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mtl-wash trape poposal...thoughts?

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Old
04-05-2007, 03:50 AM
  #1
Miller Time
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mtl-wash trape poposal...thoughts?

Posted this on the habs board... wondering what caps fans would think of this deal:
*assuming that the caps are unable to land one of the elite UFA centres on the market*

to Wash:
Koivu, Ryder, Bouillion, SJ 1st 07

to Mtl:
Clark, Morrison, 1st 07

habs get top 5 pick, solid if unspectacular forward (though the 30 goals this year is impressive), a younger D-man who seems to be coming into his own, and cap space.

wash gets a very good playmaking veteran centre, coming of a career point total despite never playing with an elite winger. Leadership and heart galore. a young*ish* (27) RFA scoring winger with 25+ goals in his first 3 seasons, a solid 5th-6th d-man who plays a very responsible and physical game and a late 1st round pick.

Deal or No Deal? Why?

P.S I am not a koivu hater, he's been my favorite hab for years, and it scares me to think what kind of numbers he'd put up next to a Ovechkin or Semin... but you gotta give to get + I think Gainey will be targeting one of the other UFA centres big time this offseason (as I'm sure the caps will)

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04-05-2007, 04:05 AM
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EHCler
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That proposal is a no go for the Caps, so value wise it is not bad.

Morrison is the Top Defender the caps have the moment and we have enough 5-6 defensman, we need quality to defense not subtract and add depth.

We do need a center for our top 2 lines but if Backstrom comes over, it is not the highest priority.

Given that Montreal is looking for a young top four defensman as main part of the deal there are other teams which are better trading partners for Montreal.

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04-05-2007, 06:01 AM
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NoMeSudes
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I also can't see something like this happening. Clark and Mo are so valuable for the Caps. Add in Koivu's injury history, and I think this becomes a no go.

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04-05-2007, 06:17 AM
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Drake1588
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Since the market doesn't even open until July 1st, and the draft is in June, check your timelines.

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Old
04-05-2007, 01:08 PM
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Jasper17
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The trade sounds decent at first. But then when you think about it this way...

to Wash:
Koivu, Ryder, Bouillion, SJ 1st 07

to Mtl:
The Captain, Best Defensman on the team, Top 5 pick

It sounds less attractive. The players given up by the Caps are so valuable to this team that I wouldn't make this move.

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04-05-2007, 01:13 PM
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BrooklynCapsFan
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Have 2 team captains ever been traded for each other?

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04-05-2007, 01:20 PM
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Roccoman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapsFan@Vassar View Post
Have 2 team captains ever been traded for each other?
there is a man only known as OC in the official boards that has a knack for finding out such things.

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Old
04-05-2007, 02:13 PM
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HockeyCritter
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Big ole pass thank you very much.

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Old
04-05-2007, 03:06 PM
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CapitalsCupFantasy
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Do Koivu and Ryder play on the same line in Montreal?


Really one of the better trade proposal's I've seen here, because value wise it's close. Could be a big win for either team or both. Not sure of Montreal's team needs, but the Caps need a top line RW and a center for Ovy, so that fills two of our top 3 needs. Little concerned that Koivu is a few years older (33) than I would like for a major pickup to be for the Caps.

From the Caps standpoint I don't see how McPhee give's up the best asset he got from the Jagr selloff year (Mo) and Clark one of the best trades ever for the Caps org. I don't think many NHL GM's this side of Keenan have the stones to pull a deal like this one.


What's the story on Bouillion?

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Old
04-05-2007, 04:24 PM
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PSUhockey34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
Posted this on the habs board... wondering what caps fans would think of this deal:
*assuming that the caps are unable to land one of the elite UFA centres on the market*

to Wash:
Koivu, Ryder, Bouillion, SJ 1st 07

to Mtl:
Clark, Morrison, 1st 07

habs get top 5 pick, solid if unspectacular forward (though the 30 goals this year is impressive), a younger D-man who seems to be coming into his own, and cap space.

wash gets a very good playmaking veteran centre, coming of a career point total despite never playing with an elite winger. Leadership and heart galore. a young*ish* (27) RFA scoring winger with 25+ goals in his first 3 seasons, a solid 5th-6th d-man who plays a very responsible and physical game and a late 1st round pick.

Deal or No Deal? Why?

P.S I am not a koivu hater, he's been my favorite hab for years, and it scares me to think what kind of numbers he'd put up next to a Ovechkin or Semin... but you gotta give to get + I think Gainey will be targeting one of the other UFA centres big time this offseason (as I'm sure the caps will)
Clark and Ryder sotra of wash each other out...both bring things to the table that other one lacks...but Clark had done nothing but get better since coming DC and looks to be a solid 20g/20a that does the dirty work in the corners (his 30 goal season is a fluke IMO)

I'm on the fence with Koiuv, the thing that worries me is that if he's our #1 pivot and the fact we lack offensive depth at center, him being injury prone could be an issue

Mo isn't going anywhere...he's been a rock on the blueline and is part of the corps group of young dmen that McPhee has been drafting or trading for

Bouillion is a guy we have a glutton of right now, bunch 5-6 paring dmen

McPhee doesn't trade 1st round picks, he hordes them

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Old
04-05-2007, 05:24 PM
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Burgh32
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Maybe if it were a younger Koivu without the injury bugs.

