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Pavel Kubina: overpaid?

View Poll Results: Is Kubina overpaid?
Overpaid 117 80.14%
Underpaid 4 2.74%
Paid fairly 25 17.12%
Voters: 146. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-11-2007, 03:20 PM
  #26
Kristia
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Kubina is a good d-man... he's just not worth $5 million IMO... I would say $4 million max...so to me he's overpaid..

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Old
10-11-2007, 04:58 PM
  #27
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Overpaid big time
Agreed.

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Old
10-11-2007, 08:23 PM
  #28
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He's about where he should be.

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Old
10-11-2007, 08:30 PM
  #29
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Mr. Burns: greedy?

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Old
10-13-2007, 02:11 AM
  #30
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Habs Three Highest Paid Dmen

Markov 5.750
Hamrlik 5.500
Bouillon 1.875
TOTAL: 13.125 million

Leafs Three Highest Paid Dmen

Kaberle 4.250
McCabe 5.750
Kubina 5.000
TOTAL: 15.000 million

Difference: 1.875 million

Personally, I like our trio best and 1.875 million isn't enough to really concern me. What is more of a problem, IMO, is that our 5th/6th guy is making 2 million. If we're going give up someone, it should be Gill because his role is one that can be filled easily and for less money than we're paying him.

That said, and to answer the question, Kubina is slightly overpaid as are most defensemen signed after July 1st. His contract is looking better and better with recent signings though.

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Old
10-13-2007, 09:43 AM
  #31
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Overpaid? Hell yes.

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Old
10-13-2007, 09:45 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutchecktime View Post
Habs Three Highest Paid Dmen

Markov 5.750
Hamrlik 5.500
Bouillon 1.875
TOTAL: 13.125 million

Leafs Three Highest Paid Dmen

Kaberle 4.250
McCabe 5.750
Kubina 5.000
TOTAL: 15.000 million

Difference: 1.875 million

Personally, I like our trio best and 1.875 million isn't enough to really concern me. What is more of a problem, IMO, is that our 5th/6th guy is making 2 million. If we're going give up someone, it should be Gill because his role is one that can be filled easily and for less money than we're paying him.

That said, and to answer the question, Kubina is slightly overpaid as are most defensemen signed after July 1st. His contract is looking better and better with recent signings though.
That's a skewed analysis. Compare all 6 d-men and you'll see the Habs are getting much better bang for the buck from their defense. That said, other teams are getting much better bang for the buck than either the Habs or Leafs. Basically the Habs and Leafs, in terms of defense, are dum and dummer. Other than Kaberle and Streit, none of their defensemen have would could be called bargain contracts for what they bring.


Last edited by Psycho Papa Joe: 10-13-2007 at 09:52 AM.
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Old
10-13-2007, 12:17 PM
  #33
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That's a skewed analysis. Compare all 6 d-men and you'll see the Habs are getting much better bang for the buck from their defense.
I'll do all of them.

Markov 5.750
Hamrlik 5.500
Bouillion 1.875
Dandenault 1.725
Komisarek 1.725
Brisebois 1.400
Streit .600
TOTAL: 18.55

McCabe 5.75
Kubina 5.00
Kaberle 4.250
Gill 2.075
Colaiacovo 1.283
White 0.85
Wozniewski 0.50
TOTAL: 19.708

Not a huge difference. I don't know that I agree that they are getting more bang for their buck. On their #3 Komisarek, yes, definitely. On guys like Boullion, Dandenault, and Brisebois all at 1.4 million +, I'd say no.

Like I said though, there's nothing wrong with paying 15 million to your top 3, if the bottom three are both cheap and effective. Gill at 2 million doesn't really make sense for our salary structure when we have guys like Stralman and Kronwall who can be a bottom pairing guy for 700K or 500K.

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Old
10-13-2007, 12:22 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
I think it's more of a case of underperforming, rather than being overpaid. If he was playing like he did in TB, I wouldn't have a problem with his salary. But in Toronto he has quite simply not been the same very good all round d-man he was in TB. IMO he was the best d-man on a Cup champion, so that must be worth something.

Spot on.

It was not a bad signing. He just hasn't worked out as well as Toronto might have hoped. But, I hope he still will.

P.S. All you guys in this thread are card carrying members of the International Anti-Leafs Conspiracy (IALC). That seem obvious.

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Old
10-13-2007, 12:25 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Fleury14 View Post
For the player, he's not overpaid. However, it makes zero sense to sign a guy that will be your #3 blueliner to a $5m/yr contract.
I agree with this, on top of it it makes no sense to have Kubina when you have Kaberle who basically is thesame type of guy(but better). The would have been better to go out and spend the money on a Bruising type of guy.

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Old
10-13-2007, 12:27 PM
  #36
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Kubina may very well be underpaid, but consdering he's a #3 he's overpaid.

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10-13-2007, 12:33 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Jeffler View Post
Kubina may very well be underpaid, but consdering he's a #3 he's overpaid.
As an Islanders fan i would be happy to take him off your hands, he would be a perfect fit for our defense. I assume there is a few other teams that might be interested as well.

From an outsiders perspective i always thought a deal with Phoenix would make sense where you have a trade of Kubina for Morris. Morris would probably better compliment your defense while giving you 1M in capspace(Phoenix would probably have to sweeten the pot slightly).

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Old
10-13-2007, 12:37 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Gutchecktime View Post
I'll do all of them.

