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Vancouver / Los Angeles Trade Proposal

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Old
12-13-2003, 12:24 PM
  #1
Burkey
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Vancouver / Los Angeles Trade Proposal

To Vancouver: Ian Laperriere (RW/C) and Yanick Lehoux (C)
Laperriere's Vital Information
SALARY: $900,000 (source: nhlpa.com)
CONTRACT STATUS: RFA after this season
SIZE: 6'1, 200 lbs
STATS: 20 GP, 0 G, 6 A, 6 PTS (source: tsn.ca)

Lehoux's Vital Information
SALARY: unknown
CONTRACT STATUS: unknown
SIZE: 6'0, 200 lbs
STATS: 25 GP, 6 G, 13 A, 19 PTS for Manchester of the AHL

To Los Angeles: Jarkku Ruutu (LW/RW) and R.J. Umberger (C)
Ruutu's Vital Information
SALARY: $575,000 (source: nhlpa.com)
CONTRACT STATUS: until 2004-05 season*
SIZE: 6'2, 200 lbs
STATS: 24 GP, 1 G, 1 A, 2 PTS (source: tsn.ca)

Umberger's Vital Information
SALARY: UNSIGNED
CONTRACT STATUS: UNSIGNED
SIZE: 6'2, 200 lbs
STATS: HAS NOT PLAYED

* - Disclaimer: I spent a good amount of time trying to figure out the length of Ruutu's contract, but was unable to find anything definite. According to canucksworld.com, he's believed to have signed a 2 year deal last summer, which means he's signed through until the summer of 2005.

REASONING:

The Los Angeles Kings do this deal because Laperriere is a free agent at the end of the season. With the rule in place that allows guys with ten years of professional experience and a salary below the league average to become unrestricted free agents, Laperriere could be lost for nothing. The CBA also could bring in a lower unrestricted free agency age, which means there's a good chance that Laperriere could leave Los Angeles as a free agent. Why lose him for nothing? Might as well trade him, although admittedly LA has managed to prevent guys like Norstrom and Miller from leaving as UFAs. They get one of the peskiest agitators in the NHL in Ruutu. Ruutu will never score much and is prone to bad penalties, but if they had him AND Sean Avery, they could drive opponents insane. Ruutu had a good playoff for the Canucks last season and is a valuable role player. Umberger is a fine prospect, but his uncertain contract status lowers his value. He had a big year last year for Ohio State, earning All-American second team honors and was considered a candidate for the Hobey Baker. He has a good set of wheels, can handle the puck well and proved he can score in the clutch with 8 game winners last year in the CCHA.

The Canucks do this deal because, IMO, they aren't going at full steam and need a minor deal to shake things up a bit. This deal would give them a veteran warrior in Laperriere who is a good penalty killer who plays a physical brand of hockey and works hard. He's a leader and would be a good playoff player for the Canucks. Lehoux can score goals, and that's something that the Canucks don't have much of in the pipeline. He does need to upgrade his defensive play, but he's playing well in the AHL and looks like a potential NHLer. Umberger could be lost for nothing (except a compensatory draft pick), so the Canucks might as well move him for SOMETHING, no matter what Brian Burke says. In fact, I don't think that Brian Burke is unwilling to trade him. He's just saying he isn't so Umberger perhaps lowers his demand. Smart strategy, but this kid probably sees through that. In any case, I think Umberger could be moved and I think this would be a good return for him and Ruutu.

Thoughts? I know that it probably need some reworking, but is it doable?


Last edited by Burkey: 12-13-2003 at 12:29 PM.
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Old
12-13-2003, 12:31 PM
  #2
Sydor25
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We already have an agitator in Avery who is doing very well (2G, 9 A) and you don't really need two of them. What about a deal for Ed Jovanovski?

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12-13-2003, 12:32 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25
What about a deal for Ed Jovanovski?
I doubt that you'd be willing to offer what that would take.

