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Old
08-20-2007, 09:45 AM
  #51
LesCanadiens
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AH View Post
That's all we need, fans of a loser organization telling us why some of us feel the way we do about Souray. You dont know the story so shove it.

Souray is a jerk for the way he acted. He wanted to play the market in order to end up in NY or Cali. Those teams didnt bite. The Habs moved on to Hamrlik. He was left holding the bag and is now lashing out at the Habs when he really should be lashing out at his agent.

F Souray.
Right on! Here's a guy that knows his .....errr....stuff.

To the "fan" that told is REAL fans to **** off...right back at ya.

A real fan supports the TEAM....not one egocentric, poor excuse for a defenseman, like Souray. Souray was given a good offer to sign here, and as AH said, he played out the market and the only suckers he could find were the Oilers. Just wait until stinks it up like usual in your D zone...and then you'll see.

IMO, Souray never cared to get better defensively...he inflated his offensive numbers every contract year, grabbed the dough, and then settled back to mediocrity offensively, and kept his usual uselessness defensively...leaving nothing more than an overpaid, semi-goon that is a major liability. Oh, and did I mention he's injury prone to boot?

And who said he was a "shutdown man" in NJ? Please, SS couldn't shut down if his life depended on it.

I'll take 1/2 a Markov or Komi over that bum any day.

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08-20-2007, 09:51 AM
  #52
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Sigh ok, deep breath;

Let's look at what Sourray says happened, at the very least we'll see how he saw it, if nothing else.
  • Sourray claims that during the season, Gainey informed him that he wouldn't negotiate with anyone {for mind numbing reasons i won't even begin to try to comprehend}. Sourray in an interview said he was fine with that.

  • As the end of the season approached, he told Gainey and also in interviews later, that he felt Markov should be negotiated with first, because he's the marque Dman for the team. No problems so far.

  • The season comes to an end, and Sourray expects the team to make an offer to Markov first they do signing Markov up for 5.5 mill or thereabouts per season. Everything's fine so far.

  • At this point, Sourray claims he did not know for certain where he'd eventually sign, but that he was pretty confident that he would be back in Montreal and that returning to montreal was his priority, assuming the team made what he felt was a fair offer {market value}. Everythings going well so far.

  • Gainey gives Sourray what Sourray, rightly or wrongly, feels is an offer that is well below market value. Gainey offers 4 million dollars per year for 3 years. Sourray thinks he's worth at least 5 {if not more} on the open market. At this point he says he feels like he's being lowballed.

  • Sourray's agent tells Gainey they think this is a very low offer and that he can get more on the open market. Gainey breaks off communication with Sourray's agent.

  • Over the next week or so, Gainey goes gangbusters trying to sign Briere, then Smyth, there are rumours he's doing everything he can to bring a marque player into the team. In the interum he makes zero offers to Sourray, there is absolutely no communication between the two. Sourray is beggining to feel alienated {unwanted}.

  • Gainey makes a second offer {after a good week or so}. It's a "take it or leave it" offer. Sourray at this point is already getting offers in the 5.5 and 6 mill range from other teams who are tripping all over themselves to sign him. At this point he feels like he's very very low on the teams list of priorities, that he is a 7th or 8th option. He feels undervalued as a player, by the GM.

  • Gainey signs Hamrlik and closes the door on any further negotiations with Sourray.

  • Sourray waits a week or two, and finally signs with Edmonton. Edmonton seems extremely enthusiastic about signing him, they're saying all the right things, expressing intense interest in making him their go to guy. Their offer is almost identical to what Gainey offered, but includes a no trade clause. So he signs with them.

This is what happened, according to Sourray
Now .....

To me this reads like a player who wanted to stay in montreal, but felt rejected, felt like he was not really anything more than an afterthought, and frankly just felt he was not being treated respectfully. And I agree with him. It's clear reading this {And Gainey's own words} that Gainey wanted to go after others players, that Sourray's +/- was a concern, that his injuries {wrist/shoulder} were a concern and that he was not very high on their priority.

Do I wish he'd stayed anyway? Yes
Am I going to name call him or curse his name, wishing he'll do poorly? No. If Gainey had shown the least bit of respect for one of our teams leaders, both on and off the ice, he'd still be here. In fact, if he'd simply made an offer DURING THE SEASON he'd still be here.

