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Old
09-22-2007, 02:03 PM
  #1
WhipNash27
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9 Forward Spots, 11 Players

Boy are those final few days of preseason going to be killer for Renney.

01. Jagr
02. Shanahan
03. Prucha
04. Gomez
05. Drury
06. Straka
07. Hossa
08. Avery
09. Callahan
10. Dubinsky
11. Dawes

Two have to be cut and if Dubinsky keeps playing how he did last night, he's going to make it very tough for Renney to cut him... thoughts?

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Old
09-22-2007, 02:06 PM
  #2
theduke35
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id say let hossa go, we gave that kid 2 years and a good amount of time on that 1st line with jagr and no offense but anyone can score when theyre on a line with a top5 best player in the world. He sucks away from that first line and would rather give his spot to a more deserving kid and package his ass along with whoever else for picks n prospects.

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09-22-2007, 02:09 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theduke35 View Post
id say let hossa go, we gave that kid 2 years and a good amount of time on that 1st line with jagr and no offense but anyone can score when theyre on a line with a top5 best player in the world. He sucks away from that first line and would rather give his spot to a more deserving kid and package his ass along with whoever else for picks n prospects.
I'll keep Hossa thank you very much.

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09-22-2007, 02:14 PM
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Carlos Ranger
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Are you ranking them by how sure a lock they are to keep their position? Because Shanny looked terrible last night and could be dropped to 3rd line if the kids continue impressing. We'll know a lot more after tonights game, but if I had to guess, I'd say Dubi is the only rookie to get a spot out of camp. Also it's senseless to get rid of Hossa, his salary is very manageable and he can adapt to playing anywhere in the lineup.

Jagr
Drury
Gomez
Avery
Straka
Prucha
Shanahan
Hossa
Dubinsky
Callahan
Dawes

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09-22-2007, 02:33 PM
  #5
illmatic
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I agree with whoever has been saying that there's no room for both Dubinsky and Hossa as Top 9 forwards on this team...basically Dubinsky can't make the team if Hossa is playing on one of the Top 3 lines...

hopefully this is the year that our kids finally force Hossa to the 4th line for good...I'd rather see anyone on that list getting Top 9 forward minutes before Hossa...and of course I'd like to see Dubinsky make the team, I'm pretty sure anyone who saw the game last night feels the same way...

two seasons with us, one good 10 game stretch each year, 20 goals and 34 points in 128 games with us, and yet Hossa still gets first line consideration on this team...unreal...he'll be pushing 30 and the apologists will still talk about him "developing"...I'm definitely glad to see Dawes pushing him for that 1st line spot and getting the start tonight with Gomez and Jags

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09-22-2007, 02:42 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illmatic View Post
I agree with whoever has been saying that there's no room for both Dubinsky and Hossa as Top 9 forwards on this team...basically Dubinsky can't make the team if Hossa is playing on one of the Top 3 lines...

hopefully this is the year that our kids finally force Hossa to the 4th line for good...I'd rather see anyone on that list getting Top 9 forward minutes before Hossa...and of course I'd like to see Dubinsky make the team, I'm pretty sure anyone who saw the game last night feels the same way...
Hossa-Gomez-Jagr
Avery-Drury-Shanahan
Straka-Dubinsky-Callahan
Prucha-Betts-Dawes/Hollweg/Jessiman

Hossa and Dubinsky are both top 9 forwards.

What makes this year any different than last with regards to Prucha playing on the bottom two lines and never really getting a chance? If you think that Renney wouldn't do that this year, you better think again IMO.

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Old
09-22-2007, 02:43 PM
  #7
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dump Hossa

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Old
09-22-2007, 02:44 PM
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no Anisimov... or possibly even Jessiman/Byers?

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09-22-2007, 02:55 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illmatic View Post
I agree with whoever has been saying that there's no room for both Dubinsky and Hossa as Top 9 forwards on this team...basically Dubinsky can't make the team if Hossa is playing on one of the Top 3 lines...

hopefully this is the year that our kids finally force Hossa to the 4th line for good...I'd rather see anyone on that list getting Top 9 forward minutes before Hossa...and of course I'd like to see Dubinsky make the team, I'm pretty sure anyone who saw the game last night feels the same way...

two seasons with us, one good 10 game stretch each year, 20 goals and 34 points in 128 games with us, and yet Hossa still gets first line consideration on this team...unreal...he'll be pushing 30 and the apologists will still talk about him "developing"...I'm definitely glad to see Dawes pushing him for that 1st line spot and getting the start tonight with Gomez and Jags
Some guys have different development curves than others. I mean, Avery is only a year older than Hossa and he just starting hitting his stride as a player last year. Yet here we are talking about him as a lock for the top 2 lines.

