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Is this Philly's year?

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Old
12-11-2003, 05:47 AM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PEli
Let it be known that the only reason I or anybody should favor the Leafs over the Flyers is Belfour. As much as I think the guy is a few nuggets short of a happy meal, he's a gamer. He's been there before and he's not showing any signs of slowing down in terms of consistency.
Belfour is a gamer, but they had him last year. Until they get some better defenseman they're still a few steps behind the other teams in the East.

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12-11-2003, 06:11 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Belfour is a gamer, but they had him last year. Until they get some better defenseman they're still a few steps behind the other teams in the East.
The Flyers had the same group of forwards last year as well. What's the difference this year? The Senators had the same team as last year. That doesn't mean anything. The Devils are virtually unchanged as well. None of this means:

A) The Flyers will beat the Leafs if they run up against them.
B) The Senators will once again lose in the ECF.
C) The Devils will win it all again.

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12-11-2003, 06:18 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PEli
The Flyers had the same group of forwards last year as well. What's the difference this year? The Senators had the same team as last year. That doesn't mean anything. The Devils are virtually unchanged as well. None of this means:

A) The Flyers will beat the Leafs if they run up against them.
B) The Senators will once again lose in the ECF.
C) The Devils will win it all again.

Agreed, nothing is guarunteed, but I would say that of the 4 teams mentioned, the weakest link any of the 4 has, is the Leafs blueline.

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Old
12-11-2003, 06:26 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teezax
Put this in your head, Cechmanek is not better than Hackett, never was, never will be, i think his numbers this year explain that. He only had that many shutouts and great GAA's as a result of Philly's defensive game. Hackett is undefeated in his last 9 games and is singlehandedly the reason we won our last 3 games. 38 Saves against the Bruins, 36 against the Habs. The only thing i'll question are his rebounds, but Philly's D is good enough to help him out in that regard.
Hold on here, is this the same Cechmanek that got widely praised as the clear cut Vezina winner by Philly fans at the end of last season? The same one that got endlessly defended saying he was far from the reason for their playoff faillure? How it was the dissapearing offense and such?

You can't have it both ways. Cechmanek was a solid netminder last season and he was already producing some nice numbers before Hitch arrived so your logic is flawed. Yet, you do view Hackett as a much better netminder and you aren't suprised in the least why he suddenly records numbers of a 1.71 and .931%? After floating through 2.50 and 3.50 for pretty much his entire career? Same goes for Esche, or hell, look at Roloson, Fernandez, Schwab or even Brodeur, all guys that suddenly achieve career years playing in a simular system? That's not a coincidence my dear..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teezax
I'd question Turco before questioning Hackett.
Classic response. Trashing a certain player of the respective team from the poster you disagree with. Turco achieved more in one season than Hackett has ever done in his long backup career. But mood point anyways, there won't be any questioning Turco anything, as I doubt the Stars will reach the playoffs.

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Old
12-11-2003, 06:27 AM
  #30
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In Hitch's system, if we can win with Esche or Hackett.
It will come down to seeding. If we end up with the 1st or 2nd seed, we most likely will avoid one of either Ottawa or Devils.
There is always the chance of the 2nd or 3rd seed, losing to the 6th, like Tampa did last season.
The Flyers missed the 2nd seed, by 1 point, and had a grueling 7 game series w/ Toronto. If Chemo would have not allowed the "soft" goal, we'd have disposed of them in 5 or 6, not 7, and the majority in OT!

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Old
12-11-2003, 06:28 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Belfour is a gamer, but they had him last year. Until they get some better defenseman they're still a few steps behind the other teams in the East.
While they're by no means elite, I think replacing the Leafs' weakest links with Klee and Marchment is a noteworthy upgrade.

Any move that puts Belak on the bench instead of on the ice, is a good move.

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12-11-2003, 06:34 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmg
While they're by no means elite, I think replacing the Leafs' weakest links with Klee and Marchment is a noteworthy upgrade.

Any move that puts Belak on the bench instead of on the ice, is a good move.

Klee & Marchment replaced Wesley & Svehla from last year, so I'm not sure I would call that an upgrade.

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12-11-2003, 06:38 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Klee & Marchment replaced Wesley & Svehla from last year, so I'm not sure I would call that an upgrade.
Klee has been wonderful this season, at both ends. And Marchment, well, I think the opposition prefers Wesley above Mush as Mush, despite his lack of talent, is one of the most feared players in the league. I say the two are a very decent replacement for Svehla and Wesley.

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12-11-2003, 06:46 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
Klee has been wonderful this season, at both ends. And Marchment, well, I think the opposition prefers Wesley above Mush as Mush, despite his lack of talent, is one of the most feared players in the league. I say the two are a very decent replacement for Svehla and Wesley.
Even if you say that Klee & Marchment are slight upgrades on Svehla & Wesley (not sure I agree on that) it still leaves the Leafs with a very similar defense corps that that had lasy year. One that leaves Belfour hung out to dry far too often.

