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Are we wasting out time with Gilbert?

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Old
02-22-2007, 04:48 PM
  #1
Shaynsaw
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Are we wasting out time with Gilbert?

I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.

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02-22-2007, 04:50 PM
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Cloned
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Reasoner is American (IIRC) as well, but he loves it in Edmonton.

I don't think every American born player would pick where they play solely based on what country the team is in. Some do, but some don't.

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02-22-2007, 04:57 PM
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Jimmy Carson is an American and we all he didn't want to be here.

Chris Pronger is a Canadian and he didn't want to be here. Ok i need to get over with FCP thing.

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02-22-2007, 05:07 PM
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alanschu
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If the organization treats him with respect and gives him an offer he deems fair, there's no reason why he wouldn't stay here.

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02-22-2007, 05:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloned View Post
Reasoner is American (If I recall correctly) as well, but he loves it in Edmonton.

I don't think every American born player would pick where they play solely based on what country the team is in. Some do, but some don't.
Exactly... Marchant, Weight, Geurin, Grier.... we have a history of strong american players, and it isn't like they left at the first opportunity or demanded a trade.... at least no more so than some of the Canadian players from the same era (Cujo, Comrie, etc).

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02-22-2007, 05:10 PM
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Doug Weight, Mike Grier, Todd Marchant, etc., are all American college boys, and they never had a problem playing in Edmonton. I know looking for the negatives is the cool thing to do on the Oilers board lately , but I see no reason to worry about Gilbert right now.

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Old
02-22-2007, 05:10 PM
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Most guys don't play the 4 years of college either, so most would arrive before the age of 23. Something to think about, when a person like Gilbert becomes a UFA he would have spent 3 years in Edmonton, the only pro team he has ever know 8 months of the year. He would develop good friends on the team and in the Community, he may even date or marry a local girl. Who knows where his priorities would lie is such a case.

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02-22-2007, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloned View Post
Reasoner is American (If I recall correctly) as well, but he loves it in Edmonton.

I don't think every American born player would pick where they play solely based on what country the team is in. Some do, but some don't.
Indeed he is, he was born in New York.

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02-22-2007, 05:11 PM
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We've had more American players on our team than any other franchise, so I see no problems with that aspect. Weight, Guerin, Marchant, Grier, York, Reasoner, Greene *cough* Conklin *cough* to name a few.

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02-22-2007, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.
Why just pick on Gilbert? There are a lot of American players in the NHL, and expecting them to screw the Oilers is blatantly casting all Americans in the same mold. I'd be much more inclined to suspect we're wasting our time with Robbie Schremp, who is also an American, but that's for a bunch of other reasons. As Cloned pointed out, we didn't seem to waste our time on Marty Reasoner (or even Doug Weight for that matter).

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02-22-2007, 05:49 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.
By this logic Chris Higgins hates his life in Montreal and needs to get out. Last I checked he loves it there and should be part of that team for a long time.

American born players appriciate hockey just as much as Canadian players. If an American player is happy in a Canadian Market, chances are he'll stay there.

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02-22-2007, 05:55 PM
  #12
Loki
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I don't think the worry is as much that Gilbert is American as much as it is a concern about retaining a future UFA.

Edmonton is historically not a prime target for UFA players, and we are one of the teams that really need to have our players reach their primes during their RFA years in order to maximize their value to the organization.

In which case... I think it is unfortunate that Gilbert only has 4(?) years until UFA status, but I don't consider it a waste of time to develop him if we are able to get a return from him before he goes UFA, or sign him past his UFA years.

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02-22-2007, 05:56 PM
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the future of the Oilers' defense will be loaded with Americans and thats a good thing

Greene
Gilbert
Chorney

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Old
02-22-2007, 05:58 PM
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Walsher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.
I think there is a lot to be said for a team that gives you your first shot in the NHL. As long as the honeymoon is enjoyable in Edmonton, a young player like Gilbert has the opportunity to turn it into his home if he plays decent and the fans don't destroy him. I have no worries about him turning his back on Edmonton if push came to shove. Lets all remember who Tom Gilbert is and what he has accomplished thus far in his career... At this point I don't see fat UFA contracts being thrown at his agent like candy come the age of 27 - that said he looks like a guy who is developing quickly and can make an impact. How much of an impact is yet to be seen.

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Old
02-22-2007, 06:00 PM
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I don't think it's so bad. People make friends on the team, make friends in the city. Some players will leave when they hit UFA, but some will stay - it's certainly a big advantage when trying to sign players.