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Old
04-06-2007, 07:45 AM
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Foy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapsFan@Vassar View Post
Have 2 team captains ever been traded for each other?
Hatcher for Tinordi.


We don't need no OC.

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Old
04-06-2007, 08:50 AM
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BrooklynCapsFan
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Quote:
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Hatcher for Tinordi.


We don't need no OC.
Thanks. That was a little before my time.

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Old
04-06-2007, 09:42 AM
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Foy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapsFan@Vassar View Post
Thanks. That was a little before my time.
I was twelve, and I remember it clearly! Age is not an excuse!

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Old
04-06-2007, 09:56 AM
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I was twelve, and I remember it clearly! Age is not an excuse!
Ha, I was 12 too. Sadly I was not a hockey fan at that time. I'd been fooled by Griffey and Ripken.

I caught the hockey bug hard in 95.

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Old
04-06-2007, 02:32 PM
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RandyHolt
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I dont like that trade but i'd swap Morrisson with Eminger and Clark for Klepis. I sure did like Langway Engbloom Locker and Dougie Jarvis for Ryan Walter (my fav player at the time) and Rick Green. We may need a blockbuster deal like that before we are going anywhere...

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Old
04-06-2007, 03:02 PM
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Chimaera
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I think the value is probably skewed towards Washington in this one a decent bit... but I don't think the trade is realistic.

The team wants to keep Morrisonn and Clark.

If Koivu was younger, I might deal a package of picks and prospects for him.

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04-07-2007, 03:17 PM
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MentalPowerHouse
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Washington is better off using that package to land Brad Richards.

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04-07-2007, 03:32 PM
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Jasper17
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Originally Posted by MentalPowerHouse View Post
Washington is better off using that package to land Brad Richards.
yea, because I am sure the Caps would love to add that 7.8 million dollar salary. Never mind the fact Tampy would never trade him to another team in the division.

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04-10-2007, 12:09 PM
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MentalPowerHouse
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yea, because I am sure the Caps would love to add that 7.8 million dollar salary. Never mind the fact Tampy would never trade him to another team in the division.
Hey I didn't say it was going to happen, but with that package of young players and picks you'd hope to get someone not past their prime.

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Old
04-10-2007, 02:26 PM
  #21
ChuckyToGally
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I don't think the Habs would consider that deal.

That would leave us with no legit 1st center and no guarentee we would be able to sign one. There's also the fact that Ryder is the only proven 30 goals scrorer of the team.

The draft isn't that great. I wouldn't touch that deal.

To MTL: 5th overall
To WAS: Kovalev, Perezhogin or Chipchura, 12th overall, SJ 1st

To MTL: Eminger and 5th overall
To WAS: Perezhogin, D'Agostini, 12th overall, SJ 1st

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Old
04-10-2007, 06:45 PM
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The Viking Fury
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I don't see the caps taking Kovalev. I personally would take Chipchura, and maybe a defenseman prospect over Kovy in that deal.

Eminger, 5th
for
Chipchura, Dman prospect, 12th overall, and SJ first.

is that doable?

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Old
04-10-2007, 08:46 PM
  #23
ChuckyToGally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Viking Fury View Post
I don't see the caps taking Kovalev. I personally would take Chipchura, and maybe a defenseman prospect over Kovy in that deal.

Eminger, 5th
for
Chipchura, Dman prospect, 12th overall, and SJ first.

is that doable?
You won't get a top quality d-man prospect but I think that Gainey would be real interested in such a deal.

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Old
04-10-2007, 08:57 PM
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The Viking Fury
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I don't know about top quality, but decent potential or future PPQB type guy maybe?

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Old
04-11-2007, 12:27 AM
  #25
txpd
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This is a great fantasy hockey trade that won't happen in the real world.
From the Caps point of view they can't trade Clark who is both a symbol of the Caps identity AND a player of exceptional value. By value I mean a player producing WAY above his contract numbers.

Koivu on the other hand is a player who is expensive and provides fair value for his cost, but who is not exactly a bargain. That is a trade the Caps just won't make.

Looking at the trade another way, the Caps have two major holes in the lineup. One is a lack of experienced veteran players throughout the lineup and the other is for quality defenseman. With this trade the Caps do not address either of those holes in the lineup. You can argue the Koivu is more experienced and more of a leader than Clark is but in the end that is only a matter of marginal improvement since it is a net gain of ZERO experienced players. The Caps NEED MORE experienced players not different one's.

On defense Boullion cube is a step back from Morrisonn and so that part of the deal does not address the Caps needs on defense.

Ryder makes more than Clark and scores less than Clark. I don't see that as insentive to trade first round picks.

The Caps may well make a trade of significance this offseason. But if they do, it will be trading of assets they have an abundance of for assets they desperately need.
The first round pick in the June draft and/or any of the recently taken first round picks might well be traded as well as one of the many solid young 3rd or 4th line forward in the organEYEzation. Eminger, Fehr, Pokulok and the lottery pick plus one of Gordon, Sutherby, Laich, Steckel, Clymer, Bradley, Bourque could be packaged for a player that the Caps need. Trading Clark and Morrisonn though is really just a lateral move and not worth the risk.

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