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All-Time Draft #8, Part IV

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Old
10-18-2007, 03:27 PM
  #101
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BM67 View Post
452 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Tom Barrasso
454 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Vladimir Dzurilla
Man what a coincidence! I was just thinking about THOSE exact two goalies!

I was wondering a couple of hours ago about what backup to take and thought that Barrasso would be my pick if I wanted to maximize regular season seeding because he could see 30+ games as a backup, basically like a tandem situation, and if Hasek got injured then Tomcat could take over for the playoffs, only, Hasek is not the sort of goalie who'll be happy resting 30+ games a season, guys like he and Fuhr want and need to work most nights.

Then I thought how Dzurilla steps into situations with little prep and shines, like when the refrigerator mechanic was called up last minute to play Canada and stole the spotlight. He seems like the perfect backup to come in for a game or two or three here or there, especially in a clutch.

So...

The Tommy B pick boosts my esteem for Nanaimo in reflecting on regular season rankings, especially given that the team's starter is Benedict who only played 24-40 games per season and could really use help down the stretch to ensure the oldtimer isn't overused going into the playoffs. But I'll have a question mark in my head come playoff time, especially after the first round or two, when I expect Barrasso to be more of a hassle to deal with personalitywise.

The Slovak pick improves my respect for Sherbrooke's playoff goaltending, especially given the question marks surrounding starter Connell. Now the team has two guys who have played well when it mattered most. But can Connell handle more than 44 games per season? Perhaps with modern training in an all-time context,.. but one wonders. And I dunno about how Dzurilla would play with a 20-40 games workload, he always looking a bit out of shape, more skill than fitness. So regular season standing might take a knock with this pick, more geared to playoff insurance.

imo

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Old
10-18-2007, 03:46 PM
  #102
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I guess you know you're pretty deep into a draft when you see a run on backup goalies and in-depth analysis of the potentially earth-shaking ramifications of drafting Tom Barrasso.

Northcott + goalie would have been the way we went if Laprade was off the board. I guess sometimes a certain amount of consensus exists even this late in the draft.

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:04 PM
  #103
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The best rounds are coming up. Choice is greater, planning and decision making more deliberative. I much prefer the later rounds to the early ones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
...the potentially earth-shaking ramifications of drafting Tom Barrasso
more like dressing room rumble

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:22 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
But can he check his ego at the door and accept the role of a back-up? Or is he going to be a malcontent and a problem child in the locker room?
"Hey, Tom. Until you play better than Clint Benedict, shut up.
Love,
Coach Day"

... problem solved.

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:28 PM
  #105
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The best rounds are coming up. Choice is greater, planning and decision making more deliberative. I much prefer the later rounds to the early ones.
In my opinion, the great challenge to coming out ahead in the early rounds is projection and manuevering. Correctly identifying at what point certain tiers of talent (and tiers within certain positions, as well) will run out and getting in on the end of those runs is the best way to maximize value through about round ten or so.

After the first ten rounds or so, the emphasis becomes more tilted towards research and knowledge. You've got to have a deep list to make the most out of all your picks in the bottom half of the draft. The picks do tail off in importance just as the players picked tail off in projected icetime, but still they can be the difference between winning and losing.

What's interesting about the top half of the draft is watching everyone jockey for position, trying to predict opposing GM's moves, seeing which players rise and fall, etc. The opening rounds of the draft also seem to spur some lively debates about relative player value, much moreso than the bottom half, in which there is nothing close to a crystallized consensus.

The bottom half of the draft is interesting because you really get to see what's new - the fruits of the league's collective research and knowledge. Some interesting stuff has already come out and I'm sure it will get really wide open here shortly as third lines and top 4 defenses are basically all complete and almost everyone's list is running on fumes. Now is the time when I'm sure we'll see a lot of "I like this guy" picks, some good, some bad, but all pretty interesting. I haven't seen any names so far that I just didn't know (shows what a nerd I am), but I'm sure it's coming...

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:43 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cottonking View Post
"Hey, Tom. Until you play better than Clint Benedict, shut up.
Love,
Coach Day"

... problem solved.
I would give you Tom's reaction, but I don't see a middle finger emoticon on here.

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:48 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
I would give you Tom's reaction, but I don't see a middle finger emoticon on here.


Those ones would be the better fit I guess.

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:51 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
I have to say I considered throwing Godzilla's name into the pot when Nalyd and I were discussing backup goalie candidates, but we both decided that we wanted a guy with NHL playoff experience. Normie Smith was a hell of a goalie for a couple of years before hurting his arm and he's a guy we feel comfortable slotting in to give Holocek a break, both during the regular season and in the playoffs.