Look at the current Oiler roster, and you see alot of our vets were RFA Oilers, and chose to stay, and even a player like Hemsky signed well into his UFA days.

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02-22-2007, 06:25 PM
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Mr Sakich
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ignoring the fact he is americain, you have to wonder about the wisdom of drafting defencemen outside of the top 10 picks.How many impact defencemen are there in the nhl who are under 25 (gets us 2 good years) who weren't drafted in the top 10-12 overall picks?

maybe Hamhuis and Zidlicky but even they are worth more for their potential than what they bring right now. They are ufa after one more year and they are just finally contributing. They are also the exception.

To give you an idea of how long it takes to bring along a dmen. COnsider that Coliocov is ufa after one more year and he has finally put together a 10 game stretch of solid play. At best, the leafs get 1 and 1/3 season from him where he is better than a free ufa journeyman dman.

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02-22-2007, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloned View Post
Reasoner is American (If I recall correctly) as well, but he loves it in Edmonton.

I don't think every American born player would pick where they play solely based on what country the team is in. Some do, but some don't.
Speaking of Reasoner, I live in New England and one of the parents on my sons team knows him well because he used to play on that guys older son's team. Plus they are BU grads and Marty played there (I think it was BU anyway). Had nothing but great things to say about Marty. Level headed, natural leader, all round great guy. It was really nice to hear.

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02-22-2007, 07:18 PM
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What a lame thread!

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02-22-2007, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.
This is the exact same thing said about Hemsky last year, only 3 years until he goes UFA, trade him now, look what happened. I think what the organization does if he looks like he will turn into a good D they try to lock him up for 3 or 4 years the year before he goes UFA. I am not a big fan of this only 3 years of RFA let's trade him now mentality a lot of people have. I am starting to hear the same thing on Greene. Why try to develop players at all if you are going to put up with the growing pains and then just ship him off so he can flourish elsewhere, just for the sake of it?

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Old
02-22-2007, 07:40 PM
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Weight - American, loved it here. Choking on the bench first game back

Guerin - loved it here.

Grier - loved it here.

Marchant - wife was crying on their first game back to edmonton.

Reasoner - re-signed here after being traded close to his home.

Gilbert had a chance to go back to the draft if he didn't re-sign last summer.

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02-22-2007, 08:00 PM
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What a lame thread!
Congrats on your 665 post, you must have really needed it.

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02-22-2007, 08:37 PM
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ignoring the fact he is americain, you have to wonder about the wisdom of drafting defencemen outside of the top 10 picks.How many impact defencemen are there in the nhl who are under 25 (gets us 2 good years) who weren't drafted in the top 10-12 overall picks?
I'm hoping that you're just being sarcastic but I don't see the humour. You're basically saying that the lowest 20 teams in the draft shouldn't even bother drafting d-men.

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02-22-2007, 08:40 PM
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I think we are. I think from this point on we should draft and trade for people who are either from Edmonton or Siberia. Nobody else because who else would like it here.

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02-22-2007, 08:55 PM
  #24
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I'll go the other way in this thread.
Given that Pronger was an anomaly, and Bergeron couldn't play defence, the rest of the d-men have been treated very well by the management and coaching staff. The team has given them no reason to sign elsewhere for the same money. The loyalty shown to greybeards like Smith and Staios should mean a lot to guys like Gilbert.
Edmonton is NOT the third world country of the NHL, and I'm tired of jealous media and fans of other teams trying to derail the team that we are so proud of.

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02-22-2007, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
I hope I got your attention with that title but I have an interesting point to make. I was talking to a friend of mine about Gilbert the other day and how impressed we were by his play so far. He mentioned that he won’t play the whole season because he would get sent down before playing 10 games. I accepted this and the conversation ended.

Until today. The 7 years playing time in the NHL is meaningless.
I looked up Gilbert’s age. He just turned 24 in January. When this guy turns 27 in three years he will be a UFA.

If he turns out to be an excellent defenseman that we develop, coach and mold, what happens? He’s an American, raised there, played hockey there. Honestly what are the odds of him signing in Edmonton?
I guess the best case scenario is that he turns into a good asset that we can trade before he leaves.

What a waste of a thread!

Mabe drafting college boys is not such a good idea, once they are ready to play in the NHL they are 23. Not a lot of time to work with.

I guess the only positive is that by then the market will be saturated with UFA’s. A good GM should know the wheat from the chaff. So much for building for the future.

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