It's a good thing you put in the smiley. Otherwise, your reputation would be demolished. Breaking news, indeed.
OK, let's make it sound at least plausible. How about Ribeiro, Perezhogin, and Hainsey for LeCavalier? Getting a francophone who is also a big center with 100-point potential would be necessary to appease Yvon Pedneault, Réjean Tremblay, and the 110% aveugles in any trade for Ribeiro.
This is not even funny! You posted on the Bruins board that Samsonov + Boynton won't get Lecavalier because non of them is the best at his position... and now that???
From these three who is the best at his position? Ribeiro? Perezhogin(who can't even get a place on offensievly challenged Habs line up) or Hainsey?
This is not even funny! You posted on the Bruins board that Samsonov + Boynton won't get Lecavalier because non of them is the best at his position... and now that???
From these three who is the best at his position? Ribeiro? Perezhogin(who can't even get a place on offensievly challenged Habs line up) or Hainsey?
Where would he play?!?! Suggesting that Ribeiro would play centre in favour of Lecavalier is ludicrous. If Koivu was to centre line 1A, Lecavalier would take 1B.
Lecavalier as center # 2 ???common !first , i am sure that if we trade for him , Tampa are probably going to ask for Koivu , and if not , Koivu is going to play as center # 2
Lecavalier as center # 2 ???common !first , i am sure that if we trade for him , Tampa are probably going to ask for Koivu , and if not , Koivu is going to play as center # 2
There is no way I'd trade Koivu for Vinny.
At least Koivu gives his 100% every night unlike Lecavalier.
Actually, I would give Tampa Bay their choice of any three forwards in the entire Habs organization for LeCavalier because he's more talented than any one of them. The Lightning would probably take Ribeiro instead of Koivu, but only because he's younger and makes far less money. If LeCavalier came to Montréal he would be the #1 center and Koivu the #2.
Boynton is a very good defenseman, the best on the Bruins, but not in the top 10 in the NHL. Samsonov is overrated IMO, a small one-way player. He gets his points but he isn't a force on the ice. In the playoffs against the Devils he didn't play as well as Brian Gionta, another small player.
Hate to break your bubble but Lecavalier is not on the block. If we were to deal him we may as well fold the franchise now. Plus if he WERE on the block we'd need Zednik/Bulis and one of your prospect types ( Ribeiro,Hossa,Komisarek,Perezhogin )
I really don't understand you guys, looking at Vinny's career so far, it's nothing spectacular. I'd even take Koivu before him. I wouldn't even trade Ribeiro and Zednik for him.
28 points in 82 games
67 points in 80 games
51 points in 68 games
37 points in 76 games
78 points in 80 games
19 points in 31 games
Lecavalier is not more skilled than Koivu.
Bigger yes, better no.
ok , you give some stats , i am gonna give ALL THE STATS ;the ones of Koivu and Vincent but also the ones of the players they played with , at the star of their career
Saku Koivu born; nov 1974 > 20-21 years old
1995-96 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82 20 25 45
1996-97 Montreal Canadiens NHL 50 17 39 56
1997-98 Montreal Canadiens NHL 69 14 43 57
1998-99 Montreal Canadiens NHL 65 14 30 44
1999-00 Montreal Canadiens NHL 24 3 18 21
2000-01 Montreal Canadiens NHL 54 17 30 47
2001-02 Montreal Canadiens NHL 03 0 2 2
2002-03 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82 21 50 71
2003-04 Montreal Canadiens NHL 23 6 12 18
NHL Totals 452 112 249 361 308
Vincent Lecavalier born ;april 1980 > 18-19 years old
1998-99 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 82 13 15 28
1999-00 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 25 42 67
2000-01 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 68 23 28 51
2001-02 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 76 20 17 37
2002-03 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 33 45 78
2003-04 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 31 11 8 19
NHL Totals 417 125 155 280 249
look the ch the year Saku begin to played; 8 scorers of 20 and + goals
77 Pierre Turgeon................................ 80 38 58 96
25 Vincent Damphousse......................... 80 38 56 94
8 Mark Recchi................................... . 82 28 50 78
26 Martin Rucinsky, ............................. 78 29 46 75
51 Andrei Kovalenko.............................. 77 28 28 56
11 Saku Koivu.................................... .. 82 20 25 45
18 Valeri Bure................................... .... 77 22 20 42
43 Patrice Brisebois............................. ...69 9 27 36
49 Brian Savage.................................. ..75 25 8 33
it's not all to have skill; you need teammates to play with
Saku start to play more older , and with a team a way better than Tampa Bay.
