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Old
03-27-2007, 10:41 AM
  #1
oil slick
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Is Tampa out to lunch

Just wondered if anyone else thought Tampa is a little bit weird with how they are constructing their team. ((I know... Oiler fans are ones to talk)), but they've got two of their big three going on all cylinders, and Richards is playing OK... yet they're still on the verge of missing the playoffs. Now this is fine (plenty of teams miss the playoffs), but I'm reading that Feaster is saying that they'll pare down their payroll from 44 down to 40, but still keep the big three + Boyle, and they'll just sign guys for league minimum.

Does anyone else think this is nuts?

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03-27-2007, 10:43 AM
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Jimmi Jenkins
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I do, it's a pretty all or nothing way of playing. Either you're stars will win for you, or you'll lose.

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03-27-2007, 10:43 AM
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Soundwave
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They may have no choice. Richards and St. Louis (I think) have no trade clauses, and they probably don't want to trade Lecavalier.

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03-27-2007, 10:46 AM
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Yup.

I honestly believe the best move to have a better team, fo rthem, is to move Vinny. He could demand a king's ransom that would fill the roles around the other three (incl. Boyle).

Richards and STL get paid too much to fetch crazy return. They could alternatively dump one of those guys and use the cap space, but as I say, moving Vinny would command enough to have a competative team.

Going to be interesting to watch.

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03-27-2007, 10:54 AM
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Mr Sakich
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the beginning of the end for the old nhl. Tampa will be cutting payroll next year. They have allready said this. There will be some salary dumping trades comming just like you see in baseball , football, and basketball. Nashville is also going to be in a huge dumping mode if they don't go on a long playoff run.

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03-27-2007, 10:56 AM
  #6
Soundwave
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Joffrey Lupul
Jarrett Stoll
Matt Greene
Cogliano
NYI 1st Round pick
ANA 1st Round pick

for

Lecavalier
Kuba

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Old
03-27-2007, 10:57 AM
  #7
oil slick
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Originally Posted by Mr Sakich View Post
the beginning of the end for the old nhl. Tampa will be cutting payroll next year. They have allready said this. There will be some salary dumping trades comming just like you see in baseball , football, and basketball. Nashville is also going to be in a huge dumping mode if they don't go on a long playoff run.
While there will be salary dumps, at least Feaster is posturing to keep his big 4 (with Boyle). The people I've seen mentioned have been Ruslan Fedotenko and Cory Sarich, although this is not from Feaster himself. Maybe it is all posturing on his part, but he's seemed pretty adament about not trading those 4 big players.

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03-27-2007, 11:01 AM
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Jimmi Jenkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Joffrey Lupul
Jarrett Stoll
Matt Greene
Cogliano
NYI 1st Round pick
ANA 1st Round pick

for

Lecavalier
Kuba
No thanks.

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Old
03-27-2007, 11:05 AM
  #9
Soundwave
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The guy that I would really want is Patrice Bergeron. Young and under contract, someone we could grow with Hemsky. Or Jordan Staal.

Staal is not likely to be availiable (then again, how much long does Pittsbugh keep Crosby playing with 40 year olds?), but Bergeron ... you never know with Boston.

The word is Boston is also under pressure to dump salary. At least Tampa is likely to earn some playoff revune this year, even if it's only two home games.

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03-27-2007, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
The guy that I would really want is Patrice Bergeron. Young and under contract, someone we could grow with Hemsky. Or Jordan Staal.

Staal is not likely to be availiable (then again, how much long does Pittsbugh keep Crosby playing with 40 year olds?), but Bergeron ... you never know with Boston.

The word is Boston is also under pressure to dump salary. At least Tampa is likely to earn some playoff revune this year, even if it's only two home games.
I wouldn't mind Bergeron here either but the Boston organization took some big steps this summer in commiting money to their younger players for the future of the club. It would take a lot to get Bergeron and I dont think it would be worth it.

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03-27-2007, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oil slick View Post
Just wondered if anyone else thought Tampa is a little bit weird with how they are constructing their team. ((I know... Oiler fans are ones to talk)), but they've got two of their big three going on all cylinders, and Richards is playing OK... yet they're still on the verge of missing the playoffs. Now this is fine (plenty of teams miss the playoffs), but I'm reading that Feaster is saying that they'll pare down their payroll from 44 down to 40, but still keep the big three + Boyle, and they'll just sign guys for league minimum.