The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.

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08-20-2007, 09:54 AM
  #53
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I had no problems with Sheldon walking away and going elsewhwere for money/family reasons. But the commentary in this article and in the Francois Gagnon the day after he signed in Edmonton reek of bitterness at how the marketplace shunned him, which forced him to take the best offer from the least desirable market.

And now he is lashing out at the Habs when he should be lashing out at his agent and their FA strategy. Wow, what a man you are Sheldon. All this after how the organization supported you through your injuries and when your wife accused you to be a wife beater. The Habs did a lot for this guy and this is how he talks of them.

F Souray. To make matters worse, we now have Oiler fans telling us that we are bitter he didnt sign with us and how we shouldnt be because he signed with his chidhood team. I dont know what's dumber, Souray or Oiler fans who actually believe that stuff.

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08-20-2007, 09:59 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.
How do you know that simply an offer from Gainey would have inked Souray. Souray wanted to play the market. I truly believe he wanted to play in MTL, but he wanted teh most money possible. Playing the market burned him and now he is bitter.

The Habs have been a mid level team for how many years? We missed the playoffs yet again last year. Why would you want to tie up your payroll on the same mediocrity and basically come back with the same team? People talk about players having earned teh right to play the market, but guess what the same situation applies to teams. They have every right to want to get better players for their money.

It's business.

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08-20-2007, 09:59 AM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
Sigh ok, deep breath;

Let's look at what Sourray says happened, at the very least we'll see how he saw it, if nothing else.
  • Sourray claims that during the season, Gainey informed him that he wouldn't negotiate with anyone {for mind numbing reasons i won't even begin to try to comprehend}. Sourray in an interview said he was fine with that.

  • As the end of the season approached, he told Gainey and also in interviews later, that he felt Markov should be negotiated with first, because he's the marque Dman for the team. No problems so far.

  • The season comes to an end, and Sourray expects the team to make an offer to Markov first they do signing Markov up for 5.5 mill or thereabouts per season. Everything's fine so far.

  • At this point, Sourray claims he did not know for certain where he'd eventually sign, but that he was pretty confident that he would be back in Montreal and that returning to montreal was his priority, assuming the team made what he felt was a fair offer {market value}. Everythings going well so far.

  • Gainey gives Sourray what Sourray, rightly or wrongly, feels is an offer that is well below market value. Gainey offers 4 million dollars per year for 3 years. Sourray thinks he's worth at least 5 {if not more} on the open market. At this point he says he feels like he's being lowballed.

  • Sourray's agent tells Gainey they think this is a very low offer and that he can get more on the open market. Gainey breaks off communication with Sourray's agent.

  • Over the next week or so, Gainey goes gangbusters trying to sign Briere, then Smyth, there are rumours he's doing everything he can to bring a marque player into the team. In the interum he makes zero offers to Sourray, there is absolutely no communication between the two. Sourray is beggining to feel alienated {unwanted}.

  • Gainey makes a second offer {after a good week or so}. It's a "take it or leave it" offer. Sourray at this point is already getting offers in the 5.5 and 6 mill range from other teams who are tripping all over themselves to sign him. At this point he feels like he's very very low on the teams list of priorities, that he is a 7th or 8th option. He feels undervalued as a player, by the GM.

  • Gainey signs Hamrlik and closes the door on any further negotiations with Sourray.

  • Sourray waits a week or two, and finally signs with Edmonton. Edmonton seems extremely enthusiastic about signing him, they're saying all the right things, expressing intense interest in making him their go to guy. Their offer is almost identical to what Gainey offered, but includes a no trade clause. So he signs with them.

This is what happened, according to Sourray
Now .....

To me this reads like a player who wanted to stay in montreal, but felt rejected, felt like he was not really anything more than an afterthought, and frankly just felt he was not being treated respectfully. And I agree with him. It's clear reading this {And Gainey's own words} that Gainey wanted to go after others players, that Sourray's +/- was a concern, that his injuries {wrist/shoulder} were a concern and that he was not very high on their priority.

Do I wish he'd stayed anyway? Yes
Am I going to name call him or curse his name, wishing he'll do poorly? No. If Gainey had shown the least bit of respect for one of our teams leaders, both on and off the ice, he'd still be here. In fact, if he'd simply made an offer DURING THE SEASON he'd still be here.

