HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Best Way for the Oilers to get an impact player

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-17-2003, 05:39 PM
  #1
Lowetide
Registered User
 
Lowetide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,281
vCash: 500
Best Way for the Oilers to get an impact player

With Comrie's exit the Oilers really have only one impact calibre player on their roster (Hemsky, who's not there yet but is showing all the signs).

Aside from Hemsky, Torres was a top 5 pick and if he can be a 25 goal man he's certainly going to have an impact. Smyth is certainly an above average player, and I'd include York in that category, or close to it.

The Oilers also have some valuable soldiers (Dvorak, Oates, Brewer, Staios, Smith) and some quality youngsters (Semenov, Chimera, Salmelainen, Woywitka, Lynch) either in Edmonton or on the farm, and some nice things bubbling under (Mikhnov, Deslauriers). Some of those could develop into impact players (Semenov could be tremendous, and Mikhnov is making big strides).

There is, as always, a nice foundation there for a team that has the dollars to keep the assets that are maturing. Hopefully, this will be the final season of the NHL's uneven playing field, and signing someone like Hemsky won't be a high wire act.

Here's my question to you: If you're Kevin Lowe, do you move Jason Smith and Georges Laraque (or whomever) to try and run up to the playoffs?

OR is it better to cut bait, play the Salmelainen's of the world, finish up 12th and get the number 7 pick?

The difference is going to be huge (as always).

If the Oilers pick number 7, they might get a shot at Cam Barker (or be close enough to trade up and get him, something that they weren't able to do despite trying very hard for Gaborik and Pitkanen) or someone like Wes O'neill or Lauri Tukonen (who apparently is the best Finn forward in years).

If the Oilers pick 15, it doesn't really matter who they go for, the player will almost certainly not be as sure a thing as guys in the top half dozen or so (although that goalie Montoya looks interesting).

Anyway, as young as this season is, Lowe will probably have to make a big decision in January about which direction to go.

Which direction would you go?

Lowetide is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 06:04 PM
  #2
Seachd
Registered User
 
Seachd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: The Fail
Posts: 13,391
vCash: 500
I've been wondering about this myself. I've been told by one scout anyway that he thinks the first round this year is head and shoulders above last year, especially goalies (of course) and d-men. But he just thinks the overall talent of the top 30 or so guys is pretty darn good. I have McKeen's top 100 list for this year's draft - exactly half of those players are 6'2" or bigger. Unreal. But looking at that list (even though it's early), there's some pretty good looking players in the top 30.

Anyway, if they decide to move Smith, they might be able to grab another good d-man for the future. Here are the d-men in McKeen's top 30:

4. Cam Barker (Medicine Hat, WHL) 6'3" 210 CAN
7. Wes O'Neill (Notre Dame, CCHA) 6'4" 215 CAN
11. Ladislav Smid (Liberec, CZE) 6'3" 190 CZE
17. Kirill Lyamin (CSKA, RUS) 6'3" 200 RUS
26. Johan Fransson (Luleå, SWE) 6'1" 180 SWE

Or, as Lowetide suggested, maybe even a goalie? There are some real good ones out there like Dubnyk, Schwarz, Montoya, and David Brown.

Seachd is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 06:06 PM
  #3
rabi_sultan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 3,782
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to rabi_sultan Send a message via AIM to rabi_sultan Send a message via MSN to rabi_sultan Send a message via Yahoo to rabi_sultan
we're building post 2005 rite? coz the pieces are in place for it. We have two first round picks, i'd say to Lowe move some junk grab a third first rounder and let Brewer-Semenov-Bergeron-Woywitka-Staios/Smith/Ferguson/Cross/Allen handle defensive duties and hope we squeeze into the playoffs

rabi_sultan is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 06:07 PM
  #4
Hellström
Registered User
 
Hellström's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Country: Iceland
Posts: 2,896
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Hellström
I would take the middle

I´ll explain it this way:
I would try to get rid of some bigger contracts (Laraque via trade, Salo via not picking up the option).