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12-13-2003, 12:33 PM
  #4
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Excellent research and thought. But from a kings standpoint... No. Lappy is a fan favorite and doubtfull he will go anywhere, Lehoux has the possibility to be a top 6 and with the prospects dealt in the Straka deal, i can't see Dave Taylor letting anymore go. Maybe a deal with a couple D'men being swapped in place of Lappy and Ruutu. Possibly trading Modry for Salo, along with the 2 prospects you mentioned.

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Old
12-13-2003, 02:02 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by straka82
Excellent research and thought. But from a kings standpoint... No. Lappy is a fan favorite and doubtfull he will go anywhere, Lehoux has the possibility to be a top 6 and with the prospects dealt in the Straka deal, i can't see Dave Taylor letting anymore go. Maybe a deal with a couple D'men being swapped in place of Lappy and Ruutu. Possibly trading Modry for Salo, along with the 2 prospects you mentioned.
Ummm RJ isn't that bad of a prospect. I"D DEF! Take this deal if I was the Kings.

Fan fav or not, he won't fit in anymore (Lappy)

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12-13-2003, 02:48 PM
  #6
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Very colorful layout... but this isn't the type of deal you'll ever see Taylor make. The Kings have about 15 guys who will be FA's after this season... With your thinking, they should trade half their team. Fact is, the Kings purposely did that with the unforseable future of the CBA.

Kings need Lappy for this year... He won't be traded.

But like I said very nice layout and color.

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Old
12-13-2003, 03:18 PM
  #7
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I'd do Lehoux, who is stuck in the minors for an eternity, for Umberger straight up.

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12-13-2003, 05:34 PM
  #8
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This deal doesn't help the Canucks at all. We get a 4th liner who brings marginally more to the table than the guy we trade (more money too) and we get a worse prospect. Makes no sense.

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12-13-2003, 05:45 PM
  #9
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I think the idea is that we need a minor deal to shake things up a bit on the roster, which could indeed be the case. His experience and overall skill would be an upgrade on Ruutu, and he brings virtually the same game. However, Umberger and Lehoux likely wouldn't be done, as Burke said he won't deal Umberger. However, theoretically in terms of value, a good deal. But I don't think it's enough of an upgrade to make Burke bite.

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12-13-2003, 05:52 PM
  #10
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Laperriere is a free agent as seasons end... Ruutu isn't. Plus Ruutu is younger and cheaper and has a bit more offense. I'll pass on that trade off anyway.

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12-13-2003, 05:55 PM
  #11
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Lappy is better than Ruutu by a leap mate and he doesn't take stupid penalties either. He will also contribute offencively on occasion to boot. I think the deal is fair enough but to say that you would only end up with a fourth liner well mate, if Lappy is a fourth liner that Ruutu wouldn't even belong in the league.

As for the rest of the deal RJ is simply twice the prospect that Lehoux is at this point so from a value point of view this deal is fair in its value and one I would make as a Kings fan but RJ would be the piece that would interest me more than Ruutu. I like Ruutu but we are chock to the brim with players like him so he would just be another piece and that is the trouble. Interesting proposal though.

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Old
12-14-2003, 10:39 AM
  #12
Hi-wayman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25
We already have an agitator in Avery who is doing very well (2G, 9 A) and you don't really need two of them. What about a deal for Ed Jovanovski?
H'mm. I think you are suggesting we trade Jovo in place of Ruutu to go along with Umberger for Laperriere & Lehoux. A very intriguing idea as we Canuck fans are constantly trying to find players we can run out of town & Jovo is as good a choice now as Potvin was a few years ago. Would LA be willing to take Sopel, Bertuzzi & Cloutier off our hands too? The problem is I canít see this trade happening as the whole reason for Canuck fans suggesting this trade is our desperate desire to trade Umberger, but Brian Burke wants to see Umberger become a free agent at the end of this year & has promised him that he wonít trade him before that can happen. From a fans point of view, unless we can include Umberger in the trade, we donít want to trade Ruutu, Jovo, Bertuzzi, Cloutier or any other Canuck even though it would allow us to dump more unwanted Canuck players on the poor, unsuspecting Kings.