The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.
Tripping over themselves? Who? Sorry, but this is pure BS.

Blame Gainey huh? Why, because Gainey didn't want to overpay the most overrated FA out there? Thank him, don't blame him.

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Old
08-20-2007, 10:07 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.
Blame for what? Trying to make the team better? If we sign Souray for $5.5-$5.75M per year before July 1st, and then we see what guys like Rafalski, Hannan, Schneider, etc. went for, Hab fans would have been complaining all summer that Gainey gave in to Souray too quickly and should have waited.

So that's what he did. The smart thing. Souray was not the guy on the market who the Canadiens wanted most. So we waited to try to get other guys first. When we couldn't get those other guys, we went back to Sheldon. He couldn't deal with not being our first choice so he shunned us. He has essentially stated just that.

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08-20-2007, 10:36 AM
  #57
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What I get is that he's basically sad to leave. I don't understand the Briere offer either, that was ridiculous and completely off the charts. Especially for Gainey. That's like a Donald Audette moment.

In the end, this also shows that we have to keep building from within because FA's just don't want to come here. We have to get some stars from our system or it will be back to the drawing board pretty soon.

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08-20-2007, 10:55 AM
  #58
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I've never been able to figure out why players who depart the Canadiens have such scorn and vitriol heaped upon them. At the end of the day, Souray felt he was worth a certain amount of dollars, the Club disagreed, and they parted ways. The inability to come to an agreement on a new contract does not erase Sheldon's 7 years as a key contributor for the Canadiens. I wish him well in Edmonton, save for when the Oil play the Habs.

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08-20-2007, 11:03 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
Sigh ok, deep breath;

Let's look at what Sourray says happened, at the very least we'll see how he saw it, if nothing else.
  • Sourray claims that during the season, Gainey informed him that he wouldn't negotiate with anyone {for mind numbing reasons i won't even begin to try to comprehend}. Sourray in an interview said he was fine with that.

  • As the end of the season approached, he told Gainey and also in interviews later, that he felt Markov should be negotiated with first, because he's the marque Dman for the team. No problems so far.

  • The season comes to an end, and Sourray expects the team to make an offer to Markov first they do signing Markov up for 5.5 mill or thereabouts per season. Everything's fine so far.

  • At this point, Sourray claims he did not know for certain where he'd eventually sign, but that he was pretty confident that he would be back in Montreal and that returning to montreal was his priority, assuming the team made what he felt was a fair offer {market value}. Everythings going well so far.

  • Gainey gives Sourray what Sourray, rightly or wrongly, feels is an offer that is well below market value. Gainey offers 4 million dollars per year for 3 years. Sourray thinks he's worth at least 5 {if not more} on the open market. At this point he says he feels like he's being lowballed.

  • Sourray's agent tells Gainey they think this is a very low offer and that he can get more on the open market. Gainey breaks off communication with Sourray's agent.

  • Over the next week or so, Gainey goes gangbusters trying to sign Briere, then Smyth, there are rumours he's doing everything he can to bring a marque player into the team. In the interum he makes zero offers to Sourray, there is absolutely no communication between the two. Sourray is beggining to feel alienated {unwanted}.

  • Gainey makes a second offer {after a good week or so}. It's a "take it or leave it" offer. Sourray at this point is already getting offers in the 5.5 and 6 mill range from other teams who are tripping all over themselves to sign him. At this point he feels like he's very very low on the teams list of priorities, that he is a 7th or 8th option. He feels undervalued as a player, by the GM.

  • Gainey signs Hamrlik and closes the door on any further negotiations with Sourray.

  • Sourray waits a week or two, and finally signs with Edmonton. Edmonton seems extremely enthusiastic about signing him, they're saying all the right things, expressing intense interest in making him their go to guy. Their offer is almost identical to what Gainey offered, but includes a no trade clause. So he signs with them.

This is what happened, according to Sourray
Now .....

To me this reads like a player who wanted to stay in montreal, but felt rejected, felt like he was not really anything more than an afterthought, and frankly just felt he was not being treated respectfully. And I agree with him. It's clear reading this {And Gainey's own words} that Gainey wanted to go after others players, that Sourray's +/- was a concern, that his injuries {wrist/shoulder} were a concern and that he was not very high on their priority.

