HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

The Atlantic Next Year

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-23-2007, 12:12 PM
  #76
RangerSteve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Jeruz
Country: United States
Posts: 638
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to RangerSteve
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
LOL, how is it stupid to fire a coach right before the playoffs when it has worked before?? Seriously man, are we forgetting 2000 already? I mean com'on Jon, do you think it was stupid then?
It worked before when you had another COACH step in. Lou knows his hockey team better than others, but that doesn't necessarily mean he is fit to coach either. Face it..Lou couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich and these last two seasons have proved that.

RangerSteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:12 PM
  #77
WhipNash27
Quattro!!
 
WhipNash27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Westchester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 14,850
vCash: 500
Sather > Lou and has 3 extra rings

WhipNash27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:13 PM
  #78
Ronnie Bass
elite pissy upside
 
Ronnie Bass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Country: Ireland
Posts: 19,859
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Rx View Post
I give the guy credit when it's deserved and I give the guy **** when it's deserved. And you know I do give him credit when it's needed and that I've also bashed him many, many times. I've done the same thing with Sather (though he's bashed much more than praised, haha).

Now he deserves to get ****. He did no better than Julien could've done and looked just as lost as Julien did at times. It made him look very, VERY arrogant and pompous -- thinking he could do a better job and then falling right on his butt. It was pretty laughable from an outsider's viewpoint as well.

I can't imagine anyone who isn't a Devils fan thinking that Lou doesn't look foolish for this move now that his team got their ***** handed to them on a silver platter by the Senators. Only a huge homer would think so, and I wouldn't consider you a homer, LiG.

Jon, name any other time that Lou has done something that was very arrogant and pompous? If he had a history of this then yeah, you can make a case for it, but because something doesn't work for him doesn't earn him the right to be labeled as such.

Also I said in this thread that Lou didn't screw up when he fired Julien, but when he hired him.

__________________
1995, 2000, 2003..........
Ronnie Bass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:17 PM
  #79
Ronnie Bass
elite pissy upside
 
Ronnie Bass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Country: Ireland
Posts: 19,859
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerSteve View Post
It worked before when you had another COACH step in. Lou knows his hockey team better than others, but that doesn't necessarily mean he is fit to coach either. Face it..Lou couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich and these last two seasons have proved that.
What? Oh com'on man, are you forgetting how the team played for him in the 2nd half of the 2006 season? And the guy was a great college coach as well, to say he couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich is stupid with all due respect.

The man didn't lose in the postseason to average teams, he lost to a team that won the cup in 2006 and most likely the samething is going to happen this year.

Ronnie Bass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:21 PM
  #80
Bird Law
Daisy's back.
 
Bird Law's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NoVA / NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 67,188
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Bird Law
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
Jon, name any other time that Lou has done something that was very arrogant and pompous? If he had a history of this then yeah, you can make a case for it, but because something doesn't work for him doesn't earn him the right to be labeled as such.

Also I said in this thread that Lou didn't screw up when he fired Julien, but when he hired him.
Actually, I've always thought he was fairly arrogant and pompous. Just in the way he'd talk at interviews and even about the salary cap. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just his attitude. It's funny, because my dad (who is a Devils fan) thinks the same thing and notices the same things I do.

I don't think it's bad for a guy who's won 3 Stanley Cups in a decade to be arrogant. But there are some things that really bring it out and have to make you laugh at the pompousness and arrogance that it took to do such a thing. And firing your Atlantic winning (and possible Jack Adams candidate) coach is one of those things.

For the record, I think Sather is the same way. There are some GMs who are more arrogant and some who are much more humble. Lou has a reason to be quite arrogant and I think it comes off sometimes.

And while I agree that Julien was clearly not the best coach for NJ, who out there could've done any better than an Atlantic Division win?

__________________
"Of course giving Sather cap space is like giving teenagers whiskey and car keys." - SBOB
"Watching Sather build a team is like watching a blind man with no fingers trying to put together an elaborate puzzle." - Shadowtron
Sestito still on the make a wish tour. - rholt168
"Okay, Joel. You've had your fun. Give your brother his pads back." - Trxjw
Bird Law is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:22 PM
  #81
Bird Law
Daisy's back.
 
