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Lidstrom's last month or so..

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Old
03-13-2007, 02:07 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
He HAS looked slower and has made more mistakes than ever before.

Many of his points have been "secondary assists".

And...I think he plays too much. 30m/game...and many night even more than that, is alot for a guy his age. I know injuries have been part of him declining since heīs played with unfit or bad players, but I hold him in sutch high regard itīs kinda sad to see.

Was really only looking and hoping for an explanation and someone telling me "hey man, heīs soon back to normal again"
Will you PLEASE stop pulling stuff out of thin air? He averages 27 minutes TOI and I only checked back to the middle of January, but since then, he's played over 30 minutes only two times (30.11 and 30.20 respectively).

I didn't check on your secondary assist claim, but since your "facts" in this thread have been complete BS so far, I'm assuming that you're talking out of your *ss again. Besides, the "secondary assists inflate good players' point totals" argument has been debunked many times. It's the fringe players that benefit mostly from secondary assists.

If you expect way more than 70 points in a season from Nick Lidström, a season in which the Wings have devoted more time and energy to be better defensively (obviously at the cost of offense), you're a fool. He's cracked 70 points three times in his career. You make it sound like it's something he should do in his sleep.

Stop trolling, troll.

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03-13-2007, 02:47 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
He HAS looked slower and has made more mistakes than ever before.

Many of his points have been "secondary assists".

And...I think he plays too much. 30m/game...and many night even more than that, is alot for a guy his age. I know injuries have been part of him declining since heīs played with unfit or bad players, but I hold him in sutch high regard itīs kinda sad to see.

Was really only looking and hoping for an explanation and someone telling me "hey man, heīs soon back to normal again"


You asked why his points were down, you never mentioned secondary assists. You simply implied that his points were down...which they are not.

And I just find it completely hilarious how someone would question a players +/- stats when he is leading the league in that particular stat. Was he -3 the other day? He sure was. And he still leads the league. Like I said before, it happens to everyone, even the best. Also...+/- is more a team stat than anything. I actually hate that stat more than any other stat in hockey. When Hasek failed to stop that puck on the shoot around the other day and it bounced right out in front of the net for Bergeron for a slam dunk empty net goal, every Red Wing on the ice got a minus. Its a misleading stat...very misleading.

To round things out. Yes, Lidstrom is slowly declining. But he is so terrific that even a slowly declining Nick Lidstrom is better than 98% of the other defensmen in the league.

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03-13-2007, 02:59 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Higgy4 View Post
You asked why his points were down, you never mentioned secondary assists. You simply implied that his points were down...which they are not.

And I just find it completely hilarious how someone would question a players +/- stats when he is leading the league in that particular stat. Was he -3 the other day? He sure was. And he still leads the league. Like I said before, it happens to everyone, even the best. Also...+/- is more a team stat than anything. I actually hate that stat more than any other stat in hockey. When Hasek failed to stop that puck on the shoot around the other day and it bounced right out in front of the net for Bergeron for a slam dunk empty net goal, every Red Wing on the ice got a minus. Its a misleading stat...very misleading.

To round things out. Yes, Lidstrom is slowly declining. But he is so terrific that even a slowly declining Nick Lidstrom is better than 98% of the other defensmen in the league.
You're off by a couple percentage points.

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Old
03-13-2007, 05:13 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by TheDakkster View Post
Will you PLEASE stop pulling stuff out of thin air? He averages 27 minutes TOI and I only checked back to the middle of January, but since then, he's played over 30 minutes only two times (30.11 and 30.20 respectively).

I didn't check on your secondary assist claim, but since your "facts" in this thread have been complete BS so far, I'm assuming that you're talking out of your *ss again. Besides, the "secondary assists inflate good players' point totals" argument has been debunked many times. It's the fringe players that benefit mostly from secondary assists.

If you expect way more than 70 points in a season from Nick Lidström, a season in which the Wings have devoted more time and energy to be better defensively (obviously at the cost of offense), you're a fool. He's cracked 70 points three times in his career. You make it sound like it's something he should do in his sleep.

Stop trolling, troll.
You have noticed that there have been an inflation in points the last two seasons, right? He gets a huge ammount of time on the blue line during PP, and with that time he should get more points. Especially with guys like Z & D out there, and with Homer doing what he does. My old man whoīs retired and has alot of free time on his hands (donīt have to get up to job in the mornings) watches alot of the Wings games, and he made the same comment just a couple of days ago.

He said something along the lines, that he lacked focus and was unconcentrated. Something that made him lose position which made it possible for players to get around him. Letīs face it, heīs never been a flash, what makes/made him great was his positioning and smoth balanced skating, not his explosiveness.

With this is mind I hope itīs just temporary and that he gets a monster playoff, there should be 3-4 good years left in him, perhaps even more.

I think it all comes down to motivation, if you lack it, you come off as unfocused and unconcentrated.