Nevertheless in 6 seasons Lecavalier have already more goals than Saku in 9 years...
Last edited by goalchenyuk: 12-25-2003 at 08:49 PM.
I fail to see anything that indicates that Lecavalier is a better player than Koivu in your stats. Lecavalier might have 13 more goals but Koivu has almost 100 more passes.
Also I fail to see your point in putting other players' stats in there, why post Turgeon's and Damphousse's stats? They might of been in the same team but as I remember, they were 3 different centers
ok , you give some stats , i am gonna give ALL THE STATS ;the ones of Koivu and Vincent but also the ones of the players they played with , at the star of their career
Saku Koivu born; nov 1974 > 20-21 years old
1995-96 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82 20 25 45
1996-97 Montreal Canadiens NHL 50 17 39 56
1997-98 Montreal Canadiens NHL 69 14 43 57
1998-99 Montreal Canadiens NHL 65 14 30 44
1999-00 Montreal Canadiens NHL 24 3 18 21
2000-01 Montreal Canadiens NHL 54 17 30 47
2001-02 Montreal Canadiens NHL 03 0 2 2
2002-03 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82 21 50 71
2003-04 Montreal Canadiens NHL 23 6 12 18
NHL Totals 452 112 249 361 308
Vincent Lecavalier born ;april 1980 > 18-19 years old
1998-99 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 82 13 15 28
1999-00 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 25 42 67
2000-01 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 68 23 28 51
2001-02 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 76 20 17 37
2002-03 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 33 45 78
2003-04 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 31 11 8 19
NHL Totals 417 125 155 280 249
look the ch the year Saku begin to played; 8 scorers of 20 and + goals
77 Pierre Turgeon................................ 80 38 58 96
25 Vincent Damphousse......................... 80 38 56 94
8 Mark Recchi................................... . 82 28 50 78
26 Martin Rucinsky, ............................. 78 29 46 75
51 Andrei Kovalenko.............................. 77 28 28 56
11 Saku Koivu.................................... .. 82 20 25 45
18 Valeri Bure................................... .... 77 22 20 42
43 Patrice Brisebois............................. ...69 9 27 36
49 Brian Savage.................................. ..75 25 8 33
it's not all to have skill; you need teammates to play with
Saku start to play more older , and with a team a way better than Tampa Bay.
Nevertheless in 6 seasons Lecavalier have already more goals than Saku in 9 years...
You can tell by watching both players play that Saku is clearly the superior player at this stage of their careers. Lecavalier doesn't have any grit and is not a good leader. He doesn't pay the price. Saku does all of those things and is also a better playmaker.
Lecavalier will get better, but I'm not sure he's going to turn into the player we all thought he would be.
I fail to see anything that indicates that Lecavalier is a better player than Koivu in your stats. Lecavalier might have 13 more goals but Koivu has almost 100 more passes.
Also I fail to see your point in putting other players' stats in there, why post Turgeon's and Damphousse's stats? They might of been in the same team but as I remember, they were 3 different centers
better season of Saku at 27-28 years old;
2002-03 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82 21 50 71
vincent at 19-20 years old
1999-00 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 25 42 67
his better , at 22-23 years old
2002-03 Tampa-Bay Lightning NHL 80 33 45 78
and you fail to see anything that indicates is better ??? common !
and about the 3 centers , he 've played with them in pp situations, but i just wanted to show you that ch were a way better to tb,
2002-03's season wasn't Koivu's best. In terms of how many games he played and how many points he had maybe, but his 56 points in 50 games was a way better season. It was cut short only because of injuries.
Anyways, just looking at Koivu on the ice and Lecavalier on the ice, it's pretty easy to see who's better and it's without a doubt, Koivu. He is a better puck handler, a better passer, a better playmaker and he gives his effort every night unlike Lecavalier.