Do I wish he'd stayed anyway? Yes
Am I going to name call him or curse his name, wishing he'll do poorly? No. If Gainey had shown the least bit of respect for one of our teams leaders, both on and off the ice, he'd still be here. In fact, if he'd simply made an offer DURING THE SEASON he'd still be here.

The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.
There was so much spin on this post I'd be surprised if it didn't come back and hit you in the noggin.

The offer of $4M/yr is from someone's imagination, nobody has confirmed this as a real offer. Perhaps it was low, perhaps it was close to market, we don't know. All we know is that Souray *says* it was low.

the line that "Gainey breaks off Communication with Souray's agent" is all readers of this post need to read to sense the spin you're putting on this. Souray admits he didn't counter-offer Gainey's initial submission, that he wanted to see the open market. So who "broke off" with whom?

Gainey made an offer to Souray on July 2, one day into free agency. Gainey assesses the responses from Briere and Smyth and immediately went to work on making Souray the top priority again. Your comment that the offer came a "good week or so" is misleading and incorrect.

"Souray waits a week or 2 and finally signs with Edmonton". Again, the timelines that you use are wrong. Souray signed on July 27, after detailed discussions with the Devils, the Rangers, the Sharks and other teams went sour. Seems like the amicable, reasonable, respect seeking Souray couldn't come to terms with a good many teams this year.

Souray's immaturity was the main negotiating factor. Now he's stuck in Edmonton with little chance of making the playoffs for his contract term. That's what happens when you bring ego and a twisted perspective of respect into a contract negotiation.

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08-20-2007, 11:08 AM
  #60
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I've never been able to figure out why players who depart the Canadiens have such scorn and vitriol heaped upon them.
Well, some of us have felt that way all along....maybe, others can only make decisions based on the most current situations. And the most current situation clearly shows that Sheldon is a dik. So I can't blame them. I've thought he was a one all along....

Gainey is one of the most respected and admired men in hockey....from his peers and from the players and agents...who is Sheldon Souray? Nice of him to take every opportunity he can to slam the Habs. I'm glad Gainey is taking the high road (as he always does) and letting Sheldon do what he does best: suck when going on the defensive.

For Sheldon it's all about his ego and his pocketbook.

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08-20-2007, 11:16 AM
  #61
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Wow. Some of you are so, so angry, and why?

The two sides could not come to an agreement. The Habs would have rather had Briere or Smyth than Souray. Souray didn't like that. Habs played some tough line negotiations. He signed elsewhere. Where is the problem here?

You crybabies who are saying he shouldn't have been so insulted by the first offer, well, you don't show much maturity yourselves so take a look in the mirror.

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08-20-2007, 11:28 AM
  #62
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Well, some of us have felt that way all along....maybe, others can only make decisions based on the most current situations. And the most current situation clearly shows that Sheldon is a dik. So I can't blame them. I've thought he was a one all along....

Gainey is one of the most respected and admired men in hockey....from his peers and from the players and agents...who is Sheldon Souray? Nice of him to take every opportunity he can to slam the Habs. I'm glad Gainey is taking the high road (as he always does) and letting Sheldon do what he does best: suck when going on the defensive.

For Sheldon it's all about his ego and his pocketbook.
That's one way of looking at the situation, I thought Souray was simply voicing his disappointment and reflecting on his time in Montréal. My key point was that it's a waste of energy to speculate on who’s at fault now that he's gone. At this point I'm more interested in what Hamrlik brings to the table than what Souray thinks about the sometimes sticky business of NHL contract negotiations.

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08-20-2007, 11:30 AM
  #63
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Seems clear to me that despite what Souray said, that "it is a business" his feelings got involved. In business it is never too late, and everything can be negotiated.

I myself found myself in a negotiation with my landlord where we were 300% apart. I told them that, and we settled at something we both could live with. I had offered an amount and they counteredt that my rent should be 3 times what I had offered. But we settled because we both wanted the deal.

If we had allowed our feelings to get in the way, we would have never agreed.

My point is, Souray is lieing to himself and us, but that is the way it is when you are dealing with people's feelings rather than professionals, this is hockey. Souray is really no different than most other hockey players out there.

