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Old
03-01-2007, 07:49 AM
  #26
golfmade
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
The Swedes get together to bash my view on Foppa, I like it
NMK is a Swede? Hot damn!

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03-01-2007, 09:04 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
The Swedes get together to bash my view on Foppa, I like it
Yeah, but they way you're describing his play the Preds would have a better shot had they hung on to Upshall for a Cup run. Is that what you think? I'm asking because I don't want to be accused of putting words in anyone's mouth. Listened to three Preds games and caught part of one on the tube that Forsberg has played in. Hardly "float and gloat" performances. Creating scoring chances would be a better description - that is the type of player he was, and is, and still does it better than most. The defenseive decline has been evident since the lockout and he's been slammed by columnists for it, but his set-up play has been a nice addition. Just need more finishing form some of the other cast.

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03-01-2007, 09:06 AM
  #28
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bilros has trolled every Forsberg post or thread. Just let them be as they are clueless.

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Old
03-01-2007, 11:15 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Stranger View Post
bilros has trolled every Forsberg post or thread. Just let them be as they are clueless.
Ignore feature is a god send ... click on bilros name, click add bilros to your ignore list ... next screen ... scroll down and save list

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Old
03-01-2007, 11:49 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Stranger View Post
bilros has trolled every Forsberg post or thread. Just let them be as they are clueless.
Having an opinion that varies from the mass, is trolling?

Thatīs rich..


Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralPred View Post
Yeah, but they way you're describing his play the Preds would have a better shot had they hung on to Upshall for a Cup run. Is that what you think? I'm asking because I don't want to be accused of putting words in anyone's mouth. Listened to three Preds games and caught part of one on the tube that Forsberg has played in. Hardly "float and gloat" performances. Creating scoring chances would be a better description - that is the type of player he was, and is, and still does it better than most. The defenseive decline has been evident since the lockout and he's been slammed by columnists for it, but his set-up play has been a nice addition. Just need more finishing form some of the other cast.
They gave up wwwaaayyyyy to much for him.

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Old
03-01-2007, 12:00 PM
  #31
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Forsberg...

Okay.
Well, I'm 'kinda' objective...root for Nashville next to the Sabres...but IMO I do think Forsberg is over the peak/zenith, and hiking his way downward in his career...that being said, you can't tell me that in the playoffs, with his experience, he is not one heck of an asset. You can't argue with that. I don't even feel so much he is a 'rent - a - player'. Heck, if he can be happy in Nashville for a couple of seasons, he will be good for the team, that is in its prime. Like I've said, this year - maybe next year, is your window for the Cup. The deal. Just fine. I was more upset to lose Parent than Upshall. Good for Scottie in Philly. But, we all know where his head is at at the end of the day! IMO.

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Old
03-01-2007, 12:01 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Having an opinion that varies from the mass, is trolling?

Thatīs rich..
No, it's their opinion that you troll. And honestly, there are a ton of moderators on these boards who would share those thoughts. Name calling and demonstrative positions with little support behind them aren't really conducive to worthwhile conversations.

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Old
03-01-2007, 12:23 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause View Post
No, it's their opinion that you troll. And honestly, there are a ton of moderators on these boards who would share those thoughts. Name calling and demonstrative positions with little support behind them aren't really conducive to worthwhile conversations.
Namecalling? When?

That opinion is based on the fact that I have a view on Forsberg, that most people do not?

Disagree, and youīre trolling? Why even have a forum if you arent allowed to vent your opinions?

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03-01-2007, 01:16 PM
  #34
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Bottom line = get your act together, or Fiddler will come to your house whilst you are sleeping. You will wake up, and he will be standing over you, grinning. It won't be pretty.

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Old
03-01-2007, 02:06 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Namecalling? When?

That opinion is based on the fact that I have a view on Forsberg, that most people do not?

Disagree, and youīre trolling? Why even have a forum if you arent allowed to vent your opinions?

If I'm not mistaken, you referred to Forsberg as Floppa and even went so far as to emphasize the added L.

And posing a different viewpoint is not trolling. However, doing so without providing any support for the opinion can easily be considered trolling. You've made a lot of very strong statements about Forsberg and the trade in this thread without so much as a follow up sentence explaining your rationale. That's what is trouble because it gives very little for your opponents to argue about but you. They can't fight your logic because they don't know it. I feel like I'm doubling up my previous post here, but do you understand where we are coming from?

The best way to argue with fans of another team is to present your differing argument and then back it up with your support. Consider it like you would a HS essay. State the thesis and then build a body that supports it. Because then you put intelligent fans in a position to argue your logic and not just you. And that's where effective and meaningful discussion occurs. And if you'll notice, not a lot of that has occurred in your presence.

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Old
03-01-2007, 02:34 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause View Post
If I'm not mistaken, you referred to Forsberg as Floppa and even went so far as to emphasize the added L.

