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Proposal: Edmonton/Philadelphia

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Old
01-01-2004, 07:35 PM
  #1
epa80
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Proposal: Edmonton/Philadelphia

Lots of rumors floating around that Edmonton is going to shakeup there team in search for more goals, and the names you hear alot are Eric Brewer and Georges Laraque. Would Edmonton do this:

Oilers Get: C Michal Handzus, D Jim Vandermeer
Flyers Get: D Eric Brewer, RW Georges Laraque

Jim Vandermeer has been streaky this year, and Dennis Seidenberg has recently been recalled and played well in his first game vs. St. Louis. Chris Therien is also still around landing Jim as the 8th d-man. Michal Handzus is currently 4th one the Flyers C depth chart behind Roenick, Comrie, and Primeau. Vandermeer is a former Red Deer Rebel (ala Jeff Woywitka) and Michal Handzus would be tied for 2nd on the Oil in scoring behind only Mike York. He gives them a young C (25 or 26 I believe) making less than 2 million.

Too much/too little from either side?

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01-01-2004, 07:39 PM
  #2
HockeyBestFan
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Maybe replace Vandermeer for Jeff Carter instead

Edm: handzus, carter
Phily: Laraque, Brewer and 6e round pick

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Old
01-01-2004, 07:49 PM
  #3
thome_26
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this is some kind of joke right?
Laraque is worth more then Vandermeer easily! Vandermeer does nothing for us. We are loaded with 6-7th Dmen. Brewer is probably slightly more valuable then Handzus seeing as he's younger and also that he's a Dman.

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01-01-2004, 08:08 PM
  #4
epa80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
this is some kind of joke right?
Laraque is worth more then Vandermeer easily! Vandermeer does nothing for us. We are loaded with 6-7th Dmen. Brewer is probably slightly more valuable then Handzus seeing as he's younger and also that he's a Dman.
Why is it a joke? Laraque is more valuable than Vandermeer EASILY? Vandermeer is an under 25 year old d-man who showed plenty of promise last season but has struggled out of the gate this year. Laraque is the league's best fighter, ok, great, but none the less thats all he is, an enforcer. Handzus and Brewer are close. Handzus is a former Selke nominee and again, would already be 2nd in scoring on Edmonton, this while skating on Philly's 3rd line, and at times 4th line. Why is it such a joke when by your own words, it is even that far off base?

Brewer has struggled some this year also, otherwise there wouldn't be talk of him being dealt at all. Ditto Laraque. If these guys were having premier years or Edmonton didn't need help up the middle I could understand just throwing this proposal away, but get real.

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01-01-2004, 08:17 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epa80
*snip*
Brewer has struggled some this year also, otherwise there wouldn't be talk of him being dealt at all. Ditto Laraque. If these guys were having premier years or Edmonton didn't need help up the middle I could understand just throwing this proposal away, but get real.
When was it said that the Oilers want to trade Brewer. KL is in love with the guy and Brewer will not be traded. Brewer played over 32 minutes against the Wild the other day when Jason Smith got injured. Brewer is important to the Oilers and he will not be traded. With Both Smith and Cross injured right now, the Oilers will not be trading Brewer. The Oilers defense in weak as it is and even more so with both Smith and Cross injured.

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01-01-2004, 08:25 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epa80
Lots of rumors floating around that Edmonton is going to shakeup there team in search for more goals, and the names you hear alot are Eric Brewer and Georges Laraque. Would Edmonton do this:

Oilers Get: C Michal Handzus, D Jim Vandermeer
Flyers Get: D Eric Brewer, RW Georges Laraque

Jim Vandermeer has been streaky this year, and Dennis Seidenberg has recently been recalled and played well in his first game vs. St. Louis. Chris Therien is also still around landing Jim as the 8th d-man. Michal Handzus is currently 4th one the Flyers C depth chart behind Roenick, Comrie, and Primeau. Vandermeer is a former Red Deer Rebel (ala Jeff Woywitka) and Michal Handzus would be tied for 2nd on the Oil in scoring behind only Mike York. He gives them a young C (25 or 26 I believe) making less than 2 million.

Too much/too little from either side?
Don't really know anything about Vandermeer so can't say but I have said before and will repeat here that I wouldn't take Handzus off the waiver wire. Totally unsuited to the way Oilers play hockey and wouldn't fit at all. Mostly though I am not ready to give up on Brewer. Laraque? If it wasn't for the fact that I know somebody will give us something for him I would pay for his airplane ticket down there myself. You must want ulcers or your hair to fall out if you want him.

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01-01-2004, 08:26 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epa80
Brewer has struggled some this year also, otherwise there wouldn't be talk of him being dealt at all.
Actually, Brewer played injured earlier this year, had to sit out (stomach 12/12/2003), and has been incredible since his return.