Markov 5.750
Hamrlik 5.500
Bouillion 1.875
Dandenault 1.725
Komisarek 1.725
Brisebois 1.400
Streit .600
TOTAL: 18.55

McCabe 5.75
Kubina 5.00
Kaberle 4.250
Gill 2.075
Colaiacovo 1.283
White 0.85
Wozniewski 0.50
TOTAL: 19.708

Not a huge difference. I don't know that I agree that they are getting more bang for their buck. On their #3 Komisarek, yes, definitely. On guys like Boullion, Dandenault, and Brisebois all at 1.4 million +, I'd say no.

Like I said though, there's nothing wrong with paying 15 million to your top 3, if the bottom three are both cheap and effective. Gill at 2 million doesn't really make sense for our salary structure when we have guys like Stralman and Kronwall who can be a bottom pairing guy for 700K or 500K.
Dandenault is actually playing forward this year, and he hasn't been half bad. The number 7 guy is Gorges at 495K. Also, Brisebois salary is actually 700K. The 1.4 includes performance bonuses. If he earns those bonuses, he's worth the money, because it will mean he contributed.

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Old
10-13-2007, 01:47 PM
  #39
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Overpaid IMO. I think 3.5 million or so would be fair for him.

Although I'm a Canucks fan and I'm used to that 3.5 number for defensemen...


edit: Also, I'm gonna throw in the Canucks salary comparison here just to make the Leafs and Habs fans feel bad...

Markov 5.750
Hamrlik 5.500
Bouillion 1.875
Komisarek 1.725
Brisebois .700 (1.400 w/bonuses)
Streit .600
Gorges .495
TOTAL: 16.645 (17.345 w/bonuses)

McCabe 5.75
Kubina 5.00
Kaberle 4.250
Gill 2.075
Colaiacovo 1.283
White 0.850
Wozniewski 0.500
TOTAL: 19.708

Ohlund 3.5
Mitchell 3.5
Salo 3.5
Bieksa .525 (doesn't get a raise till next year)
Krajicek 1.1
Miller 1.5
Weaver .600
TOTAL: 14.225


Last edited by tesplen: 10-13-2007 at 01:55 PM.
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Old
10-13-2007, 01:48 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by tesplen View Post
Overpaid IMO. I think 3.5 million or so would be fair for him.

Although I'm a Canucks fan and I'm used to that 3.5 number for defensemen...
When does Ohlund become a free agent again?

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Old
10-14-2007, 12:19 PM
  #41
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I couldn't tell you because I don't generally see the leafs or other teams from the north east. I started a thread last year asking about kubina and they said he played well for the most part. If that's the case and he played similar to when the lightning won the cup hed be worth the money. His last year in tampa he was not very good and out of position a bit and that kubina is vastly overpaid

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Old
10-14-2007, 12:23 PM
  #42
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Once you can attach "key player on Stanley Cup winner" after the end of your name your price goes up, similar thing happened to Brad Richards.

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10-14-2007, 12:43 PM
  #43
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*mooseOAK - Once you can attach "key player on Stanley Cup winner" after the end of your name your price goes up, similar thing happened to Brad Richards.

Brad richards though is a consistent 20 goal scorer and great playmaker, I wouldn't say his contract is so bloated just because of his conn smythe. The lightning were desperate to keep him and paid him max dollars.

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Old
10-14-2007, 09:57 PM
  #44
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*mooseOAK - Once you can attach "key player on Stanley Cup winner" after the end of your name your price goes up, similar thing happened to Brad Richards.

Brad richards though is a consistent 20 goal scorer and great playmaker, I wouldn't say his contract is so bloated just because of his conn smythe. The lightning were desperate to keep him and paid him max dollars.
Consistent 20 goal scorers weren't getting maximum deals. You can bet your bottom dollar the agent was throwing the Conn Smythe trophy out there.

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Old
10-15-2007, 08:23 AM
  #45
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As a #3 in Toronto... Overpaid.

As Pavel Kubina... Paid fairly.

Honestly though, I think he's paid pretty fairly... As for him being #3 in Toronto... I'd say he's #2. He gets more IT per game than McCabe, especially ES and SH, McCabe makes up about 3 mins on the PP.

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Old
10-15-2007, 08:37 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by yadadaimhollaing View Post
His last year in tampa he was not very good and out of position a bit and that kubina is vastly overpaid
No idea what you're talking about here, guessing you just looked at his stat sheet.

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As for him being #3 in Toronto... I'd say he's #2. He gets more IT per game than McCabe, especially ES and SH, McCabe makes up about 3 mins on the PP.
Problem is, Kubina needs PP time to really put some #s up, and his #s are why he get that contract presumably. Other than that he pays off the most in the playoffs. Take away that stuff and he's not worth the money IMO. To me it just seems like the Leafs don't really need him, they have players that fill his role already.

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Old
10-15-2007, 03:12 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Sotnos View Post
No idea what you're talking about here, guessing you just looked at his stat sheet.


Problem is, Kubina needs PP time to really put some #s up, and his #s are why he get that contract presumably. Other than that he pays off the most in the playoffs. Take away that stuff and he's not worth the money IMO. To me it just seems like the Leafs don't really need him, they have players that fill his role already.

I agree. But, then the problem is not the contract they gave Kubina. Kubina was simply a bad fit for that team. With McCabe and Kaberle as two of the better offensive dmen in the league (in terms of offensive abilities, at least), Kubina is redundant.

I suspect he still has good trade value, because on a team like the Isles, he'd easily be a #1 and log tons of ice time at critical moments.

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Old
10-15-2007, 04:09 PM
  #48
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Overpaid.

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