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03-13-2007, 05:19 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
You have noticed that there have been an inflation in points the last two seasons, right? He gets a huge ammount of time on the blue line during PP, and with that time he should get more points. Especially with guys like Z & D out there, and with Homer doing what he does. My old man whoīs retired and has alot of free time on his hands (donīt have to get up to job in the mornings) watches alot of the Wings games, and he made the same comment just a couple of days ago.

He said something along the lines, that he lacked focus and was unconcentrated. Something that made him lose position which made it possible for players to get around him. Letīs face it, heīs never been a flash, what makes/made him great was his positioning and smoth balanced skating, not his explosiveness.

With this is mind I hope itīs just temporary and that he gets a monster playoff, there should be 3-4 good years left in him, perhaps even more.

I think it all comes down to motivation, if you lack it, you come off as unfocused and unconcentrated.
I'm surprised that you didn't throw out any more false... errr, I mean "facts" in that last post.

The rest of us are watching the games too, you know. So what your old man says is ... well, let's just say that "irrelevant" is putting it mildly.

Like I said: Stop trolling, troll.

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03-13-2007, 05:19 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
You have noticed that there have been an inflation in points the last two seasons, right? He gets a huge ammount of time on the blue line during PP, and with that time he should get more points. Especially with guys like Z & D out there, and with Homer doing what he does. My old man whoīs retired and has alot of free time on his hands (donīt have to get up to job in the mornings) watches alot of the Wings games, and he made the same comment just a couple of days ago.

He said something along the lines, that he lacked focus and was unconcentrated. Something that made him lose position which made it possible for players to get around him. Letīs face it, heīs never been a flash, what makes/made him great was his positioning and smoth balanced skating, not his explosiveness.

With this is mind I hope itīs just temporary and that he gets a monster playoff, there should be 3-4 good years left in him, perhaps even more.

I think it all comes down to motivation, if you lack it, you come off as unfocused and unconcentrated.
Lidstrom had 38 points the season prior to the lockout. He is now about to put together his 2nd straight 70 point season.

Wouldn't that qualify as an INCREASE in production???

Seriously, what is your problem? You are making zero sense and actually becoming quite comical.

Keep it coming.

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03-13-2007, 05:59 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Higgy4 View Post
Lidstrom had 38 points the season prior to the lockout. He is now about to put together his 2nd straight 70 point season.

Wouldn't that qualify as an INCREASE in production???

Seriously, what is your problem? You are making zero sense and actually becoming quite comical.

Keep it coming.
He had 62 the season before that, whatīs your point? You point out his worst season and compare it to the first one with the new rules, where everyones stats gets boosted, whereīs the sense in that? Heīs had a couple of 70+ seasons during the dead hockey era, he should be able to pack some more now with the current rules.

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Old
03-13-2007, 06:01 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by TheDakkster View Post
I'm surprised that you didn't throw out any more false... errr, I mean "facts" in that last post.

The rest of us are watching the games too, you know. So what your old man says is ... well, let's just say that "irrelevant" is putting it mildly.

Like I said: Stop trolling, troll.
How about you try to actually argue your case instead of using derogatory remarks and generally acting like a little kid?

Tell me in what way Iīm wrong in saying heīs losing his step, for a start..?

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Old
03-13-2007, 06:10 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
How about you try to actually argue your case instead of using derogatory remarks and generally acting like a little kid?

Tell me in what way Iīm wrong in saying heīs losing his step, for a start..?
I really think your overanalyzing a 1 month stretch of the season. Its a long season. Yes, Lidstrom is not the same player he was 5-10 years ago, but you're really overanalyzing this. If you've watched the Wings at all over the past month, their record is a bit deceiving. They have not looked great as a team against playoff teams, epecially teams fighting for a playoff spot.

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Old
03-13-2007, 06:16 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
How about you try to actually argue your case instead of using derogatory remarks and generally acting like a little kid?

Tell me in what way Iīm wrong in saying heīs losing his step, for a start..?
We've already refuted every "fact" you've used to add substance to your argument and now you're left with something that is not only very subjective, but also pure conjecture/assumption on your part. Unless you can crawl inside Lidström's head, your claims don't have any validity.

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03-13-2007, 06:33 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by TheDakkster View Post
We've already refuted every "fact" you've used to add substance to your argument and now you're left with something that is not only very subjective, but also pure conjecture/assumption on your part. Unless you can crawl inside Lidström's head, your claims don't have any validity.
So in other words, you donīt think heīs lost his step?


Okey.

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03-13-2007, 07:44 PM
  #37
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How about I end this by pointing out Nick was so many steps ahead of everyone that EVEN IF has lost a step... he's still way ahead of the competition. Chalk up Norris #5 now. That should pretty much end any debate. If you're the defacto number one D-man in the league, so what?

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03-13-2007, 09:44 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
He had 62 the season before that, whatīs your point? You point out his worst season and compare it to the first one with the new rules, where everyones stats gets boosted, whereīs the sense in that? Heīs had a couple of 70+ seasons during the dead hockey era, he should be able to pack some more now with the current rules.
70 is more than 62.

No?

Your schtick is old now. I know you dont take this seriously, but you ARE just being a troll now.

Your opinions have been debunked by numerous FACTS and yet you continue to prod.

