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Randy Jones hit on Patrice Bergeron [Youtube at post #158]

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:20 PM
  #326
Muppetus Galacticus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Hmm..

I see the Flyers haven't learned anything.

Perhaps the league should start fining the organization.

$1M cap space fine for every illegal hit resulting in injury and suspension.
I know this probably isn't the thread for this but at the least I would like to see suspended players kept on the roster for the duration of the suspension. I think though that I may have read somewhere that the league can't force a team to do that, is that right?

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10-27-2007, 06:22 PM
  #327
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Update on Bergeron yet???

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10-27-2007, 06:23 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by bruinsfan2000 View Post
agreed this was not Jones intent but that should not exempt him from a suspension, he made a bad decision period.
I guess a suspension could be warranted to make an example and take a stand against boarding, but anything above 5 is pathetic. He made a stupid decision but no matter what direction Patrice was standing he would have hit him the same, he was just defending.

In all honesty though, I don't really care about the suspension I just want Patrice back out there ASAP.

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10-27-2007, 06:23 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by KristieLovesSBates17 View Post
Update on Bergeron yet???
Nothing to report yet..they took him to the hospital.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=221555&hubname=

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:23 PM
  #330
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NRHL: No Respect Hockey League.

Randy was looking right at Patrice's head and focused on it when he decided to ram it into the boards.

Yeah, it's a fast game - but the guys can decide to tip slapshots and they can also decide whether or not to hit guys in the head. Randy decided to take Bergeron out. I've seen plenty of Thrashers (Sutton on Tucker) pull this kind of garbage too. I'm losing my love affair with NHL hockey. I'd rather see AHLers scrap than this kind of wanton viciousness.

No Respect Hockey League.

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10-27-2007, 06:24 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus View Post
I know this probably isn't the thread for this but at the least I would like to see suspended players kept on the roster for the duration of the suspension. I think though that I may have read somewhere that the league can't force a team to do that, is that right?
Downie is suspended for 20 games. Boulerice is suspended for 25 games. If the Flyers spend the next 3 years moving those guys to/from the minors to get those suspensions served, it doesn't matter - they still won't play until they've been on an NHL roster for 20 and 25 missed games, respectively.

Doing the shuttle thing, they still can't play in the NHL; if anything, it makes it more likely they'll have to miss more time than they would if they were stuck on the NHL roster.

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10-27-2007, 06:24 PM
  #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KristieLovesSBates17 View Post
Update on Bergeron yet???
Nothing yet according the TV broadcast. He was taken to the hospital.

The hit caused a concussion and I recall hearing he wasn't conscious during the time he was on the ice.

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10-27-2007, 06:24 PM
  #333
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As far as the outrage about the hit, remember that hits from behind happen in the NHL (way too often). A player on the team you root for has probably thrown a hit from behind within the last year which you would have/did defended if people started calling for their head. Every single hit from behind can have these consequences. The only way I'd be ok with the league punishin this more than 10 games is if it marks the beginning of harsh consequences for every hit from behind (even the ones that don't cause grave injury). If the league just punishes this because of the outcome and then goes back to slapping people on the wrist for similar actions with different results, nothing will change.

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10-27-2007, 06:24 PM
  #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr BLUEandWHITE View Post
Just a friendly reminder....

Just reading some posts and we are getting a lot of "There was no intent".

I must ask why is that important?

If I want to beat someone up, but I kill them am I going to get any leniency from the judge. I think not. He will punish the action. Remember its punish the action not intent.

If we are to punish the intent then he would not get a single game for this hit. Because I think people are right I don't think he wanted to hurt Bergeron.

But, again that doesn't matter punish the action...30 games minimum, and we'll see less of this **** in our game.

I tend to agree with you...

I don't know Randy Jones so it's far from me (or anyone else who wasn't in his head at that split second) to say wether or not he intended to hurt Bergeron.

But looking at the video over and over again, it's OBVIOUS that he saw him in a vulnerable position, and had enough time to decide wether to "finish the check" or ease up a bit.
He may not have "intended" to potentially paralyze him, but a guy who has been playing hockey for most of his life could reasonably be expected to know the danger of hitting a guy in that position... I didn't mean to in a situation like this is an excuse that runs dry about the same time you learn to wipe your own ass!

Reminds me of a fight I was in once... ended up standing above the guy, with him on all fours, and in a position were I could have really done some serious damage. Despite being drunk and in the fury that takes over when in a bar brawl, I still had the presence of mind to ease up and NOT "finish" him*** I don't buy for one second that it was defensible for Jones to not ease up on Bergeron (and the name doesnt matter) considering how vulnerable he was. It's called respect of your opponent, respect for the game and respect for another human being.
Jones deserves a lengthy suspension, but will likely be sparred because there are so many neanderthals in hockey that think outright violence has a rightful place in sports.

Hockey should learn from Rugby. A sport that is just as, if not more physical than hockey but were acts of unecessary violence are dealt with immediately, and respect for opponents is considered a fundemental part of the game. (that's not to say, of course, that there arent jerks who play dirty, or players known for being cheap... only that they are dealt with and watched much more vigilantly)

As someone else posted, a guy like Lidstrom would have had the class to do the right thing, Jones made a bad mistake and deserves to be punished for it.