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08-20-2007, 11:34 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
Sigh ok, deep breath;

Let's look at what Sourray says happened, at the very least we'll see how he saw it, if nothing else.
  • Sourray claims that during the season, Gainey informed him that he wouldn't negotiate with anyone {for mind numbing reasons i won't even begin to try to comprehend}. Sourray in an interview said he was fine with that.

  • As the end of the season approached, he told Gainey and also in interviews later, that he felt Markov should be negotiated with first, because he's the marque Dman for the team. No problems so far.

  • The season comes to an end, and Sourray expects the team to make an offer to Markov first they do signing Markov up for 5.5 mill or thereabouts per season. Everything's fine so far.

  • At this point, Sourray claims he did not know for certain where he'd eventually sign, but that he was pretty confident that he would be back in Montreal and that returning to montreal was his priority, assuming the team made what he felt was a fair offer {market value}. Everythings going well so far.

  • Gainey gives Sourray what Sourray, rightly or wrongly, feels is an offer that is well below market value. Gainey offers 4 million dollars per year for 3 years. Sourray thinks he's worth at least 5 {if not more} on the open market. At this point he says he feels like he's being lowballed.

  • Sourray's agent tells Gainey they think this is a very low offer and that he can get more on the open market. Gainey breaks off communication with Sourray's agent.

  • Over the next week or so, Gainey goes gangbusters trying to sign Briere, then Smyth, there are rumours he's doing everything he can to bring a marque player into the team. In the interum he makes zero offers to Sourray, there is absolutely no communication between the two. Sourray is beggining to feel alienated {unwanted}.

  • Gainey makes a second offer {after a good week or so}. It's a "take it or leave it" offer. Sourray at this point is already getting offers in the 5.5 and 6 mill range from other teams who are tripping all over themselves to sign him. At this point he feels like he's very very low on the teams list of priorities, that he is a 7th or 8th option. He feels undervalued as a player, by the GM.

  • Gainey signs Hamrlik and closes the door on any further negotiations with Sourray.

  • Sourray waits a week or two, and finally signs with Edmonton. Edmonton seems extremely enthusiastic about signing him, they're saying all the right things, expressing intense interest in making him their go to guy. Their offer is almost identical to what Gainey offered, but includes a no trade clause. So he signs with them.

This is what happened, according to Sourray
Now .....

To me this reads like a player who wanted to stay in montreal, but felt rejected, felt like he was not really anything more than an afterthought, and frankly just felt he was not being treated respectfully. And I agree with him. It's clear reading this {And Gainey's own words} that Gainey wanted to go after others players, that Sourray's +/- was a concern, that his injuries {wrist/shoulder} were a concern and that he was not very high on their priority.

Do I wish he'd stayed anyway? Yes
Am I going to name call him or curse his name, wishing he'll do poorly? No. If Gainey had shown the least bit of respect for one of our teams leaders, both on and off the ice, he'd still be here. In fact, if he'd simply made an offer DURING THE SEASON he'd still be here.

The blame here lies squarely on Gainey's shoulder.
Unfortunately, I agree completely with you. Gainey messed this one up. And if he wasn't keen on re-signing him, he should've dealt him at the deadline.

Souray wasn't the best defensive guy in the league but he had heart and would defend a teammate at the drop of a hat. We don't have nearly enough of his ilk on this team and from that perspective I'll be sad to see him go.

If we wanted to keep him, I'm not saying we should've opened the vault, but we should have offered him something close to what we offered Hammer instead of lowballing him. Again though, I would've dealt him at the deadline.

In any event, what's done is done.

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08-20-2007, 11:38 AM
  #65
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You guys are quick to bash Souray, but I actually believe what he said in the article... and the reason is that something very close to what he described happened to me as well.

"It's business" doesn't mean that he's greedy and wanted the most cash possible; it means that he realized that loyalty by the company plays a very small part. In the end, it's just a job for the player and it's business for the organization.

If he felt that he gave a lot during the 7 years, that he was a vital part of the team, it's perfectly understandable to be devastated when your boss treats you as an easily-replaceable part.

I'm not saying this is what happened, but if it did, I completely understand why he left.

