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André Savard is proud of "his/our" youngs...

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Old
04-11-2007, 05:40 PM
  #1
Le depisteur
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André Savard is proud of "his/our" youngs...

According to André Savard, the Habs can be optimistic, with his great depth in very good young players...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20.../1002/CPSPORTS

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04-11-2007, 05:41 PM
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Good to hear but at the same time, was he really going to say that his picks ended up being mediocre or useless?

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04-11-2007, 05:53 PM
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It's good he's talking about Perezhogin as an enigma, he hyped him so much in the last few years. Hopefully he will be better next year and the hands will come back.

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04-11-2007, 05:55 PM
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I miss André

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04-11-2007, 06:12 PM
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So do I. No offense to Gainey.

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04-11-2007, 06:22 PM
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Erik Estrada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Le depisteur View Post
According to André Savard, the Habs can be optimistic, with his great depth in very good young players...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20.../1002/CPSPORTS
"During the 5 years I spent in the (Habs) organization (as GM and Assistant-GM), I found myself in a position where I could clinch the argument (during the draft). And that's what I did. "

I find this an interesting quote. It shows that the buck stops at the GMs office for the draft. The GMs office can decide to delegate its power to the director of player personnel or the scouts, but it's ultimately responsible for the success or failure of drafts.

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04-11-2007, 06:39 PM
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So do I. No offense to Gainey.
I miss Savard and Vignault.

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04-11-2007, 06:57 PM
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Le depisteur
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At the end of this article, André Savard made some comments about his badest pick ever, Urquhart. He also say he didn't pay attention to Patrice Bergeron because he wasn't on the Habs prospect list...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20...006/CPSPORTS01

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04-11-2007, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Le depisteur View Post
At the end of this article, André Savard made some comments about his badest pick ever, Urquhart. He also say he didn't pay attention to Patrice Bergeron because he wasn't on the Habs prospect list...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20...006/CPSPORTS01
Again, even with the CSS a guy like Lapierre was ranked ahead of Bergeron.

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Old
04-11-2007, 07:28 PM
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I miss André
Same here. Probably 'cause as a fan, I thought it was easier to read André than it is with Bob. My perception of André was that he was more proactive and a little less patient than Bob. And while Bob's style may be great in some occasions, I prefered André's style with his flaws as well. Still have in mind his rage in New Jersey when Burns had to restrain him a little, loved his passion.

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04-11-2007, 07:52 PM
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I miss André
Speculation : Gainey to Toronto if Ferguson is fired.

We hire Savard, he comebacks by the big door!

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Old
04-11-2007, 07:57 PM
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Speculation : Gainey to Toronto if Ferguson is fired.

We hire Savard, he comebacks by the big door!
I call supreme ******** on that one, he had a chance to go to TO years ago and wanted NO part of it.

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Old
04-11-2007, 09:50 PM
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I like A.Kostitsyn but I'd trade him in a heartbeat for either Parise or Getzlaf.

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04-11-2007, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
"During the 5 years I spent in the (Habs) organization (as GM and Assistant-GM), I found myself in a position where I could clinch the argument (during the draft). And that's what I did. "

I find this an interesting quote. It shows that the buck stops at the GMs office for the draft. The GMs office can decide to delegate its power to the director of player personnel or the scouts, but it's ultimately responsible for the success or failure of drafts.
I don't think he was GM for five years, no? I don't think gainey is the one who has the last word at the draft. Probably has influence, but i'm pretty sure Timmins is the one who decides in the end.

I still think Savard should be the hab's GM. This guy had such a mess to work with when he gecame the gm it's unbelievable. He deserves a lot mor credit than he got.

So that's why I want to wait to judge Gainey's work, even though I'm far from impressed up to now; because people didn't give Savard that chance and I think it was unfair.

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04-11-2007, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
I like A.Kostitsyn but I'd trade him in a heartbeat for either Parise or Getzlaf.
Would I have in hindsight drafted in a heartbeat Getzlaf and Parise before Kostitsyn. Probably. But that's because Getzlaf and Parise had 1 year and half to 2 years added production in their respective teams.

