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OT: Pettitte is gone

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Old
12-11-2003, 08:42 AM
  #1
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OT: Pettitte is gone



The empire is falling!!!

poor Mike Francesa is going crazy

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Old
12-11-2003, 09:16 AM
  #2
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Good job Cashman...

Good thing they signed Ruben Sierra though.

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12-11-2003, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
Good thing they signed Ruben Sierra though.

That wasn't Cashman, this was all George. He's taking over again.

Cashman & Torre were begging for Torre to sign Pettite.

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12-11-2003, 10:11 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
That wasn't Cashman, this was all George. He's taking over again.

Cashman & Torre were begging for Torre to sign Pettite.

John is right. Cashman is no longer GM. George is the GM now. He offers that trouble maker Sheffield 39 mil, yet offer pettite 30 mil only after waiting 2 wks! It pissed Pettitte off and he bolted. I am a diehard fan but George is pissing me off the last few years. Pettitte was a must. This was horrendous.

Now they will go trade for Kevin Brown and pay him the 15 mil they would not give Pettitte. WHere's the logic in that?

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12-11-2003, 10:17 AM
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pettitte can go get bent. piece of garbage.

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Old
12-11-2003, 10:18 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Bill
John is right. Cashman is no longer GM. George is the GM now. He offers that trouble maker Sheffield 39 mil, yet offer pettite 30 mil only after waiting 2 wks! It pissed Pettitte off and he bolted. I am a diehard fan but George is pissing me off the last few years. Pettitte was a must. This was horrendous.

Now they will go trade for Kevin Brown and pay him the 15 mil they would not give Pettitte. WHere's the logic in that?
We're going back to the 80's here. I hope it doesn't turn into another 14 year playoff drought. The only hope for the Yanks is for George to be out of the picture.

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12-11-2003, 10:50 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Train
We're going back to the 80's here. I hope it doesn't turn into another 14 year playoff drought. The only hope for the Yanks is for George to be out of the picture.

George has wanted to trade Andy for years, so now he gets rid of him for nada! It just proves once again that just because your rich doesn't mean your smart!! George and little Jimmy must be good friends.

This one will come back to bite the Boss in the ass next Sept. when Boston is going to the WS.

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12-11-2003, 10:55 AM
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George made a HUGE mistake. He lost a great left-handed clutch pitcher. He took his time and he jerked around Andy and now he will pay for it. Kevin Brown will NOT replace him.

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12-11-2003, 11:06 AM
  #9
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Yawn...

Andy "wwjd" Pettite..

Good, not a great gamer.. Had some clutch postseaoson performances, had some god awful post season performances..

Great teammate..

32 with a questionable elbow..

Lefthander at Yankee Stadium..

Wanted the Yanks to pay more than the Astros..

52 million for 4 years (see elbow, questionable)

Don't really see what the big deal is.. Stinks to lose another member of that core, but really that was too many years for too much money. The only problem I have with it is having Wells as the only lefthanded starter. But the Yanks can always deal for another..

I've been saying that they needed to get younger in the rotation, and Vasquez is a big step there.. I'm sure there's more moves to go.. Brown wouldn't make them younger, but I think he showed last year that he's back..

I agree that George needs to let Cash do his job, but I don't think Andy Pettite will be the difference this season.. Like last year, it will be the bullpen leading to Mo..

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12-11-2003, 11:09 AM
  #10
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I read...

that the Yankees' offer was $7.5 million (in the aggregate) more than the Astros', but Pettitte wanted another year and another, I believe, $4 million per.

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Old
12-11-2003, 11:20 AM
  #11
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Not bad for a guy who talked about retiring in the not so distant future.


bottom line is if he wanted to be here, he would, but 4 championships the lore of the yankees wasnt enough because he wanted to be by houston....well have fun.

yeah he went 21-8, but he easily could have went 14-12 with how bad his elbow is.

with any luck Vasquez wins 17 and Pettite and the astros flop as personally i think their "window" of opportunity has already passed.

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Old
12-11-2003, 11:40 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Bill
yet offer pettite 30 mil only after waiting 2 wks! It pissed Pettitte off and he bolted.
Let's get the fact straight. The 'Yanks offer to Pettite was $39m for 3 years. $9m more in total that the 'Stros offer and $3m/per more. Andy wanted to go home.
Can't bash Cashman here. This move was all Steinbrenner. He has neve liked Pettite and simply refuses to believe that he is one of the elite pitchers. And no amount of stats or big games were going to convince him any different. Stienbrenner's #1 problem is the he ALWYAS seems to think that the grass is greener on other pastures. Kind of like Sather.
We'll see what Steinbrenner does. Probably see Kevin Brown. As for Pettite, one has to wonder how he'll fare in the stadium the Astros play in. That stadium yeilded more hits than Coors field.

