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Gotta get rid of all the Euros on this team or were going nowhere

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Old
02-25-2007, 01:16 PM
  #51
Anthony Mauro
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
I'm sorry if I don't give much value to that as an example of Nylander sucking.

That's a good case to make for trading him or a good case for why this team isn't much of a team, but that is not a good example of why Nylander sucks.
I'm sorry. I just thought not shooting, hitting, taking a hit, playing defense, or hustling has been re-hashed many many times.

The guy can stickhandle, pass, and is a deceptive skater, that's it.

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Old
02-25-2007, 02:48 PM
  #52
Son of Steinbrenner
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Originally Posted by Kostik View Post
Good funny thread.
I know that thread starter is pretty young guy still, so i can only hope that he will grow up from this
Seriously, this thread is just another "find a scapegoat" game.
that's it...

it's like Jagr, Straka, Prucha, Lundqvist, and Tyutin don't exist...Even Nylander although I would move him at the deadline....Not because of where he was BORN!!!!

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02-25-2007, 02:50 PM
  #53
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I would trade Prucha as well. The best Prucha could possibly get is become like Jagr, and Jagr hasnt done jack **** for this team.

Deal Prucha now while you can and get a good player in return.
maybe i'm wrong, but all of prucha's goal have been from him beening in the front of the net and getting rebounds. He Maybe has scored like 4-5 goals from "1 Timers".

Jagr only takes "1 Timer" shots. Prucha goes to the net and gets rebounds

If you don't believe me go to nhl.com and watch all of his goals

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Old
02-25-2007, 09:57 PM
  #54
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All you guys who think Nylander sucks, fine, go ahead and find another center in the $2-3 million salary range. Oh, Cullen is at $3 million, put him on the first line then. And he's an american north-south player that you love so much. Problem solved I guess?

You're ridiculous. He is arguably the only player who has shown he can play at a position higher than most people thinks he can play at and you want to get rid of him.

You don't even want to play him at 2nd center, no no, you want to ditch him. Fine, move up Cullen and Betts there and whatever other center you might find in some trade that's within the salary range.

Nylander has been critizied tenfold more than Cullen has ever been and what did Cullen produce at 2nd center position? 5 points in 40 games or so?

The arguments against him are also somewhat strange. "He never shoots! He always circles around with the puck!" Well guess what, he's a playmaking center. Do you know what playmaking means? It's like complaining on a grinder because he hits too much. And still, you have it on black and white that Nylander shoots just as much as Straka for example. I have never ever heard any whining that Straka doesn't shoot enough.

Jagr has been ice cold and didn't score for 27 games, yet Nylander seems to take all the blame because he continued to do what he's good at and increased his scoring when Jagr was ice cold.

And about the other argument to ditch Nylander? "He's ooold! He's a dinosaur, we need youuth! Ditch him fast, we need youuth! Tank the team!" I guess some people won't be satisfied until the average age on the team is 18.

On a side note, personally I think tanking with a team is disgraceful and it's not what a sport is about. You don't only affect your own team, you certainly affect the other teams in the same league.


Last edited by Chimp: 02-25-2007 at 10:14 PM.
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Old
02-25-2007, 10:31 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by g52 View Post
Gotta get rid of all the Euros on this team or were going nowhere .
so, are you including one of Fedor Tyutin and Marcel Hossa on this list too?

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Old
02-25-2007, 10:40 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
All you guys who think Nylander sucks, fine, go ahead and find another center in the $2-3 million salary range. Oh, Cullen is at $3 million, put him on the first line then. And he's an american north-south player that you love so much. Problem solved I guess?

You're ridiculous. He is arguably the only player who has shown he can play at a position higher than most people thinks he can play at and you want to get rid of him.

You don't even want to play him at 2nd center, no no, you want to ditch him. Fine, move up Cullen and Betts there and whatever other center you might find in some trade that's within the salary range.

Nylander has been critizied tenfold more than Cullen has ever been and what did Cullen produce at 2nd center position? 5 points in 40 games or so?