Maybe that would include, that we´re lucky and make the POs. If we do so, then i´d try and get premier pick via trade (use Dvorak to get that pick or something else). If we miss the POs, then we should go for a excellent defenseman.
I´d try to get the high potential guys over to NA (Niinimäki, Mikhnov) and some decent guys like Svenk to see what we really got.

From the point Draft2004 on, the Oilers can see what they have talentwise, rosterwise, etc.

I would not try to unload Jason Smith, unless we have solutions for the defense. Without Salo and Laraque´s contracts (maybe include Oates here) and with Rita/Salmelainen/Lynch on the Oilers we could use some free salary and sign a solid goaltender (something like Jani Hurme) and let Conklin + the new guy handle the goaltending duties.
The defense would be okay with Brewer, Semenov, Staios, Smith, Cross, Bergeron, Lynch, Woywitka (on camp it can be decided, wheter you´ll go on with 2 rookies and trade one older guy or with just one rookie and sent the other to Toronto).
The offense would be quite the same as this season, except that Oates, Laraque and maybe someone is not coming back, if the Oilers have to settle a package to acquire a better pick.
The young guys will be a year older, will be more experienced and will get the job done.

This team would be solid in all aspects, you could watch the youngsters develop and then decide whom to keep and whom to trade.

As i said at the beginning of this posting, i´d go the middle of both ways. Try to unload salary, but try to make the play-offs and try to get a good pick (try hard, maybe overpay a little bit).

The Oilers are at a point where Lowe should look at the team and think about the fact if this team is not too talented. Too stocked with talented youngsters.

The Oilers can´t free up spots for Pouliot, Niinimäki, Mikhnov, both 2004 1sts, Rita, Salmelainen, Lynch, Deslauriers, Woywitka, Brodziak, etc.

It´s important to get the best of those guys into the line-up, let them develop in there, get some other guys in the AHL and let them develop there. Use the rest to adress needs of the team.
At the moment we´re stocking our team with good youngsters, in the near future we have to get to the point where we say: We´ve got enough, let´s "use" them and i think this point will come soon.
When this point arrives, we´ll HAVE TO free spots.

The 2003-2004 season should be played as best as possible, but at the Draft the Oilers should go for the best they can get and pay the price. As Lowetide mentioned: more good prospects won´t work, unless you´re the lucky guy and get one of those tremendous steals.

Hellström is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 06:25 PM
  #5
Smaug
Guest
 
Country:
Posts: n/a
vCash:
It looks as though Kevin Lowe may have already decided to make additional trades.

His direction will likely be dictated by what he has to offer up in a trade. In my mind, Lowe doesn't have any assets that he could afford to move to get an impact "roster" player. He could offer a whole boatload of Jason Smith, Ferguson, George Laraque, Brad Isbister, Horcoff et all, but there is not enough there to get, say, a top six scoring centre. The best Lowe can hope for is a few extra picks in the 04 draft. And that is what he will go for .... the only thing is he already has 2 first, and two second round picks. Thus, he will be looking to offer some combination of the "expendible" players and a first round/second round pick to get one of the 04 top five picks.
Jason smith, a late first rounder, and maybe the third round pick from the flyers in 05 might be enough to get a top five pick, if not, chuck in Laraque, or Ferguson too. At least, that is what I think Kevin Lowe will do.
Gentlemen, there will be no "help" parachuting in to get the Oil to the dance this year. They must do it on their own, and I think they will too

 
Old
12-17-2003, 06:39 PM
  #6
Dr_Gonz0
Registered User
 
Dr_Gonz0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd
I've been wondering about this myself. I've been told by one scout anyway that he thinks the first round this year is head and shoulders above last year, especially goalies (of course) and d-men. But he just thinks the overall talent of the top 30 or so guys is pretty darn good. I have McKeen's top 100 list for this year's draft - exactly half of those players are 6'2" or bigger. Unreal. But looking at that list (even though it's early), there's some pretty good looking players in the top 30.