Bird Law's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NoVA / NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 67,188
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Bird Law
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
What? Oh com'on man, are you forgetting how the team played for him in the 2nd half of the 2006 season? And the guy was a great college coach as well, to say he couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich is stupid with all due respect.

The man didn't lose in the postseason to average teams, he lost to a team that won the cup in 2006 and most likely the samething is going to happen this year.
We all know how well "great college coach[es]" work in the NFL

Bird Law is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:36 PM
  #82
RangerSteve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Jeruz
Country: United States
Posts: 638
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to RangerSteve
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
What? Oh com'on man, are you forgetting how the team played for him in the 2nd half of the 2006 season? And the guy was a great college coach as well, to say he couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich is stupid with all due respect.

The man didn't lose in the postseason to average teams, he lost to a team that won the cup in 2006 and most likely the samething is going to happen this year.
2005-2006 Devils: 101 points
2006-2007 Devils: 107 points

I will still stand by my statement about how he couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich simply because the Devils have gone 0-2 with him behind the bench in their run for the cup. I'm done with this topic for the fact that I made a few question in my initial post, and you still continue to flip flop on the issue. My post went from what makes you think the Devils will be able to just change into next season due to Pat Burns coming back, and you have turned this into a protect Lou contest. I thought it was a very good discussion until the topic was changed.

RangerSteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:43 PM
  #83
Ronnie Bass
elite pissy upside
 
Ronnie Bass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Country: Ireland
Posts: 19,859
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Rx View Post
And while I agree that Julien was clearly not the best coach for NJ, who out there could've done any better than an Atlantic Division win?

Lou's son, Jesus.

Ronnie Bass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 12:46 PM
  #84
Ronnie Bass
elite pissy upside
 
Ronnie Bass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Country: Ireland
Posts: 19,859
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerSteve View Post
2005-2006 Devils: 101 points
2006-2007 Devils: 107 points

I will still stand by my statement about how he couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich simply because the Devils have gone 0-2 with him behind the bench in their run for the cup. I'm done with this topic for the fact that I made a few question in my initial post, and you still continue to flip flop on the issue. My post went from what makes you think the Devils will be able to just change into next season due to Pat Burns coming back, and you have turned this into a protect Lou contest. I thought it was a very good discussion until the topic was changed.

Does that mean every coach - including Renny, who I like alot - who is 0-2 in the playoffs couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich.

Ronnie Bass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:00 PM
  #85
RangerSteve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Jeruz
Country: United States
Posts: 638
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to RangerSteve
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
Does that mean every coach - including Renny, who I like alot - who is 0-2 in the playoffs couldn't coach a starving man to eat a ham sandwich.
Renney would eat the sandwich to lead by example.

RangerSteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:04 PM
  #86
Ronnie Bass
elite pissy upside
 
Ronnie Bass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Country: Ireland
Posts: 19,859
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerSteve View Post
Renney would eat the sandwich to lead by example.
LOL, fair enough, I can see your dead tired of this discussion as much as me!

Ronnie Bass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:34 PM
  #87
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,693
vCash: 500
I agree that the Pens and the Rangers will probably be the top teams in the Atlantic, but if the Pens strengthen other areas, they will most probably be the cream of the crop and not just in the Atlantic division, but the conference.

The Devils will be interesting, because they do have a solid core in Elias, Gionta, Lagenbrunner, Parise, Zajac, Martin and the kid Greene, plus Marty who maybe on the down side of his career, but will still be better then 80% to 90% of the goaltenders.

I'm personally torn with what they should do, because I'm used to watching them have good regular seasons and making the playoffs. However, I believe with a couple of solid drafts, they can be a serious contender again by 2010. And for that to happen, they would have to not make the playoffs in the next few years. But, I can understand Lamoriello heading into a new arena will do his best not to have that happen by probably going after B type free-agents and try to have a more balanced team for all the new season ticket holders they keep stating they have. I think they will at the very least be a 6 to 8 playoff seed. Not sure that really accomplishes anything in my opinion. Sometimes you may need to take a step back to take two step forwards. And I'm not talking about a totaly rebuild, because you can get stuck in a situation like Colombus and Florida that seem to be rebuilding every year and drafting low without much success.

Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:44 PM
  #88
Bird Law
Daisy's back.
 
Bird Law's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NoVA / NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 67,188
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Bird Law
Brooklyn or Lou: Any of you guys think the Debs might take Poulin (G) next year in the 1st? He'll be a 17/18 year old kid and Marty will be what, 34/35? That way in 5 years a guy like Poulin will be 22/23 and ready to take the starting role.

Bird Law is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:53 PM
  #89
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,693
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Rx View Post
No one's trying to sell him short, but it's not like Julien was working with the most SKILLED team out there. I think you have to face it that he did a very good job and won the team the damn Atlantic division while having a group of guys who can play a good system but aren't the most skilled group of players after the EGG line, Rafalski and Broduer.

I think that speaks a lot to how well Julien actually did with the team. The Devils should not have been as good as they were last year when you look at them on paper. We say this every year and they constantly prove the naysayers wrong. The talent level they had should not have let them be as good as they were. But Julien coached them well enough to have them be as good as they were.

I highly doubt Burns would do any better than Julien. And I think you guys are selling Julien way short simply because there is a need for a Devils fan to justify Lou's firing of him (which was boneheaded and made him look like a pompous fool). Julien could've beaten the Lightning. So it's just stupid for the GM to fire a guy right before the playoffs. I just don't think that anyone can say that Burns would've been a better coach. How much better COULD he have been to win the Atlantic and lose to the team that made the Stanley Cup?

I don't think Burns could've coached the Devils through the Senators. Just don't see it. So that's why I think you guys have all sold Julien SERIOUSLY short here.

Jon,

And you can track our posts were many of us questioned Juline's coaching during mid-season on. So, it's not like he was fired and Devil fans came out of the woodwork posting that the guy sucked. But, you bring up a valid point about the Devils having a 100pt. season. However, most of that was due to Marty having a spectacular regular season. And when I tell you are defensemen never crossed the blue line or how our forwards hardly ever forechecked, you will probably say that's the Devils M.O., but it isn't. Rafalski and Niedermayer in his last season when he won a Norris, always carried the puck deep on rushes and if you watch tapes of the Devils from last season, you will see that they had a solid forecheck. Did they trap, yes with a lead, but I have seen Buffalo, Ottawa and the Rangers trap this season. As for not being able to win by using the trap, I must disgree. And Montreal fans warned us when the Devils hired him how he coaches. He was the must conservative coach we ever had.

Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 01:59 PM
  #90
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,693
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Rx View Post
Brooklyn or Lou: Any of you guys think the Debs might take Poulin (G) next year in the 1st? He'll be a 17/18 year old kid and Marty will be what, 34/35? That way in 5 years a guy like Poulin will be 22/23 and ready to take the starting role.

Jon,

You probably know more about these prospects than I do. I was reading up a some swedish goaltender. The Devs have a 2nd, two 3 and a 4th. I can see them take a goaltender with any of those picks if they like one. They will probably load up on goaltending prospects in the next several drafts.

Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:11 PM
  #91
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
Jon,

And when I tell you are defensemen never crossed the blue line or how our forwards hardly ever forechecked, you will probably say that's the Devils M.O., but it isn't.


And Montreal fans warned us when the Devils hired him how he coaches. He was the must conservative coach we ever had.
This is what kills me in the ongoing debate about the Devils and the level of excitment/lack there of associated with their games because all year we saw post after post saying what a uneducated, biased, slanted view all these jealous fans and media hacks were showing with commenting on just how unwatchable Devil games were and you guys have sticky threads ridiculing all these people with these opinions but yet after the Julien firing now all of the sudden the team was the most conservative ever(aka boring) and forwards never forechecked and dmen never entered the attacking zone etc.....I just don't get it.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:22 PM
  #92
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,693
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
This is what kills me in the ongoing debate about the Devils and the level of excitment/lack there of associated with their games because all year we saw post after post saying what a uneducated, biased, slanted view all these jealous fans and media hacks were showing with commenting on just how unwatchable Devil games were and you guys have sticky threads ridiculing all these people with these opinions but yet after the Julien firing now all of the sudden the team was the most conservative ever(aka boring) and forwards never forechecked and dmen never entered the attacking zone etc.....I just don't get it.
Jr. You can find some of my posts where I mentioned that this Devils team was hard to watch. And I wasn't the only Devils fan. Now if you espect a Devil fan to admit that to you, especially the way you attack the Devils, which let's be honest, you do, no one is going to give you the statisfaction. But, there were games that were so ugly, I changed channel this season and I never did before, and that's the God honest truth!

Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:29 PM
  #93
Classic Devil
Global Moderator
Spirit of 1988
 
Classic Devil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 32,881
vCash: 500
Awards:
I don't think Lou looked like a fool. No matter who was coaching New Jersey, whether it be Lamoriello, Julien, Burns, Lemaire, or Bowman, the Devils weren't going to beat Ottawa this year. It just wasn't going to happen.

So, at best Julien does as well as Lou did. At worst, Julien does worse than Lou did and we get knocked out in the first round by Tampa Bay - and Tampa lost because Tortorella refused to play the rest of his team.

It has little to do with style, as Lou used the same style Julien would have. The big problem with Julien's coaching (and Devils coaching in general since Robinson was fired the first time) is that he's 100% passive. There's no forecheck, there's very little offensive pressure, it's all waiting for turnovers. And that didn't work against Spezza and it barely worked against Lecavalier. The old Devils relied on a solid forecheck. The passive style worked in 2003 because we had Stevens and Niedermayer and Brodeur backing up a Madden and Pandolfo (and Pascal Rheaume) who were all playing the best defensive hockey of their lives.

Lou's mistake was waiting so long to fire Julien, because there was no time to try to get the passivity out of our system. The Devils are built for speed now - everyone can skate. If we had played to that strength, and worked to develop the team around that aspect of our game, instead of the aspects of the game where we used to be the best, we would have had a more successful postseason. Though, with Gomez likely leaving, I'm not sure what we're going to look like next season.

As for the Atlantic...

Philadelphia is going to be a better team next year than last. I don't think the Flyers will make the playoffs, but I won't be surprised if they do, especially if they make the right UFA signings and shore up their defense. The Rangers will end up above the Flyers in the standings. The Islanders will miss the playoffs, IMO, since I don't think they're going to be able to re-sign any of their key free agents - Smyth, Blake, and Poti will all be on other teams next year, I think. The Devils will find a way to make it into the postseason, as we always do, although I have no idea what our top-2 lines are going to look like. To be honest, a couple bad seasons to restock the farm might not be a terrible idea, although I can't ever imagine us tanking.

And Pittsburgh is going to continue improving. I don't see them winning the cup for another 2 years or so, but I do see them winning the division. Pittsburgh is going to improve, have a couple seasons where they're going to be dominant, and then everyone is going to hit free agency at the same time. When that happens it'll be a real test of their GM to see if he can keep the team on a dominant level.


Last edited by Classic Devil: 05-23-2007 at 02:40 PM.
Classic Devil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:38 PM
  #94
JR#9*
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
Jr. You can find some of my posts where I mentioned that this Devils team was hard to watch. And I wasn't the only Devils fan. Now if you espect a Devil fan to admit that to you, especially the way you attack the Devils, which let's be honest, you do, no one is going to give you the statisfaction. But, there were games that were so ugly, I changed channel this season and I never did before, and that's the God honest truth!

Yeah, that wasn't dirceted specificly at you BD but at Devils fans in general and believe me I'm not holding my breath waiting on any Devil fan granting me satisfaction, rightfully so.

JR#9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:43 PM
  #95
Bird Law
Daisy's back.
 
Bird Law's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NoVA / NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 67,188
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Bird Law
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
Jon,

You probably know more about these prospects than I do. I was reading up a some swedish goaltender. The Devs have a 2nd, two 3 and a 4th. I can see them take a goaltender with any of those picks if they like one. They will probably load up on goaltending prospects in the next several drafts.
Gistedt? He's pretty good. But he's already 19 or 20. I would think the Devils would want to go with a younger netminder prospect right now rather than take an older one just because they could let him develop longer and he wouldn't bolt back to Sweden or anything.