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09-22-2007, 02:58 PM
  #10
illmatic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhattan Blue View Post
Hossa-Gomez-Jagr
Avery-Drury-Shanahan
Straka-Dubinsky-Callahan
Prucha-Betts-Dawes/Hollweg/Jessiman

Hossa and Dubinsky are both top 9 forwards.

What makes this year any different than last with regards to Prucha playing on the bottom two lines and never really getting a chance? If you think that Renney wouldn't do that this year, you better think again IMO.
that's my point, I definitely know Renney would do that to Prucha again this year, and it's always wrong to me...it seems like you agree with me though...

Prucha, with 52 goals in his first 2 NHL seasons, playing on the 4th line? playing with Betts as his center?

Dawes either not making the team, or playing on the 4th line with Betts as his center? that made no sense last year and still makes no sense...

all this so Hossa can get 1ST LINE minutes?

that's why I want Dawes to win the 1st line spot, and for Hossa to be the one who gets bumped down to the 4th line...

I swear this is the only team in the NHL where this scenario could possibly take place: burying Prucha on the 4th line, and maybe having Dawes and/or Dubinsky not make the team, all so MARCEL HOSSA can get 1st line minutes

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:08 PM
  #11
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Hossa - Gomez - Jagr
Avery - Drury - Shanahan
Prucha - Straka - Callahan
Hollweg - Betts - Orr

I just have a feeling thats what Renney will go with to start the season. Its a safe lineup to begin the season, and Im sure it will change about 50 times through the year.

Im just thankful the organization finally has some legitimate depth, and if someone doesn't work out, theres other viable options.

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:08 PM
  #12
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Dawes Gomez Jagr
Straka Drury Prucha
Avery Dubinsky Shanny
Hossa Betts Callahan

Hollweg Orr as extras

Malik Rozsival
Tyutin Girardi
Staal Mara

with Pock as the extra defenseman

Hutchinson and Strudwick end up being waived....

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:09 PM
  #13
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Originally Posted by illmatic View Post
that's my point, I definitely know Renney would do that to Prucha again this year, and it's always wrong to me...it seems like you agree with me though...

Prucha, with 52 goals in his first 2 NHL seasons, playing on the 4th line? playing with Betts as his center?

Dawes either not making the team, or playing on the 4th line with Betts as his center? that made no sense last year and still makes no sense...

all this so Hossa can get 1ST LINE minutes?

that's why I want Dawes to win the 1st line spot, and for Hossa to be the one who gets bumped down to the 4th line...

I swear this is the only team in the NHL where this scenario could possibly take place: burying Prucha on the 4th line, and maybe having Dawes and/or Dubinsky not make the team, all so MARCEL HOSSA can get 1st line minutes
To be brutally honest, I dont think Nigel Dawes will ever play a legitimate role with the New York Rangers.

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:12 PM
  #14
illmatic
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Some guys have different development curves than others. I mean, Avery is only a year older than Hossa and he just starting hitting his stride as a player last year. Yet here we are talking about him as a lock for the top 2 lines.
here's my point with Hossa: at some point he's not "developing" anymore, he just is what he is...he's closer to 30 than 20...

every year it's something new: last year it was "he was great down the stretch and in the playoffs vs. New Jersey, he's coming around!" (even though his stats didn't back that up)...this year it's "he was great for that 12 game stretch with Jagr last year before he got hurt, he's coming around!"...next year it will be something else...

he's been given 2 seasons here: 1st line minutes...2nd line minutes...3rd line minutes...4th line minutes...PP time...PK time...and to me, at age 26, he looks like a solid 4th liner, not someone who should be holding back players like Prucha, Dawes, or Dubinsky at this point...

basically my Opening Night lineup would include Hossa, just not as a Top 9 forward, and definitely not at the expense of Prucha/Dawes/Dubinsky

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09-22-2007, 03:14 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
To be brutally honest, I dont think Nigel Dawes will ever play a legitimate role with the New York Rangers.
To be brutally honest, I agree with you.

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:16 PM
  #16
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The thing I don't get about (okay, one of the several things) I don't get about all the Hossa haters:

You always blow off his blossoming as "oh and he had one nice stretch for a couple of weeks" like it happened in November and then he produced poorly again for 50 games. Um, no. Hossa was exploding when last we saw him.

All the supporters are saying is that he may well have figured it all out. If so, he belongs on the first line. If not, well, he can play a number of other roles on the other lines. But let's see if the switch did in fact go off first before relegating him to the bottom line. Why is that so difficult to understand?

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:17 PM
  #17
illmatic
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
To be brutally honest, I dont think Nigel Dawes will ever play a legitimate role with the New York Rangers.
trust me I can see that happening too, and wouldn't it be horrible if Marcel Hossa got 2+ seasons to earn a legitimate role on this team, and Dawes didn't get a real shot?