Anyway, if they decide to move Smith, they might be able to grab another good d-man for the future. Here are the d-men in McKeen's top 30:

4. Cam Barker (Medicine Hat, WHL) 6'3" 210 CAN
7. Wes O'Neill (Notre Dame, CCHA) 6'4" 215 CAN
11. Ladislav Smid (Liberec, CZE) 6'3" 190 CZE
17. Kirill Lyamin (CSKA, RUS) 6'3" 200 RUS
26. Johan Fransson (Luleå, SWE) 6'1" 180 SWE

Or, as Lowetide suggested, maybe even a goalie? There are some real good ones out there like Dubnyk, Schwarz, Montoya, and David Brown.
You wouldn't happen to have a complete list of the projected top 30 for the 20004 draft would you?

Dr_Gonz0 is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 07:45 PM
  #7
hockeyaddict101
Registered User
 
hockeyaddict101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 19,903
vCash: 500
I do

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Gonz0
You wouldn't happen to have a complete list of the projected top 30 for the 20004 draft would you?
From two different sources. Of course these could change as the draft gets closer

From Redline:
Ovechkin LW 6-1/195 R 17 Sept 85 Dynamo
Malkin C 6-2/176 L 31 Jul 86 Dynamo
Olesz C 6-2/191 L 10 Oct 85 Vikovice
Barker D 6-3/205 L 04 Apr 86 Medicine Hat
Schwarz G 5-9/165 R 01 Apr 86 Sparta Praha
Wolski LW 6-2/188 L 24 Feb 86 Brampton
Sindel RW 5-11/163 R 24 Jan 86 Slavia Praha
O'Neill D 6-3/192 L 03 Mar 86 Notre Dame Univ.
Lisin RW 6-1/189 L 22 Apr 86 Dynamo Moscow
Tukonen C 6-3/191 R 01 Sep 86 Espoo
Smid D 6-2/189 L 01 Feb 86 Liberac
Dubnyk G 6-5/190 R 04 Mar 86 Kamloops
Schremp LW 6-0/195 L 01 Jul 86 London
Chipchura C 6-2/200 L 19 Feb 86 Prince Albert
McGrath C 6-0/175 L 14 Jan 86 Kitchener
Montoya G 6-2/178 L 13 Feb 85 Univ. of Michigan
Meszaros D 6-2/191 L 13 Oct 85 Dukla Trencin
Stafford RW 6-2/200 R 19 Oct 85 North Dakota Univ.
Voloshenko LW 6-1/189 R 12 May 86 Krylja
Meidi C 6-3/194 L 27 May 86 Plymouth
Pineault C 6-2/193 R 23 May 86 Boston College
Wick RW 6-1/176 L 30 Dec 85 Kloten
Brown G 5-11/186 L 01 Feb 85 Notre Dame Univ.
Green D 6-1/191 R 12 Oct 85 Saskatoon
Booth LW 6-1/208 L 24 Nov 84 Michigan State
Makarov LW 5-11/196 R 17 Sep 85 Magnitogorsk
Ladd LW 6-2/199 L 12 Dec 85 Calgary
Schneider G 6-2/188 L 18 Mar 86 Andover Acad.
Kaspar RW 6-2/196 L 23 Sep 85 Litinov
Plyuschev C 6-0/185 L 08 Feb 86 Spartak

From Mckeens

Ovechkin
Olesv
Malkin
Barker
Schremp
Dubnyk
O'Neill
Schwarz
Tukonen
Pineault
Smid
Wolski
Sindel
Lisin
McGrath
Kaspar
Lyamin D 6-3/200 CSKA
Ellis G 5-11/201 L 27 Jan 86 Shawninigan
Stafford
Bickell LW 6-3/210 L 09 Mar 86 Ottawa
Pohl RW 5-10/158 R 28 Aug 86 Hulll
Picard LW 6-2/190 L 09 OCT 85 Lewiston
Chipchura
Booth
Schneider
Fransson
Montoya
Soderberg
Hensick
Meidl

---------------------------------------------------------------------

This draft is not as deep at the 2003 draft the first half dozen picks have more star quality.

Redline lists who they think the 30 best players are and not how they think they will be drafted and I am pretty sure Mckeens lists them the same way.