Bird Law is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:51 PM
  #96
Classic Devil
Global Moderator
Spirit of 1988
 
Classic Devil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 32,881
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
Yeah, that wasn't dirceted specificly at you BD but at Devils fans in general and believe me I'm not holding my breath waiting on any Devil fan granting me satisfaction, rightfully so.
I think that Devils games have gotten progressively slower and more boring to watch ever since we traded Jason Arnott and Randy McKay for Nieuwendyk and Langenbrunner. The reason most Devils fans take offense to people calling us boring is that people make it sound like we've ALWAYS been boring, which just simply isn't the case. In 1988 we had a hugely offense-oriented team, and we remained so until Lemaire. And despite playing the trap in 1995, that was a team which was not a passive club, but played a very intense forecheck (leading to all Devils fans' enduring love for Peluso-Holik-McKay). That feature in our game didn't dissipate until we no longer had the players to do it, which is when we lost Holik and Arnott and replaced them with Madden and Nieuwendyk. Everyone forgets that we were #2 or #1 in goal scoring from 1999-2001 and those teams were anything but boring.

But since 2002 we've played a very passive game, and that's because we haven't had a McKay or Holik or Arnott to jump-start the offensive forecheck. Those kinds of players aren't easy to come by.

Even still, I wouldn't call the Devils boring ALL of the time. Especially when we fall behind, we are forced to switch hats and go from a passive trapping team to a skating and passing team - the difference between a team whose focus is playing without the puck and a team whose focus is puck possession. One of those is not much fun to watch. The other is a lot of fun to watch. Not to mention more effective....

So...

Skating Team (1986-1992ish) ---> Forechecking Team (1994ish-2002) ---> Passive Trap Team (2002-2007) ---> Skating Team again please!


Last edited by Classic Devil: 05-23-2007 at 03:03 PM.
Classic Devil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 02:59 PM
  #97
Ola
Registered User
 
Ola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 16,663
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou is God View Post
Dude, it wasn't the Devils style that killed them this postseason, it was the lack of scoring from their 3rd and 4th lines.
Nah, I don't agree. I think you might be alittle flawed in your thinking here, you are used to see you guys back off and create allot of very dangerous chances, nothing unusual. That aren't working anymore...

Though the backing down part gets very obvious when you see NJD play one night and then any of the 6 other teams another night.

In terms of puckpossesion NJD was way way behind the other teams.

So yeah, I think it was their style. In terms of pure skill, you guys got more depth then Ottawa. Though its hard when everything is supposed to be created off the rush.

Ola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 03:00 PM
  #98
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,693
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9 View Post
Yeah, that wasn't dirceted specificly at you BD but at Devils fans in general and believe me I'm not holding my breath waiting on any Devil fan granting me satisfaction, rightfully so.

Anyway, it should make for an interesting off season with the rumors of offers to RFA's and UFA's. Lou has been in a difficulty position the last few years, some his own fault, some not of his own making, so for us Devil fans it will be interesting to watch and see what type of off season he has. I for one am very interested to see if he bounces back with a good year, if he doesn't, it may be time for a change. He can just handle his duities as president, what ever that details and give the position to either his Son, which I believe he's gromming him for or to Davie Conte in the meantime.

As for Sather, I've never like the guy, he just rubs me the wrong way back when he was with the Oilers. But, lately I like how he's quitely going about his job by staying out of the lime-light and kudos to him for some fine drafting of late and making all the right moves in regards to trades like Avery, Mara and keeping Jagr happy.

I believe the draft is in June and free agency begins July 1st., can't wait.


Last edited by Brooklyndevil: 05-23-2007 at 08:43 PM.
Brooklyndevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 03:05 PM
  #99
Ola
Registered User
 
Ola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 16,663
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Devil View Post
I think that Devils games have gotten progressively slower and more boring to watch ever since we traded Jason Arnott and Randy McKay for Nieuwendyk and Langenbrunner. The reason most Devils fans take offense to people calling us boring is that people make it sound like we've ALWAYS been boring, which just simply isn't the case. In 1988 we had a hugely offense-oriented team, and we remained so until 1993-4. And despite playing the trap in 1995, that was a team which was not a passive club, but played a very intense forecheck (leading to all Devils fans' enduring love for Peluso-Holik-McKay). That feature in our game didn't dissipate until we no longer had the players to do it, which is when we lost Holik and Arnott and replaced them with Madden and Nieuwendyk. Everyone forgets that we were #2 or #1 in goal scoring from 1999-2001 and those teams were anything but boring.

