In terms of spectators, yes, more people go to see live games, but that's also helped by the fact that the average hockey rink seats more people than the average handball arena. I don't have any numbers, but in terms of capacity-%, I'd guess that handball scores higher.
As long as the arenas aren't full capacity-% is no good. If it was the smaller handball arenas that was the thing that limited the attendance.
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Handball gets much more exposure in terms of live games and coverage in the news, both on TV and radio, and also in print.
Furthermore, handball is popular as both a men's and women's sport, which makes it appealing across genders. Women's hockey barely exists in Denmark.
So, all in all, I'd say that it's unfair to call ice hockey the #2 sport.
Please note you that i've not said that hockey was the 2nd most popular sport. I've talked about attendance numbers, and then hockey is 2nd. This totally proves what i was trying to convince - that we actually DO care about hockey.
If you sould rank the sports in overall popularity it would be
Well, yes, the sports' respective problems and success have probably allowed cycling to be overtaken by hockey now. But there's still some way to go up to the popularity of handball. Also just in everyday terms. I can't stand handball, but my friends are always talking about it - noone ever talks about hockey, and hockey fans are practically all fans because they come from a hockey town. The same limits don't apply to handball, in my experience.
Well, yes, the sports' respective problems and success have probably allowed cycling to be overtaken by hockey now. But there's still some way to go up to the popularity of handball. Also just in everyday terms. I can't stand handball, but my friends are always talking about it - noone ever talks about hockey, and hockey fans are practically all fans because they come from a hockey town. The same limits don't apply to handball, in my experience.
Well i don't know if i would consider cycling that popular. Besides that you are correct on all accounts.
I don't stand handball either. But to claim that Denmark don't care about hockey just makes me
Ukrainian NT is declining, their best players were born in 1970-75
Then it's no way Russia is above Sweden and Czech. SWE znd CZE are 2 of 3 most succesful teams in the World.
WELL DUDE if u watch the paper, then russia is allways ahead of czech, sweden and finland, but as u can see sweden and finland plays very good as a team so then u could rank finland and sweden ahead of russia
russia has much more better players than sweden and finland..
the IIHF rankings are:
1. canada
2. sweden
3. finland
4. czech
5. russia
6. slovakia
7. usa
so finland is the 3rd because it plays so well as a team
WELL DUDE if u watch the paper, then russia is allways ahead of czech, sweden and finland, but as u can see sweden and finland plays very good as a team so then u could rank finland and sweden ahead of russia
russia has much more better players than sweden and finland..
the IIHF rankings are:
1. canada
2. sweden
3. finland
4. czech
5. russia
6. slovakia
7. usa
so finland is the 3rd because it plays so well as a team
1.Russia is better than Sweden or Czech on paper? At Olimpics? No.
Russia doesn't have much more better players than this countryies.
Hockey isn't only offence, espescially in inernational tournaments.
And still even at offence, Russia isn't head and shoulders above Sweden or Czech.
Compare, how many suprstars or semi-stars this nations have. Does Russia has advatage?
And there's something wrong with your IIHF rankings, its
1.Sweden
2.Canada
3.Czech
4.Finland
5.Russia
Interesting debate, and i feel you all have valid points. Without doubt danish icehockey is booming right now and that is mainly due to two elements -
1) The national teams succes in the A-POOL over the last 5-6 years.
2) The influx of young talents leaving for Sweden.
Theese two elements have created a nice buzz, which is creating added benefits. Some of theese are in my opinion
1) Better import players in the danish leauge - Especially this year we have seen quite a lot of talent we would not have secured say 2-3 years ago. Players comming directly from the swedish elite leage and the SM liga.
Obviously that creates media interest, more money for the clubs and better chances for the talents who will not go to Sweden, to develope in the danish leage. Exsamples of this are Jannik Hansen, Peter Regin, and future players like Morten Poulsen (J20 WC topscorer for DK), Nichlas Hardt (future national player for DK ).. just to mention some.
2) A benifit is also that the clubs in Sweden and in the NHL have changed their view of Denmark as a solid market for prospects.
3) New and bigger rinks being buildt..
------------
When that is all said of done, in 3-4 years and 10 years ahead Denmark could have a really solid national team if all the players where availeble each year. Unfortunately they wont. This will hurt us because we dont have the same deepth of top end skills as the big7.
Which is also why i think Denmark will NEVER be a part of the big7. When we have a good showing, we'll surely be able to compete..against the best. We might produce upsets and give teams a scare, but on a constant basis, no way.. unless all our guys are competing , which they wont.