And posing a different viewpoint is not trolling. However, doing so without providing any support for the opinion can easily be considered trolling. You've made a lot of very strong statements about Forsberg and the trade in this thread without so much as a follow up sentence explaining your rationale. That's what is trouble because it gives very little for your opponents to argue about but you. They can't fight your logic because they don't know it. I feel like I'm doubling up my previous post here, but do you understand where we are coming from?

The best way to argue with fans of another team is to present your differing argument and then back it up with your support. Consider it like you would a HS essay. State the thesis and then build a body that supports it. Because then you put intelligent fans in a position to argue your logic and not just you. And that's where effective and meaningful discussion occurs. And if you'll notice, not a lot of that has occurred in your presence.

When you wrote "namecalling" I assumed you meant something like calling another user idiot. Calling Forsberg by a widely known nickname, is reason enough...or what?

Iīve said on numerous ocassions that Forsberg isnīt the player he used to be, heīs always injured, doesnīt play as physical and with the same explosiveness he used to do, these things and alot more makes the trade pretty bad if you look at what the Preds had to give up.

I thought this was clear?

And people still maintain the opinion that Iīm a troll, howīs that for namecalling?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralPred View Post
Yeah, but they way you're describing his play the Preds would have a better shot had they hung on to Upshall for a Cup run. Is that what you think? I'm asking because I don't want to be accused of putting words in anyone's mouth. Listened to three Preds games and caught part of one on the tube that Forsberg has played in. Hardly "float and gloat" performances. Creating scoring chances would be a better description - that is the type of player he was, and is, and still does it better than most. The defenseive decline has been evident since the lockout and he's been slammed by columnists for it, but his set-up play has been a nice addition. Just need more finishing form some of the other cast.
How will he get inside? Through the roof?



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Old
03-01-2007, 03:04 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
When you wrote "namecalling" I assumed you meant something like calling another user idiot. Calling Forsberg by a widely known nickname, is reason enough...or what?

Iīve said on numerous ocassions that Forsberg isnīt the player he used to be, heīs always injured, doesnīt play as physical and with the same explosiveness he used to do, these things and alot more makes the trade pretty bad if you look at what the Preds had to give up.

I thought this was clear?

And people still maintain the opinion that Iīm a troll, howīs that for namecalling?
I've not seen all your posts, but I cannot recall a time where you really analyzed anything in depth. The overwhelming majority of your posts are quick, emphatic one liners. (see this thread, for example) If you can step back for a second and look at your contribution to this thread and this thread alone, I think you'd reluctantly back up my thoughts.

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03-01-2007, 03:14 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
When you wrote "namecalling" I assumed you meant something like calling another user idiot. Calling Forsberg by a widely known nickname, is reason enough...or what?

Iīve said on numerous ocassions that Forsberg isnīt the player he used to be, heīs always injured, doesnīt play as physical and with the same explosiveness he used to do, these things and alot more makes the trade pretty bad if you look at what the Preds had to give up.

I thought this was clear?

And people still maintain the opinion that Iīm a troll, howīs that for namecalling?



How will he get inside? Through the roof?



When u have a million dollars sparing $20,000 is no big deal in reference to the wealth of prospects Nashville has. That trade being lopsided is only clear to those who dont know what the preds have on the farm and in players like Hamhuis, Suter,
Weber etc

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Old
03-01-2007, 08:46 PM
  #39
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Sabres fan, Ads fan...

But, watched the whole Flyers game vs. the Bruins...just to see the dramatics of Marty's (Biron) first game starting for PHILA...and guess what?
All the crap I talked about Scottie (Upshall)...guess who won the game in OT for PHILA - on a breakaway, using Forsberg's (kinda) signature deke - Scottie!

Man, Even I might be rethinking all my Upshall smack!
Out.

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03-02-2007, 12:49 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause View Post
I've not seen all your posts, but I cannot recall a time where you really analyzed anything in depth. The overwhelming majority of your posts are quick, emphatic one liners. (see this thread, for example) If you can step back for a second and look at your contribution to this thread and this thread alone, I think you'd reluctantly back up my thoughts.
Thatīs the problem right there.

Iīve explained my standpoint several times, both in here and in other parts ofthe forum.

My contribution to this thread is far "better" than many other people, who didnīt even stay on topic.

But verbally bashing someone whose opinion isnīt the "mainstream" one, seems to be more than ok?

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Old
03-02-2007, 01:02 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Thatīs the problem right there.

Iīve explained my standpoint several times, both in here and in other parts ofthe forum.

My contribution to this thread is far "better" than many other people, who didnīt even stay on topic.