*** incidentally, my reward for not pumelling that guy was to have his friend push me off from behind, allowing him to get back up and come at me, landing a few good shots before I laid him out...

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10-27-2007, 06:24 PM
  #335
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It doesn't matter what he tried to do...it happened. You pay for being responsible for the injury if it is deemed worse than the attempt(more cases than not)

eg of intent worse than action - attemped murder

eg of action worse than intent -....well this.

As for his leg moving that looks to be like more of a state of shock reaction more than being ok...his leg moved a matter of inches.

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10-27-2007, 06:25 PM
  #336
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Philly will have a pretty stacked team in SHL (Suspension Hockey League).

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:25 PM
  #337
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You dont want ESPN to report it?
????

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:25 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus View Post
I know this probably isn't the thread for this but at the least I would like to see suspended players kept on the roster for the duration of the suspension. I think though that I may have read somewhere that the league can't force a team to do that, is that right?
I like that idea, the team would loose cap space, and would have to pay the player during that time period (i think the money goes to a the nhl players fund) and they would loose players from their active lineup.

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10-27-2007, 06:26 PM
  #339
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I'm glad the Bruins aren't lower the quality of their play to the Flyer's level.

Everyone is acting professional and nobody is randomly leaping off their feet to make head shots. Kudos to the Bruin players.

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10-27-2007, 06:26 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by Checker View Post
As far as the outrage about the hit, remember that hits from behind happen in the NHL (way too often). A player on the team you root for has probably thrown a hit from behind within the last year which you would have/did defended if people started calling for their head. Every single hit from behind can have these consequences. The only way I'd be ok with the league punishin this more than 10 games is if it marks the beginning of harsh consequences for every hit from behind (even the ones that don't cause grave injury). If the league just punishes this because of the outcome and then goes back to slapping people on the wrist for similar actions with different results, nothing will change.
As a fan of a team that was guilty of a similar incident I agree with everything you said. The league needs to set the precedent that it is the action that is penalized and not the outcome.

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:28 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by Heske_44 View Post
eg of intent worse than action - attemped murder

eg of action worse than intent -....well this.
eg of action worse than intent - manslaughter.

Death by fluke accident is still illegal and punishable by North American laws.

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10-27-2007, 06:28 PM
  #342
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(Even people that are paralyzed from the neck down can move their legs)

Not voluntarily, but they still can. Spinal cord injuries don't mean all the muscles in your legs go dead.

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10-27-2007, 06:29 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Irish Blues View Post
Downie is suspended for 20 games. Boulerice is suspended for 25 games. If the Flyers spend the next 3 years moving those guys to/from the minors to get those suspensions served, it doesn't matter - they still won't play until they've been on an NHL roster for 20 and 25 missed games, respectively.

Doing the shuttle thing, they still can't play in the NHL; if anything, it makes it more likely they'll have to miss more time than they would if they were stuck on the NHL roster.
But do you think there might come a time when the team gets punished as well? I don't mean anything retroactive, but let's say the rules were there and "what if" Downie, Boulerice and now Jones are sitting out their suspensions and counting against the cap and roster limit? It actually sounds harsh looking at that now but would that shake the teams up a bit and take their share of responsibility?

And I forgot to say earlier, prayers to Bergeron and I hope he will be just fine!

In regards to the boards sticking out, is that a glass issue? Would it even be possible for the glass/boards to be flat?

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10-27-2007, 06:30 PM
  #344
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Old
10-27-2007, 06:30 PM
  #345
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I don't think there was an intent to injure... but a hit like that when you can see the numbers is a huge no-no. He'll be suspended for sure...

My thoughts go out to Bergeron... hopefully his injuries aren't too serious.

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:30 PM
  #346
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Was it a bad hit? Yes
Was it illegal? Yes
Did Jones intend to injure? I don't think so

I think he will be suspended a few games but not more than the other 2 hits.

I wish Patrice Bergeron well and hope for a speedy recovery.

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:30 PM
  #347
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Look the hit was bad, but in NO way was Jones TRYING to do that. That hit happens every game, and if Bergeron does what he was taught in Peewee he doesn't turn his back to the boards and takes the hit he would be fine.

Jones by NO WAY is a dirty player. Listening to all the people saying the Flyers go out to "injure" people ... well that's just ridiculous. Darcy Tucker throws checks 10 times as worse.

Saying Jones could pull up is silly. Anyone who's ever played this game knows how fast it is. Jones was finishing his check something defensemen are taught to do.

BTW reports are that Bergeron is at the hospital with the Bruins doctors. And Jones has already issued an apology saying he had NO intention of hitting Bergeron as he did.

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10-27-2007, 06:31 PM
  #348
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I haven't read anything beforehand. My initial thought seeing the hit is that it was a bad hit, but it wasn't one that seemed to have any ostensible or severe malicious intent...

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10-27-2007, 06:32 PM
  #349
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get well soon bergeron. wow, that was bad.

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Old
10-27-2007, 06:32 PM
  #350
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Get well soon Patrice! You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.

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