Played 32 minutes the other night. Averages 22:09 over this season (with injury.
)

Only -1 on the 13th team in the west. Over 100 minutes playing on the 29th ranked penalty kill.

Appears better than last season (all-star)

Huh?

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Old
01-01-2004, 08:49 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBestFan
Maybe replace Vandermeer for Jeff Carter instead

Edm: handzus, carter
Phily: Laraque, Brewer and 6e round pick
No thanks.

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01-01-2004, 09:11 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epa80

Oilers Get: C Michal Handzus, D Jim Vandermeer
Flyers Get: D Eric Brewer, RW Georges Laraque
I wouldn't do that from a Flyer's POV, simply because we don't need another "enforcer" who doesn't fight.
Handzus is also pretty much off limits (to Bobby Clarke), unless a big centerman is coming back in return. Some may say that Clarke was lying to the media, but I guarantee you Clarke will not go with less than two big centers in his lineup.

I would love to acquire Brewer, but I really don't see something like that happening.

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01-02-2004, 04:06 AM
  #10
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Yea, I agree, I would love to aquire Eric Brewer but I don't see this happening..

The first proposal mentionned is way too lopsided. But I propose smthg : Brashear for Laraque.

Yea or no?

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01-02-2004, 05:18 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyman
The first proposal mentionned is way too lopsided. But I propose smthg : Brashear for Laraque.

Yea or no?
Hey, you stole my idea! :p
A change of scenery might get both players ignited again.

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01-02-2004, 05:40 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyers guy
Handzus is also pretty much off limits (to Bobby Clarke), unless a big centerman is coming back in return. Some may say that Clarke was lying to the media, but I guarantee you Clarke will not go with less than two big centers in his lineup.
Just to get this out there, Clarke's "lying" to which FG referred where he said he had no interest in a smallish center like Comrie a week or two before he acquired him was made in response to a reporter's question about a Michal Handzus-Comrie trade rumor.

Though I can't see many managers who wouldn't listen if Eric Brewer's name came up, I concur that Bob Clarke loves big centermen. I think he married one. I don't know enough to really know Lowe's situation.

That Comrie trade sure sent to rumor mongers (sportswriters) to their typewriters in a hurry. I think I was offered in a trade rumor in the past week, and I can't even find my skates right now. Oh, and I think you guys can take it a little easy on epa80 (good ol' Superfund), who did write "proposal" in the post title. If we questioned whether we were at a comedy club to every post on this board, the only rolling by would be tumbleweed. :-)

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01-02-2004, 06:21 AM
  #13
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I'm sorry but that proposal is brutal. Brewer has a lot more value around the league than Hadzus and the same can be said about Laraque over Vandermeer.

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01-02-2004, 07:16 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
I'm sorry but that proposal is brutal. Brewer has a lot more value around the league than Hadzus and the same can be said about Laraque over Vandermeer.
Why? Michal Handzus was a nominee for the Selke at 24 YEARS OLD. He was the centerpiece of St. Louis' offer to Phoenix for KEITH TKACHUK. He's still only 26 and yet AGAIN would be 2nd in scoring on the Oilers yet having played a lot of the year with mix amd match wingers, including the offensively challenged Donald Brashear and Radovan Somik. I don't get this "way more value" crap. You wanna see he's more valuable, fine, I will buy Brewer is a bit more valuable being a young d-man with upside. But stop with this way more valuable. Laraque being way more valuable than Vandermeer is so laughable I won't even comment on it. Vandermeer won't be traded for Peter Forsberg any time soon, but what the hell do enforcers EVER garner? Donald Brashear got Jan Hlavac, he's been dealt twice since. Worrell just landed Nedorost and Messier. Messier is a 4th liner as well at best, and Nedorost was already sent to San Antonio, after Colorado already gave up on him. And Lowe has made it so public at times that Laraque gives him fits, that I doubt his value is even THAT high.

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01-02-2004, 07:32 AM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epa80
Why? Michal Handzus was a nominee for the Selke at 24 YEARS OLD. He was the centerpiece of St. Louis' offer to Phoenix for KEITH TKACHUK. He's still only 26 and yet AGAIN would be 2nd in scoring on the Oilers yet having played a lot of the year with mix amd match wingers, including the offensively challenged Donald Brashear and Radovan Somik. I don't get this "way more value" crap. You wanna see he's more valuable, fine, I will buy Brewer is a bit more valuable being a young d-man with upside. But stop with this way more valuable. Laraque being way more valuable than Vandermeer is so laughable I won't even comment on it. Vandermeer won't be traded for Peter Forsberg any time soon, but what the hell do enforcers EVER garner? Donald Brashear got Jan Hlavac, he's been dealt twice since. Worrell just landed Nedorost and Messier. Messier is a 4th liner as well at best, and Nedorost was already sent to San Antonio, after Colorado already gave up on him. And Lowe has made it so public at times that Laraque gives him fits, that I doubt his value is even THAT high.
Want to know which Oiler fields the most calls from other GM's? Laraque. Lowe has stated this a million times. Trust me he holds more value league wide than Vandermeer. Secondly I'll take a potential #1 or #2 dman anyday by a fair margin, over a potential Selke candidate unless we are talking about Lethinen who is quite better than Handzus. Defenceman take longer to develop, and Brewer is also younger. His value and potential are higher. Oilers are weak at defence, meaning a team would have to overpay for him, thus his value is a lot higher than that of Handzus'