But if we do have 2-4 NHL guys with us every year, i do think we have an excellent chance of being a mainstay team in A-pool.. where we some years might make a crack at the QF's.. while we other years just have to settle with not being relegated.
I do think the talents we see right now is a special crop.. fact is that over the last 10 years we have seen a steady stream of atleast 2-3 players every other year who have 1-2 round skills.
Players like Morten Green, Kim Staal would surely have had a better shot if they where 18 in 2007 than back in the good old days.
But the thought of a national team with --
Lars Eller, Mikkel Bødker, Frans Nielsen, Jannik Hansen, Morten Madsen, Kiril Starkov, Peter Regin who all more or less have a shot of playing in the NHL and if that doesnt pan out are locks in the best leages in Europe (Sweden, Germany, Schweitzerland)
+ stand outs - Kim Staal, Morten Green, Lasse Degn, Kasper Degn.. Jesper Damgaard, Daniel Nielsen..
and then we should not forget about the players who are next in the pipeline, Philip Larsen, Sebastian Svendsen and Mark Mieritz ..
One might notice that most of the players mentioned are offensive talent, and that is our big achielles heel.. We are not producing as much back talent as we should to rreally get a solid team.
But offensively if we where able to compete with all our guys.. we could definately be one of thoose teams that is capable of upsets.. even against the top7.
No matter what it will be fun to watch the progress of all thoose guys in the next 10 years.
i think that my neighbour's little brother who is 3 years old will be a superstar, because he just started hockey and win's one other guy
LOL
MY POINT IS THAT start to talk about potential when player is at least 14 years old. before that can happend anything
here in finland all kids play same team in age 8-12 doesnt matter how good are, managers hadnt even choosen the a-team and the b-team of every team yet in that age
ps. i do know about danish hockey
I think that lil bro is actually getting nervous.
And yes, it is unfair because it's much easier for swedish teams (and schools) to pick up Danish and Norwegian talents.
Same rules, but different languages (or family of languages to be precise).
It's obvious to anyone that Swedish and Finnish hockey is a level above Danish and Norwegian, at least for now.
But it wont last forever, pro sports is driven by money. And where there is money, sports will grow.
I share Kuiskaaja's angst, losing a hockey game against Denmark or Norway would be a national disaster, but I think that it will happen.
It'll take some time, both nations will bounce up and down from group A, but they are learning, and they are getting better.
The teams are getting more professional, the leagues are getting more professional.
And just like the Finnish, Swedish, Russian and other leagues are nibbling on NHL, the younger leagues are nibbling on ours.
1.Russia is better than Sweden or Czech on paper? At Olimpics? No.
Russia doesn't have much more better players than this countryies.
first sweden is NOTHING against russian offense, if u say something else u are kidding or u are stupid. sweden's stars are old but they still got foppa, sundin and alfredson. what does russia have? ovethin, kovaltsuk, datsjuk, malkin, fedorov, yashin, kovalev, gonchar, markov etc..
there is no way sweden or finland is near russia what comes to offense. the defense is pretty much as good, but finland is very good organized team also
first sweden is NOTHING against russian offense, if u say something else u are kidding or u are stupid. sweden's stars are old but they still got foppa, sundin and alfredson. what does russia have? ovethin, kovaltsuk, datsjuk, malkin, fedorov, yashin, kovalev, gonchar, markov etc..
there is no way sweden or finland is near russia what comes to offense. the defense is pretty much as good, but finland is very good organized team also
We're still ranked as 1st due to the lag of the system.
And note that neither Forsberg, Sundin, Alfredsson or Lidström was part of the WC team.
But the Swedish team will be crippled.
We'll have to rely on unknown youngsters like Zetterberg, Kronwall, Lundqvist (x2), Sedin (x2), Bäckström, and others.
Poor us.
But I still think that we have to brace ourselfs for the impossible, losing a national game against Denmark or Norway.
first sweden is NOTHING against russian offense, if u say something else u are kidding or u are stupid. sweden's stars are old but they still got foppa, sundin and alfredson. what does russia have? ovethin, kovaltsuk, datsjuk, malkin, fedorov, yashin, kovalev, gonchar, markov etc..
there is no way sweden or finland is near russia what comes to offense. the defense is pretty much as good, but finland is very good organized team also
Sweden has only Sunin, Foppa and Alfredsson?
Zetterberg, Sedins, Huselius, Pahlsson, Naslund, Holmstrom must be Bulgarian or Portugals.