The arguments against him are also somewhat strange. "He never shoots! He always circles around with the puck!" Well guess what, he's a playmaking center. Do you know what playmaking means? It's like complaining on a grinder because he hits too much. And still, you have it on black and white that Nylander shoots just as much as Straka for example. I have never ever heard any whining that Straka doesn't shoot enough.

Jagr has been ice cold and didn't score for 27 games, yet Nylander seems to take all the blame because he continued to do what he's good at and increased his scoring when Jagr was ice cold.

And about the other argument to ditch Nylander? "He's ooold! He's a dinosaur, we need youuth! Ditch him fast, we need youuth! Tank the team!" I guess some people won't be satisfied until the average age on the team is 18.

On a side note, personally I think tanking with a team is disgraceful and it's not what a sport is about. You don't only affect your own team, you certainly affect the other teams in the same league.
i agree with everything you said Chimp.

As a European myself I'm kinda shocked to hear that we should dump European players, because personally, I think the majority of Euro-born players are the skilled guys in the league.

I understand people are getting tired of losing, but I dont see any reason to blame European hockey players... what kind of an argument is that?

I'll take a speed guy over a tough guy anyday, primarily because he'll outrun ya.

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Old
02-25-2007, 10:45 PM
  #57
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Some of you are seriously ridiculous. They had an off year so now were gonna be quick to jump the gun and dump our best forwards. Dont blame the fact that we had no real second line forwards all year to back up that first line with the exception of shanny on our top 3 Straka, Nylander, and Jagr. Dont blame the fact that we had piss poor coaching on our 3 forwards. Jagr has played hard all year even though he hasnt fully recovered from the shoulder injury, the guy wants to win. Really some of you make me sick you think he is immortal, you go out there and try playing with the shoulder problem he has had to play with. Or try playing when every night you are getting covered by 2 players with the opposing teams best checking forwards against you. You can talk about all you want how great players find ways to score/win but thats just a little hard when you have no help whatsoever from the other 3 lines. Jagr is our best player. He may not be our best leader when Shanahan is here but he is still our best player. I'm tired of people hating on him its ridiculous. He's had a pretty good season, sure its not last year's numbers but the numbers this year are still good and a ton of players would kill for those stats. He's done his best. We have a bad year and all the sudden lets panic and go crazy. Yes Jagr got hurt throwing a punch last year in the playoffs but hey no one else was coming to his defense. At least this year thats changed a little bit with shanny here.

Do not dismantle this team. Straka was having a great year, so was shanny but after awhile they were slowed down because there was no help from anyone else. This team is a couple good players away from being a solid team that could make the playoffs and do damage. Don't go out and deal nylander who is still a world class skater and makes things happen even though some of you just see it as him skating out there in circles and not doing anything. I dont know about you but to me when i guy can hold the puck in the opposing zone on his stick for more than 30 seconds is someone you dont get rid of, god forbid nobody was open to pass to. Dont break up this team. Hossa is just coming alive. Dont overreact and make dumb moves to get picks and put this team back in the lower part of the conference for next season too when like i said were only a couple players away from putting it all together.

Sure a few moves could be made. Like getting rid of Ward. Getting rid of Malik and if so maybe Rozsival too. Let the young guys like Pock, Staal, and Baranka take over. And even go out and get a defenseman like Souray to give us a stronger PP. Trade Rachunek for picks. Restructure the defense a little and add a true scoring forward to compliment shanny, maybe two. Trade Prucha for picks too. Keep Dupuis and Cullen. Keep Avery.

Hossa-Straka-Jagr
?????-Nylander-Shanny
Avery-Cullen-Dupuis
Ortmeyer-Betts-Callahan

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Old
02-25-2007, 10:46 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
The arguments against him are also somewhat strange. "He never shoots! He always circles around with the puck!" Well guess what, he's a playmaking center. Do you know what playmaking means? It's like complaining on a grinder because he hits too much.
Ummm, people here do that too. "Hello Hollweg/Ortmeyer, you are worthless cause you never score."

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Old
02-26-2007, 11:28 AM
  #59
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Great great post, chimp!

I agree with everything you said.

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02-26-2007, 11:35 AM
  #60
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Hooray, some sense has washed over the Rangers board!