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01-02-2004, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBestFan
Maybe replace Vandermeer for Jeff Carter instead

Edm: handzus, carter
Phily: Laraque, Brewer and 6e round pick
Keep dreaming - Carter is going nowhere.
Laraque is not needed on a team with Brashear and Fedoruk.
Handzus and a fourth for Brewer.

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01-02-2004, 02:19 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
Want to know which Oiler fields the most calls from other GM's? Laraque. Lowe has stated this a million times. Trust me he holds more value league wide than Vandermeer. Secondly I'll take a potential #1 or #2 dman anyday by a fair margin, over a potential Selke candidate unless we are talking about Lethinen who is quite better than Handzus. Defenceman take longer to develop, and Brewer is also younger. His value and potential are higher. Oilers are weak at defence, meaning a team would have to overpay for him, thus his value is a lot higher than that of Handzus'
Who cares when all teams are willing to give up is a 3rd round pick or something. He can get a call from every team for Laraque, but that doesn't mean his value is high.

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01-02-2004, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by blah
Who cares when all teams are willing to give up is a 3rd round pick or something. He can get a call from every team for Laraque, but that doesn't mean his value is high.
No it means his value is low.

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01-02-2004, 09:03 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
No it means his value is low.
Did I say that? Nobody is going to overpay for a goon. Be serious.

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01-02-2004, 09:25 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theoil
Don't really know anything about Vandermeer so can't say but I have said before and will repeat here that I wouldn't take Handzus off the waiver wire. Totally unsuited to the way Oilers play hockey and wouldn't fit at all.
Just thought I'd make sure everyone read that, in case some skimmed through it.

Handzus is no slower than Georges Laraque, theoil.

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01-02-2004, 09:30 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theoil
Don't really know anything about Vandermeer so can't say
Defensive dman, gives pretty good long fights in which it will seem as if he's losing then he'll come on strong and win it. He passed Seidenberg last season but had some lapses this season in his defensive play. He was sent down and was involved in that huge BIN-PHI AHL brawl.

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01-03-2004, 06:35 AM
  #22
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Originally Posted by blah
Did I say that? Nobody is going to overpay for a goon. Be serious.
Worrel was overpayed for. Laraque brings more to the game than him.

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01-03-2004, 07:06 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
Worrel was overpayed for. Laraque brings more to the game than him.
Nedorost and Messier for Worrel and a 2nd?

Nedorost isn't worth a 2nd, imo, and Messier is an old 4th liner. Doesn't seem like overpayment for me.

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01-03-2004, 07:19 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
Worrel was overpayed for. Laraque brings more to the game than him.
That may be good and bad. Yes, he does have more skills than Worrell, the problem that causes is he gets the mentality of "I got game now" and stops being a tough guy. Hence an Oiler fan in this thread previously stated Laraque gived them fits. And as far as Lowe getting more calls about Laraque than anyone: Yeah, even if that were true, which I find hard to believe, if Laraque brought it ANY more than what Worrell got, I'd be shocked. And anyway, Lowe can say that about Laraque, think he'd say that about Smyth or Hemsky? No, of course not, because the one he WANTS to shop IS Laraque.

Handzus by the way isn't just a potential selke candidate with bad wheels. At one point he centered arguably a top 5 line in St. Louis with Demitra and Bartecko. It's no worse using this as an argument FOR Handzus, than using Brewer's solid year last year, or his Olympic Gold season, to up his value.

And theOil: What, Edmonton doesn't employ bad skaters? What the hell are Jason Smith, Brad Isbister, and Georges Laraque? At best each is average in skating and thats generous.

This proposal is even more moot than detractors may have though originally, now that Keith Primeau is injured and for the moment Handzus is not a viable trading chip.


Last edited by epa80: 01-03-2004 at 07:24 AM.
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01-03-2004, 07:39 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex88
Keep dreaming - Carter is going nowhere.
Laraque is not needed on a team with Brashear and Fedoruk.
Handzus and a fourth for Brewer.

What ever dude. Brewer is better than any d-man u have and you think Handzus and a 4th is enought to get him good luck. If you want to make offer that is realistic fine if you going to embarrass yourself maybe don't post next time.

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