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Old
12-14-2003, 11:34 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi-wayman
H'mm. I think you are suggesting we trade Jovo in place of Ruutu to go along with Umberger for Laperriere & Lehoux. A very intriguing idea as we Canuck fans are constantly trying to find players we can run out of town & Jovo is as good a choice now as Potvin was a few years ago. Would LA be willing to take Sopel, Bertuzzi & Cloutier off our hands too? The problem is I canít see this trade happening as the whole reason for Canuck fans suggesting this trade is our desperate desire to trade Umberger, but Brian Burke wants to see Umberger become a free agent at the end of this year & has promised him that he wonít trade him before that can happen. From a fans point of view, unless we can include Umberger in the trade, we donít want to trade Ruutu, Jovo, Bertuzzi, Cloutier or any other Canuck even though it would allow us to dump more unwanted Canuck players on the poor, unsuspecting Kings.

He was JOKING

Btw, I bet you once Ruutu got to the Kings, he would be injured in his second shift in

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Old
12-14-2003, 07:31 PM
  #14
Burkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Face Wash
The Kings have about 15 guys who will be FA's after this season... With your thinking, they should trade half their team. Fact is, the Kings purposely did that with the unforseable future of the CBA.
True, they have a lot of free agents. I don't think they should trade half their team, but with guys like Palffy, Allison, Deadmarsh and Robitaille being free agents at the end of the year and quite possibly wanting sizeable amounts of money, that it is not ridiculous to think that they might not retain Laperriere. They'd save some money if they did, so why not get something for him?

I don't deny that the Kings might keep Laperriere, but I do think that they'd at least listen to an offer involving Ruutu and Umberger for him and Lehoux.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mecca13
Ruutu=Laperriere
Let's compare, shall we?

AGE: Ruutu - 28 years old, Laperriere - 29 years old
SALARY: Ruutu - $575,000, Laperriere - $900,000
CONTRACT STATUS: Ruutu - signed beyond this year, Laperriere - free agent after this year
SIZE: Ruutu - 6'2, 200 lbs, Laperriere - 6'1, 200 lbs
CAREER POINTS PER GAME AVERAGE: Ruutu - 22 pts in 138 NHL games for a points per game average of 0.16, Laperriere - 188 pts in 652 NHL games for a points per game average of 0.29
STATS (this season): Ruutu - 1 goal and 1 assist in 24 games thus far, Laperriere - 0 goals and 6 assists in 20 games thus far
ICE TIME: Ruutu - 10:03 of ice time per game (averages 1:15 on penalty kill per game), Laperriere - 16:14 of ice time per game (averages 3:34 on penalty kill per game)

Their ages are comparable, as is their size.

Ruutu does have an edge in that he makes less money, which boosts his value a bit in today's NHL, in which salary plays a big part in trade value.

However, Laperriere has a better career points per game average and has more points this season, so he's better offensively than Ruutu. He also plays 6 minutes more than Ruutu does each game and also plays 2 minutes more on the penalty kill each game. Los Angeles injuries could have caused his ice time to go up slightly, but 2 years ago (in the 2001-02 season) Laperriere averaged more than 13 minutes per game, which is still 3 minutes more than Ruutu has averaged this season.

Laperriere also brings intangibles such as strong leadership abilities that boost his trade value.

Laperriere is not drastically better than Ruutu, but he is better. He's a good penalty killer who works hard and gets under the opposition's skin without taking stupid penalties (as Ruutu does so often). He's better offensively. The only true edge that Ruutu has over Laperriere is that he has a less expensive salary, and that's because he isn't as good. They are very similar in style, but Laperriere is an upgrade over Ruutu.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SopelFan
Laperriere is a free agent as seasons end... Ruutu isn't. Plus Ruutu is younger and cheaper and has a bit more offense. I'll pass on that trade off anyway.
Ruutu is only younger by a year and DOES not have more offense. Laperriere has a career points per game of 0.29 and 6 points this season, compared to Ruutu's career points per game of 0.16 and 2 points this season. Laperriere is better offensively. He is a good penalty killer with excellent work habits and leadership abilities. And he doesn't take stupid penalties, like Ruutu does upon occasion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by canucklehead17
I think the idea is that we need a minor deal to shake things up a bit on the roster, which could indeed be the case. His experience and overall skill would be an upgrade on Ruutu, and he brings virtually the same game. However, Umberger and Lehoux likely wouldn't be done, as Burke said he won't deal Umberger. However, theoretically in terms of value, a good deal. But I don't think it's enough of an upgrade to make Burke bite.
Indeed the idea is to do a minor trade to shake things up a bit. And indeed his experience and skill are better than Ruutu's and they play very similiar styles.