But verbally bashing someone whose opinion isnīt the "mainstream" one, seems to be more than ok?
Your viewpoint isn't the problem. It's the fact that you're rubbing it in everyone's faces. You're not watching games, you're watching stats, and it's more than annoying when Forsberg plays a terrific game, and all you can do is post, "BUT HE WUZ A MINUS 1 LOLZZZ." If you want to come back at the end of the summer and comment, fine. But showing up after every game that you look at a boxscore for IS trolling, and will be handled duly, from here on out.

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03-02-2007, 07:47 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
Your viewpoint isn't the problem. It's the fact that you're rubbing it in everyone's faces. You're not watching games, you're watching stats, and it's more than annoying when Forsberg plays a terrific game, and all you can do is post, "BUT HE WUZ A MINUS 1 LOLZZZ." If you want to come back at the end of the summer and comment, fine. But showing up after every game that you look at a boxscore for IS trolling, and will be handled duly, from here on out.
Please quote me where I ever wrote in this childish manner.

And the fact remains, you can play a hell of a game and still not help your team.

Especially in Forsbergs casde since heīs not involved in shutting anyone down, for him points is the only thing that matters, and when that fails you can atleast hope for him to get a plus-stat. Not even that is the case.

Bash me all you want, but my opinions are valid.

And again, noone would be happier if he started owning again.

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Old
03-02-2007, 08:20 AM
  #43
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Your opinion is that you've completely discounted Forsberg being on the backside of his prime and passed it on as he now sucks. Driving this point home by the fact he went three games w/out a point in Nashville and went minus on a particular night while on the ice w/4th liners playing the role of pylons against SJ. All isolated incidences. If you judge soley by points and stats, as the majority of your backing indicates, then Forsberg isn't living up to expectations in your eyes. An opinion I can respect, however, one that I would see as a little short sighted when coupled with the blanket "float and gloat" descriptions that would seem to be the opposite of how Forsberg has performed given the amount of offense and scoring chances he has created since coming to Nashville. It is this same stats-based argument used to burn Joe Thornton in last years playoffs.

As to namecalling, I'm not sure wht you meant by the "Swedes ganging up on me" comment from the previous page - that might be what posters are refering to. That, or something you've posted in other threads.

You quoted a post of mine twice, the first one (in post #30) referenced overpayment. Initially I thought this as well, but given that I tend to overvalue 1st round picks (and probably a 25th or lower pick at that) and that Upshall was a player not going anywhere in this organization, so essentially a throw-in, the meat was Parent. A GM cannot pass on the opportunity to bring in a player like Forsberg to compliment an already talented squad. With the abundence of D prospects in the Pred's system one was certain to go. Do you realize what the Preds have between Nashville, Milwaukee, and the juniors for defense depth? From the Preds perspective this would justify the price to pay for a true legitimate shot at the Cup. A luxury that Waddell did not have in Atlanta when paying for Tkachuk.

The second time you quoted my post (in post #36), I have no idea what you were talking about. Anyway, I agree with you in that Forsberg's skills are not what they were 5 years ago, but he still has skills above and beyond most all other players in the World. I also lean towards the notion that they may have overpaid for this rental short of a Cup appearance, but as has been said, Poile needed to land this guy - the biggest name at the deadline an the Preds had to secure him.


Last edited by AdmiralPred: 03-02-2007 at 08:32 AM.
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Old
03-02-2007, 09:22 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralPred View Post
Your opinion is that you've completely discounted Forsberg being on the backside of his prime and passed it on as he now sucks. Driving this point home by the fact he went three games w/out a point in Nashville and went minus on a particular night while on the ice w/4th liners playing the role of pylons against SJ. All isolated incidences. If you judge soley by points and stats, as the majority of your backing indicates, then Forsberg isn't living up to expectations in your eyes. An opinion I can respect, however, one that I would see as a little short sighted when coupled with the blanket "float and gloat" descriptions that would seem to be the opposite of how Forsberg has performed given the amount of offense and scoring chances he has created since coming to Nashville. It is this same stats-based argument used to burn Joe Thornton in last years playoffs.

As to namecalling, I'm not sure wht you meant by the "Swedes ganging up on me" comment from the previous page - that might be what posters are refering to. That, or something you've posted in other threads.

You quoted a post of mine twice, the first one (in post #30) referenced overpayment. Initially I thought this as well, but given that I tend to overvalue 1st round picks (and probably a 25th or lower pick at that) and that Upshall was a player not going anywhere in this organization, so essentially a throw-in, the meat was Parent. A GM cannot pass on the opportunity to bring in a player like Forsberg to compliment an already talented squad. With the abundence of D prospects in the Pred's system one was certain to go. Do you realize what the Preds have between Nashville, Milwaukee, and the juniors for defense depth? From the Preds perspective this would justify the price to pay for a true legitimate shot at the Cup. A luxury that Waddell did not have in Atlanta when paying for Tkachuk.