Maybe Lecavalier is bigger, but bigger isn't always better, especially if you don't put the efforts every night.
I'll still take my little Koivu who dishes it out like he's twice his size
You can tell by watching both players play that Saku is clearly the superior player at this stage of their careers.
???
Lecavalier doesn't have any grit and is not a good leader. He doesn't pay the price. Saku does all of those things and is also a better playmaker.
Lecavalier will get better, but I'm not sure he's going to turn into the player we all thought he would be.
i'm not sure myself and don't think he will be the star he was suppose to turn into , but i that he's going to be a great player , and a better one that Koivu ,may be because the fact that Koivu is too injurie prone ,and have already bad knees ...
[QUOTE=Malakhov] his 56 points in 50 games was a way better season. It was cut short only because of injuries.
QUOTE]
sorry guy but 56 points is 56 points for the team ;
we are ok to say that Koivu is a great player ,but it's clear that he's having an injurie history ,and a player that is not on the ice is not producing ,
koivu have missed +-260 games / in a total of 710 games , and having playing 3 seasons less , Lecavalier have only 35 games less than him ...so when i said to look to those stats , i was not only reffering to the points , but also to that
Going by seasons played is ridiculous, seeing as Koivu missed almost one entirely because of cancer.
Koivu: 452 games 112 goals 249 assists 361 points
Lecavalier: 417 games 125 goals 155 assists 280 points
They've played roughly the same amount of games, give or take about 30 games or so and koivu has way better stats than Lecavalier. He might be injury prone but at least when he's there, he makes the difference unlike Lecavalier who is often invisible on the ice with his lack of effort.
Where would he play?!?! Suggesting that Ribeiro would play centre in favour of Lecavalier is ludicrous. If Koivu was to centre line 1A, Lecavalier would take 1B. Perhaps Julien would go with 3 scoring lines, the last one being centred by Ribeiro, and the fourth line would be a much grittier checking line revolving around you know who.
Breaking News Guys, it appears Lecavalier is really a Hab now. :p
I was pointing to the dilemma of having 3 scoring centers. I don't see the point of adding Lecavalier.
First, forget a package of Hainsey, Hossa and Rivet. The talks would begin with one of Bulis or Zednik and a top prospect like Higgins or Komisarek, perhaps even more. Lecavalier will not come cheaply.
Second, Ribeiro and Koivu have played well as the Habs scoring centers. The team does not need another scoring center, especially at the cost of a scoring winger and a top defensive prospect. The Habs just need to let their prospects and young players continue their development.
Third, Julien will not go with 3 scoring lines, and none of Koivu, Ribeiro or Lecavalier could (or should) play on a checking line. I also don't see any of them being happy with the idea of moving to the wing, and more importantly, I don't see any of them maximizing their skills on the wing.
Fourth, the kind of trade Gainey probably wants to make involves losing players like Perreault, Juneau and possibly Kilger, Rivet, Sundstrom and Dackell. These players do not fetch Lecavaliers. Gainey would perhaps trade away some of the future in a blockbuster, but I would think that he would go for a scoring power forward or a stud defenceman, seeing as the Habs possess plenty of pure offensive skill at the prospect level.
Fifth, I think that adding Lecavalier would be a negative distraction. Expectations would be very high, especially considering what it would take to acquire him. Tensions are supposedly already high between Ribeiro and Koivu. I can only imagine the drama that the media would make if Lecavalier was added to the cast.
If Lecavalier were really available, every team would be lining up with an offer. I just don't see an offer from the Habs that could satisfy Feaster without weakening the team in one way or another.
Going by seasons played is ridiculous, seeing as Koivu missed almost one entirely because of cancer.
Koivu: 452 games 112 goals 249 assists 361 points
Lecavalier: 417 games 125 goals 155 assists 280 points
They've played roughly the same amount of games, give or take about 30 games or so and koivu has way better stats than Lecavalier. He might be injury prone but at least when he's there, he makes the difference unlike Lecavalier who is often invisible on the ice with his lack of effort.
retour à la case depart
you really don't understand that koivu is not a team ...and it's the team that have to win to go far ...Koivu 've scored 112 goals during the 710 games played by the team . that's it that's all !
so stop to have wet dream about what he would have done if he didn't get injuries ...the team need real goals, and to score real goals you have to be on the ice...a player that have less ppg could easily have more points than a better player that is injurie prone , but at the end wich one is helping more his team ?