Would I trade Getzlaf and Parise for Kostitsyn in a heartbeat right now. That's a different story because were just evaluating future (not past) production.

Getzlaf and Parise are good players that had a good season with their clubs. They're not great players (at least not yet). The numbers they put up this season are roughly equivalent to Michael Ryder's numbers:

Zach Parise 82-31-31-62
Michael Ryder 82-30-28-58
Ryan Getzlaf 82-25-33-58

Getzlaf's prior year (rookie) he had 39 pts (14G) in 56 games, while Parise's were similar to Latendresse's rookie season.

Zach Parise 81-14-18-32
Latendresse 80-16-13-29

We also need to factor in the fact we have his brother and compatriot Grabovski in the pipe, and the effect it would have on them.

Have Parise or Getzlaf topped out their offensive potential ? Are they going to put bigger numbers in the next few years ? Can Kostitsyn match these 60 points seasons ? I would certainly take more than a split second on the question.

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04-11-2007, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Burnside_1 View Post
I don't think he was GM for five years, no? I don't think gainey is the one who has the last word at the draft. Probably has influence, but i'm pretty sure Timmins is the one who decides in the end.

I still think Savard should be the hab's GM. This guy had such a mess to work with when he gecame the gm it's unbelievable. He deserves a lot mor credit than he got.

So that's why I want to wait to judge Gainey's work, even though I'm far from impressed up to now; because people didn't give Savard that chance and I think it was unfair.
1) GM + Assistant GM = 5 years (it's in my translation)
2) "Probably has influence, but i'm pretty sure Timmins is the one who decides in the end."
Maybe I'm misunderstanding Savard's quote or maybe Savard's lying about the inner workings of the organization.

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Old
04-11-2007, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
1) GM + Assistant GM = 5 years (it's in my translation)
2) "Probably has influence, but i'm pretty sure Timmins is the one who decides in the end."
Maybe I'm misunderstanding Savard's quote or maybe Savard's lying about the inner workings of the organization.
I said that because when he left he mentionned that they didn't listen to him anymore; he wanted brûlé at the draft but timmins wanted price. Think we have our answer right here.

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04-11-2007, 11:51 PM
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Erik Estrada
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I said that because when he left he mentionned that they didn't listen to him anymore; he wanted brûlé at the draft but timmins wanted price. Think we have our answer right here.
At the 2005 entry draft he wasn't GM anymore, he was Assistant-GM, Bob Gainey was the GM. What happened is Bob Gainey trusted Timmins more than he did Savard on this matter.

If you read my first post, you'll see that I wrote that the GMs office is entrusted with the power to make the decision. Who heads the GMs office. The GM. Who was GM at that time. Bob Gainey. Bob Gainey has the power to delegate or override the Director of Player Personnel on draft matters (or his Assistant GM's advice).

At least that's what my reading of André Savard's quote implies "je me suis retrouvé dans la position de trancher (au repêchage)". As GM the ultimate power "de trancher", and as Assistant-GM the delegated power from Gainey "de trancher".

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04-11-2007, 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
At the 2005 entry draft he wasn't GM anymore, he was Assistant-GM, Bob Gainey was the GM. What happened is Bob Gainey trusted Timmins more than he did Savard on this matter.

If you read my first post, you'll see that I wrote that the GMs office is entrusted with the power to make the decision. Who heads the GMs office. The GM. Who was GM at that time. Bob Gainey. Bob Gainey has the power to delegate or override the Director of Player Personnel on draft matters (or his Assistant GM's advice).

At least that's what my reading of André Savard's quote implies "je me suis retrouvé dans la position de trancher (au repêchage)". As GM the ultimate power "de trancher", and as Assistant-GM the delegated power from Gainey "de trancher".
Perfectly understand what you mean, never questionned it either. I just find it weird that he said he had the power to decide who to draft given the Price vs Brûlé situation. So no need to deconstruct your post, I know it's late but even then

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04-12-2007, 01:31 AM
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AS rebuilt this franchise, no question.

