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Kostitsyn, Latendresse and 1st rounder vs Rental

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Old
04-14-2007, 11:11 AM
  #1
kostitsyn1489
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Kostitsyn, Latendresse and 1st rounder vs Rental

That's pretty much what Boivin said in Cyberpresse

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20.../1002/CPSPORTS

Quote:
«C'est comme pour la date limite des échanges, ajoute le président montréalais. Tout le monde nous a critiqués parce qu'on n'a pas bougé. Mais nous, on mise sur la patience. Ça nous aurait donné quoi de «louer» un joueur au mois de février? De toute façon, les prix étaient beaucoup trop élevés. Il aurait fallu donner Kostitsyn et Latendresse, en plus de notre choix de première ronde cette année. On ne voulait pas faire ça. C'était un prix trop élevé pour une équipe qui a un plan comme le nôtre.»
It's not a Bob Gainey bashing thread.

Maybe they wouldve make the playoff but these 2 players will be key to this team right next year and for the next 5 at least.

I just want to know if you wouldve traded these players plus a first rounder for Ryan Smyth, Tkachuk, Bertuzzi, Guerin or else?

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04-14-2007, 11:19 AM
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Does that question really need to be answered?

What gets me is that teams that mortgage their future always get lauded...even if they simply make the playoffs.

James Duthie actually had the nerve to say the o9ther day that the Islanders won the Smyth deal because they made the playoffs. Never mind that they were in a playoff position before the deal was made.

If every team that traded three first rounder merely to "make the playoffs" was considered to be a winner.....seems pretty preposerous to me.

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04-14-2007, 11:19 AM
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Why in the name of holy **** would the Habs ever trade Kostitsyn and Latendresse for someone not named Lecavalier or Iginla?

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04-14-2007, 11:39 AM
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Haha, that's more than any team gave up for any player at the deadline.

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04-14-2007, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brownman View Post
Why in the name of holy **** would the Habs ever trade Kostitsyn and Latendresse for someone not named Lecavalier or Iginla?
Yeah and only if they're not UFA's the following season.

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04-14-2007, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by brownman View Post
Why in the name of holy **** would the Habs ever trade Kostitsyn and Latendresse for someone not named Lecavalier or Iginla?
Can we includ Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin... or Jokinen, Phaneuf, Marleau... or...

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04-14-2007, 11:47 AM
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Quiet Robert
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Originally Posted by brownman View Post
Why in the name of holy **** would the Habs ever trade Kostitsyn and Latendresse for someone not named Lecavalier or Iginla?
Because that wouldn't be enough to get them. What would push those teams to give up a bonifide superstar, in his prime and under contract for two young players and a draft pick? That's not even close to being enough.

Although maybe it would have been enough to get us Forsberg at the deadline. In fact I get the feeling it would have been pretty close to a package good enough to land Forsberg, maybe if it was tweaked a little.

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04-14-2007, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Haha, that's more than any team gave up for any player at the deadline.
That's exactly what I thought when I read the article. Is it harder for Montreal to trade for a rental, has it is with signing a Ufa? I mean, with all due respect for the O'Marra Nilsson combo, they do not have the same potential as a Lats Kost combo. Just wondering.

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04-14-2007, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by MTL-rules View Post
Can we includ Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin... or Jokinen, Phaneuf, Marleau... or...

While I wouldn't have traded Lats and Kost without a big return, I can't believe you're compaing players that have already fulfilled much of their potential with two guys who are far from doing the same.

Of course, this is common on HFBoards...

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04-14-2007, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by turnbuckle View Post
James Duthie actually had the nerve to say the other day that the Islanders won the Smyth deal because they made the playoffs. Never mind that they were in a playoff position before the deal was made.
LOL, I love Duthie, he's such a funny guy!

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04-14-2007, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kostitsyn1489 View Post
That's pretty much what Boivin said in Cyberpresse

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20.../1002/CPSPORTS



It's not a Bob Gainey bashing thread.

Maybe they wouldve make the playoff but these 2 players will be key to this team right next year and for the next 5 at least.

I just want to know if you wouldve traded these players plus a first rounder for Ryan Smyth, Tkachuk, Bertuzzi, Guerin or else?
If they would have said that at the trade deadline, BG would have been less bashed. They waited after the season to tell us that, that's the problem.

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04-14-2007, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Montrealer View Post
While I wouldn't have traded Lats and Kost without a big return, I can't believe you're compaing players that have already fulfilled much of their potential with two guys who are far from doing the same.

Of course, this is common on HFBoards...
That's not what I'm doing... Read again...

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04-14-2007, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Gustave View Post
That's exactly what I thought when I read the article. Is it harder for Montreal to trade for a rental, has it is with signing a Ufa? I mean, with all due respect for the O'Marra Nilsson combo, they do not have the same potential as a Lats Kost combo. Just wondering.
I think teams with good young prospects get asked for more. A lot of teams looking to trade their rentals want bluechippers in return. Well, not too many teams actually have bluechippers, and those that do don't usually want to give them up in a rental.

Anaheim faced that situation as well with Bobby Ryan, Ryan Getzlaf, and Corey Perry, according to Burke everyone was asking for one of those players for a rental which is why he couldn't make a deal. He wasn't going to give them up. And, nobody was willing to look at what was behind them, or at other options.

I imagine when Montreal phoned, teams asked for one of Guillaume Latendresse, Andrei Kostitsyn, and/or Carey Price. I'm sure those were short phone calls.

Who ultimately changed hands at the tradeline? A lot of first round picks and a lot of future 3rd liners, but no top end guys. Teams that don't have bluechippers, but just good prospects tend to win out in the end because the team getting the return is at least getting one of the other teams 'best' prospects.