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09-22-2007, 03:20 PM
  #18
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Getting rid of Hossa, like so many of us want, is probabl among the dumbest of moves we could make. Any player that can maintain the puck for that long in the corners is an asset. His defensive knowledge is growing keener, and when he masters maneuvering the puck down low, he'll be a big threat.

He's better off there than Straka, who's a playmaker and 35. Who else could we put there? Prucha the peanut, to be cracked 10 games into the season?

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:26 PM
  #19
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Originally Posted by illmatic View Post
trust me I can see that happening too, and wouldn't it be horrible if Marcel Hossa got 2+ seasons to earn a legitimate role on this team, and Dawes didn't get a real shot?
I think Dawes did get his shot when he made the team out of training camp last season. Now granted, he saw very minimal action, mostly on the 4th line, but he wasnt very noticeable. And whether its fair or not, 5th round picks usually get a cup of coffee at the NHL level, and if they dont make an impact on those lower lines, they dont climb the depth chart.

Mid-first round picks like Hossa with a unique combination of size and speed will usually always get the shot first, even if Dawes is the more polished player.

I think it all boils down to the fact that Hossa has shown he can legitimately handle 3rd and 4th line duties, and has the Potential to be a top 6 forward, while Dawes may be a top 6 NHL forward, but isn't much of a factor if he isn't scoring.

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:29 PM
  #20
illmatic
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
The thing I don't get about (okay, one of the several things) I don't get about all the Hossa haters:

You always blow off his blossoming as "oh and he had one nice stretch for a couple of weeks" like it happened in November and then he produced poorly again for 50 games. Um, no. Hossa was exploding when last we saw him.

All the supporters are saying is that he may well have figured it all out. If so, he belongs on the first line. If not, well, he can play a number of other roles on the other lines. But let's see if the switch did in fact go off first before relegating him to the bottom line. Why is that so difficult to understand?
it took over 100 games with us for Hossa to finally "blossom" for a 12 game stretch, and now you're ready to just hand him 1st line minutes based on those 12 games? why should I forget the other 100+ games with us? I know it happened when we last saw him, but he has a nice 10-15 game stretch every year (before going back to the same-old Hossa), why should I think he's gonna continue that for 82 games this year?

if that's your feeling then I hope if Hossa underachieves this season (like his track records says he always will) that you and other Hossa supporters will finally give up on him as a 1st liner this year, and accept him as being more of a 3rd/4th line-type NHL forward

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:29 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 25Prucha View Post
dump Hossa
Lol. Dump a guy who played very good for a good portion of the 2nd half last season.

How about dump Hollweg, or Orr? Guys who aren't nearly as good as Marcel is.

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09-22-2007, 03:32 PM
  #22
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Honestly, getting rid of Hossa would be a very dumb move IMO. He didn't get much of a chance at all the last 2 seasons to play on a top line until later on in last season on Jagr's line. ALSO, he led the team in goals during that streak after the all star game until he got hurt. The bottom line is, the kid has potential and we may have just untapped it. Not to mention I felt hossa played very very well in the playoffs and contributed at both ends of the rink.

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:38 PM
  #23
illmatic
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I think Dawes did get his shot when he made the team out of training camp last season. Now granted, he saw very minimal action, mostly on the 4th line, but he wasnt very noticeable. And whether its fair or not, 5th round picks usually get a cup of coffee at the NHL level, and if they dont make an impact on those lower lines, they dont climb the depth chart.

Mid-first round picks like Hossa with a unique combination of size and speed will usually always get the shot first, even if Dawes is the more polished player.

I think it all boils down to the fact that Hossa has shown he can legitimately handle 3rd and 4th line duties, and has the Potential to be a top 6 forward, while Dawes may be a top 6 NHL forward, but isn't much of a factor if he isn't scoring.
I have to strongly disagree about Dawes getting a real/fair shot last year, I think most Rangers fans will tell you the same...Renney didn't put him in a position to succeed at all...that's like saying "I didn't notice Callahan" when they brought him up the first time, look at what Callahan did when Renney gave him a real chance...

I'm not saying I don't want Hossa on this team as a 3rd/4th liner, and I do understand why Renney has given him endless chances (even if I disagree with it), I'm just saying the idea that he "won" or should be given the 1st line spot based on 15 games last year is ridiculous, even if it was "when we last saw him"

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:45 PM
  #24
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I thought there was 12 fowards? 4 lines right.

Hollweg is gone so is Orr and Dawes. Orr will be the extra man

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Old
09-22-2007, 03:55 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Fire Sather View Post
Lol. Dump a guy who played very good for a good portion of the 2nd half last season.

How about dump Hollweg, or Orr? Guys who aren't nearly as good as Marcel is.
Dump Orr? Let's not get crazy here... Colton isn't standing in anybody's way except for maybe Fritz. Colton knows his role on the team and does it really well. And he scored 2 goals for us too.

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