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Old
12-11-2003, 12:16 PM
  #13
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Thats a lot of money...

Strikes me, thats a lot of money for a game of rounders. Those baseball contracts are HUGE.

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12-11-2003, 12:28 PM
  #14
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With Pettitte and Clemens gone that is 38 wins that leave between them.

They have replaced them with Vazquez' 13.

Thats a lot of wins leaving.

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Old
12-11-2003, 12:37 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway
Thats a lot of wins leaving.
can't analyze it that way. The fact that any pitcher won 13 games with the Expos is commendable. Who knows how many wins Vasquez could have had had he pitched for the 'yanks. I think that Vasquez will win A LOT of games for NY, providing he does not melt under NY pressure like Weaver did. Vasquez actually has better stuff than Pettite.

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Old
12-11-2003, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
can't analyze it that way. The fact that any pitcher won 13 games with the Expos is commendable. Who knows how many wins Vasquez could have had had he pitched for the 'yanks. I think that Vasquez will win A LOT of games for NY, providing he does not melt under NY pressure like Weaver did. Vasquez actually has better stuff than Pettite.

It's not a perfect science but it certainly is telling.

And I don't know where people are getting the idea that the Expos were a lousy team.

And you said it best: who knows how many games he wins for the Yankees. He is no sure thing. But it is sure that 38 wins are gone.

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Old
12-11-2003, 12:59 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway
It's not a perfect science but it certainly is telling.

And I don't know where people are getting the idea that the Expos were a lousy team.

And you said it best: who knows how many games he wins for the Yankees. He is no sure thing. But it is sure that 38 wins are gone.
Not really telling. Expos arent terrible but its tough with teams like Atlanta, Florida, and Philly in your division. Pettite would have been good for at least 4 fewer wins and Vazquez would have gotten 4 more wins with that run support if they switched teams, your talking a very mediocre team compared to one of, if not the best team and baseball. BIG difference. You think Browns sub-3.00 on the Dodgers wouldnt have meant at the very least 16-17 with NYY? And the dodgers are better then the Expos.

I would figure 17-18 wins this year for Vazquez.

Figure 15-16 for Pettite on the Astros.

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Old
12-11-2003, 01:20 PM
  #18
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The Yanks have played their cards just fine. Kevin Brown is a definate upgrade over Pettite. And Vazquez is a slight downgrade, possible upgrade in the future, on Clemens. The Yanks offered more than than the 'Stros but in the end I think Andy just felt instulted by the entire process. Andy is a very proud man and he is the type of guy who prides himself in integrity and honesty. Today when Andy was asked what he had to say to the NY fans, since he really hasnt had a chance to say goodbye, he just broke down and cried. He truly was a Yankee. I for one am sad that such a great man is leaving New York, but I will embrace Kevin Brown as a Yankee as well. From Andy's standpoint, I dont see this as a great career move. Aside from the fact that he could have gone down as the best left handed Yankee pitcher of all-time, Andy took less money, and will be playing in Enron (yea i still call it that) Field. Not good for a guy who's ERA already hovered above 4.00

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12-11-2003, 01:24 PM
  #19
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it could be worse. we could have al leiter as our number 1 starter and an unproven major league shortstop as our best and only free agent signing. you have to believe the yankees know something about pettite and his balky elbow to let this go down. oh well it could be worse. we could be mets fans

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12-11-2003, 02:46 PM
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truth me known he wanted to go home, if he turned 39 million from this team then how far do you take it?

He won 21 games and suddenly he is back amongst the elite again, yet when he won 28 over his previous two season i'd bet all of you were wondering about his elbow. personally i am still not sold on it.

people he signed with the astros for god's sake. he wanted to go home, period. Andy pettite's first priority in life is his family, it's not winning, it's not baseball. talk to him in interviews and you get the impression that almost doesnt even like what he does for a living and would be perfectly content to walk away and be at home with his kids if the money wasnt enough to set his family up for generations to come.

After 9 years, 4 championships and a ton of memories from the team that drafted, developed and became winners with him, there's not much you can offer a guy.