Last edited by hockeyaddict101: 12-17-2003 at 08:00 PM.
hockeyaddict101 is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 08:03 PM
  #8
HOZ
Registered User
 
HOZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Japan
Country: Japan
Posts: 650
vCash: 500
Ovechkin or bust

HOZ is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 08:04 PM
  #9
elphy101
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: City of Champions
Posts: 1,568
vCash: 500
I think it's time to let the kids play. Time to move Smith, Laraque and a few others. Make room for Wowitka, Rita and Salmolainen. Give some quality ice time to guys like Stoll. These young guys are the key to the future of this team. The best way to improve is by playing, learn from your mistakes. Trial by fire.

The Oilers should try and solve their goaltending situation as well. Bite the bullet on Tommy Salo if you have to. Send him to the minors and pay him to play the last half of the season there. Trade for another young goalie to team with Salo (look what the Kiprusoff trade did for Salo). If Wowitka, Rita, Conklin, and Salmo play now, they will be that much better come 2005.

The worst thing that happens to Edmonton if they play their kids is they lose and end up with a shot at a bonafide impact player. Some punishment.

(P.S In regards to the impact player bit. I think the Oilers have two. Ales Hemsky and Eric Brewer. Ryan Smyth and York are excellent but not impact players. I don't know why everyone seems so down on Brewer, he went from heavily overated last year to being the most underated this year)

elphy101 is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 08:30 PM
  #10
kingbrath
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,161
vCash: 984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Gonz0
You wouldn't happen to have a complete list of the projected top 30 for the 20004 draft would you?

that is a long way off, maybe by then you could get Ovechkins great great great great great great great great great great grandson!

kingbrath is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 08:38 PM
  #11
kruezer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Toronto
Posts: 6,273
vCash: 500
I think Lowe should go for Barker at all costs (well not all but you know what I mean). With a Couple firsts to work with he can move up. I honestly think Barker will be better than Jay Bouwmeester....I know thats blasphemy, but JMO. Anyway, I think they really do need to make room for the youngsters very soon.

kruezer is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 08:49 PM
  #12
hockeyaddict101
Registered User
 
hockeyaddict101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 19,903
vCash: 500
Not really IMO

Quote:
Originally Posted by kruezer
I think Lowe should go for Barker at all costs (well not all but you know what I mean). With a Couple firsts to work with he can move up. I honestly think Barker will be better than Jay Bouwmeester....I know thats blasphemy, but JMO. Anyway, I think they really do need to make room for the youngsters very soon.
Bouwmeester was the best in what was considered a weak draft year. Barker is in a strong top 12. It is not inconceivable to think that Barker will be the better dman.

hockeyaddict101 is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 09:06 PM
  #13
Mowzie
Asst. Dishwasher
 
Mowzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Lebanon, Alberta
Country: Lebanon
Posts: 8,289
vCash: 500
I dont think we need to trade Jason Smith for salary reasons. My heart of hearts tells me that after the CBA is cleared up and hockey resumes, Salo and Oates will no longer be Oilers, that is nearly 6 mil from this years budget gone. Laraque and Isbister are bubble players, meaning I think they have until the end of this season to make a name for themselves. Laraque needs to play his role again and is being given the chance to regain it. And in Izzy's case, Lowe wanted him for a long time, so I dont see them trading him until he has atleast one full season in Oiler silks and fails; I think Izzy will be an Oiler for a longtime personally, he does more things right than wrong and if he can find some consistency, he'll be just fine.

I dont really know we could trade for an impact guy, looking at our roster, I dont think we can or will part with Hemsky, Smyth, York or Dvorak. Hemsky has shown flashes of brilliance Oilers fans havent seen since the 80's. Smyth personifies what being an Oiler is all about, and he's willing to take a pay cut to play here, so you've gotta respect that. Dvorak and York have adapted well here and are relatively cheap as well.

Mowzie is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 09:17 PM
  #14
momentai
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,352
vCash: 500
Problem with Smith is that he is having a great year this year especially when you look at the numbers. If he files for arbitration (and he's done it once before much to the dismay of Kevin Lowe), he is bound to get at least 3.5 million.