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Old
04-12-2007, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Same here. Probably 'cause as a fan, I thought it was easier to read André than it is with Bob. My perception of André was that he was more proactive and a little less patient than Bob. And while Bob's style may be great in some occasions, I prefered André's style with his flaws as well. Still have in mind his rage in New Jersey when Burns had to restrain him a little, loved his passion.
Yea you knew André was going to do everything to win. And when the Habs began active on the UFA front he wanted the best. I'm pretty sure the summer he was canned as GM that he was gonna do a big move, get a good UFA player but hiring Gainey put the procedures to a stop. It's like the whole organisation went into suspended animation for a while. Especially that summer. With Savard we were ready to take the next step, aquire other guys to go further in the playoffs. But when Gainey took over that summer he didn't know anybody, didn't know the players so he prefered evaluating them for a whole season rather than realise where we were and help the team win. It was an awful waste of time for everybody and I think not fair for the fans who should have expected better than waiting for a new GM to find his feet. Heck we could even say that Gillet hired Gainey so everybody will could off and accept to suck for a while. Because everybody was trusting the super legend that was Gainey. Gillet didn't have to spend the money that he should have had. It's funny that the moment Bob did spend Gillet's money it was disaster, overpaying for limited results: Theo, Huet, Kovalev, Koivu, Samsonov.

I really believed we would have progressed under A. Savard but instead by hiring Gainey we regressed. The Habs as a team are probably as weak as we were when Peanut left.

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Old
04-12-2007, 07:56 AM
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Kimota that has to be the most insane statement I've come across in awhile. While I agree that Gainey taking over produced a lull that probably wouldn't have occured had Savard been here, how can you compare the team today to Peanut's legacy? Go back and see the roster we had then.

I'm at a loss for words really...

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Old
04-12-2007, 08:06 AM
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Saying Bob made bad signings and Andre is on the ball is not fair IMO.

It was Savard who wanted top take S.Kostitsyn 45th and Bob who opted to take Latendresse instead. Looking back where Kosty Jr. was drafted it seems clear that Bob has a better grasp on the consensus of how other GM's think. Bob had Andre's advice and still managed to sneak Kosty Jr. out of the draft.

Number 2. Theo's 1st big contract was Savard's work and also the $4 million for Breezer was Savard's decision too. Czerkawski for our 1st rounder was Andre's as well. He did make some lousy decisions.

Both have completely different strengths and weaknesses. Both are good hockey men.

We still miss you Brother Andre.

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04-12-2007, 08:26 AM
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I like A.Kostitsyn but I'd trade him in a heartbeat for either Parise or Getzlaf.
What are you smoking. Still much too soon to tell.

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Old
04-12-2007, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by ATHLÉTIQUE_CANADIEN View Post
Saying Bob made bad signings and Andre is on the ball is not fair IMO.

It was Savard who wanted top take S.Kostitsyn 45th and Bob who opted to take Latendresse instead. Looking back where Kosty Jr. was drafted it seems clear that Bob has a better grasp on the consensus of how other GM's think. Bob had Andre's advice and still managed to sneak Kosty Jr. out of the draft.

Number 2. Theo's 1st big contract was Savard's work and also the $4 million for Breezer was Savard's decision too. Czerkawski for our 1st rounder was Andre's as well. He did make some lousy decisions.

Both have completely different strengths and weaknesses. Both are good hockey men.

We still miss you Brother Andre.
Agree, but Theo threatened to hold out. Bob probably wouldn't have done any better with his contract. Brisebois at $4 mil for his playing time is akin to Bouillon at $2.5 mil.

I really think we're still better off with Bob. Andre thinks more in terms of getting talent for cheap, which is exactly how most HFboards posters think. Bob focuses moreso on the chemistry of his team, and if he has to pay a price for the veteran he wants, he will.

It really comes down to Gainey's experience playing with a dynasty. He knows how to keep teams winning, and he knows how players think. He'd rather keep his team sinking than make a panic move and hurt it in the long run.

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