Last edited by goalchenyuk: 12-26-2003 at 11:10 AM.
you really don't understand that koivu is not a team ...and it's the team that have to win to go far ...Koivu 've scored 112 goals during the 710 games played by the team . that's it that's all !
so stop to have wet dream about what he would have done if he didn't get injuries ...the team need real goals, and to score real goals you have to be on the ice...a player that have less ppg could easily have more points than a better player that is injurie prone , but at the end wich one is helping more his team ?
Right, it's a team. But did you consider the points scored by the players who took his place while he was out? They scored very little, which demonstrates that Koivu was sorely missed and that no other centers who played on the first line in his absence were worth talking about.
you really don't understand that koivu is not a team ...and it's the team that have to win to go far ...Koivu 've scored 112 goals during the 710 games played by the team . that's it that's all !
so stop to have wet dream about what he would have done if he didn't get injuries ...the team need real goals, and to score real goals you have to be on the ice...a player that have less ppg could easily have more points than a better player that is injurie prone , but at the end wich one is helping more his team ?
You guys who prefer Koivu over Lecavalier are ridiculous. You demonstrate a very little knowlage of hockey. You seem to love Saku more than the CH.
It's so burlesque that I intend to make a link for others of HFBoards to read your posts and have a good laught.
First of all : Lecavalier can skate much much much faster than Koivu. Lecavalier is big and strong. He have the same skills of Koivu plus he have an harder shot than Koivu. He is younger too and has never been injured to the knees.
Koivu had 3 major knees surgeries and is now much slower than before. I havn't seen Koivu score on a breakaway since the last 5 years. I saw him try very hard to distant an opponent on breakaways but he never succeeded to arrive alone with the goalie. Even at at young age of 29, he's much much slower than Bondra at 39.
One other thing : the next generation of skilled fast players of the CH (Perezh & Kats) will be able to play many years together with Lecavalier. With Koivu 1rst center they will reach their summit when Koivu will fall at 34y. Because Lecavalier is much younger, big and fast, there will be a much better equilibrated fast 1rst line with Perez-Lecav-Kats for many many years.
Lecavalier is unhappy right now with Tampa Bay. This is an UNIQUE chance to grap a big, fast, young, not injured 1rst center. Bob Gainey should take that opportunity and run. There is no chance we can grap Modano, Thornton, Datsyuk, Fedorov, Sundin, or Roenik, etc.
Lecavalier may be available. It's now or never.
You guys who prefer Koivu over Lecavalier are ridiculous. You demonstrate a very little knowlage of hockey. You seem to love Saku more than the CH.
It's so burlesque that I intend to make a link for others of HFBoards to read your posts and have a good laught.
First of all : Lecavalier can skate much much much faster than Koivu. Lecavalier is big and strong. He have the same skills of Koivu plus he have an harder shot than Koivu. He is younger too and has never been injured to the knees.
Koivu had 3 major knees surgeries and is now much slower than before. I havn't seen Koivu score on a breakaway since the last 5 years. I saw him try very hard to distant an opponent on breakaways but he never succeeded to arrive alone with the goalie. Even at at young age of 29, he's much much slower than Bondra at 39.
One other thing : the next generation of skilled fast players of the CH (Perezh & Kats) will be able to play many years together with Lecavalier. With Koivu 1rst center they will reach their summit when Koivu will fall at 34y. Because Lecavalier is much younger, big and fast, there will be a much better equilibrated fast 1rst line with Perez-Lecav-Kats for many many years.
Lecavalier is unhappy right now with Tampa Bay. This is an UNIQUE chance to grap a big, fast, young, not injured 1rst center. Bob Gainey should take that opportunity and run. There is no chance we can grap Modano, Thornton, Datsyuk, Fedorov, Sundin, or Roenik, etc.
Lecavalier may be available. It's now or never.
You forgot to mention that LeCavalier has a tremendous shot.
Koivumay not be as fast as he used to be but he can still easily outrace Ribeiro.