Does anyone else think this is nuts?
Yup. I've never understood the thinking behind paying the "Big Three" big money and paying everyone else on the team squat. What happens if one or two or even three of those stars go down with injury?

A better strategy in my mind (and I'd argue the complete opposite of Tampa's strategy) is the one that's been employed by the Devils for so long, starting with their "faceless flock of forwards". Just have a whole bunch of "good" and "very good" players, give them a great goalie, and see how they do.

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Old
03-27-2007, 12:33 PM
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I can understand where Feaster is going tho. Its much more difficult to develop or sign a big star like Richards, Lecavalier or St. Louis, than it is to find a 3rd liner.

I think he's waiting for the cap to go up - before he starts signing some additional talent.

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03-27-2007, 12:38 PM
  #13
oil slick
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
I can understand where Feaster is going tho. Its much more difficult to develop or sign a big star like Richards, Lecavalier or St. Louis, than it is to find a 3rd liner.

I think he's waiting for the cap to go up - before he starts signing some additional talent.
I don't think this is true though... from what I understand, he's getting a pretty firm internal budget from the owners... 40 million - so I don't think the cap going up will allow him to spend.

About the only top tier team that has multiple big salary players are the Ducks, and even then they have only 2, and have great young cheap talent from drafts.

I know it's hard to find top ranked players, but it just seems that limiting your salary to 18 million for two goalies, 5 defensmen, and 9 forwards means that when your big three are not out there, the team is absolute crap...

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03-27-2007, 12:40 PM
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This is a good example of the hard decisions thing that Lowe mentioned when he moves Smyth and that other teams are going to face. Some teams will bite the bullet and move stars for prospects and cap space. Others will retain their stars and move everybody else.

It'll be interesting to see how things turn out for the Tampa Bay Lightning, especially if they do drop their payroll to well below the cap, but still pay 21 million to three forwards.

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03-27-2007, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Joffrey Lupul
Jarrett Stoll
Matt Greene
Cogliano
NYI 1st Round pick
ANA 1st Round pick

for

Lecavalier
Kuba
That's crazy! This is a team looking to the future you can't give away some of the most important pieces of that future. Besides they have said Lecavalier is not going anywhere and the chances of him wanting to play in Edmonton long term are slim to nil.

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03-27-2007, 01:09 PM
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I think what the Lightning is doing is madness in a gate driven league, in a market that although has shown success, (due to thier Stanley Cup) probably can't sustain much losing.

If the owners are forcing thier payroll down, then they are asking to lose revenue. They're basically hurting themselves. Fans there won't stick around to watch a crap hockey team for 4 or 5 years (or 30 like the Leafs )

They need one or 2 big stars in Tampa, and a supporting cast that can keep that team competitive. They should have kept Khabibulin and dumped Richards and St. Louis. With Nik and Vinnie, and using the rest of the $$$ for a solid supporting cast, they would at least have a competitive team. They could have moved Richards and St. Louis for picks and prospects - players who could contribute at a much lower salary.

The Oilers IMO are in a very good place right now (unbelievable that I wrote that). They have great goaltending locked up, a young, hopefully soon-to-be superstar, and lots and lots of picks and prospects. Lowe has some money to spend too, so he basically can make or break this team this summer. The only negatives I see right now on this payroll are the ugly contracts given to Pisani and Staios (as much as I love them).

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03-27-2007, 01:12 PM
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I think Feaster will trade one of the big three and possibly Boyle, but why would he tell anybody that he is going to do this at seasons's end when he is in the middle of a playoff race. Saying that you are possibly going to trade one of your Big three would create a distraction to your three best players that are currently carrying your team. Also saying you have no intention of trading these players increases the value of the asset.



I think Lecavlier will be availble because Richards is untradeble and St.Louis is a better bargain then Lecavier and Feaster could get more for lecavlier then St.Louis.