The Oilers are still a small market team and have to work in a budget. 3.5 million or more is just too much money to tie into one dman regardless of how much is saved by not picking up the option on Salo and not resigning Oates. Especially a dman that won't even be the number 1 option for this team.

momentai is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 09:50 PM
  #15
kruezer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Toronto
Posts: 6,273
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaz44
Bouwmeester was the best in what was considered a weak draft year. Barker is in a strong top 12. It is not inconceivable to think that Barker will be the better dman.
Fair enough, then mark me down for one who thinks so.

kruezer is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 10:11 PM
  #16
OYLer
Registered User
 
OYLer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Win Desperate & Mad!
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
With Comrie's exit the Oilers really have only one impact calibre player on their roster (Hemsky, who's not there yet but is showing all the signs).

Aside from Hemsky, Torres was a top 5 pick and if he can be a 25 goal man he's certainly going to have an impact. Smyth is certainly an above average player, and I'd include York in that category, or close to it.

The Oilers also have some valuable soldiers (Dvorak, Oates, Brewer, Staios, Smith) and some quality youngsters (Semenov, Chimera, Salmelainen, Woywitka, Lynch) either in Edmonton or on the farm, and some nice things bubbling under (Mikhnov, Deslauriers). Some of those could develop into impact players (Semenov could be tremendous, and Mikhnov is making big strides).

There is, as always, a nice foundation there for a team that has the dollars to keep the assets that are maturing. Hopefully, this will be the final season of the NHL's uneven playing field, and signing someone like Hemsky won't be a high wire act.

Here's my question to you: If you're Kevin Lowe, do you move Jason Smith and Georges Laraque (or whomever) to try and run up to the playoffs?

OR is it better to cut bait, play the Salmelainen's of the world, finish up 12th and get the number 7 pick?

The difference is going to be huge (as always).

If the Oilers pick number 7, they might get a shot at Cam Barker (or be close enough to trade up and get him, something that they weren't able to do despite trying very hard for Gaborik and Pitkanen) or someone like Wes O'neill or Lauri Tukonen (who apparently is the best Finn forward in years).

If the Oilers pick 15, it doesn't really matter who they go for, the player will almost certainly not be as sure a thing as guys in the top half dozen or so (although that goalie Montoya looks interesting).

Anyway, as young as this season is, Lowe will probably have to make a big decision in January about which direction to go.

Which direction would you go?
Frankly lowetide, I am amazed at how we can differ on so many points and both be such diehard fans. Firstly, I never thought Comrie was an impact player to begin with. He was showing some signs over a year and a half, but only when he was given the opportunity to play with the Oilers' best talent. When Mikey was demoted to the 3rd line his performance was very Cleary like, getting nocked off the puck easily, skating miles but getting nothing done. MC committed lots of turnovers which led to alot of goals after he was healthy at the end of last year. Smytty and Carter and Marchant and York help him look better than he is, IMHO.

Secondly, the Oilers' impact player so far this year is Jason Smith; check out his stats against the other top ten defensemen in the league. Apart from the penalty kills his numbers are great and deserving of recognition. If Edmonton's specialty team play didn't literally stink this team would be in seventh or maybe sixth place in the WC. If we had great consistent goaltending we could be in 5th position. If Selfish Comrie had been a useable asset and not caused such a demoralizing team distraction maybe even 4th place. The degree of difference between success and failure it very slight in the NHL. To many small irritations, injuries to key people (i.e. Reasoner), and coaching blunders can become the excuses that justify poor and uninspired team play.

If you now add to this reduced fan expection, a playoff team could unconciously choose to take the low road and finish 13th or 14th in the conference and play poor unexciting hockey until the strike next year. By the end of say two years of bad and no hockey the fan base will dwindle away and even a more favourable CBA will not keep NHL hockey alive in Edmonton. The Edmonton Investors' Group had better spend every last cent they can to make sure the Oilers go farther into the playoffs this year or they will be trying to sell the Edmonton NHL franchise and competing for purchasers with the 5 or 6 other American franchises that will be going belly-up. Making the playoffs and doing well so that a marginally successful teams like Edmonton can maintain the loyalty of their fanbase during a protracted work stoppage is crucial for all Small Market NHL franchises that are currently in financial trouble.