Some of you just dislike Europeans in general and would find the every little last bit wrong with them, plain and simple

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02-26-2007, 11:36 AM
  #61
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I don't know if this is a racist notion but it sure is an ignorant one. Look around the league at some of the Euros and tell me you don't want them. They are some of the best players in the NHL today. The list is too long to even start.

You have a problem with some players, fine. You have a problem with Euros you're just not an astute follower of the game.

Don Cherry, dirtbag extraordinaire, would be very proud.

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Old
02-26-2007, 11:45 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Ummm, people here do that too. "Hello Hollweg/Ortmeyer, you are worthless cause you never score."
I agree, 4th line forwards like Hollweg and Ortmeyer need to chip in 7 or 8 goals a year. As much as I like Hollwegs/Ortmeyer grit, we need to replace them. Ortmeyer had an open shot in the slot on Thurs nite and could have won the Devil game but he shot wide. And Hollweg shot over Broduer when he had a wide open net. I dont expect these guys to become the next Guy LaFleur but they have to do better.

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Old
02-26-2007, 12:15 PM
  #63
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To me the reason for getting rid of Nylander is not because he's not a good player because he is but because of his age and because of his very reasonable contract I see him bringing back a top notch prospect or two--beyond that he falls somewhere in between a 1st and a 2nd line player and the money we'd save on hisvery reasonably priced contract could be used to entice another center who might be of more use to us next year--for instance a Briere--who is also to me somewhere between a 1st and 2nd line player but younger--or for another instance Jokinen who just by the criteria of being from Finland--even though he has a very good North-South game--would make him persona non grata--again though a younger player. Personally I don't give a damn where a player is from just so long as he earns his keep. Maybe the worst player we had this year other than Orr (a North American) was Hall (another North American) though there was Ozo and good riddance to him too. In any case no way in the world would I be looking to get rid of Prucha, Tyutin or Lundqvist all Europeans and all part of the solution. As for Ortmeyer not scoring enough. He's still a player I can live with. Goals aren't everything and to judge everyone by the standard of how many goals they score is ridiculous. We don't need him to score too many goals as long as the rest of the team is working the way it should. If he gets beat out fair and square in training camp by say a Byers or a Moore--then we'll get rid of him. Each player should be judged individually on what they bring or brought to the team--not on where they're from.

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Old
02-26-2007, 12:57 PM
  #64
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Maybe? Just maybe NYR (as a team) played beyond expectation last year and they are not ready to make that second step (becoming consistent playoff team).

As far as Euros… You can have Hatcher and Esche for Lundqvist and Rozsival.. Hatcher is very tall and Esche likes country music.. Whats not to like?

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Old
02-26-2007, 01:27 PM
  #65
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I'm not sure I would specifically target European players in the league, but it does seam that way on the Rangers. Rosival loves the passing game, and likes to miss the net on whatever shot he takes. Rachunek, well I outright don't like him as a player, he gets beat too often/easily (or helps the other team ). Prucha can score, but he gives up on plays, and he half ***** it when the other team is attacking (Must I remind you of the Devils game when he was beat fromm the blue line and allowed a goal because he took a terrible angle? Or that pathetic job he did on the underhanded goal the other night?). Nylander, well there can be arguments made about how good or how bad he is, I like him, but there will always be someone who hates him, but the Icecapades need to stop, if that's the only way he can make a play, maybe we should use him to get some prospects. Straka is having a pretty good year also, but I don't like his play when he doesnt have the puck, he turns into Prucha almost, I don't want to call him lazy but if the shoe fits...
Now, the reason simply saying Europeans are the problem is partially wrong. Jagr, like him or not (I like him as a player, but he is in no way a leader and you can't get Lord Stanley without a leader...), he is one of the best on the team. He is playing hurt, and is on a cold streak, but when he wants to, he controls games. Hossa is getting better everyday and is proving himself game after game, he is exactly what we need more of. Then of course, Lundquist, who doesn't love this guy? Honestly?
I think the Europeans on the Rangers get it especially bad from everyone because the Rangers aren't exactly a physical presence. I mean we do how our enforcers, but there not that big, and they play more mind games than actual hits/fights (Orr/Hollweg come to mind, while Avery Ortmeyer get under the opponents skin). I think if there was a bigger physical presence, as in being able to push other teams around, everyone would love how the Euros play, they are just in a difficult situation.
BTW: If we are gunna bring race into it, I'd love to get a couple crazy Russians on the team...