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Old
04-14-2007, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by MTL-rules View Post
That's not what I'm doing... Read again...
Ah, I see... you're talking about asking for Iginla and saying we might as well have asked for the moon.

Sorry, I guess I read that too quickly.

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04-14-2007, 02:44 PM
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Ah, I see... you're talking about asking for Iginla and saying we might as well have asked for the moon.

Sorry, I guess I read that too quickly.
Man, what is it with you? Did you woke up from the wrong side of the bed?

The guy posted that we shouldn't think of trading our two youngsters for "anyone not name Lecavalier or Ignla"...

I just said that I wouldn't mind trading these two for Lecavalier, Ignla, Crosby, Malkin...and a lot more superstars...

I never implied that they (Lats and Kost) were superstars to be nor did I say that I would only trade these two to get superstars.

Do I need to make it even clearer or what?

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04-14-2007, 03:03 PM
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Boivin exagerated a bit but there is certainly some truth in that.. One of Kostitsyn or Latendresse + our first round pick would have been the price to get a guy like Ryan Smith and I wouldnt have never did it neither Gainey..

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04-14-2007, 03:35 PM
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Kostitsyn, Latendresse and 1st rounder vs Rental


No way.

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04-14-2007, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by NewHabsArea View Post
Boivin exagerated a bit but there is certainly some truth in that.. One of Kostitsyn or Latendresse + our first round pick would have been the price to get a guy like Ryan Smith and I wouldnt have never did it neither Gainey..
Yeah, after the trade deadline Gainey said that he was not willing to give up the Habs top young prospects for a temporary quick fix. I agree 100%. Hopefully, the team will have the bucks to sign top UFA's without sacrificing the future going into next season.

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04-14-2007, 03:40 PM
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no way in hell.

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04-14-2007, 03:47 PM
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As the Glorious Weep
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If they would have said that at the trade deadline, BG would have been less bashed. They waited after the season to tell us that, that's the problem.
Oh, so now Gainey is accountable to the media?

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04-14-2007, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Quiet Robert View Post
Because that wouldn't be enough to get them. What would push those teams to give up a bonifide superstar, in his prime and under contract for two young players and a draft pick? That's not even close to being enough.

Although maybe it would have been enough to get us Forsberg at the deadline. In fact I get the feeling it would have been pretty close to a package good enough to land Forsberg, maybe if it was tweaked a little.
Hmmm, what did Edmonton get for Chris Pronger after he was arguably the best player in the entire playoffs last year?
If you look at it, basically Ryder, Emelin and draft picks.

And the Flyers did not get close to that for Peter Forsberg.

I always find it funny when people (fans, media, and hockey analysts) say that we don't have the players to make a deal happen and then the deal happens and the players going the other way may have name recognition but are slightly above average at best.

The last time I can remember a team getting good value, after the fact, for one of their star players was when Calgary traded Nieuwendyk to Dallas for Iggy.

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Old
04-14-2007, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsArea View Post
Boivin exagerated a bit but there is certainly some truth in that.. One of Kostitsyn or Latendresse + our first round pick would have been the price to get a guy like Ryan Smith and I wouldnt have never did it neither Gainey..
I don't think he exagerated at all. I remember very well Demers saying quite some time ago ( it went under the radar, no one even mentioned it ) that the Oilers had called the habs about Smyth. They wanted Higgins and Latendresse ( or replace one of those two by Komisarek ).

For us it doesn't make any sense, but I'm willing to bet the Oilers weren't the only one trying that.

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04-14-2007, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by MTL-rules View Post
Man, what is it with you? Did you woke up from the wrong side of the bed?

The guy posted that we shouldn't think of trading our two youngsters for "anyone not name Lecavalier or Ignla"...

I just said that I wouldn't mind trading these two for Lecavalier, Ignla, Crosby, Malkin...and a lot more superstars...

I never implied that they (Lats and Kost) were superstars to be nor did I say that I would only trade these two to get superstars.

Do I need to make it even clearer or what?
Was my apology not clear enough? I understood what you said the second time, and I honestly don't see in my second post what caused you to freak.

Maybe you're the one who woke up one the wrong side of the bed?

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Old
04-14-2007, 09:58 PM
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tiredman
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Originally Posted by As the Glorious Weep View Post
Oh, so now Gainey is accountable to the media?
No. But if he wouldn't have waited that long before telling us something, he would have been less bashed.

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Old
04-14-2007, 10:10 PM
  #25
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1st + Latendresse + Kostitsyn vs type of players like Marian Hossa/Ilya Kovalchuk/Evegni Malkin/Vincent Lecavalier. = Okay...


Kostitsyn and Latendresse may not reach potential but on the other hand this is possible.

So you are not going to trade a 35-55-90 player (Kostitsyn, numbers are at max potential develop to 100%) and 35-35-70 (Lats) and a first against a rental but yes against franchise player like named above. But we all know Kostitsyn will never get 90pts in the NHL on the Habs organisation. We are not good to make perform a player offensively I would say we are the best to blow up talent up front.

3 Last best offensive player by a Habs:

Last 90pts:

Pierre Turgeon 1995-96 96pts
Vincent Damphousse 1995-96 94pts

Last 80pts:

Mark Recchi 1996-97 80pts
Vincent Damphousse 1996-97 81pts

Last player near of the 80pts in a season:

Alexei Kovalev 2005-2006 65pts in 69games (77 in 82games)
Saku Koivu 2006-2007 75pts in 81 games (75pts in 82 games)

My post turn off topic a little bit but honestly when the habs will have a 80pts players on their rosters ? Next season, 2008-09, 2009-2010, never ?

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