The majority of Oilers' fans will not put up with two more years of poor hockey and no hockey and stay loyal to a team that throws-in the towel. The paying fans will not continue to buy: the season tickets, the parking, the merchandise, the beer, the vended food, and the PPV. Fans want and deserve return on their investments too! Sporting entertainment dollars will only continue to be spent by fans, if and only if, their team has a sporting chance to be entertaining, and yes, winning is a big part of that formula. Revenues will plummet and this franchise will fold. Maybe the Oilers can stay afloat if they win a little more this year than they did last year. However if the 'Oil' continue to lose their days are numbered, because virtually no one will continue to support losers in professional sports. It takes Big Market teams longer to fold than Small Market teams because of pent-up demand. As I have said before, for the Oilers' Franchise THE FUTURE IS NOW!


Last edited by OYLer: 12-17-2003 at 10:36 PM.
OYLer is offline  
Old
12-17-2003, 10:57 PM
  #17
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,031
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OYLer
Frankly lowetide, I am amazed at how we can differ on so many points and both be such diehard fans. Firstly, I never thought Comrie was an impact player to begin with. He was showing some signs over a year and a half, but only when he was given the opportunity to play with the Oilers' best talent. When Mikey was demoted to the 3rd line his performance was very Cleary like, getting nocked off the puck easily, skating miles but getting nothing done. MC committed lots of turnovers which led to alot of goals after he was healthy at the end of last year. Smytty and Carter and Marchant and York help him look better than he is, IMHO.
I don't think Mike was healthy at all after he came back, ergo the complete uselessness. As far as him being an impact player is concerned he was offensively, but his defensive woes probably take him out of the overall category if you get my meaning.

Carter never helped anyone do anything imo, he was the one riding on the coattails of his linemates if anyone was. Marchant never played on a line with Comrie, and York only played with him in the pre-season and on the infamous "gimp" line in the playoffs. Yeah they hooked up on the pp a bit, but that's not enough to pump up his stats and make him look better than he was. You're going way too far to make a point here.

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 07:16 AM
  #18
OYLer
Registered User
 
OYLer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Win Desperate & Mad!
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
I don't think Mike was healthy at all after he came back, ergo the complete uselessness. As far as him being an impact player is concerned he was offensively, but his defensive woes probably take him out of the overall category if you get my meaning.

Carter never helped anyone do anything imo, he was the one riding on the coattails of his linemates if anyone was. Marchant never played on a line with Comrie, and York only played with him in the pre-season and on the infamous "gimp" line in the playoffs. Yeah they hooked up on the pp a bit, but that's not enough to pump up his stats and make him look better than he was. You're going way too far to make a point here.
Toronto, Monteal, Chicago, the Rangers, New Jersey, Philly, Col, Dallas, STL, Detroit, Boston are NHL franchise teams with an agenda. They have a vested interest in NHL contraction. If 5 or 6 NHL franchises go under, the resultant glut of NHL talent will bring down average player salaries dramatically. Then all these owners can get back to making the big bucks. Older expensive players will be replaced by the younger great prospects in the contraction pool.

Do you think that LA wouldn't be happy if Anaheim went under and the Kings fan base could only attend their own games instead of the LA fans filling the Ducks rink when those two teams play each other. The last game the Oilers played in the pond there were just a smattering of fans. This is a team that went to the Stanley Cup finals! If you think I'm a Chicken Little crying wolf you'd better think again. Teams will go under, mark my words, Nashville knows the writing is on the wall unless they make the playoffs. The Large Market teams don't care if Edmonton survives. Calgary has seen the light and they know that they must make the playoffs or it is lights-out at the Saddledoom! One of those Sunshine teams in Florida is going to be gator bait and have you noticed the coaches who have been fired lately. It is survival time as NHL hockey must admit over expansion into the States did NOT work. The Pens, the Caps, TB, NYI, are all teams that could be moved. Edmonton losing its team would be just too bad but well they didn't want to pay the 50% increase in ticket prices needed to keep a losing team so who cares!