The second time you quoted my post (in post #36), I have no idea what you were talking about. Anyway, I agree with you in that Forsberg's skills are not what they were 5 years ago, but he still has skills above and beyond most all other players in the World. I also lean towards the notion that they may have overpaid for this rental short of a Cup appearance, but as has been said, Poile needed to land this guy - the biggest name at the deadline an the Preds had to secure him.
Great post. Maybe now it will stick on some people's heads. No matter how many times we type it, someone always goes omg nahsvill ovrepaid!

Even more so on the last part is the fact that we needed another center. How many centers were available trade deadline time?

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Old
03-02-2007, 09:45 AM
  #45
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And the fact remains, you can play a hell of a game and still not help your team.
Simply not true. Of course you help your team when you play well. A player who does well demands more attention thus creating space and opportunities for other players. Don't stare yourself blind on the stats.

You've been given some good advice from some of the other posters. I suggest you think them over. If you go on like you've done on the Flyer board and now here no one is going to take you seriously.

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03-02-2007, 10:18 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Bash me all you want, but my opinions are valid.
Your opinions are valid. Most people's are. It's your delivery that needs substantial work.


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03-02-2007, 10:24 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Thatīs the problem right there.

Iīve explained my standpoint several times, both in here and in other parts ofthe forum.
That is the problem. When in rather tense situations such as this, you simply cannot rely on posts on other boards or in other threads to support demonstrative positions. It's not reasonable to expect most posters to go from the thread to thread to find backup for your positions.

It would be much wiser for you to look at each thread as a standalone rather than viewing all your posts in the aggregate. Other posters aren't bilros. They don't know what's in your head. And they certainly don't know what you wrote 9 days ago in a thread that is two pages removed from the front.

It's not wise to make the assumption that all your previous posts will immediately be available to anyone reading one of your emphatic one-liners. I consider the burden of explanation to rest on your shoulders in this situation. I'm not asking for a thorough recap of the support for your views, but some contribution to the thread in excess of your current posts would be nice.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
My contribution to this thread is far "better" than many other people, who didnīt even stay on topic.

But verbally bashing someone whose opinion isnīt the "mainstream" one, seems to be more than ok?
Your contribution to the thread is what is causing these "far lessor" posts to occur. Without you, they don't exist. And keep in mind that they are supporting the "popular" opinion. Unfortunately, one of the charges of holding an opinion unlike the mainstream is that you must go the extra step to support your opinion. It may not seem fair, but it's life.

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03-03-2007, 04:45 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause View Post
That is


Your contribution to the thread is what is causing these "far lessor" posts to occur. Without you, they don't exist. And keep in mind that they are supporting the "popular" opinion. Unfortunately, one of the charges of holding an opinion unlike the mainstream is that you must go the extra step to support your opinion. It may not seem fair, but it's life.

Without them, you could also argue that this board would be far more dull

My opinion is that Preds gave up too much for him, considering he could tear a groin or get his ankleproblem back in a heartbeat, considering heīs not half the player he used to be, and considering the fact that he probably wont be back next season.

You people on the other hand, take offence personally when I commit to this opinion, and therefore Iīm getting called a "troll" and what not. Thatīs usually something that people dish out when they canīt argue their own cases.

Have I been trolling the forums by having an opinion, not supported by the masses?

How about the mods just make up a new rule, where itīs forbidden to have a negative opinion about any threads started by someone else?

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03-03-2007, 07:47 AM
  #49
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The thing that is always underestimated in the trade for Forsberg is bringing his experience to the locker room and what his presence does for the other players.

I talked to a number of Preds players 2 days before we acquired him, and to a man, all thought the biggest thing that he would bring to the table is the leadership, experience in a long playoff run, warrior-attitiude, and the ability to elevate everybody elses game [especially Kariya, Sullivan, and Arnott] just by being here.

That is the intangible that just simply can't be measured on paper.

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03-03-2007, 08:15 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilros View Post
You people on the other hand, take offence personally when I commit to this opinion, and therefore Iīm getting called a "troll" and what not. Thatīs usually something that people dish out when they canīt argue their own cases.

Have I been trolling the forums by having an opinion, not supported by the masses?

How about the mods just make up a new rule, where itīs forbidden to have a negative opinion about any threads started by someone else?
Apparently, you are just ignoring the concept of 'supporting' dissenting opinions that I've tried to explain to you. You've been warned by both nmk and myself. Please continue to post your opinion. But do it in the manner that was explained to you in depth.

And stop the whining. You've been shown to be in the wrong as nmk and I see it. Complaining and poorly defending yourself is tiresome. We get it that you think that you are considered a troll for "disagreeing with the masses." And we have explained to you there's more to you being a troll than just disagreeing with popular opinion. If you don't like it or don't want to abide by it, take your act elsewhere. I hear the Flyers board wants you back in full.

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