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12-11-2003, 06:58 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Even if you say that Klee & Marchment are slight upgrades on Svehla & Wesley (not sure I agree on that) it still leaves the Leafs with a very similar defense corps that that had lasy year. One that leaves Belfour hung out to dry far too often.
I think they are a decent pairing that would be capable repalcing Svehla and Wesley when they are asked upon. I still have them slightly below the former 2, but I view Mush and Klee much higher than you give them credit for.

Agree on your point in general though..

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12-11-2003, 07:00 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Even if you say that Klee & Marchment are slight upgrades on Svehla & Wesley (not sure I agree on that) it still leaves the Leafs with a very similar defense corps that that had lasy year. One that leaves Belfour hung out to dry far too often.
I don't think that the Leafs are going into the playoffs without upgrading their blueline. Antropov, Stajan, Steen, other prospects and picks will be used as bait and IMO, that's damn good bait. The Leafs can get a quality #2 and a decent 3rd pairing guy and they'll be a lot better.

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12-11-2003, 07:01 AM
  #37
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[QUOTE=Modano = God]Hold on here, is this the same Cechmanek that got widely praised as the clear cut Vezina winner by Philly fans at the end of last season? The same one that got endlessly defended saying he was far from the reason for their playoff faillure? How it was the dissapearing offense and such?

You can't have it both ways. Cechmanek was a solid netminder last season and he was already producing some nice numbers before Hitch arrived so your logic is flawed. Yet, you do view Hackett as a much better netminder and you aren't suprised in the least why he suddenly records numbers of a 1.71 and .931%? After floating through 2.50 and 3.50 for pretty much his entire career? Same goes for Esche, or hell, look at Roloson, Fernandez, Schwab or even Brodeur, all guys that suddenly achieve career years playing in a simular system? That's not a coincidence my dear..
QUOTE]


I was not one of them, Cechmanek cost the Flyers atleast four games in last years playoffs. Cechmanek is good, but Hackett is a much better fit for the style of play the Flyers have. Hes a guy thats always in postion to make a save, as where Cechmanek was all reaction. Goalie is without a doubt and upgrade or at the very least even. It the powerplay and defense thats been even better, much like the Stars in Hitchcocks 2nd year.

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12-11-2003, 07:06 AM
  #38
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No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As long as Bob Clarke is in charge in Philadelphia, you can kiss your championship hopes goodbye. Plus, add in the Hackett factor and you are in for a 1st round loss. Wait until Ottawa picks it back up and watch how your Flyers take a dive.

HaB

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Old
12-11-2003, 07:07 AM
  #39
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How can anyone at this point have the Leafs over the Flyers? The Flyers beat the Leafs last year, and the Series did go 7 game, but the Leafs were outplayed in atleast 5 of the games and there only match up this year the Flyers pounded them 7-0 with Belfour in net. The Flyers are also a better and much deeper team then last year and have a powerplay. It would be like me trying to put the Flyers above the Sens.

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12-11-2003, 07:22 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Even if you say that Klee & Marchment are slight upgrades on Svehla & Wesley (not sure I agree on that) it still leaves the Leafs with a very similar defense corps that that had lasy year. One that leaves Belfour hung out to dry far too often.
I was assuming they have had a substantial impact, because Belfour is facing better than three shots fewer per 60 minutes of play this year (25.97 shots per 60 minutes) than he did last year (29.16).

Again, I don't think the leafs' defense is elite, by *any* stretch - but I will argue that it is _improved_.

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Old
12-11-2003, 07:25 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
I think they are a decent pairing that would be capable repalcing Svehla and Wesley when they are asked upon. I still have them slightly below the former 2, but I view Mush and Klee much higher than you give them credit for.

Agree on your point in general though..

I'm saying that they are equal to Svehla & Welsey, which is more than we both think of them. That still isn't enough. The Leafs defenseman can still be exploited, and that hasn't changed from last year.

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12-11-2003, 07:26 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PEli
I don't think that the Leafs are going into the playoffs without upgrading their blueline. Antropov, Stajan, Steen, other prospects and picks will be used as bait and IMO, that's damn good bait. The Leafs can get a quality #2 and a decent 3rd pairing guy and they'll be a lot better.

If they add those defenseman, then I may change my mind. I'm basing the teams as they are currently constituted.

Obviously trades and/or injuries could alter the balance of power.

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12-11-2003, 07:52 AM
  #43
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I think a lot will have to do with the way everybody ends up seeded. I agree that whoever wins the division between NJ/Phi should technically have an easier route to the Conference Finals. But even then, you never know there'll be a team that sucks it up in the first half, but plays elite hockey in the 2nd half and ends up with a lower seed (see Anaheim last year). Devils barely edged out the Flyers last year, and it made a ton of difference. Boston/Tampa was a whole lot easier than Toronto/Ottawa would have been.

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12-11-2003, 08:39 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
Hold on here, is this the same Cechmanek that got widely praised as the clear cut Vezina winner by Philly fans at the end of last season? The same one that got endlessly defended saying he was far from the reason for their playoff faillure? How it was the dissapearing offense and such?