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02-26-2007, 01:44 PM
  #66
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i can't believe so many people even acknowledged this thread

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02-26-2007, 01:57 PM
  #67
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I can't believe so many people wrote so many crap in this thread.

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Old
02-26-2007, 02:19 PM
  #68
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Bottom line is we need to get tougher, more grit and more passion. We sorely lack that. Outside of a few players the current crop we have is not getting this done.

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02-26-2007, 02:22 PM
  #69
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We need more emotion around here. We need more toughness. I look around the league everyday...see the fights and the physicality in games...and some of the things that go on would never happen here. Look at Buffalo-Ottawa. After Biron got whooped by Emery, Peters got in there and gave him a beating. No one would do that on this team with the exception of Hollweg/Orr/Avery. Not one defenseman would stick up for Henrik if a guy like Avery ran him. The team lacks overall team toughness. They've got an enforcer...they've got a hitter...and a nice little agitator. However....not one other guy will even throw a hit. It really is ridiculous. Sure Jed hits every now and then too...but nothing hard. The backline is probably the softest in hockey. Toughen up boys

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Old
02-28-2007, 09:08 AM
  #70
Chimp
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And now we have Mara who can drop the gloves.

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02-28-2007, 11:53 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by True Blue Bleed Blue View Post
We need more emotion around here. We need more toughness. I look around the league everyday...see the fights and the physicality in games...and some of the things that go on would never happen here. Look at Buffalo-Ottawa. After Biron got whooped by Emery, Peters got in there and gave him a beating. No one would do that on this team with the exception of Hollweg/Orr/Avery. Not one defenseman would stick up for Henrik if a guy like Avery ran him. The team lacks overall team toughness. They've got an enforcer...they've got a hitter...and a nice little agitator. However....not one other guy will even throw a hit. It really is ridiculous. Sure Jed hits every now and then too...but nothing hard. The backline is probably the softest in hockey. Toughen up boys
Fighting will be eliminated from NHL in a few years. No sense to stack up bullies, enforcers or whatever. Once you take violence away, there is practically nothing left the most of the tough guys could offer. I am all for NA players like Sid Crosby. Could we get those?

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02-28-2007, 01:00 PM
  #72
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Fighting will be eliminated from NHL in a few years. No sense to stack up bullies, enforcers or whatever. Once you take violence away, there is practically nothing left the most of the tough guys could offer. I am all for NA players like Sid Crosby. Could we get those?
You really think it will be eliminated? Its on the decline but I dont thik Bettman has the balls to get rid of it all together.

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02-28-2007, 01:54 PM
  #73
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You really think it will be eliminated? Its on the decline but I dont thik Bettman has the balls to get rid of it all together.
You keep saying 'Bettman won't do this or that', but If you know anything about how that league office is run you'd know that even Bettman has people he needs to answer to. If big changes were to happen it wouldn't be because of one guys decision. It's the old way vs. the new one, and its been that way in the NHL since for as long as I remember.

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02-28-2007, 04:54 PM
  #74
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You keep saying 'Bettman won't do this or that', but If you know anything about how that league office is run you'd know that even Bettman has people he needs to answer to. If big changes were to happen it wouldn't be because of one guys decision. It's the old way vs. the new one, and its been that way in the NHL since for as long as I remember.
Bettman represents the new way to me, when I speak about him I mean him and his posse that go along with him. Its basically more of a group that makes decisions but Bettman is the leader. Kind of like referring to George Bush when he still has to go through Congress and everything.

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02-28-2007, 04:57 PM
  #75
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If they were really trying to eliminate fighting would the GMs have just voted to lighten up on the instigator rule? The league made some big changes post-lockout and right now we are seeing a correction in the system... a balance is being found. Look at the reaction to the officiating, the cap rules, everything. Everything is coming back to the middle.

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