BTW Gontchar and Markov, where do this FORWARDS play?
And Fedorov is very old and it's a question if he will play for Russia again.
Defence is pretty much AS good?
Then you must be kidding, because defense always was a problem for Russia.
To add, Russia has absolutely no depth at G position,
P.S.Finland is weaker on paper than Sweden or Russia. But Finland has the best goalie depth in Europe.
Zetterberg, Sedins, Huselius, Pahlsson, Naslund, Holmstrom must be Bulgarian or Portugals.
BTW Gontchar and Markov, where do this FORWARDS play?
And Fedorov is very old and it's a question if he will play for Russia again.
Defence is pretty much AS good?
Then you must be kidding, because defense always was a problem for Russia.
To add, Russia has absolutely no depth at G position,
P.S.Finland is weaker on paper than Sweden or Russia. But Finland has the best goalie depth in Europe.
u know thats ********. russia hasnt got bad defense, they just cant play as a team, eventhougth in this years world cups they were very strong, but finland owned them..
players like påhlson, sedins, huselius are allround players and they get ruined if u compare russian virtuoses
P.S.Finland is weaker on paper than Sweden or Russia. But Finland has the best goalie depth in Europe.
actually finland has better defense and goaltending right now and after few years when sundin, foppa, alfie, lidas has retired finland beats also with offense, when we have ruutu, j.jokinen, o.jokinen, m.koivu, kontiola, bergemheim all on their prime
u know thats ********. russia hasnt got bad defense, they just cant play as a team, eventhougth in this years world cups they were very strong, but finland owned them..
players like påhlson, sedins, huselius are allround players and they get ruined if u compare russian virtuoses
1.Russia IS bad on defense compared with Sweden for example. The reasons are: some of Russian TOP D-man aren't good at defense, Russia hasn't much depth at Defense, 3 Zubov and Zhitnik aren't playing for them.
2.Huselius isn't an allround player, actually he's a bit 1-dimensional as many Russians.
Sedins are great players when it comes to offense, they are undoubful best skaters at a goodm playoff team.
3.At this world cup Russia and Canada were clear fovorites, because Sweden and Czech played with their C-teams.
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actually finland has better defense and goaltending right now and after few years when sundin, foppa, alfie, lidas has retired finland beats also with offense, when we have ruutu, j.jokinen, o.jokinen, m.koivu, kontiola, bergemheim all on their prime
Better goaltrending? Overall yes, but Swedish TOP goaltrender is very, very good.
Better defense? No,
That's Swedish defense: Lidstrom, Ohlund, Tallinder, Johnsson, N.Kronwall, K.Jonsson, Havelid/Norstrom
That's Finlands: K.Timonen, Salo, Lydman, Numminen(39), Pitkanen, Kukkonen/Nummelin, Vaananen.
Swedish depth players like Backman or Tjarnqvist could have cracked Finnish lineup. MAybe even Walin/Johansson/Oduya/Murray.
Finland hasn't got much depth at defense, look at your WC 2007 roster.
As fore offense, don't forget that Selanne, Lehtinen, Peltonen and S.Koivu aren't young boys too.
salo is better than öhlund
there are not as good dman in swedish defense than kimmo timonen. kronwall is nothing against pitkänen. talinder can play his own place, but i rather take aki berg than him. johnssons are not high leveling dmen. finland has much better defense. u tribute too much players from your country. that is just your oppinion and this is mine
salo is better than öhlund
there are not as good dman in swedish defense than kimmo timonen. kronwall is nothing against pitkänen. talinder can play his own place, but i rather take aki berg than him. johnssons are not high leveling dmen. finland has much better defense. u tribute too much players from your country. that is just your oppinion and this is mine
Berg is better than Tallinder?
Kronwall was WC MVP in Riga btw, and Ohlund is playing much more than Salo in Vancouver.
But I don't want to argue more, because it's totally offtopic.
Berg is better than Tallinder?
Kronwall was WC MVP in Riga btw, and Ohlund is playing much more than Salo in Vancouver.
But I don't want to argue more, because it's totally offtopic.
then u are gona lose this one
forst of all may finns have playd very well in wc, but it doesnt matter if year ago some kronwall guy was good in 6 games, thats nothing
the nhl is the right place where u compare your players and that berg was a joke. lydman is much better than talinder at least..
u have alot defensive dmen who plays their own place, but cant carry the team, same goes with öhlund. he plays PK but not PP as much as salo. finnish dmen can carry the team, thats the difference
thats the truth.. sorry to say it man.. no bad feelings..