But since 2002 we've played a very passive game, and that's because we haven't had a McKay or Holik or Arnott to jump-start the offensive forecheck. Those kinds of players aren't easy to come by.

Even still, I wouldn't call the Devils boring ALL of the time. Especially when we fall behind, we are forced to switch hats and go from a passive trapping team to a skating and passing team - the difference between a team whose focus is playing without the puck and a team whose focus is puck possession. One of those is not much fun to watch. The other is a lot of fun to watch. Not to mention more effective....

So...

Skating Team (1986-1992ish) ---> Forechecking Team (1994ish-2002) ---> Passive Trap Team (2002-2007) ---> Skating Team again please!
Devils have been booring all the time -- to play against.

1-3-1 is a offensive system. Though, it gets darn booring if two trapping teams plays against each other, thats the problem with the trap.

When a 1-3-1 team plays against a "ordinary" team with the redline the trapping team will create allot of offense.

There was one way to play in this league with the redline offside, that was to trap, trap and then trap some more. Though the scale have tipped now. Its one thing to play organized defense, there are no other way. But before you could give the puck away, line up in the neutralzone, and then create offense right after misstakes was made. These days thoose misstake don't come nearly as often.

Ola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-23-2007, 03:09 PM
  #100
ziggy7716
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,079
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Devil View Post
I don't think Lou looked like a fool. No matter who was coaching New Jersey, whether it be Lamoriello, Julien, Burns, Lemaire, or Bowman, the Devils weren't going to beat Ottawa this year. It just wasn't going to happen.

So, at best Julien does as well as Lou did. At worst, Julien does worse than Lou did and we get knocked out in the first round by Tampa Bay - and Tampa lost because Tortorella refused to play the rest of his team.

It has little to do with style, as Lou used the same style Julien would have. The big problem with Julien's coaching (and Devils coaching in general since Robinson was fired the first time) is that he's 100% passive. There's no forecheck, there's very little offensive pressure, it's all waiting for turnovers. And that didn't work against Spezza and it barely worked against Lecavalier. The old Devils relied on a solid forecheck. The passive style worked in 2003 because we had Stevens and Niedermayer and Brodeur backing up a Madden and Pandolfo (and Pascal Rheaume) who were all playing the best defensive hockey of their lives.

Lou's mistake was waiting so long to fire Julien, because there was no time to try to get the passivity out of our system. The Devils are built for speed now - everyone can skate. If we had played to that strength, and worked to develop the team around that aspect of our game, instead of the aspects of the game where we used to be the best, we would have had a more successful postseason. Though, with Gomez likely leaving, I'm not sure what we're going to look like next season.

As for the Atlantic...

Philadelphia is going to be a better team next year than last. I don't think the Flyers will make the playoffs, but I won't be surprised if they do, especially if they make the right UFA signings and shore up their defense. The Rangers will end up above the Flyers in the standings. The Islanders will miss the playoffs, IMO, since I don't think they're going to be able to re-sign any of their key free agents - Smyth, Blake, and Poti will all be on other teams next year, I think. The Devils will find a way to make it into the postseason, as we always do, although I have no idea what our top-2 lines are going to look like. To be honest, a couple bad seasons to restock the farm might not be a terrible idea, although I can't ever imagine us tanking.

And Pittsburgh is going to continue improving. I don't see them winning the cup for another 2 years or so, but I do see them winning the division. Pittsburgh is going to improve, have a couple seasons where they're going to be dominant, and then everyone is going to hit free agency at the same time. When that happens it'll be a real test of their GM to see if he can keep the team on a dominant level.
Hahah thats pretty funny, What's your reasoning of why the Islanders won't be able to keep Smyth, Blake or Poti, It's possible Blake and Smyth walk, but you better believe Garth will go very hard after Drury, Briere, Gomez or Kayria, as far as Poti goes I think he re-signs, he liked it here. Oh of course you can see the devils making it somehow, your a Devil fan. Take the red and black sunglasses off.

ziggy7716 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:17 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.