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08-20-2007, 11:39 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by habfan4 View Post
That's one way of looking at the situation, I thought Souray was simply voicing his disappointment and reflecting on his time in Montréal. My key point was that it's a waste of energy to speculate on who’s at fault now that he's gone. At this point I'm more interested in what Hamrlik brings to the table than what Souray thinks about the sometimes sticky business of NHL contract negotiations.
Understood...but then we wouldn't have any fun over the summer...

It's kinda getting beat to death now I agree, but this is a valid, relevant topic.

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08-20-2007, 11:40 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by earl_the_habs_fan View Post
There was so much spin on this post I'd be surprised if it didn't come back and hit you in the noggin.

The offer of $4M/yr is from someone's imagination, nobody has confirmed this as a real offer. Perhaps it was low, perhaps it was close to market, we don't know. All we know is that Souray *says* it was low.
I don't see any reason to doubt this though. I take Souray at his word.

Quote:
Originally Posted by earl_the_habs_fan View Post
the line that "Gainey breaks off Communication with Souray's agent" is all readers of this post need to read to sense the spin you're putting on this. Souray admits he didn't counter-offer Gainey's initial submission, that he wanted to see the open market. So who "broke off" with whom?
Either way, it certainly appears that the Habs had other players on their minds which they gave greater priority.

Quote:
Originally Posted by earl_the_habs_fan View Post
Gainey made an offer to Souray on July 2, one day into free agency. Gainey assesses the responses from Briere and Smyth and immediately went to work on making Souray the top priority again. Your comment that the offer came a "good week or so" is misleading and incorrect.

"Souray waits a week or 2 and finally signs with Edmonton". Again, the timelines that you use are wrong. Souray signed on July 27, after detailed discussions with the Devils, the Rangers, the Sharks and other teams went sour. Seems like the amicable, reasonable, respect seeking Souray couldn't come to terms with a good many teams this year.

Souray's immaturity was the main negotiating factor. Now he's stuck in Edmonton with little chance of making the playoffs for his contract term. That's what happens when you bring ego and a twisted perspective of respect into a contract negotiation.
How was the guy immature? Its a business. If somebody lowballs you, you move on. Edmonton stepped up with a five year term, something that we probably weren't prepared to do (and with good reason).

Edmonton was willing to pay better over a longer period of time. Sheldon Souray took the offer because he felt it was competitive and he had some loyalty to his hometown. I know that if I was a FA hockey player and the Habs offered me a competitive wage I would sign there even if it wasn't the BEST offer out there. I'd do it because I grew up in Montreal and would love the chance to play for the team I grew up with. I'm sure its the same with him.

I don't see any reason to fault Souray here. We had a chance to re-sign him and probably could've if we hadn't of lowballed him. Once the other offers came in, we were cooked. Simple as that.

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08-20-2007, 11:45 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Wildbeliefs View Post

it's perfectly understandable to be devastated when your boss treats you as an easily-replaceable part.

I'm not saying this is what happened, but if it did, I completely understand why he left.
Yeah, but it could be read that Sheldon treated the Habs as an easily replaceable place to play.

He was asking way too much money...that's the bottom line. Look at his record over time, he's not a great defensman. The only team that paid him more than he's worth was the Oilers, who are overpaying everyone in some kind of desperate "sign anyone that will play for us, at any cost" mode they're in.

IMO, Gainey comes out looking great in this....both Souray and Lowe look like "ladies of the night" .

And speaking of loyalty, it was the Montreal Canadiens who supported Sheldon through his multiple injury-riddled, wife-abusing(alleged) seasons and episodes respctively.

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08-20-2007, 12:05 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
Yeah, but it could be read that Sheldon treated the Habs as an easily replaceable place to play.

He was asking way too much money...that's the bottom line. Look at his record over time, he's not a great defensman. The only team that paid him more than he's worth was the Oilers, who are overpaying everyone in some kind of desperate "sign anyone that will play for us, at any cost" mode they're in.

IMO, Gainey comes out looking great in this....both Souray and Lowe look like "ladies of the night" .
Sure, that's possible too. I don't know what happened and I don't particularly want to speculate; we have enough people in Montreal who do that already.