I think the oilers could get Lecavlier for Torres Greene and NYI first or Green Schremp and NYI first. Remember Pronger's trade value was much higher then Lecavlier's is now due to there Contracts (pronger 4 years 6.25, VL 2 years 7.10)

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03-27-2007, 01:24 PM
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Wouldn't give up Stoll or Greene, since Smith is an UFA after 07/08. Don't think TB would give up Lecavalier. Richards isn't earning his 7.8M right now, and he's due that till 10/11, but he's still younger than St. Louis. Depends on who they want to build around I guess.

Don't mind St. Louis' contract either, according to nhlnumbers it goes from 6M next season, to 5 (08/09), 4, then 4 (10/11). He'll be 32 this summer, and unless he has a drop off from this season, may earn his contract every year. I'd take him. Think they'd take Lupul, prospect (Winny or Syvret), and NYI 1st rounder for him?

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03-27-2007, 01:48 PM
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It's not just the fact that he's keeping the big 3 around, it's that he extremely overpaid for Richards and Lecavalier when he didn't have to. What had Lecavalier done at that time that warrented 200k less then what Iginla(the best player in the league at that time)was worth??? I know, he won a Cup, but let's not kid ourselves.....other then game 7 of the finals, Vinny was pretty much a no show for most of that run. And he was comming off I BELIEVE a 64 point season(04 season). Point is they probably could have locked up Lecavalier for cheaper, Richards for A LOT cheaper, and could have then had enough money to at least keep guys like Sarich around. But all the Southern teams have done questionable things lately, and the reason is because they're getting desperate for the fans. If they traded a superstar in Tampa then the fans(most of them fringe)would be up in arms. Even though Feaster stated that he wants to keep Boyle as well, and I know the guy has a NTC, but I wonder if Lowe tossed him a nice enough offer if Feaster would ask him to waive it??? Say....Torres, Gilbert, and Brodziak? I know it doesn't save them much money(if any), but it spreads his money around a little better.

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03-27-2007, 01:57 PM
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I wouldn't mind stealing Kuba out of Tampa. Back in Minny, he was their best defenseman.

Season Team GP G A PTS +/-
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03-27-2007, 02:17 PM
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I've always questioned the strategy of top-loading your roster in a salary cap environment... and I've always thought Feaster was crazy to sign those guys to those contracts. But the silliest thing was paying that kind of money to three FORWARDS. If he would have paid a top end d-man or goalie that kind of coin, Tampa would be in much better shape. All three of those guys play among the most minutes for forwards, so even if they make the playoffs they could be burnt out.

Just look at Vancouver. How did tying up all that salary in Nasland, Bertuzzi and Jovo work out for them in 05/06? But getting rid of Jovo (who is so overpaid and overrated it is not even funny) and basically giving Bertuzzi's salary (and a bit more) to Luongo, they've turned their team around in one year.

I detest the Canucks, but IMO Nonis has iced a far better team this year with just a couple of key moves.

If Tampa misses the playoffs OR is out in the early rounds, I'll be watching them closely this summer, because SOMETHING has to give.

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03-27-2007, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Wolfpack View Post
I've always questioned the strategy of top-loading your roster in a salary cap environment... and I've always thought Feaster was crazy to sign those guys to those contracts. But the silliest thing was paying that kind of money to three FORWARDS. If he would have paid a top end d-man or goalie that kind of coin, Tampa would be in much better shape. All three of those guys play among the most minutes for forwards, so even if they make the playoffs they could be burnt out.

Just look at Vancouver. How did tying up all that salary in Nasland, Bertuzzi and Jovo work out for them in 05/06? But getting rid of Jovo (who is so overpaid and overrated it is not even funny) and basically giving Bertuzzi's salary (and a bit more) to Luongo, they've turned their team around in one year.

I detest the Canucks, but IMO Nonis has iced a far better team this year with just a couple of key moves.

If Tampa misses the playoffs OR is out in the early rounds, I'll be watching them closely this summer, because SOMETHING has to give.
Your right about the fact that it's bad basically because it's 3 forwards and not say 1 forward, 1 d-man and a goaltender. But it's not ALL THAT fair to the Canucks. Had they chose to trade Naslund and keep Jovo with Luongo they would be just as good, or had they got rid of all 3 of those guys and got Luongo they would be just as good. My point is that Luongo is FREAKIN AMAZING, and I depise Chris Pronger for not leaking his trade demand to the press in an interview immediatly following game 7. Had he done that, we would likely have Luongo on our team.

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