Although I dislike short-peak players in general, I make an exception for backup goalies, for whom brief bursts of greatness are more important than long-term consistency. There haven't been many better two year peaks than Normie had from 1935 to 1937, but there also wasn't a whole lot more to his career than that, so I don't see much reason to believe he'd have a problem playing second fiddle to a workhorse like Holocek.
It all depends on how much work you're going to give your #1 'tender, I figure.

Since Cheevers never played more than 52 games in the regular season, I felt it necessary to get another quality goaltender with long-term consistency (Chabot) to help share the load. I don't think a goalie like Smith would've been ideal in my case, but if you're confident in Holocek playing a healthy portion of your season, I think Smith could perform well in a limited role.

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Old
10-18-2007, 04:55 PM
  #109
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Today's moving much more slowly than I thought it would.

Will anyone be around tonight to take HO's list from me?

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Old
10-18-2007, 05:03 PM
  #110
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Send it my way Dr.Dark. I'll be back during the intermissions.


Last edited by MXD: 10-19-2007 at 10:26 AM.
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Old
10-18-2007, 05:09 PM
  #111
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Ottawa selects Ian Turnbull.

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Old
10-18-2007, 05:10 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
I would give you Tom's reaction, but I don't see a middle finger emoticon on here.
I'm not sure if a goalie stick wouldn't be involved.

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Old
10-18-2007, 05:45 PM
  #113
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Is Evil Sather aware that it is his turn?

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Old
10-18-2007, 05:49 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
You've got to have a deep list to make the most out of all your picks in the bottom half of the draft... almost everyone's list is running on fumes
I have several lists running on high octane having spent a lot of time getting ready for the next minor league draft and coming across some gems.

One learns very little early in the draft but - as I'm sure several other g.m.s can confirm - researching depth options for the later rounds and the minor league draft is an educational experience.

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Old
10-18-2007, 06:06 PM
  #115
Evil Sather
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The New York Rangers select a stellar rushing defensemen with a few Cups on his resume, one the first true superstars of the game, the first defenseman credited with a goal, and a contender for the Captaincy.. D Lester Patrick.

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Old
10-18-2007, 06:09 PM
  #116
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The New York Rangers select a stellar rushing defensemen with a few Cups on his resume, one the first true superstars of the game, the first defenseman credited with a goal, and a contender for the Captaincy.. D Lester Patrick.
And an awesome goaltender

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Old
10-18-2007, 06:12 PM
  #117
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Biltmores select C Orland Kurtenbach

Surprised he was still available with all the Canuck fans in this draft.

Kurtenbach was a tough effective 2 way centre who was the first captain of the Canucks. He was also pretty good with his fists. Didn't go looking for trouble but was able to handle it when it came his way.

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Old
10-18-2007, 06:20 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by pappyline View Post
Biltmores select C Orland Kurtenbach

Surprised he was still available with all the Canuck fans in this draft.

Kurtenbach was a tough effective 2 way centre who was the first captain of the Canucks. He was also pretty good with his fists. Didn't go looking for trouble but was able to handle it when it came his way.
A man after my own heart. He was on my list, but after we got Riser, we didn't have any room left for a centre.

Remember, pappy, none of the Canuck fans were around when Orland was our double-tough captain.

BTW, is this the first draft that BM didn't have Patrick as a player or a coach? Or both?

And did mullin send a pick to anyone? If not, I'll need to PM my two-man list to somebody in 20 minutes. (mulls, if you do come on-line, that's how long you have to pick).

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Old
10-18-2007, 06:47 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
WOW. I just knew BM67 was gonna grab Holmes. But Smith is a great consolation prize. With a European starter, I knew it was essential to have a back-up with not just playoff experience, but some Stanley cup wins, so a two time Cup champion, retroactive Smythe winner and winner of the longest game in NHL history is just what the doctor ordered.

Funny that Northcott went next as he was next on our list...
It's a sad day, I was hoping to have Smith as the only three-time Clipper. Obviously you don't have to sell me on his talent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cottonking View Post
"Hey, Tom. Until you play better than Clint Benedict, shut up.
Love,
Coach Day"

... problem solved.
That's pretty much what it came down to for me. I think with how quirky a lot of goalies are, most guys who were starters for most or all of their career wouldn't be comfortable in a backup position. But for the sake of an ATD, I'd rather have a backup who is competitive and feels that he can (and should) be the starter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturminator
The bottom half of the draft is interesting because you really get to see what's new - the fruits of the league's collective research and knowledge. Some interesting stuff has already come out and I'm sure it will get really wide open here shortly as third lines and top 4 defenses are basically all complete and almost everyone's list is running on fumes. Now is the time when I'm sure we'll see a lot of "I like this guy" picks, some good, some bad, but all pretty interesting. I haven't seen any names so far that I just didn't know (shows what a nerd I am), but I'm sure it's coming...
I've lost all faith in you guys. Last draft I was able to not pick players I really wanted because I thought they had a good chance of sliding to my next pick. There's going to be no more of that from me from now on.