Troll your wares elsewhere.

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03-13-2007, 09:48 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
So in other words, you donīt think heīs lost his step?


Okey.

Can you read? I know that atleast TWICE I have agreed with you that he is losing a step. I bet all of us on this board can atest to that.

That being said, you continue to bring up point production and other nonsense to justify your opinion. He had a CAREER HIGH in points last season and will top the 70 point mark again this year.

Give me the name of 1 other NHL defenseman who will have back to back 70 point seasons the past 2 years.

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03-13-2007, 09:50 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
How about I end this by pointing out Nick was so many steps ahead of everyone that EVEN IF has lost a step... he's still way ahead of the competition. Chalk up Norris #5 now. That should pretty much end any debate. If you're the defacto number one D-man in the league, so what?

Agreed.

We dont get a whole lot of trolls on this board, but this guy is definitely trying to give us a glimpse.

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Old
03-14-2007, 03:42 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Higgy4 View Post
Agreed.

We dont get a whole lot of trolls on this board, but this guy is definitely trying to give us a glimpse.
Try to be original insyead of just bouncing the word "troll" against the walls.

Points arenīt everything, a defenders main objective is to....defend. And lately he hasnīt been himself, stopping everyone who tries to get past him.

Up til about two months ago I hadnīt seen anyone get past him, one on one, in several years. Since then Iīve seen it on numerous occasions, forgive me, but it makes me puzzled.

I mean... you canīt get that much slower during sutch a short timeperiod?

Or is it merely coincidental?

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03-14-2007, 04:12 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Try to be original insyead of just bouncing the word "troll" against the walls.

Points arenīt everything, a defenders main objective is to....defend. And lately he hasnīt been himself, stopping everyone who tries to get past him.

Up til about two months ago I hadnīt seen anyone get past him, one on one, in several years. Since then Iīve seen it on numerous occasions, forgive me, but it makes me puzzled.

I mean... you canīt get that much slower during sutch a short timeperiod?

Or is it merely coincidental?
I remember Patrick Sharp getting by him last season a couple of times. There were others too. You're trolling. Go away.

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03-14-2007, 07:53 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by bilros View Post
Try to be original insyead of just bouncing the word "troll" against the walls.

Points arenīt everything, a defenders main objective is to....defend. And lately he hasnīt been himself, stopping everyone who tries to get past him.

Up til about two months ago I hadnīt seen anyone get past him, one on one, in several years. Since then Iīve seen it on numerous occasions, forgive me, but it makes me puzzled.

I mean... you canīt get that much slower during sutch a short timeperiod?

Or is it merely coincidental?
Ok, for the fourth time. We all know he is losing a step. How many more times do I have to say that we see the same thing??

Lidstroms game has always been position, however. And he is still always in the right position. Even when a player gets by him he has a way of keeping said player to the outside and depriving him of a really good scoring chance. He is 37 or so years old now. Ray Bourque wasnt his same old self at the end of his career either, but he was still in the top echelon of defenders. Lidstrom is in that same mold, maybe even better.

You want to talk his speed? Thats the only legit point you have brought up this entire time.

You want to talk about production? Just stop because you sound like a fool.

Now, go ahead and respond AGAIN about him losing step so I have to say that I agree for the 5th time.

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Old
03-14-2007, 08:06 AM
  #44
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Joe Sakic lost a step. Ergo, he sucks.

Hey, I like this game.

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03-14-2007, 12:46 PM
  #45
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Come on folks, give the man a break. He/she just wants to discuss hockey, it is not trolling.

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03-14-2007, 12:50 PM
  #46
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What's funny is that Higgy called SMOE grumpy in another thread! I remember Higgy used to be the optimist on this board. Maybe a long day at work, or else he's having a Dakkster moment.


If there's one guy you just don't pick on its Lidstrom. Not when the guy is having another Norris year. What more can you want out of defensemen? That he walk on water too (the liquid kind before anyone gets cute).


Last edited by Fugu: 03-14-2007 at 01:03 PM.
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Old
03-14-2007, 12:50 PM
  #47
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Come on folks, give the man a break. He/she just wants to discuss hockey, it is not trolling.

Go away troll.

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03-14-2007, 01:00 PM
  #48
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What's funny is that Higgy called SMOE grumpy in another thread! I remember Higgy used to be the optimist on this board. Maybe a long day at work, or else he's have a Dakkster moment.


If there's one guy you just don't pick on its Lidstrom. Not when the guy is having another Norris year. What more can you want out of defensemen? That he walk on water too (the liquid kind before anyone gets cute).
He/she did pick up the wrong guy. Lidstrom leads the league in +/- and all Dmen in points, not even a miracla can take away the Norris from his this season. He deserves the Hart this season IMO.



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Go away troll.
I've been away all day long, did not even start a single thread ............... yet.

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Old
03-14-2007, 06:14 PM
  #49
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Come on folks, give the man a break. He/she just wants to discuss hockey, it is not trolling.
I refuse to distinguish between whether incredibly dimwitted things are said intentionally to elicit a response, or because the person actually believes them.

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