Friends of mine who have 4 seasons tickets (2 adults + 2 boys) have taken to leaving the games 20 minutes early to get a jump on missing the stampede of unhappy fans that are escaping Rexall Place earlier and earlier when the Oilers are losing. This is the first year they're started doing this. Ownership and Management should seriously conduct a poll of the intention of their season ticket holders, because if the Oilers don't perform better this year than last, then the EIG might get a nasty surprise--people who are playing the freight are unhappy.

You might notice the the best year Comrie had in Edmonton, the Oilers missed the Playoffs, not much impact there! Those last few games where Calgary knocked us out of contention, when the going got tough, Mikey was not a factor. The reason Comrie was so upset at Carter leaving was he knew how much playing with Anson and Smytty helped his game. Like Arnott and Poti found out, now Carter is learning the hard lesson playing for a Big Market Club. Talent, skill, and a little finish only will get you so far when ice time is at a premium. Mikey will be growing up fast or riding the Philly pine.


Last edited by OYLer: 12-18-2003 at 10:30 AM.
OYLer is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 08:06 AM
  #19
barto
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 2,465
vCash: 500
I'd be OK with moving Smith close to the deadline for some 'good stuff'. Playoff-bound teams might be willing to overpay, and we'd only lose his services for the last...what, 4-6 weeks of the season? Maybe Woywitka will have stepped up his game to earn a spot, or Semenov will have turned the corner to make Smith more expendable, or...? Greene could be our mean & nasty d-man at some point, right?

I don't think Lowe's done dealing just yet, but I guess we'll see what happens as we approach the deadline and how the team is doing by then. Maybe he even moves Salo for something if a team wants to get some goaltending depth for the stretch run/playoffs... Should be interesting!

Bart

barto is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 08:22 AM
  #20
Mizral
Registered User
 
Mizral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Earth, MW
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,121
vCash: 500
The aboslute #1 goal of this team should be to make the playoffs. Get these kids some playoff experience. It might sound interesting to go for the top 10 pick, don't make the playoffs, probobly don't make it next year either, then start winning, but by then, you've got a bunch of 22 - 25 year old kids who haven't won much at the NHL level. Losing, just like winning, can breed a contagious atmosphere of loser players. It's no coincidence that the teams with the best track record of bringing up young players also win a hell of a lot (Wings, Avs, Devils). You go the Florida route, expect to be a loser team for a few years, and after that, it depends on the talent level, but you might be stuck in the #6 - #10 bracket again. You can't risk that.

You don't put the city of Edmonton through it's third rebuild in a row. That's just bloody terrible management. Lowe has already had one shot at rebuilding the franchise, and thus far it hasn't shown a lot of progress this season. You don't take steps backwards.

Mizral is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 08:42 AM
  #21
Big T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: LLoydminster, AB
Posts: 338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by barto
I'd be OK with moving Smith close to the deadline for some 'good stuff'. Playoff-bound teams might be willing to overpay, and we'd only lose his services for the last...what, 4-6 weeks of the season? Maybe Woywitka will have stepped up his game to earn a spot, or Semenov will have turned the corner to make Smith more expendable, or...? Greene could be our mean & nasty d-man at some point, right?

I don't think Lowe's done dealing just yet, but I guess we'll see what happens as we approach the deadline and how the team is doing by then. Maybe he even moves Salo for something if a team wants to get some goaltending depth for the stretch run/playoffs... Should be interesting!

Bart

1. It takes 4 - 5 years for d-men to come close to their potential. Trading Smith for Greene means 4 years with a weak defense.

2. I look at Jackman being a young high quality guy who is only able to play at that high level by being paired with Macinnis. Old man Al really improves young Barret's game. This is what needs to be done here in E-town.

Staios - Brewer to teach Brew how to think the game better
Smith - Semanov to teach Alex toughness
Cross - Bergeron to teach MAB better defensive positioning

This would greatly improve the backfield as far as I'm concerned.