Last edited by pitseleh: 10-18-2007 at 06:55 PM.
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Old
10-18-2007, 06:49 PM
  #120
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458 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars (at the podium)
459 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF (in the on-deck circle)
460 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs (in the hole)

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Old
10-18-2007, 07:09 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
Well, when Terrible Ted Lindsay is still out there, that might have something to do with it. I'd never pass on Lindsay to take Jagr. But I'd never pass on Lindsay to take Yzerman, Lidstrom, any goalie who's out there, or some of the other guys taken ahead of Lindsay.

Lindsay was probably the BPA for about 10 picks. And when you consider his position, well-rounded game and leadership, he should go a lot earlier than 30.

And for the record, Jagr went No. 29. Or 28. Whichever was listed first.
Quote:
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I knew Flin Flon wasn't going to start Clarke-Trottier and I was fairly confident St Louis wasn't going to start Yzerman-Trottier, so when Winnipeg took Jagr (awful pick IMO) instead of Lindsay, I realized that (at the very least) I was going to get Trottier. My exact words were, "wow ... that just happened."
Hate to say it, but it's probably the biggest mistake we've made all draft. Right after the lottery, we had our eyes on a few guys: Hasek, Lidstrom, Brodeur, Jagr, Park, Sakic, Yzerman...guys who would likely get picked around that area. So when we checked to see Lidstrom, and Hasek gone, we took the next two on our list. However, ck, I fail to see how Jagr is a awful pick past 20.

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Old
10-18-2007, 07:10 PM
  #122
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While I still believe my team needs to get more physical up front, I also see a great opportunity with this pick to give me some intriguing options.

At this point this particular player has fallen so substantially from the last draft that (over 150 spots from where Pappy took him in 7, and more than that from where he was taken in 6) I imagine that perhaps people just aren't looking for this type of player anymore.

However, drafting a playmaker of his ability suits me wonderfully. I have exceptional trigger men on both of my first two lines that he would make great use of. I could slot him in between Lafleur and Blake and move Taylor to D. I could slot him between Bellows and Yakushev while moving the two-way talents of Damphousse to my third line LW position.

He gives my line-up some flexibility. Even more than that he gives me the opportunity to put his playmaking ability onto my first PP unit with Taylor moving to the other point spot.

He's a two time WHA First All-Star, two time Avco Cup Champion, WHA Playoff MVP, multiple time WHA assist leader, 3 WHA seasons with over 120 points and four with over 114 points, scored 26 points in 13 playoff games one season and 27 points in 20 games in another playoff run. Despite two debilitating injuries he still scored 169 points in 170 NHL games. He also had 16 points in 14 playoff games during the Rangers playoff run in 1981. A skilled playmaker with speed, creativity and the proven ability to make the best out of playing with superstar talent.

C Ulf Nilsson

From LEGENDS OF HOCKEY

Quote:
Nilsson was one of the players who introduced Swedish hockey to Canada when in 1974 he made his debut with the WHA's Winnipeg Jets, where his partner in offense was another great Swedish forward, Anders Hedberg. Both were often among the league's best scorers and, thanks to the Swedish duo's excellent performance, the Winnipeg Jets twice won the Avco Cup.

At the 1976 Canada Cup, he played exceptionally well for Tre Kronor and in a game against the USSR scored the decisive goal against Vladislav Tretiak. Nilsson was also included on the NHL All-Star Team pitted against the USSR at the 1979 Challenge Cup tournament.
From Winnipeg Jets Legends

Quote:
Upon arrival in Winnipeg, Nilsson and Hedberg were almost immediately teamed up with The Golden Jet - Bobby Hull. In fact, they help Hull achieve mind boggling statistics while playing an exciting brand of hockey previously not seen in North America. Many look back it at it now and call it "Edmonton Oiler Hockey" only a few years earlier. Like Gretzky's Oilers, Nilsson, Hedberg and Hull loved to run and gun.

Nilsson was more of a playmaker than Hedberg, who was more of a sniper. Both however fed the real sniper - Hull. Nilsson twice led the WHA in assists and never scored less than 114 points.

Ulf Nilsson's and Anders Hedberg's true legend lies in the World Hockey Association. They however proved they belong at the National Hockey League level as well.

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Old
10-18-2007, 07:10 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Evil Sather View Post
The New York Rangers select a stellar rushing defensemen with a few Cups on his resume, one the first true superstars of the game, the first defenseman credited with a goal, and a contender for the Captaincy.. D Lester Patrick.
Gah.

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Old
10-18-2007, 07:10 PM
  #124
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Wasn't quick enough to get in on GBC's time limit so whomever has his pick go ahead.

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Old
10-18-2007, 07:13 PM
  #125
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GBC select Defenseman Wally Stanowski

Can someone PM FI2? TY

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