Good look Andy, and don't blow your elbow out ya'all.

As for Vasquez, i agree with true blue in the sense that wins arent always very telling. Andy had 21 wins and his era was over 4.00.

Mussina was a perfect example of weird science a few years ago in baltimore, actually it was the year the yanks signed him i believe. now no one was gonna deny that he was one of the top pitchers in the game.

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Old
12-11-2003, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
Let's get the fact straight. The 'Yanks offer to Pettite was $39m for 3 years. $9m more in total that the 'Stros offer and $3m/per more. Andy wanted to go home.
Can't bash Cashman here. This move was all Steinbrenner. He has neve liked Pettite and simply refuses to believe that he is one of the elite pitchers. And no amount of stats or big games were going to convince him any different. Stienbrenner's #1 problem is the he ALWYAS seems to think that the grass is greener on other pastures. Kind of like Sather.
We'll see what Steinbrenner does. Probably see Kevin Brown. As for Pettite, one has to wonder how he'll fare in the stadium the Astros play in. That stadium yeilded more hits than Coors field.
Check your facts.

The final offer was 39 million. The initial offer, which Tom Pettitte (ANdy's father) gave to the Daily News in an interview was 3 yrs 30 million. This was the night before the Yanks two week exclusive negotiating window expired. It made Pettitte feel unwanted. In the interview, the father said Andy was upset and felt a bit unwanted/disrespected/etc... If he was the number one priority, why did Georgie wait 14 days to even make contact, and then offer a deal that he knew Pettitte would naot take, yet he offers Sheffield more $$?

It might have been the Times or the News. I will look for the article for you.

"The Yankees' initial offer of three years at $30 million came just before Pettitte filed for free agency, timing that surprised Pettitte. He had expected the Yankees to make a stronger push in the 15-day period of exclusive negotiating rights that followed the World Series."

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/12/sp...ll/12PETT.html


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Old
12-12-2003, 12:43 AM
  #22
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1. I want to feel unwanted to. Please insult me with 30 million for 3 years. I wanna be insulted.

2. He was so insulted that he got what? A total of 4 million dollars more?

3. Why should tha Yankees drive up his price before he even reaches the market, isn't that what we blast the rangers for doing all the time? Bidding against themselves.

4. Anyone who thinks this was about money is sadly mistaken. this is about andy going home. period. no more, no less. well he's home, have fun andy. remember that in august when your elbow is sore and you are the ace and there isnt a clemens, mussina or wells to take the ball after you.

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12-12-2003, 04:09 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barnaby63
pettitte can go get bent. piece of garbage.

I think you'd better reevaluate your stance. He's easily the classiest player(along with Jeter and Bernie) to wear your pinstripes in a long time.
Your GM is once again bigger than your team. No offense intended to your organization but you've got the blinders on. The Red Sox and Theo Epstein are gonna bend the Yanks over this year and you'll have that old "Steinbrenner excuse"......again.

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Old
12-12-2003, 04:12 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
Anyone who thinks this was about money is sadly mistaken. this is about andy going home. period. no more, no less. well he's home, have fun andy. remember that in august when your elbow is sore and you are the ace and there isnt a clemens, mussina or wells to take the ball after you.
I agree with you. Andy wanted to go home, plain and simple. Although, had George shown him a little love, I think that he would have still been here. But Steinbrenner was never a Pettite fan for whatever reason.
And just a little point on the 'Stros, Edge. There may not be a Clemens or a Mussina or Wells to take the ball after him, but there is an Oswalt and Miller. Not to mention the fact that the 'Stros have another top pitching prospect in the minors still. I would take Oswalt over anyone on the current Yankee staff not named Vasquez. That's how good the kid is. And Milleris no chopped liver either.

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Old
12-12-2003, 04:15 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
1. I want to feel unwanted to. Please insult me with 30 million for 3 years. I wanna be insulted.

2. He was so insulted that he got what? A total of 4 million dollars more?

3. Why should tha Yankees drive up his price before he even reaches the market, isn't that what we blast the rangers for doing all the time? Bidding against themselves.

4. Anyone who thinks this was about money is sadly mistaken. this is about andy going home. period. no more, no less. well he's home, have fun andy. remember that in august when your elbow is sore and you are the ace and there isnt a clemens, mussina or wells to take the ball after you.

I don't think it was so much the money offered...but the money he saved in taxes by playing in Texas. Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm an Astros fan so maybe I also have the blinders on.

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