All I'm saying is that regardless of his real value, if he thought he was worth way more than what the Habs offered, then I understand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
And speaking of loyalty, it was the Montreal Canadiens who supported Sheldon through his multiple injury-riddled, wife-abusing(alleged) seasons and episodes respctively.
Regarding the injuries, strictly from a resource management point of view, why would the Habs not support him? I'm not sure what his salary was, but I don't think it was much. If the Habs thought he had good potential and the injuries weren't career ending, I don't see why they wouldn't stick with him... Even if it's only 60 games per season, 60 games of an all-star D (*if* that's what they thought his potential is) for the cheap price tag is pretty darn good.

And I won't talk about the abuse thing because I don't trust much reported by mtl media regarding players' personal lives...

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08-20-2007, 12:05 PM
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My real question is this - would fans here have been happy if Souray stayed and got the same contract that Edmonton gave him, or would they be whining that we overpaid to keep a defensively challenged, injury prone, -28 player?

I think I know the answer.

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08-20-2007, 12:06 PM
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I have to defend Gainey 100% in Souray's case...

1. Paying Souray 5.5 million is overpaying (mind you I don't think Hamrlik is worth it either). But still, he offered the same money to Souray and he refused it.

2. Souray admitted that he has been playing injured most of his career. Why tie up so much money on a guy that is never 100%??

3. Gainey didn't trade Souray at the deadline - even IF he didn't plan on re-signing him 100%, because he still believed the playoffs were in reach, and it came down to the last game of the season and we lost, so you can't blame the GM at that point. We had the chance and we blew it on the ice.

4. Gainey got Hamrlik to replace Souray and it didn't cost us any prospects or warm bodies.

Does Souray felt betrayed? Maybe I guess. Should he? Some people might agree with him, some might not. I personally think that he had an above average offensive year and he'll never repeat that. So he was overvalued. Reading his article he certainly doesn't seem to think he played above his head.

We'll see what happens this year I guess.

The one and ONLY thing I'll miss about Shelly is his willingness to stand up for his teammates.

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08-20-2007, 12:06 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
Yeah, but it could be read that Sheldon treated the Habs as an easily replaceable place to play.

He was asking way too much money...that's the bottom line. Look at his record over time, he's not a great defensman. The only team that paid him more than he's worth was the Oilers, who are overpaying everyone in some kind of desperate "sign anyone that will play for us, at any cost" mode they're in.

IMO, Gainey comes out looking great in this....both Souray and Lowe look like "ladies of the night" .

And speaking of loyalty, it was the Montreal Canadiens who supported Sheldon through his multiple injury-riddled, wife-abusing(alleged) seasons and episodes respctively.
Loyalty is a 2 way street and Sheldon fails to recognize what the org did for him. He should have signed for the low ball initial offer if loyalty was in play.

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08-20-2007, 12:12 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Yeah, he left everything on the ice.. too bad he also left his defensive talent at home, every night.
Man..show some respect...Souray played his heart out for montreal this year and if it wasn't for him Montreal wouldn't have even been close to making it to the finals..you think montreals powerplay is going to be the same without souray..hell no..who's going to play the point? Sheldon also was a big leader for the habs. Who's going to replace that leadership? well lets just hope higgins and komisarek are up for the task..as for all you ppl saying F sheldon and his defensive play..you'll be eating your words when you see how much he meant to us.

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08-20-2007, 12:13 PM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AH View Post
Loyalty is a 2 way street and Sheldon fails to recognize what the org did for him. He should have signed for the low ball initial offer if loyalty was in play.
And he even turned down the same offer that Hamrlik got...at that point he was "bitter" I guess, but he still turned down the money.

Either way, I won't miss seeing Souray getting burned by Spezza. At least we have Brisebois for some of that!

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08-20-2007, 12:16 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jordy View Post
Man..show some respect...Souray played his heart out for montreal this year and if it wasn't for him Montreal wouldn't have even been close to making it to the finals..you think montreals powerplay is going to be the same without souray..hell no..who's going to play the point? Sheldon also was a big leader for the habs. Who's going to replace that leadership? well lets just hope higgins and komisarek are up for the task..as for all you ppl saying F sheldon and his defensive play..you'll be eating your words when you see how much he meant to us.
We still never won anything with him anchoring our D. I don't think that's his fault, but I still think he's not a guy that I would build a team around.

I don't think Hamrlik is the answer either though. It's obvious that Gainey wanted Souray before Hamrlik but wasn't willing to increase the money offered.

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