You can't have it both ways. Cechmanek was a solid netminder last season and he was already producing some nice numbers before Hitch arrived so your logic is flawed. Yet, you do view Hackett as a much better netminder and you aren't suprised in the least why he suddenly records numbers of a 1.71 and .931%? After floating through 2.50 and 3.50 for pretty much his entire career? Same goes for Esche, or hell, look at Roloson, Fernandez, Schwab or even Brodeur, all guys that suddenly achieve career years playing in a simular system? That's not a coincidence my dear..



Classic response. Trashing a certain player of the respective team from the poster you disagree with. Turco achieved more in one season than Hackett has ever done in his long backup career. But mood point anyways, there won't be any questioning Turco anything, as I doubt the Stars will reach the playoffs.
Excuse me? what is Turco doing without Hatcher and Sydor in front of him? that's what i thought. He was a result of a good defensive system as well, Hackett has played for putrid defenses all his life so he is not to blame. He played very well in Montreal considering the team they had. And i was never on the Cecho bandwagon and all the other Flyers posters can vouch for me there, but the fact remains Hackett is playing well this year because he is comfortable in Philly, and he sees that this would be his best chance to win the cup. Defence or no defence, the guy is on his game. He didn't have that one good season and asked for a big paycheck the next year and didn't deliver (see Giguere Theodore Turco) The difference between HAckett and Cecho is that Hackett can steal us a game while Cecho can't.

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12-11-2003, 08:46 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Even if you say that Klee & Marchment are slight upgrades on Svehla & Wesley (not sure I agree on that) it still leaves the Leafs with a very similar defense corps that that had lasy year. One that leaves Belfour hung out to dry far too often.
One other note to this. McCabe is twice the player he was last year, and Pilar is much improved over WonderLumme.

That aside, I agree, I wouldn't consider the Leafs to be serious contenders without a good upgrade on the D.

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12-11-2003, 08:50 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensGod
This goes for any team in the East.

For me...there are 4 teams that could potentially come out of the east this year.

Ottawa
Jersey
Philly
or
Tampa

It all depends on who's got the easiest playoff run...and who get's the lucky bounce in game 7 with 2 minutes left.
So you pick Tampa over Toronto eh? Way to be objective.

Quote:
How can anyone at this point have the Leafs over the Flyers? The Flyers beat the Leafs last year, and the Series did go 7 game, but the Leafs were outplayed in atleast 5 of the games and there only match up this year the Flyers pounded them 7-0 with Belfour in net. The Flyers are also a better and much deeper team then last year and have a powerplay. It would be like me trying to put the Flyers above the Sens
If you think that 7-1 loss was an accurate representation of the Maple Leafs performance this season, then you are kidding yourself. As hard as it may be to admit, the Leafs have a very good team (when healthy.. or actually when they lose key players it seems). Keep in mind that the Leafs shut out the Flyers twice last year 6-0 and 3-0 and look how that turned out in the playoffs..


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Old
12-11-2003, 08:54 AM
  #47
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No its not philly year

You will not win with hackett // Ecshh (whatever)

You need a big time goalie to win in the playoff

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12-11-2003, 08:57 AM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shakes
So you pick Tampa over Toronto eh? Way to be objective.If you think that 7-1 loss was an accurate representation of the Maple Leafs performance this season, then you are kidding yourself. As hard as it may be to admit, the Leafs have a very good team (when healthy.. or actually when they lose key players it seems). Keep in mind that the Leafs shut out the Flyers twice last year 6-0 and 3-0 and look how that turned out in the playoffs..
Good point but keep this in mind, Hitchcock knows how to analyze a team, and knows where they have flaws, obviously with Toronto it was their D, so he knew exactly how to mold his team to beat the Leafs, and ever since those Leaf shutouts, we have been dominating them. Pat Quinn doesn't know how to beat defensive teams, thus being unsuccesful against the Devs and Flyers.

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12-11-2003, 09:03 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markov79fan
No its not philly year

You will not win with hackett // Ecshh (whatever)

You need a big time goalie to win in the playoff
What like Irbe/Weekes or Hextall/Snow or Osgood/Legace??

These are all pretty good goalies, NOT "big time" and they managed to make it to the end. Say what you will, it's TEAM PLAY that gets you to the end. Minnesota proved that last year.

And by the way it's Esche

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12-11-2003, 09:19 AM
  #50
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The difference for the Flyers this year is the players buying in to Hitchcock's system. Even with the same players they are much more focused and consistent than EVER before. Last year they shared the lowest goals against with Jersey. Whose goaltender was better and whose defense was better?

Cechmanek was not a fan favorite, contrary to popular belief. Most people I know preferred Boucher.

Toronto, regardless of how many points they have or will have, will not be any better until they get rid of Quinn. Everyone who joins that team begins whining about how the other team cheated or the refs are against them. It's never the Leafs fault for their failures. They need to learn to be responsible.

As for folding in the playoffs, did you watch last year? They didn't exactly fold. Every year only one team gets it done. Every other team failed or "folded". Are the Sens better because they fold later in the playoffs?

 
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