T

Big T is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 08:45 AM
  #22
momentai
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,352
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
The aboslute #1 goal of this team should be to make the playoffs. Get these kids some playoff experience. It might sound interesting to go for the top 10 pick, don't make the playoffs, probobly don't make it next year either, then start winning, but by then, you've got a bunch of 22 - 25 year old kids who haven't won much at the NHL level. Losing, just like winning, can breed a contagious atmosphere of loser players. It's no coincidence that the teams with the best track record of bringing up young players also win a hell of a lot (Wings, Avs, Devils). You go the Florida route, expect to be a loser team for a few years, and after that, it depends on the talent level, but you might be stuck in the #6 - #10 bracket again. You can't risk that.
What about Tampa Bay? Ottawa before the emergences of young Hossa? Atlanta now? Vancouver before last season?

Fact of the matter is. You can win games and have successful season if you have the right personnel both in the coaching staff and the players in the locker room. Playoff success/failure isn't going to have a huge amount of effect in the players' confidences if they just aren't talented enough to beat out teams like Dallas in past years.

We can keep this team together, add new pieces to the puzzle but even then it is no guarantee the Oilers will A) make the playoffs or B) Win once they get in. There are risks for every plausible situation. It merely has to do with the likelihood of each happening.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
You don't put the city of Edmonton through it's third rebuild in a row. That's just bloody terrible management. Lowe has already had one shot at rebuilding the franchise, and thus far it hasn't shown a lot of progress this season. You don't take steps backwards.
Actually... Lowe has never started a rebuild of the franchise. Not once. It hasn't been since the Glen Sather days that this club went into a complete rebuild. Lowe has been, thus far, "retooling" the franchise as it goes along.

momentai is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 10:15 AM
  #23
Master Lok
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 6,670
vCash: 500
Just look at the hotheaded posts just on this board and I know that Edmonton would not be willing to go through a rebuilding process. Edmonton fans are incredibly knowledgeable, loyal to the team and.... impatient. I just can't see the Edm faithful to stick around while the Oil flounder for a couple of years as Lowe gives up all playoff hopes and trades away top end talent. It took an incredible effort by Lowe and the CopperJackets to revive the fanbase after the Sather-Pocklington years. In the end, even if we did get an impact player, the fans would probably turn on him and boo him out of here much like they did to Poti, Arnott and Comrie.

We have to stick to the middle: aiming for 6-8th spot in order to get a playoff spot and develop the talent that we have drafted. Continue with Lowe's ballsy trading and hopefully some lucky drafting will produce some better results. Lastly, a favourable CBA would help immensely.

Master Lok is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 11:39 AM
  #24
speeds
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: St.Albert
Posts: 6,823
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neogeo69
Edmonton fans are incredibly knowledgeable, loyal to the team and.... impatient. I just can't see the Edm faithful to stick around while the Oil flounder for a couple of years as Lowe gives up all playoff hopes and trades away top end talent.

So are you saying they are loyal, or they aren't?

I woud say they are impatient, that is true.

This is a team though that I think would benefit from a quick tanking this year, land a top 10 pick, and probably be ready to leap back into the playoff hunt post-lockout with a better future than before.

Also, I'd have to argue that most EDM fans are not knowledgeable at all. Every time I go to a game all I hear are these morons fans yelling "SHOOT!!!" at the most inopportune of times.

speeds is offline  
Old
12-18-2003, 11:55 AM
  #25
speeds
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: St.Albert
Posts: 6,823
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
Which direction would you go?
Any idea what I'm gonna say here lowetide ?

*************

6 points behind CAL...

they have 2 games in hand.

ANA and DAL are dogs right now, but teams like that almost always have a hot streak, hotter than EDM can get.

It is early, but it was a tough battle from the start of the year when we were all even. It's tougher now.

No doubt in my mind that it is a perfect time to "embrace the horror" and have a real quick reload here to get ready for the post-lockout era.

Oilers are a rebuilding club that honestly would be best served by moving as many of Smith, Laraque, Isbister, Dvorak***, Cross, Ferguson, Staois*** and Smyth*** as possible by the end of January. Load up on picks, hopefully pick top 10 this year, and come out swinging post lockout. And of course Salo for anything if you can, though the way he's playing the cynic in me thinks you keep splitting the games hoping Salo catches fire, and as soon as he does maybe you can move him at the deadline for a pick of some sort, in case someone wants insurance in goal.

*** - indicates only move if you get a pretty damn good return.

speeds is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:53 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.