Now for where I disagree with you. Burke has said that he won't trade Umberger, but I am fairly sure that this is just a tactic to try and force the kid to give in to Burke's demands. Burke knows that if he says he'll trade him, that Umberger will just let the trade go through and then probably get the money that he wants (otherwise the other team wouldn't be interested in getting him, right?). I think that Burke is just trying to outwit Umberger and get him to cave in to Burke and agree to Burke's terms.

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Old
12-15-2003, 06:12 AM
  #15
Face Wash
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkey
True, they have a lot of free agents. I don't think they should trade half their team, but with guys like Palffy, Allison, Deadmarsh and Robitaille being free agents at the end of the year and quite possibly wanting sizeable amounts of money, that it is not ridiculous to think that they might not retain Laperriere. They'd save some money if they did, so why not get something for him?

I don't deny that the Kings might keep Laperriere, but I do think that they'd at least listen to an offer involving Ruutu and Umberger for him and Lehoux.
Deadmarsh is a huge question mark... he's making $3 mil right now to sit at home and try and get his head straight while he changes his twin girls diapers... I don't think Deadmarsh will be getting a ton of money to play for anyone next season. Robitaille will make $2 mil/year tops for the rest of his career. That's if he scores 25 to 30 this season and the Kings still feel he can continue to contribute.

Besides, how much money do you think the Kings save be letting go of Lappy? This season, about $300k... next contract Lappy gets... I mean do you really think a guy with Lappy's skill is ever going to be worth more than $1.5 mil??

Don't forget... we got this "Lockout" thing hovering over our heads next season as it is... Talking about trading guys who are pending FA's of any kind is an act of futility until we know what the system of operation is going to be...

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12-15-2003, 08:54 AM
  #16
Burkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Face Wash
Deadmarsh is a huge question mark... he's making $3 mil right now to sit at home and try and get his head straight while he changes his twin girls diapers... I don't think Deadmarsh will be getting a ton of money to play for anyone next season. Robitaille will make $2 mil/year tops for the rest of his career. That's if he scores 25 to 30 this season and the Kings still feel he can continue to contribute.

Besides, how much money do you think the Kings save be letting go of Lappy? This season, about $300k... next contract Lappy gets... I mean do you really think a guy with Lappy's skill is ever going to be worth more than $1.5 mil??

Don't forget... we got this "Lockout" thing hovering over our heads next season as it is... Talking about trading guys who are pending FA's of any kind is an act of futility until we know what the system of operation is going to be...
Very good post. You made some good points and I agree that the Kings might be reluctant to move Laperriere. Nonetheless, I maintain that they'd still consider this deal as it does give them a similar player to Laperriere (albeit with less skill and defensive ability) who makes less money and also get a fine prospect in Umberger (albeit Umberger has an uncertain contract situation).

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Old
12-15-2003, 11:41 AM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45
I'd do Lehoux, who is stuck in the minors for an eternity, for Umberger straight up.

I'd love to see Lehoux in Montrťal, his father is a co-worker. I coul duse the free tickets. Not sure he would make the NHL line-up though.

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:10 PM
  #18
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Originally Posted by Ironchef Chris Wok
He was JOKING

Btw, I bet you once Ruutu got to the Kings, he would be injured in his second shift in
I think you are selling the Kings short. First shift injury for sure.
As for the original proposal, I'd make the trade. Lappy just isn't as big a contributor as he used to be and Lehoux will probably be a career minor leaguer. Which means that I doubt Vancouver makes this deal.

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