged the Devil series. As my dad always used to say "We shall see what we shall see".

Regarding the Edmonton Genius, I think it's a little early to give him too much credit. Yes the Avery trade seems to have been EXACTLY what the Rangers needed, and Dupuis showed some things last night that hopefully will help down the road too.

I love what I've seen of Avery so far...everything he's done has been terrific. He seems to be involved in so much of the game, bugging the other team, creating scoring chances, occupying the goalie, etc. Makes you wonder why a team like the Kings would even think for one second about trading him...but they did.

The true test of the Avery trade (and Avery himself) will be what happens and how he handles himself when everything is not going quite so perfectly. When we lose again (yes, there will be more losses...just hopefully not as many as before!).

A GM is evaluated on a much more long-term basis than a coach, and despite some recent amazing success, long-term-wise Sather still isn't cutting it. But hopefully he's put the team on the right path with his recent moves, and his past moves will pay off big time in the long run too.

But there is just something about watching Zach Parise play well for the Devils that tempers your enthusiasm for Sather a little bit, no matter how well the Rangers are playing!

dave4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:06 PM
  #13
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,865
vCash: 500
Tom Renney=Jack Adams Trophy winner


RangerBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:07 PM
  #14
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,445
vCash: 500
The best decision of Renney wasn't a recent one. Moving Shanahan away from Cullen was that move. It was hardly genius, though.

94now is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:23 PM
  #15
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
5-6 games?

I believe it was more like one game, ola, maybe there was a second one too, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't more than that and I further do not believe Straka was at center, rather a winger on Cullen's line.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:27 PM
  #16
yada
move 2 dallas 4 work
 
yada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: watching happy pony
Country: United States
Posts: 10,428
vCash: 500
Send a message via Yahoo to yada
generally i dont post on this part of the boards cause i get annoyed at all the anti renney comments

the nice thing that has turned the rangers around has been the improved play of malik, racoonick, lundqvist (from early in the season). the team has finally started playing as a team. also when you get your pk and pp playing good youre usually gonna start winning some games. sure i get annoyed with some of renneys personal choices at times but that doesnt mean that i think hes a terrible coach just cause i dont agree. basically what my point with this post is that renney isnt really doing anything different but the team is playing better but renney isnt doing much different than when he was getting crucified

yada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:32 PM
  #17
JayMan82
Registered User
 
JayMan82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,307
vCash: 500
The biggest thing I noticed on the powerplay is that we FINALLY skate around and change positions! That couple with the fact that a few people brought up that Avery that in front of the net presence that we have been DEEPLY missing... It's nice to have 2 producing PP units now, instead of watching reruns all season...

JayMan82 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 12:35 PM
  #18
SML
Registered User
 
SML's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 3,743
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
so Renney gets the blame for the bad powerplays, and doesn't get credit for the good ones right?
Settle down, pal. The only thing I ever blamed Renney for was losing control of the team. Once that happens, it's almost impossible to get back. Do you remember a few weeks ago when Shanny was quoted saying something was disjointed, and that Renney was trying to get the PP to screen and use point shots more, and they weren't doing it? That's what I'm talking about. The coach has to be the deciding vote, the voice everyone has to at least respect, if not agree with. It aooeared to me as though he lost that. Now things are working again. I am far from the biggest Renney basher, and that was my only beef with him. Go check out all the fire Renney stuff from the last month. I'm far from leading the charge. I'm glad they have turned a corner, i want them to succeed no matter who the coach is.

SML is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:28 PM
  #19
NYROrtsFan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,940
vCash: 500
He's never lost the team... Those voices were just the typical things seen in all sports when a team is struggling.

And a lot of the decisions have been good. I think where he gets a lot of credit from me personally is sticking with Hossa because i thought Hossa should have been kicked aside a long while back. Hossa brings a lot to that first line imo and the defensive ability is what helps them a ton.

Ultimately a coach is judged by the record and results in the playoffs so he'll prove something if he gets the team into the playoffs and they do well there.

NYROrtsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:33 PM
  #20
MrAlfie
 
MrAlfie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Rehab
Country: Spain
Posts: 5,249
vCash: 500
to me, Renney is still clueless how it works... the difference is that the team actually came to senses and know what its all about.
now add two guys in there who are new and have no idea what its like with renney and you have a good working machine without having a hell of a coach.

my opinion didnt change.
i still want him fired sooner than later.

MrAlfie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:34 PM
  #21
Block More Shots
Registered User
 
Block More Shots's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,355
vCash: 500
I think he's a good coach but he's very quick to change things. Sometimes that's not always good. It can take a game or two for players to find some chemistry with each other but if he sees something is not clicking, he immediatly changes it up.

He's pretty much struck gold with all 4 of his lines. Is he a genius for that? I don't think so, but let's just say he got it right when it mattered the most.

Block More Shots is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:38 PM
  #22
Inferno
HFB Partner
 
Inferno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Country: United States
Posts: 20,169
vCash: 500
hes not a genius, it took him 2/3rds of the season to do what we all told him to do.

Inferno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:41 PM
  #23
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,445
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
hes not a genius, it took him 2/3rds of the season to do what we all told him to do.
Correct. That makes him a good coach instead of genius. The stubborn moron would do nothing.

94now is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:51 PM
  #24
Finest
Puck Fittsburg
 
Finest's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 5,587
vCash: 500
The diffrence IMO is he now has the parts he needed to make this team click.

Finest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-16-2007, 01:53 PM
  #25
Blueblood 2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 874
vCash: 500
He got smart when he listened to Shanahan instead of Jagr. Shanny wanted the change in the powerplay and gave the thumbs up to Sean Avery. That has made all the difference. Give Renney credit for finally taking a chance when his back was against the wall and his job on the line.

Blueblood 2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:28 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.